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FYI: Time for FPC to reclaim the abandoned apartments

DeeDee said:
It would not change my behaviour, I'd still not pay my rent.
I (hardly) play Entropia without depositing, and with something in game having a monthly fee is very contra productive in a 'free' game.
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They've gone away from the 'free to play' marketing ploy.

Planet Calypso takes the MMORPG genre to an exciting new level. With No Subscription Fees, you can Download the Free Software now, and join a real economic action-adventure as a human colonist on a distant alien world
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mastermesh said:
I'm curious how much of a startbid Neverdie is going to put on the apartments on the Rock? I suspect it'll be above 300 peds but under 1k...?
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Now this is a good question! I'm guessing around 750 PED to start.
 
While it does suck that there is so much "property" (whether apts., shops, equipment, etc.) that seems to be in the hands of "dead avatars", I believe it would be wrong to confiscate anything "for the good of the people".

Dead apts., LAs, etc. are the occasional price we pay for allowing private property, whether IRL or ingame.
 
:scratch2: Why stop at the appartements?
If somebody has an item and not spent repair bills with it in 6 months, he get's the TT value and it gets recycled.
Bad idea?
I think there is not that much of a difference in a gun,armour,tool or an appartment, no one should be forced to pay "taxes" for something he does not use. There are quite a few available appartements out there, if you look how the prices on them fall, rather more then needed. Sure would it be cool if everyone could get a G appartement, but if everyone can get an unlimited number of everything, where is the investment and the market?
If somebody bought a few appartements for a few K 5 years ago and has still not sold them, this means that his PEDs are still bound in the economy and he has not sold out.
Sure sucks, would also like a cheap G appartment, but then again I really do not need one right now and with more storage area on more planets, I doubt I ever will.
 
thoreau said:
They've gone away from the 'free to play' marketing ploy.
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thoreau, seriously... get a grip!



The game is indeed free to download, and free to play. You are not forced to deposit by MA/FPC thugs.

Is certainly is NOT a "free-to-play, gimme-the-rights-to-squat-an-empty-apartment, lower-apartments-prices-below-a-certain-level" game.
 
on squatting...

As far as apartment squatting goes... any apartment with the estate broker as the owner still has a door that's operational... and you can drop stuff on the balcony of those any time you want. Yes, others can come and pick them up, but what do you expect when you are homeless and trying to claim another avatar's place?!? ;)

If you look on the auction, you can even find some boxes... buy some of those, stick your stuff in it, and go live on someone's balcony. Don't like being homeless? Stop complaining and buy a deed! :)
 
Originally bought an apartment to fully furnish, and decorate it as a place to hang out with people. However as time went on I found that it was rarely ever used - other than the occasional nosey people wandering in. So scrapping that idea, it began to be act as an extended storage for items (such as guns, armour, interesting looted items etc) that I rarely use. All arranged in a presentable way for those curious enough to visit storeroom. ;)

After VU 10, all items were bunged into storage boxes, and I've not yet got around to redecorating. Like Pirx said, it's best waiting until the decorating system is fully working again. Then maybe I'll redo it... heh, that'll be a fun and expensive weekend.

I know there's a lot of unused apartments, and I think that a large proportion of them have their deeds in now inactive/locked avatars. The initial price of them set by MindArk was 250PED, so I think it's only fair to refund that (what can be considered) "TT value" and stick the deeds back on auction for those of us who actually play. I mean imagine if all the avatars owning apartments stopped playing (as an example). It would mean areas/part of the game would be completely unused and pointless. May as well recycle them.

Or, if FPC is feeling somewhat needy in funds, they could just copy/paste an apartment complex, add a new TP and put them on auction. Even if it costs them 155,000PED to place a new TP (heh), they'd still make a profit. ;)

But no retaking from active avatars. I like my yearly extra MindArk gift! :laugh: Though I vow to sell my apartment on auction before leaving this game for good!
 
