Help: Advise for gear upgrade please

[Fjolla]

I am moving to CND for a while now to see if I can hunt there, it will be interesting to se if I have any chanse there. I know that on my last trip (2 months and about 10 lvls ago) I had no chanse what so ever.

CP would be fun to try out, would I have any chanse there solo with Ghost 5b and hl8 a105?

Ill try to stay away from the phasms for a while

It's doable for sure, but it's gonna be a fapping marathon
I would never recommend anyone with less than 25 evader and medium HP to go there.. well unless they have an Imp fap maybe

[Im talking about CP]

 

[Staffas]

Hehe, then I stay away for a while longer or untill i can get a big team with me there.
Even though I felt uber when I got 110hp and discovered that i can hunt ambu up to mature without armor

 

[Sarah Hawkwood]

Misses with UL guns is a myth. At least for me. I don't miss much with UL neither L weapons of similar power (like EP40 and Korss H400). But truth is that MA is nerfing damage interval. With every VU you deal lower average damage with UL guns, despite raising your skills. This comes with lowering chance for critical hits too. Still, it is good to have some UL gun just in case. EP41 will work with your skills about the same like EP40. Trust me, I tested it having about the same skills you have now. The only difference comes when you deal critical hit and when it comes to pay decay bill. EP41 can be good investment for the future, but I think it won't be usefull for you anytime soon. If you are looking for a decent laser pistol, take also Karma Killer under consideration. It's quite rare though. If you need really good UL pistol, think about Maddox IV. No matter what you choose, buy it and hide deep in your storage or use just in emergency.
Still, there is no good way around L guns, no matter we like it or not. Unless you can rise your skills to some uber level and do it fast.
Talking about amps for laser weapons, I might be wrong, but from what I have noticed, it seems that they have something like maxing level too. Or they have just lower influence on damage we are dealing than Entropedia says. Just an idea, would have to check it with L amps to proove it right or wrong. Anyway, if you can put your hands on A105, do it while you still can.

You don't say much about how much you want to spend on your upgrades. If it's something like 5k (as it seems from your OP), I would suggest bravo, A105 and some decent UL pistol (Karma Killer, EP41, Maddox IV) for emergency or for bad times.

With healing tools, you are pretty stuck with what you have now. With higher skills you will have a choice of L healing kits that will have better eco than EK2600. I would advise using EK2600 less, more FAP50 and 80 - try which mobs require each for your skills. Still, I know that EK2600 is quite addictive... And, most important: do whatever you can to raise your paramedic level. Use L faps with learning period always when you can do it instead UL ones. They might not be usefull when in combat, but still enough in between fights.

About armor... Can't really think of the reason to buy 4a platings. Especially when you have 5b for impact, 6a for penetration and burn and 6b for electricity. Maybe 5d for cold and acid would be better solution? Maybe 5a as a replacement for 5b for easier mobs...

Solir is about 1k now? I'm sorry, I'm not up to date with L armor prices... If yes, this would give you still quite a few parts of vigi. And I would reccomend you getting it as soon as you can. It may be to late though, vigi is rising in prices like hell lately. If vigi is not an option, use that money for chipping in evade. It will help you much more than solir would do... Higher evade will make your ghost more usefull and you might find yourself not needing armor better than this for a while. Plus, your armor decay bill will be lower a bit.

GL with your upgrades and have a nice shopping spree.

 

[Oleg]

Misses with UL guns is a myth.

A myth backed up by extensive research and data collection

Sorry, but you are wrong.

 

[Staffas]

... ... ... ...

the advantage with the UL weapon is that i can try it out and sell it for the same peds if I am not happy with it. I will try one, most likely the EP41 if I can find one. I will see what I think of it after testing it.

You are right, my investment budget this month is at about 5k peds, might be adjusted since I am going to CND and might try some mining there again too.

For the plate "upgrade", I had never even considered the 5d, have to take a look on that one, might be a better alternative.
The Solir, I have decided to leave for now, I might try one later if I want to go crazy sometime
it would be used for short fun hunts and not as a regular armor for everyday hunting (and yes, it is about 1k ped)

I chip in evade everytime I hit a hof, I set aside 25-50% of every hof to buy skills for, and so far most have been for evade and evade related skills. I just need to HOF alittle more

Thank you for your input

 

[Lobbe]

chipping in evade when u get a hof sounds smart I gotta try that one

GL Staffas

 

[Witte]

Trust me

I dont, so please share your test data.

