Question: Can't a non depositer success here?

[TheRock]

Hi.

I'm not someone who posts much here, but this issue made me want to ask the community.

It all started during the MM. I come cross soneone in my friend list who asked me about MM. How it went, how much PED burned, what I'm using etc...

I told him what I used and how much this is costing me. He then felt very sorry for my Visa card.
Once I told him I didn't deposit, he didn't believe. To make it very odd I told him I didn't depo for years...

Still, he asnwered me that he haven't been eating for years. Kind of making fun and not believing in me.

Why would I care if someone believes me or not? He or they can just bang their heads on a wall if he/they won't believe.
Why can't a non depositer success here? Or can a non-depositer success here?

 

[Killahbee]

Of course you can have succes here

Just ignore people that don't believe you! you should be happy being able to play smarter than him

 

[mastermesh]

http://www.examiner.com/article/doctors-confirm-indian-man-lives-on-sunlight-and-water



Seriously though yes possible... difficult though.

 

[Art Jennifer]

Yeah Non depositor can make it,

I knew a few that have more skills than me.

A few have got a few CLD's without a single deposit.

Do able, just hard.

 

[Futurama]

I have only deposited once (a small sum, related to CLD sale), I still think of myself as a non-depositor. I have done a lot of different things over the years, accumulated some wealth as well.

Although I do agree that it used to be easier before. But than again, back in 2007 or something people had way too much money, so a lot of people were doing good back then.

It all depends on the incoming cash flow - if MA have loads of depositors which have a lot of spare funds for EU and MA is profiting, than you can actually get more back (either from players from bigger markups or from MA with slightly better loot).

 

[mastermesh]

Ps. See the attqs link in sig. Now go start bidding on auctions with tt+0 start bid :-D

When stts existed that is how I survived without depo many months.

 

[shoti]

Hi.

I'm not someone who posts much here, but this issue made me want to ask the community.

It all started during the MM. I come cross soneone in my friend list who asked me about MM. How it went, how much PED burned, what I'm using etc...

I told him what I used and how much this is costing me. He then felt very sorry for my Visa card.
Once I told him I didn't deposit, he didn't believe. To make it very odd I told him I didn't depo for years...

Still, he asnwered me that he haven't been eating for years. Kind of making fun and not believing in me.

Why would I care if someone believes me or not? He or they can just bang their heads on a wall if he/they won't believe.
Why can't a non depositer success here? Or can a non-depositer success here?

Proble is that in shrinking economy when more and more ppl suffer bad loot and need to start depo, being non-depositor is no longer thing u can be proud of. Now all non-depositors are treated by depositors like leaches and freeloaders who shall shame of that.

Interesting is that change took only 2-3 years to happen.

I would say don't bother with them and do what fits u best. It's after all your wallet and your decision what do with it.

 

[HinDragoz]

A non depositor can success mainly with mining. That's what I did

Of course you could do trading or keep fapping service but I found those boring.

 

[Few Scars]

It's kinda like those on welfare and those who work and pay taxes to support the welfare recipients. If we stopped paying our taxes, those on welfare would suffer.

In this game, if we stopped depositing the game would collapse. To be honest I think it boils down to about 30-50 players who deposit $1000s per day who fund the loot pool. Those are your big crafters, miners and hunters. IF you notice, quite a few of them are getting pissed off with their returns and cutting back on deposits...

 

[Cerberus]

Proble is that in shrinking economy when more and more ppl suffer bad loot and need to start depo, being non-depositor is no longer thing u can be proud of. Now all non-depositors are treated by depositors like leaches and freeloaders who shall shame of that.

I'm calling bull.
Back in 07 there were no traders. If you bought stuff and then relisted on auction you were a reseller and essentially scamming people.

There's a good saying I picked up at cracked: "You have to envy it all".
Gamblers envy the return of markup artists. At the same time they don't envy at all how it takes two hours to cycle even 100 PED. How markup tracking can take several hours. How a sudden crash will break one's heart. How levelling and globalling happens at snails pace.

You have to envy it all.

 

[Feith]

And then, who have to fear about the colapse ?
Depositors or non depositors ?

PS : i have deposited a lot for me (near 21k $), i cycle as much ped as i can (between 500 and 1000 ped/day), and withdraw almost all my depos.

 

[whiteknut]

I'm calling bull.
Back in 07 there were no traders. If you bought stuff and then relisted on auction you were a reseller and essentially scamming people.

There's a good saying I picked up at cracked: "You have to envy it all".
Gamblers envy the return of markup artists. At the same time they don't envy at all how it takes two hours to cycle even 100 PED. How markup tracking can take several hours. How a sudden crash will break one's heart. How levelling and globalling happens at snails pace.