Amenophis said:
Lol. I would like a fee for neurons that are not used. That would save the world from poverty. Above average neuron users should be payed by the ones below average for the effort of keeping the trend over that of the monkeys.
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Not sure what hes saying, but is there any left of what he ate ?
 
thoreau said:
Here is a challenge - if you have an apartment that you're not using and you want to sell it - list it for TT+250 PEDs with no buyout and let the free market decide the price.
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Interestingly enough, you made this post a little under ten hours ago.

This apartment with a SB of TT+0.99 and no buyout has been on auction for about twelve hours. :wtg:

Beta North, 10D
Current Bid TT+3.99
Current High Bidder: Mono Chrome Monochrome

Time Remaining: 5:11:35


I look forward to bidding against you for free market price!!! :yay:
 
The problem is people bouth those flat...
If MA take them back its stealing...

if i have a weapon that i didnt use since years in my storage , should MA take them back because i dont decay them often enought ?
 
Arokh said:
I know there's a lot of unused apartments, and I think that a large proportion of them have their deeds in now inactive/locked avatars. The initial price of them set by MindArk was 250PED, so I think it's only fair to refund that (what can be considered) "TT value" and stick the deeds back on auction for those of us who actually play. I mean imagine if all the avatars owning apartments stopped playing (as an example). It would mean areas/part of the game would be completely unused and pointless. May as well recycle them.

Or, if FPC is feeling somewhat needy in funds, they could just copy/paste an apartment complex, add a new TP and put them on auction. Even if it costs them 155,000PED to place a new TP (heh), they'd still make a profit. ;)
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Aren't appartments recycled, when the ava gets deleted after it has been deemed abandoned (after 720 days) ?
If you really abandon your ava for that long, recycling sounds fair to my.
But taking away an investment just because I do not use it, sounds to me, like Etopia said, like stealing.
 
Yay!!! Another apartment-whining thread!!! :yay:

Breaks up the monotony of all the sweat-whining threads. :yay:

Why is it that everyone who doesn't want to pay for stuff figures MA should make it virtually free and everyone who wants something for nothing figures that MA should make the free stuff worth soo much more?

There are estates for sale all of the time, buy one. Then, you can feel the thrill of paying $10/month for a bigger storage unit like everyone else.


And before anyone goes down the "lost revenues" path any farther, consider that you are talking about $1 per month per apartment. Seriously??? If MA actually cared, all they would have to do is cut and paste in a whole bunch of new apartment buildings. Their whole marketing plan is based around "making real world money playing a video game". The only way to do that is by buying / hoarding / driving up the price / and reselling.
 
Chrome said:
Interestingly enough, you made this post a little under ten hours ago.

This apartment with a SB of TT+0.99 and no buyout has been on auction for about twelve hours. :wtg:

Beta North, 10D
Current Bid TT+3.99
Current High Bidder: Mono Chrome Monochrome

Time Remaining: 5:11:35


I look forward to bidding against you for free market price!!! :yay:
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Who wants to live on a rock?
 
Rumsponge said:
Why is it that everyone who doesn't want to pay for stuff figures MA should make it virtually free and everyone who wants something for nothing figures that MA should make the free stuff worth soo much more?
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I absolutely want to pay for an apartment. I want to pay a price is is reflective of the actual market value. Not some inflated price that is because thousands of players have abandoned apartments resulting is skewed supply.
 
thoreau said:
Who wants to live on a rock?
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You issue a clear challenge for an APARTMENT to have a start bid under TT+250 with no buyout...

The challenge is met...

And you still whine. :lolup:


Soooooooo what's the matter with an apartment on a rock? You've apparently been living under one for long enough. :scratch2:

So now, in addition to a low price, you have have other stipulations on where you want to buy?!?