 

[Lerxst]

I love the 2600 too. Not at all eco but it has saved me more than a few times from mobs I have no business killing with a BreerM1a +102 amp out on mining runs. Namely the Nexnecis Old that tried to jump my claim....

 

[Sarah Hawkwood]

A myth backed up by extensive research and data collection
Sorry, but you are wrong.

Even if I'm wrong, I have right to have my opinion in this subject. And I respect extensive research and data collection. Still, for my ava it is a myth, for some reason I rarely miss anyway. Did no extensive research, didn't count misses with L and UL weapons, but the fact for me is that I rarely miss. There is one exception though: plasma. But I have much lower rifle and plasma skills than handgun and laser, so this doesn't suprise me much. And it's one of reasons why I use Rv50 (L) as tagger lately more often than bravo.
Plus, not saying that UL weapons are better than L. Big bonus of UL guns however is that you always have one, no matter what L weapons are on market atm and what their price is. Plus you have a chance to finish hunting which something which actually has chance to sell with markup when you loot some L weapon. But honestly, if someone's happy with using L weapons, fine with me. If chooses UL, I also have no problem with this.

Ah, Staffas, forgot about rocket launchers. They may have not as nice range as marbers, but still they are usefull. I'm using Rv50, even though maxed long ago. But with a bit of practice you can tag a mob standing behind a hill, hiding behind a rock. And eats only 10 ammo. Decay is rather minimal, I am using one for more than a month now, still has about 20 ped tt.
Not very usefull to drag a high aggro mob from the pack, but still usefull to get a single one. Usefulness depends on your style of hunting though. I do not like to run around like headless chicken trying to aggro all mobs available in area (which seems to be favourite way of hunting of majority of players) and prefer mobs coming to me for a slaughter one by one.

I dont, so please share your test data.

It was speech figure. But I can say you that damage dealed with EP-40 and EP41 was similar when I was around lev 30 in Laser Pistoleer (Hit). If there was any difference, it was not difference justifying spending more money on it. Don't have EP41 anymore, so I will not test it again anytime soon. Still, EP41 seems to be good investment. But what I wanted to say was that around lev 30 it will be way to early to use it, especially on regular basis. Even H400 (L) will be better.

 

[Oleg]

Even if I'm wrong, I have right to have my opinion in this subject.

Of course. No-one said you weren't entitled to an opinion.

You are also free to believe that the Earth is flat and that the sun revolves around it.

 

[Staffas]

Of course. No-one said you weren't entitled to an opinion.

You are also free to believe that the Earth is flat and that the sun revolves around it.

Oleg, dont crush my belive that the earth is flat, I think that is why when I fly for long distances they always fly during the night so that they can keep it a secret (when we fly over the edge of the earth )
And of course the sun revolves around the earth, and the earth revolves around me too, nit because I am so big, but because I am so important

 

[Sarah Hawkwood]

Of course. No-one said you weren't entitled to an opinion.
You are also free to believe that the Earth is flat and that the sun revolves around it.

Oleg, please read again my post u quoted and pay attention to: "Misses with UL guns is a myth. At least for me. I don't miss much with UL neither L weapons of similar power..."
I'm not saying all avas will have the same situation. What I'm saying is that I, personally, do not miss much. I have never more misses than 1 miss per 10 shots. Don't know how the situation looks for other avas, I'm not sitting behind your back or anyone's back when you play. I'm sorry if I don't fit results of researches you made, but as I said, for me rate of misses is about the same for L and UL weapons of similar power. Maybe if I did extensive research I would find out that I miss few times more per, let's say 1000 shots with UL guns that I would with L ones. But it's not the difference that would bother me much. Still, average damage for UL is lower than for L.
And once again: I don't say that UL weapons are better than L, because they are not. I just say that every ava is different and what can be true for one, doesn't have to be true for another...

