Info: Blackhawks 15$ Experiment Kira Sweet Goodfellow

dogofwar said:

I understand. But it's a better virtue to be patient enough to mow a neighbors lawn.

Because it's so much work, like way more than getting 18,000 sweat and selling it.

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Well this might be, but that would have been hardly a proof to our mentor we had the patience to stick to his plan for our 15$ Experiment.

dogofwar said:

And for a lot of people EU is not their job, it's their fun. So you can throw this wisdom out the window. When you can make at least 100x more income per day with a minimum wage full-time job in a developed country, then why would you try to make PED in EU?

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And for a lot of people Poker is not their job, it's their fun. So you can throw this wisdom out the window. When you can make at least 100x more income per day with a minimum wage full-time job in a developed country, then why would you try to make money playing Poker?

See the difference? For a lot of people playing this game, the point is to make money. Just like Poker, the point is to win pots and increase your balance. You don't play Poker just to enjoy the game. Some people might enjoy the game, but the goal is still to make some money from it. You're not required to try to make a living from it. I hate when people try to use that argument. It doesn't have to be so black and white. Why can't I just make a few extra bucks from playing a game a few hours a day?

dogofwar said:

And for a lot of people EU is not their job, it's their fun. So you can throw this wisdom out the window.

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My advice was not meant for people like you. I'm more than happy for you to piss away your money unnecessarily if that's what you want to do.

DoubleWolf said:

And for a lot of people Poker is not their job, it's their fun. So you can throw this wisdom out the window. When you can make at least 100x more income per day with a minimum wage full-time job in a developed country, then why would you try to make money playing Poker?

See the difference? For a lot of people playing this game, the point is to make money. Just like Poker, the point is to win pots and increase your balance. You don't play Poker just to enjoy the game. Some people might enjoy the game, but the goal is still to make some money from it. You're not required to try to make a living from it. I hate when people try to use that argument. It doesn't have to be so black and white. Why can't I just make a few extra bucks from playing a game a few hours a day?

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Did it slip your mind that most people aren't making money in EU? They're losing money. But so what! They're making 100x to 300x or more income from their RL job than what most would make in EU.

I wasn't comparing the average EU player to a RL worker. I was comparing people who think they can come in EU and sweat/trade/etc to make money to people who make money IRL and saying, "Hey, it makes no sense to come here to make money if that's your aim!" Average EU players aren't making money here. You can say to me that they're trying to and thus they're the same, but in my book if you're not making a profit then you're probably here to have fun. If not, then your priorities are backwards, but many people are like that.

And finally, my post was in response to someone who said that people who move ahead quickly (spend ped) instead of sweating or taking the slower profitable route are impatient. My point was that they're not here to work or be 'patient', they're here to have fun and spend the money they've earned working in RL. If you want to judge someone's work ethic then you gotta look at their RL job too, not just how they spend their peds. In sum total, they probably have just as much patience, but they're making 100x-300x or more income. Seem smarter to me. *shrug* Some people are indeed impatient, but at least they have something to spend.

So maybe if that person wasn't so ready to judge, I wouldn't be, and you wouldn't be either.

It's a domino-effect. One person judges, and then the next and next...

When I see someone judge, I gotta judge. I think you're the same way.

Each time we post we're goign to miss things. So if you want we can argue forever back and forth.

I for one, applaud Jennson's experiment. This game is one where the cost to play can easily get out of hand. I think I've reached the point where my SIB Laser rifle is too expensive for what I am willing to depo in a given month and be able to play how I want for a significant amount of time, so either I play EU a lot less or change how I'm playing to keep the cost down. Perhaps some of each. Its always good to see what options there are to stretch the PED besides sweating, or hunting puny and shinkaba youngs.

dogofwar said:

I wasn't comparing the average EU player to a RL worker. I was comparing people who think they can come in EU and sweat/trade/etc to make money to people who make money IRL and saying, "Hey, it makes no sense to come here to make money if that's your aim!"

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Again, why would someone want to play poker in addition to their real life job? Not everyone makes money at poker. In fact, the average poker player ALSO loses money. If you sit down at a table with 5 people, only one of you is going to walk away with all the money. But the reason you play is to try to be that person. So using your logic, it makes no sense for anyone to try to make money playing poker either. And when I say "make money" I don't mean make a living. If you win $20 from a game amongst friends, you still made money, which was the goal when you started playing the game.

For EU to be considered a game, there has to be a way to win the game, or at least have a measure of success in comparison to the other competitors. Since there is no way to finish this game, the only way I see to measure your success is how much you deposited versus how much you have in the game plus any withdrawals you have made. Much in the same way you would measure the success of a poker player.

So why would you say there is no point in trying to make money here, when that is the only way to measure success in this game? Remember, skills and equipment do not equal success as those can be bought...

dogofwar said:

And finally, my post was in response to someone who said that people who move ahead quickly (spend ped) instead of sweating or taking the slower profitable route are impatient.

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As I suspected, you did not read my post properly. If you can't even be bothered to read all of the words in a 2-line post, you are certainly impatient.

You don't seem to have understood the concept of the thread either. If you don't want to play on $15 a month (or perhaps less), it has no relevance to you.