It can't be off Calypso? Does it need to be a "window" A/B/E/F apartment, or can it be a balcony C/D apartment? Do you need a view? What floor? Do you want water nearby, or do you prefer the mountains? Does it need to be near a teleporter? What if it's a long walk to the auction house? Do you want it in Genesis Amethera near New Oxford so you don't have to run anywhere to get a new TP?


The harsh reality I know you don't want to admit is...

All of those things I just listed above add VALUE.



Go live on an assteroid, it'll suit you just fine. :rolleyes:
 
I absolutely want to pay for an apartment. I want to pay a price is is reflective of the actual market value. Not some inflated price that is because thousands of players have abandoned apartments resulting is skewed supply.
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If you want to absolutely pay a price reflective of actual market value, you might look at in game market value... those are prices that people paid for the apartments on the auction... many times on auctions with very low start bids that were increased in the last few minutes.

if you don't like this game, and it's real cash economy, there's a lot of other freebie games out there with pretend gold.
 
I absolutely want to pay for an apartment. I want to pay a price is is reflective of the actual market value. Not some inflated price that is because thousands of players have abandoned apartments resulting is skewed supply.
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The PRICE/VALUE of any item ingame here under estates is what
ever the MARKET/PLAYERS are willing to pay for that particular item. ​

So if the appartment is sold for 600 ped that the current price for that particular apparment.

For an prespective apparments in Billton Towers and on CND have had a higher price than the others.

I all so remember that there was a lot of apparments for sale from MA on the auction before at flat price 250, but I think these was removed to trigger the estate maket.
 
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If you are bickering over the difference between $25 and $40 when buying the appartment then i don't pick you for the type that will pay their $1 rent each month either.

For the record I own 2 appartments in TI. 1 plat 1 gold. The gold one i use as storage and pay only when i need it. The platinum one has been paid since the day i purchased it and in advance for the next 18 months.

What everyone else decides to do with their appartments is up to them
 
Harald said:
The PRICE/VALUE of any item ingame here under estates is what
ever the MARKET/PLAYERS are willing to pay for that particular item. ​


So if the appartment is sold for 600 ped that the current price for that particular apparment.
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If a person pays 1000 PED for an apartment that does not mean that the market price for ALL apartments is 1000 PED. It only means that ONE person was willing to pay that amount of money for that apartment at that time.

What we see with regards to apartment prices is NOT market value - but rather market price:

Market value is a concept distinct from market price, which is “the price at which one can transact”, while market value is “the true underlying value” according to theoretical standards.
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Market price is the economic price for which a good or service is offered in the marketplace. It is of interest mainly in the study of microeconomics. Market value and market price are equal only under conditions of market efficiency, equilibrium, and rational expectations.
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thoreau said:
If a person pays 1000 PED for an apartment that does not mean that the market price for ALL apartments is 1000 PED. It only means that ONE person was willing to pay that amount of money for that apartment at that time.

What we see with regards to apartment prices is NOT market value - but rather market price:
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Hello? Did you read what I wrote?

I said that it was the price of that particular item meaning G apparment at Bilton Towers may have one price and E apparment at Omegatron W. Hab. has another price...

Therefore; The market price is what people wants to pay for it.
 
thoreau said:
I absolutely want to pay for an apartment. I want to pay a price is is reflective of the actual market value. Not some inflated price that is because thousands of players have abandoned apartments resulting is skewed supply.
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I doubt that we even have thousands of apartements. It is an estate that interrests an very small minority of players. And the numbers that are in the hand of brokers is even smaller.
Why don't you simply admit, that you want the apartement of your dreams for the price you think it is worth it and the sellers do not want to part with it for that price, because they do not want to make losses on their investment ?
I would also like one of those houses at the beach, preferably in TI, but somehow I never had the idea, that because they are empty and not used, one should force the owner to lose it, just because I am not willing to shell out a few K for it.
Maybe I should really ask Deathfier to sell me one of those nice looking ones NE of TI, they are empty and unsold anyway. I am sure that he would undersand that it is better to sell it to me for 500 PEDs is better than to wait for a serious buyer :D
 
thoreau said:
If a person pays 1000 PED for an apartment that does not mean that the market price for ALL apartments is 1000 PED. It only means that ONE person was willing to pay that amount of money for that apartment at that time.
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And equally if 1 person is not willing to pay that price at that time that doesn't mean that the item is overpriced.