You have to envy it all.

in 2007 there were many traders. Check screenies from that time Port Atlantis was our gathering spot.
I remember skin trading was popular, so was paint trading(yeah Buying orange paint 300%, Blue paint 400% at Boxes)
There was no auction data back then, so it was much harder to be a trader but it was possible. Au fee´s were also great

 

[SpikeBlack]

It's kinda like those on welfare and those who work and pay taxes to support the welfare recipients. If we stopped paying our taxes, those on welfare would suffer.

In this game, if we stopped depositing the game would collapse. To be honest I think it boils down to about 30-50 players who deposit $1000s per day who fund the loot pool. Those are your big crafters, miners and hunters. IF you notice, quite a few of them are getting pissed off with their returns and cutting back on deposits...

EU has been tuned to a style of playing of a select group of players. Loose those players and suddenly things start to collapse.

MA chose to do it that way and they got applauded for it at the time.

MA are now trying to detune the loot system away from what it's become. i.e. to get better average returns for everyone, but that can only come at the expense of the gamblers.

 

[Spawn]

It's kinda like those on welfare and those who work and pay taxes to support the welfare recipients. If we stopped paying our taxes, those on welfare would suffer.

In this game, if we stopped depositing the game would collapse. To be honest I think it boils down to about 30-50 players who deposit $1000s per day who fund the loot pool. Those are your big crafters, miners and hunters. IF you notice, quite a few of them are getting pissed off with their returns and cutting back on deposits...

And still cld income is stable... I guess with all the newcomers arriving at camp Icarus, the newcomers stabilize the ubers leaving?

 

[mastermesh]

It's kinda like those on welfare and those who work and pay taxes to support the welfare recipients. If we stopped paying our taxes, those on welfare would suffer.

In this game, if we stopped depositing the game would collapse. To be honest I think it boils down to about 30-50 players who deposit $1000s per day who fund the loot pool. Those are your big crafters, miners and hunters. IF you notice, quite a few of them are getting pissed off with their returns and cutting back on deposits...

If we stop depositing eu will last quite a while. Server costs and bandwidth is really the only ongoing cost. MA's downsized a lot. That six million can pay the bandwidth a few months. If all deposits stopped forever, yes, it'd be bye bye time... but that's never going to happen because someone will always be inspired to chase a global at some point in time. Today's non-depositor may be tomorrow's highest depositor and today's ubers could be tomorrow's sweaters after they cash out. There's far more than 30-50 players paying in to the system overall. The big time depositors even cut back after they break even, etc. Once Treasure Island and CND paid for the deposits, I suspect ND and Deathi stopped depositing at the rate they were prior to that. same goes for others too. They are living off of the lower levels of the pyramid scheme once they pay in to get to the high levels.

 

[Futurama]

If we stop depositing eu will last quite a while. Server costs and bandwidth is really the only ongoing cost. MA's downsized a lot. That six million can pay the bandwidth a few months.

Sure, and all the staff consist of volunteers.

 

[Spawn]

Sure, and all the staff consist of volunteers.

The tempo in which things move this year is rather slow.. check mm results delayed, and delayed again, january investment opportunity still not unveiled while it's almost March. Promised 9x cld houses for early 2013 never mentioned again, TEN event really unclear and not-announced on calypso, and the evil thing that starts with a T that's still not developed. I suspect that either all the programmers have the flu, or the team has been downsized again.

 

[Xavier Target]

And still cld income is stable... I guess with all the newcomers arriving at camp Icarus, the newcomers stabilize the ubers leaving?

or, someone who played on a smaller scale starts depositing larger amounts, CLDs even got so called non-depositors to deposit, and the game is fundamentally designed to encourage depositors to increase how much they put in to move up the mob size ladder or to compete in PVP activities...

 

[TheRock]

A non depositor can success mainly with mining. That's what I did

Of course you could do trading or keep fapping service but I found those boring.

Mining, the most profit thing u can do. That's what I'm doing

This thread was not personally, but rather general question since I been asked several times.

Yes, back in 2006/2007 I deposited around 5-8k PEDs. Not sure how much exactly, but after that been ok without it.

I think the game can tolerate some non depositors. I agree the economy isn't good in game from the financial report. But that wont make me deposit when that isn't needed to just be the little "helper" of the economy?

 

[Skullseige]

sweating is 100% profit so... yes ^^

 

[shoti]

...just chasing that globals was fun in times of weekly 20 K peds small ambu and trox and weekly 9K peds argo young.

When there were lot of swirlies ppl tend to get over bad loots course every big hit ( wchich was witnesed so many time ) positioned them on +. Badluckers eventually got their hits after some time and shuted up

When that was slightly tuned bitching over constant returns and flatnening them started. Here even nondepositors added their 2 pecs.