 

[Oleg]

Oleg, please read again my post u quoted and pay attention to: "Misses with UL guns is a myth. At least for me. I don't miss much with UL neither L weapons of similar power..."
I'm not saying all avas will have the same situation. What I'm saying is that I, personally, do not miss much. I have never more misses than 1 miss per 10 shots. Don't know how the situation looks for other avas, I'm not sitting behind your back or anyone's back when you play. I'm sorry if I don't fit results of researches you made, but as I said, for me rate of misses is about the same for L and UL weapons of similar power. Maybe if I did extensive research I would find out that I miss few times more per, let's say 1000 shots with UL guns that I would with L ones. But it's not the difference that would bother me much. Still, average damage for UL is lower than for L.
And once again: I don't say that UL weapons are better than L, because they are not. I just say that every ava is different and what can be true for one, doesn't have to be true for another...

The hit rate varies between 80% (for an avatar with zero skills using an unlimited weapon) and 92% (for a maxed weapon), so it's not a huge difference. But in EU it's the small margins that make all the difference.

Saying that your avatar is somehow different to other avatars in this respect is just ludicrous, frankly.

 

[Witte]

Not to get too much offtopic, some quick words about this. The difference between for example 5HA and 10HA is not that big and hardly noticable. Its a difference of about 86% and 92% hitrate, with attachments it more like 89% vs 92%. Basically, you can only know the difference when you do accurate tests.

About avarage damage its the same. You need to do a proper test to say anything about it. Nobody has been able to show a different distribution than a random (or uniform) one. If you are able to produce a non uniform dataset, I will be very intrested to see this data. You can very easely create such a data set using the damage logger you can find here.

Ok enough about this subject

 

[MaxArfPower]

i say dont worry about buying the high end armor to move up, and spend the money into crafting guns. since its hard to get decent lvl 30 guns now, why not get into crafting them, so one day you can make your own guns, and then when your ready to move up in mobs you will be fully prepaired with your own arsonol of guns.

 

[Miller]

It's doable for sure, but it's gonna be a fapping marathon
I would never recommend anyone with less than 25 evader and medium HP to go there.. well unless they have an Imp fap maybe

[Im talking about CP]

Before the recent VU I'd agree but since the VU the mobs up there hit less often and crit less often - making dome 1 much, much easier for lower-skilled players. You do need to be prepared to fap but I guess that's down to player preference.

If you're the sort of player who doesn't like to fap while hunting and only "tops up" their health after a mob CP is not the place to go. If you're the sort of player that enjoys a challenge and doesn't mind healing while hunting CP is a great place to skill if you accept your limitations. See a Kreltin Alpha in dome 1? Avoid it As a practical example with an HL11+A105 I find Aurli Weaks (the predominant Aurli mob in D1) quite a similar experience to Ambu Matures. You get hit for a small amount, occasionally get hit for a larger amount (15-20 at most for the Aurli) and only need to fap mid-mob if you get 3-4 of the "high hits" on you or get critted.

Ultimately L weapons give 'players like us (Staffas)' the chance to punch above our weight and do more damage than we could in the past. Bearing that and the personal preferences while hunting I'd say - try it. With all due respect if you're already looking to upgrade Ghost + 5B at level 30 you probably don't mind a challenge and for players like that CP is a unique place to hunt.

Either way, imo it's always better to try something and find out if you can manage it than just assume the worst - there's a lot of fun to be had with experimenting (in-game or otherwise )

 

[Fjolla]

Before the recent VU I'd agree but since the VU the mobs up there hit less often and crit less often - making dome 1 much, much easier for lower-skilled players. You do need to be prepared to fap but I guess that's down to player preference.

Ok i don't know, tbh i have not been there since i camped D3 and that was pre-9.3

 

[Sarah Hawkwood]

But in EU it's the small margins that make all the difference.

I completely agree. But what actually matters at the end is not how much money you will save thanks to using one gun or another, but if you are able to be on + or not (having fun on the way might be important too). When you start thinking about such small margins, you end up with a conclusion that without maxed MM there is no point in hunting at all. Or you will spend your time calculating everything 20 times instead of having fun and getting skills. I know one player who spends hours on Entropedia, calculates and prints data. And has almost no skills because of minimal amount of time spend on any activity within PE. And cool for me, if someone likes it, why not?. Who am I to judge anyone's way to have fun? Anyway, if something floats the boat for one ava, fine with me.