DoubleWolf said:

And for a lot of people Poker is not their job, it's their fun. So you can throw this wisdom out the window. When you can make at least 100x more income per day with a minimum wage full-time job in a developed country, then why would you try to make money playing Poker?

See the difference? For a lot of people playing this game, the point is to make money. Just like Poker, the point is to win pots and increase your balance. You don't play Poker just to enjoy the game. Some people might enjoy the game, but the goal is still to make some money from it. You're not required to try to make a living from it. I hate when people try to use that argument. It doesn't have to be so black and white. Why can't I just make a few extra bucks from playing a game a few hours a day?

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That's my problem with this 'game'. I'm trying to play the game aspect of this 'game' but the money part plays such a role that you simply can't. It's really not fun to sit there and think of how much money you're wasting by doing such and such or if going out to play the game (hunting) will break your peds today.

You'd honestly get more enjoyment from playing a normal subscription based game if your goal is to play a game. $15 on EU would get you maybe 4-5 days of shooting things with an opalo. Most of the people I talk to spend $15 at a minimum a week. The 'game' is literally designed to make it so you lose money on each hunt, which is to expected for a gambling system, but as a game that's horrible.

So this 'game' is more like poker than a game. Which is a shame since the game aspect is really unique and interesting.

Jrgsubzero said:

That's my problem with this 'game'. I'm trying to play the game aspect of this 'game' but the money part plays such a role that you simply can't. It's really not fun to sit there and think of how much money you're wasting by doing such and such or if going out to play the game (hunting) will break your peds today.

You'd honestly get more enjoyment from playing a normal subscription based game if your goal is to play a game. $15 on EU would get you maybe 4-5 days of shooting things with an opalo.

So this 'game' is more like poker than a game. Which is a shame since the game aspect is really unique and interesting.

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There is certainly an "issue" with new players depositing $10 and getting $5 back hunting beginner mobs.

Players with a $100 bankroll can ride out the bad waves, and average out, but this kills new players like RAID.

Puny mobs were a partial answer to this, and a welcome one, but you can tell a new player it works out over time, but if they log out and go to play WOW thats that and as someone who spent a lot of time at Swamp Camp years ago, it was very noticeable.

This is why we have 20k players and not 200k players.

Mega said:

There is certainly an "issue" with new players depositing $10 and getting $5 back hunting beginner mobs.

Players with a $100 bankroll can ride out the bad waves, and average out, but this kills new players like RAID.

Puny mobs were a partial answer to this, and a welcome one, but you can tell a new player it works out over time, but if they log out and go to play WOW thats that and as someone who spent a lot of time at Swamp Camp years ago, it was very noticeable.

This is why we have 20k players and not 200k players.

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What's good about puny mobs? They don't seem to drop any good loot.

I haven't spent anything on the game yet and so far it is my second day. Literally 5 minutes out of the tutorial my weapons broke and the only solace I had was people telling me to buy peds. Seriously? 40 minutes into the game and I'm expected to drop cash? And my only other option is to do a horribly boring and menial task for 4 hours just so I can feel cheated on my next 30 minute hunt trip?

I've been doing my best trying to give this 'game' a fair chance. I've been doing the awful sweating, of which it takes about as long to sell the stuff as it does to get it. I have to TT everything I loot as I'll never have big enough stacks to auction them off due to ammo upkeep, which causes me to lose even more money.

I can't expect much help from people since they'd be literally giving away real money, but I'd think if real money wasn't attached to every single thing in the game that it wouldn't be so hard to start out in the first place.

Mindark, I'm not here to try to profit off of your 'game'. I just want to play it. Please devise a way for me to do so without feeling like I'm burning cash with every shot.

Jrgsubzero said:

What's good about puny mobs? They don't seem to drop any good loot.

I haven't spent anything on the game yet and so far it is my second day. Literally 5 minutes out of the tutorial my weapons broke and the only solace I had was people telling me to buy peds. Seriously? 40 minutes into the game and I'm expected to drop cash? And my only other option is to do a horribly boring and menial task for 4 hours just so I can feel cheated on my next 30 minute hunt trip?

I've been doing my best trying to give this 'game' a fair chance. I've been doing the awful sweating, of which it takes about as long to sell the stuff as it does to get it. I have to TT everything I loot as I'll never have big enough stacks to auction them off due to ammo upkeep, which causes me to lose even more money.

I can't expect much help from people since they'd be literally giving away real money, but I'd think if real money wasn't attached to every single thing in the game that it wouldn't be so hard to start out in the first place.

Mindark, I'm not here to try to profit off of your 'game'. I just want to play it. Please devise a way for me to do so without feeling like I'm burning cash with every shot.

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Well assuming that when you read about the game before you started playing it, you would have seen the difference between this game and others is that it is RCE. So if you dont want to sweat or collect stones and fruit, you have to add C to the RCE..

Good luck out there.

EMW said:

Well assuming that when you read about the game before you started playing it, you would have seen the difference between this game and others is that it is RCE. So if you dont want to sweat or collect stones and fruit, you have to add C to the RCE..

Good luck out there.