Now in 2013 we have low base return and no more big hits. Every nondepositor making it's bankrol constantly grow is real genius under such circumstances.

Question is if constant flow of more or less casual MMO eaters will allow MA to survive, as they are not so dedicated like more hardcore ocasional depositors back from 2007. All seems to going to point in wchich ppl felt robbed by MA. Now its maybe month or two before newcomer rule out basic mechanism and see that whatever he do he losing peds. That period was much longer years ago and alowed to rise dedication, wchich bringed depos later.

 

[Few Scars]

Question is if constant flow of more or less casual MMO eaters will allow MA to survive, as they are not so dedicated like more hardcore ocasional depositors back from 2007. All seems to going to point in wchich ppl felt robbed by MA. Now its maybe month or two before newcomer rule out basic mechanism and see that whatever he do he losing peds. That period was much longer years ago and alowed to rise dedication, wchich bringed depos later.

If new players find it is too expensive to play with no decent returns, they wont stay long. Out of my current 5 disciples, I havent seen 4 of them in months, the only one who is working through his mentorship deposits so he can play.

 

[FallenAngel]

It's kinda like those on welfare and those who work and pay taxes to support the welfare recipients. If we stopped paying our taxes, those on welfare would suffer.

In this game, if we stopped depositing the game would collapse. To be honest I think it boils down to about 30-50 players who deposit $1000s per day who fund the loot pool. Those are your big crafters, miners and hunters. IF you notice, quite a few of them are getting pissed off with their returns and cutting back on deposits...

do you know anything about how a economy works?
ive said this before on other threads like this but it is worth repeating.
do you get angry at waiters, shop assitants and garbage collectors irl?
they produce "nothing" but provide a service, they offer up their time and get rewarded for it.
from the way you speak you dont sound like a liberal, communist or anarchist, so i presume you worship the free market.
the whole essence of the free market is supply and demand, if there is no demand there would be nobody supplying.
obviously there is some demand being met by these non-depositors, they are doing something depositors are unwilling or unable to do, otherwise they would not succeed.
the value placed on the time spent by non-depositors is not set by the non-depositors, it is set by the market, the free market.

i find it amusing that those that seem to worship the free market always want protection from "the state" for themselves.

 

[tamlin]

sweating is 100% profit so... yes ^^

If it takes you two hours to get sweat you can possibly sell for 2 PED, you have made 10 US cents in two hours,while using two hours of time, bandwidth and electricity.

Granted, if the computer would have been turned on and the bandwidth would still be used, it's just down to how you value your time.

For time you would otherwise just have farted around, why not. But profit? Today? After vehicles were introduced? I think not.

 

[mastermesh]

the way you speak you dont sound like a liberal, communist or anarchist, so i presume you worship the free market....i find it amusing that those that seem to worship the free market always want protection from "the state" for themselves.

Conservatives = guns + voices in the head they claim that is god telling to buy the guns to protect themselves.... either that or folks with too much money that wants tax breaks or someone in charge of a church creating those voices in the heads which is getting payouts from the rich because of those tax breaks... then they claim the other side is the crazy ones, lol. Probably way off topic on politics now so some mod will shut down the thread, lol.

 

[FallenAngel]

Probably way off topic on politics now so some mod will shut down the thread, lol.

they could always just delete your post instead if that is a problem
i certainly wasnt discussing real world politics, i used a example from real life to question some assumptions, and mentioned some basics regarding different views on economics and the value of someones time, im just surpised that people talk about entropia not being a game but a investment, and use terms like supply and demand but dont seem to understand the component of economics that is the labour market.

 

[Karmic]

Of course, there are lots of people who don't and many who have never deposited that do fine playing at all levels. It just takes a lot longer to gain skills etc. They don't need to be a reseller either, but most, I would imagine, sell as little as possible to the TT.

or, someone who played on a smaller scale starts depositing larger amounts, CLDs even got so called non-depositors to deposit, and the game is fundamentally designed to encourage depositors to increase how much they put in to move up the mob size ladder or to compete in PVP activities...

I hadn't thought of it that way before, but, yeah I guess CLD reinvested dividends are similar to depositing, though, I'd consider someone who bought CLD's with funds earned in game to still be a non-depositor.

 

[M Rufen Power]

Of course they definately can. In my society, Falagor is by far the one that comes to mind. He is really intelligent, smart & teaches everyone in soc a few things about the game. Including myself . If people knew how Falagor made his success, I'm sure others would be inspired to do something similar or not. Eitherway I know a few people, who have never deposited and are earning enough for themselves to keep going & increase their net value ingame. I've now finally learnt how to do the same, it's just taken alot longer for my brain to adjust . Hopefully I to become non depositor soon as well.