Saying that your avatar is somehow different to other avatars in this respect is just ludicrous, frankly.

It was just my response to attitude: "Oh, beware, with UL weapon you will miss MUCH". This MUCH as you said yourself is "small marigins". They matter, true, but still, I prefer to go hunting or mining with gear I can afford than spend time on Entropedia dreaming about mod fap and maxed MM. Or calculating that with gun X I will save Y peds compared to gun Z.
And avatars are different. Do you think your ava is able to find rare ores in places my ava finds them? Do you think your ava misses just the same as my ava using the same weapons? What I want to say is that there are a lot of factors that make avatars unique. Maybe if you compared 2 avas having exactly the same skills and gear, they would work just the same. And all calculations and theories seem to forget about differencies. Never seen any research on EF taking all skills or even only all related skills under consideration. All calculations are just models and models however generally describe well given reality, do not have to work for all the same. This is how science works too. It's based on models that seem to be the truth. Earth being flat seemed to be truth until Galileo and Copernicus prooved this model to be false. And noone will guarantee you that every modern science theory is completely true and unbreakable. The same with EU. Who says that next VU MA won't change something tiny in unnoticeable way. They did it many times in the past and still do.
What I want to say is that I prefer to spend my time skilling up and having fun that preparing models of virtual reality and make my vritual existence even more complicated than it deserves.

Witte, thanks for the link, shame I couldn't test my EP40 and my EP41 average damage using it. As I said, now I don't have EP41 anymore, so can't test it again, at least for a while. Not mentioning that to repeat experiment, I would have to chip out all skills I gained since then just to be able to repeat the experiment in exactly the same research environment. And I agree that to know the difference exactly I would have to do accurate tests. During the time I tried EP41 it didn't feel like much difference between it and much weaker gun. "Much" and "feel" are crucial here. I did no proper research on it, I just tried it.
Which still doesn't change the fact that EP41 as weapon used on regular basis around lev30 is a mistake. L weapons give great advantage and firepower that unmaxed UL guns can't give. Still, there is question if you need this firepower or not and when.

Sorry for another long post, but it's quite hard to state opinion on some subject and discuss anything in one sentence (unless opinion is build from offensive content).

 

[Fang]

CP would be fun to try out, would I have any chanse there solo with Ghost 5b and hl8 a105?

Yes you would survive up there and even have great fun, but I'd recommend that you bring your Gremlin + 5b with you instead of the Ghost. Gremlin is better in Dome 1 & 2, because of the mix of Kreltins and Aurlis (Kreltins give you Acid damage). You get a little less protection against the Aurlis, but then again you don't need to repair as often due to the higher durability of Gremlin.

I'd suggest you give CP a try! I understand that you are not really an eco hunter at heart and is willing to spend some cash on new gear to have some fun, so why not spend some on an exciting trip to CP? It's "only" 15-20 ped to get up there and 10 ped to TP back to PA. And you don't really need to upgrade to equipment you don't allready have.
No storage up there tho , so bring what you need and leave all heavy mining stuff at home.

I was in your shoes some time ago. Had an EP41, Korss H400, 104/106, Ghost, 5b, 2600 and was around your level in Handgun. I decided to give it a try, and I ended up spending months up there In fact I think I reached level 50 in Handgun before I came down planetside again

One of the first things I did was to buy the blue armor everyone else used up there. Then I decided to try out the Isis series, and bought a HL8, and eventually HL11, HL12, HL14, whatever was available at the auction.

At the time CP was a great place to get skills, specially Evade, and I unlocked avoidance up there. I can only assume the latest upgrade to the aliens, with reduced attack speed will slow this skill progression down somewhat, but the up-side is the reduced decay on your armor, which was the major PED-sink at CP before.

The only thing I think you could benefit from is to buy a long range tagger, like a Bravo. As a beginner on CP you don't want to run up to a bunch of mobs to get into range!!! Besides a certain death from your part, you will also send off mobs on many other hunter in the same dome, and that's not appretiated

So get that Bravo, strip of all heavy stuff, bring what you need to survive without having to use your storage, and enter the adrenalin-pumping world of aliens!

I'm up there at the moment and so please feel free to contact me and I can give you the tour

 

[Staffas]

the way you describe CP make sit sound realy fun. I migt try it out in a few weks, this week is designated to CND though.