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Sure did! Just didn't know how involved it was. I thought it was more like Second Life, but as it stands, you can do a heck of a lot more in that game. :S That's not to say I -want- to quit and play other games.

But it seems if I were to spend $15 that once I use that up for enjoyment I'm done until I spend more cash. You have to play like a frugal maniac and that is not the epitome of fun. I want to try mining and crafting, maybe even different types of weapons. But I laugh at the thought because I know how much money I'd have to spend or how many days of sweating it'd take. In normal games you're free to do what you want, here I feel like I'm encased a hot metal box but every now and again I can stick my finger through a tiny hole to feel a nice cool breeze on it.

This 'game' seems to be for people with a lot of disposable income, as talks with people who spend absurds amounts of money weekly have shown me. (And those people aren't even that well off in-game!!)

Seems some things can resemble real life.

If one was wanting to get to a particular place..

1 With no $ you can walk maybe find something valuable on the way or maybe not. Scratching for a living and proceed along the way. It'll take time.

2 With a few $ you can take the bus, take in the sights in a certain level of comfort and get there a ways faster.

3 With some more dollars, hire/buy a car go at your own speed within reason knowing that you have a lot of control over your timing, and comfort levels, stay in a motel as needed.

4 With a pile of money you can fly, overnighting if needed if luxury.

Like some many things both in life and the game, the amount of resources you have available to commit may have a certain bearing on the duration and facilities available on your journey.

There is no best way. Each of the methods are viable, and can have their own attractions. Such as above we may have limitations based on our circumstances, some people can choose all of the options, some are limited the the more frugal. Limitations on choice doesn't however make any version more valid than another. So it is with the game.

Jrgsubzero said:

What's good about puny mobs? They don't seem to drop any good loot.

I haven't spent anything on the game yet and so far it is my second day. Literally 5 minutes out of the tutorial my weapons broke and the only solace I had was people telling me to buy peds. Seriously? 40 minutes into the game and I'm expected to drop cash? And my only other option is to do a horribly boring and menial task for 4 hours just so I can feel cheated on my next 30 minute hunt trip?

I've been doing my best trying to give this 'game' a fair chance. I've been doing the awful sweating, of which it takes about as long to sell the stuff as it does to get it. I have to TT everything I loot as I'll never have big enough stacks to auction them off due to ammo upkeep, which causes me to lose even more money.

I can't expect much help from people since they'd be literally giving away real money, but I'd think if real money wasn't attached to every single thing in the game that it wouldn't be so hard to start out in the first place.

Mindark, I'm not here to try to profit off of your 'game'. I just want to play it. Please devise a way for me to do so without feeling like I'm burning cash with every shot.

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Thank you for replying in your 2nd day here, there is no doubt in my mind that the first week in any MMORPG is the hardest, and I felt completely out of joint for first month.

I'd like to say just take it easy and dont spend too much, talk to people, read the forum as you've obviously done, this is not your "typical" MMO.

There are problems with how items "used to work" and how they now work (eg old skool weapon / faps") but who now tells new players about this, and how do they find out about it?

Mentorship (good mentorship not farming) used to help, but thats been gone for nearly 2 years.

Sub Zero, best advice I could give with the absence of mentoring, is join a society and listen to the chatter, wait for the jigsaw pieces to settle.

Mega said:

Thank you for replying in your 2nd day here, there is no doubt in my mind that the first week in any MMORPG is the hardest, and I felt completely out of joint for first month.

I'd like to say just take it easy and dont spend too much, talk to people, read the forum as you've obviously done, this is not your "typical" MMO.

There are problems with how items "used to work" and how they now work (eg old skool weapon / faps") but who now tells new players about this, and how do they find out about it?

Mentorship (good mentorship not farming) used to help, but thats been gone for nearly 2 years.

Sub Zero, best advice I could give with the absence of mentoring, is join a society and listen to the chatter, wait for the jigsaw pieces to settle.

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First week in most mmorpgs is usually easy since they're all the same nowadays.

But my problem is not learning how to play so to speak, if I could just run around and shoot anything that moves I'd play it by ear and learn as I go.

But I'm having trouble with earning the money to go hunting for even an hour at a time, my main issue is the way the economy works but that won't change nor will I (directly) ask it to.

Being unemployed it is totally within my power to devote the time it takes to be a free-player but unlike most games where the scenario is time vs. money, here it is way more imbalanced and I'd be spending a lot of time to do even the simplest of things.

Experiment was a failure.

Nothing to do with BlackHawk, he had only the best intention, in fact he should have been sponsored.

He stepped up to the plate, few did.

Damn. Says certain things. Respect is due.

The experiment was a fail for many reasons. One of the participant proved to be a scammer later on and he did nothing to actually play. Some of the participants had little time to play. And Jennson actually played the game and failed.

However, he still plays the game now and he learned few things that made him write one of the best guides on Arkadia forum about how you can play on a budget. So maybe it was not a total fail after all.... One can still learn a thing or 2.

Edit:
I still get PM's about how to do this or that.
Best is to read here:
http://www.arkadiaforum.com/showthr...-Entropia-A-newcomer-guide.&highlight=hunting