As you said, I am not realy that concerned with eco. MA has claimed that the average cost per play is about $1 per hour, and has also recently claimed that they will try to adjust this so that it will be even closer to that figure for all players. So uneco for me equals more swirleys, and i do love them.
(btw keep the flaming about this on a moderate lvl since this is my opinion and I stick to it, I can handle some swings so its ok)

You will get a PM when I am on my way up Fang, thank you for the offer and the CP advise.

 

[byubi]

Its time tothis thread.

I'm gonna upgard my gear soon, so after reading the hole thread again, i wanna know what happend with you... what gear did you buy? and did you buy an EP-41?

 

[Staffas]

I did get the EP-41. I used it for about 3 weeks then I sold it again.
The reason I sold it was not the bad eco or something like that, it was simply that i make so much more dmg/sec with the limited weapons that i could not justify keeping it.

I am starting to like dmg/sec more and more, and due to this the EP-41 was not a good choice for me.

During the 3 weeks I could not realy see that the eco got worse, if the markup of the limited guns was included and I would stick to mobs that I didnt need high dmg/sec to kill, the overall outcome was about the same as with a limited gun.
I cant remember if the skilling was different in any way.

so from what I notised during theese 3 weeks my advise would be:
If you use a limited gun that is in short suply and like to hunt mobs with low regen and preferably low hp, then EP-41 might be a good option.
If you like me like dmg/sec and big mobs, then the unlimited guns are your only choice. Especially if you are using a limited gun that has decent markup and is in large supply in shops or at AU, then limited is still the best way to go.

All according to me offcourse

 

[ermik]

i have a bravo for sale m8 , below market i need peds lootious has been bad to me.

// ermik

 

[byubi]

I did get the EP-41. I used it for about 3 weeks then I sold it again.
The reason I sold it was not the bad eco or something like that, it was simply that i make so much more dmg/sec with the limited weapons that i could not justify keeping it.

I am starting to like dmg/sec more and more, and due to this the EP-41 was not a good choice for me.

During the 3 weeks I could not realy see that the eco got worse, if the markup of the limited guns was included and I would stick to mobs that I didnt need high dmg/sec to kill, the overall outcome was about the same as with a limited gun.
I cant remember if the skilling was different in any way.

so from what I notised during theese 3 weeks my advise would be:
If you use a limited gun that is in short suply and like to hunt mobs with low regen and preferably low hp, then EP-41 might be a good option.
If you like me like dmg/sec and big mobs, then the unlimited guns are your only choice. Especially if you are using a limited gun that has decent markup and is in large supply in shops or at AU, then limited is still the best way to go.

All according to me offcourse

I agree on all of what you said... I like limited too...

But as you said, buying L guns from auction all the time can be a pain is the ass. That's why im thinking about buying a EP-41.

I dont have the skills for UL guns, but i'll put 2 hunnirs, a Jzar and A105, does that help?

 

[Baradur]

I agree on all of what you said... I like limited too...

But as you said, buying L guns from auction all the time can be a pain is the ass. That's why im thinking about buying a EP-41.

I dont have the skills for UL guns, but i'll put 2 hunnirs, a Jzar and A105, does that help?

It will help reduce your missed shots. But it will not crank up your average damage. The 'problem' with UL guns is that (unless maxed) you get a fairly low average damage. Meaning that you will pay more pec / dmge then you would pay with an L gun (assuming that L gun is maxed).

I use both L and UL. When going UL I mainly use a ewe-ep vanguard on lower mobs (molisk... argo). It is a cheap gun to purchase (tt+40-60 depending on current market) and it will give you a nice 'feel' what UL weaps do. Fun to use but the lower average dmge is a killer . ...
(for example, a korss h400+104 will let me kill about 15-16 molisks / 10 ped ammo.. an ewe ep vanguard + 102 /> 10-12 molisks / 10 ped ammo.. on a 400 ped ammo hunt I can kill approx 140-160 molisks more with the korss setup, that means more chance for mini's and globals and more average loot).

If I ever get a nice Uber HOF.. then I will invest in Laser weaponry technology and anatomy to crank up my average damage.

Not the missed shots, but the low average damage is the BIG problem when it comes to UL guns and not enough skills.