Lets just clarify that 1 man (ie. you) is not the entire market. If these prices were unacceptable then people wouldn't pay it. But since such a large number of people (the actual market) buy and sell these appartments regularly at a price that you think is unfair we have a different scenario.

The market (everyone else) operates as usual. And 1 loner (hmm you again) stands on the side crying wishing he could hang with the cool kids. :cry:
 
I doubt that we even have thousands of apartements. It is an estate that interrests an very small minority of players. And the numbers that are in the hand of brokers is even smaller.
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Yep... There's quite a few locations in some buildings that MA should re-design ASAP... Have not gone up the hill in a while, but the last time I did here's what was in Beta Building at Omegaton...
beta2.jpg


Maybe you folks looking for a cheapy booth or apartment should look for places like that and beg MA to sell them to you? There's several shops that have no estate terminals in some of the buildings around town too... of course they might have an overabundance of booths in those buildings, but really, there's potential...
 
addz said:
And equally if 1 person is not willing to pay that price at that time that doesn't mean that the item is overpriced.

Lets just clarify that 1 man (ie. you) is not the entire market. If these prices were unacceptable then people wouldn't pay it. But since such a large number of people (the actual market) buy and sell these appartments regularly at a price that you think is unfair we have a different scenario.

The market (everyone else) operates as usual. And 1 loner (hmm you again) stands on the side crying wishing he could hang with the cool kids. :cry:
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I disagree that a 'large' number of people buy and sell these apartments. According to auction stats around 2.32 estate deeds are transferred every day. Over the course of a year that is 848 estate transactions. That is for ALL estates. Not exactly 'large' numbers.
 
Over the course of a year that is 848 estate transactions. That is for ALL estates. Not exactly 'large' numbers.
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Most estate sales are done in threads here or in person to person sales or shop sales... the market value in game is for auction sales only. Most folks don't like paying auction fees on big items if they can help it.
 
thoreau said:
I absolutely want to pay for an apartment. I want to pay a price is is reflective of the actual market value.
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thoreau said:
What we see with regards to apartment prices is NOT market value - but rather market price:
Click to expand...

Quote:
Market value is a concept distinct from market price, which is “the price at which one can transact”, while market value is “the true underlying value” according to theoretical standards.

Quote:
Market price is the economic price for which a good or service is offered in the marketplace. It is of interest mainly in the study of microeconomics. Market value and market price are equal only under conditions of market efficiency, equilibrium, and rational expectations.






According to all the blather you posted, you WANT to pay a price for an apartment at actual market value.

However, you clearly state that IN REALITY apartments are sold based on market price, due to the fact they are indeed all different... different layouts, different sizes, different locations, different views out the window, different distance from TP and auction house, etc etc etc.


So, by your own definition, apartments will NEVER be sold "at a price reflective of the actual market value", because each one is unique and cannot be compared equally.


What you want is impossible.


Out of the goodness of my heart, I've selected a theme song for you to play in the background while you surf auction on EU looking for an apartment... enjoy!!!

[YOUTUBE]XAYhNHhxN0A[/YOUTUBE]



By the way, Treasure Island Silver Building - 9F has been on auction for a few days, start bid TT+0.99, currently at TT+251.99... not like you'll actually bid on it anyways.
 
Chrome said:
However, you clearly state that IN REALITY apartments are sold based on market price, due to the fact they are indeed all different... different layouts, different sizes, different locations, different views out the window, different distance from TP and auction house, etc etc etc.
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I never said this.

I posted that market value is the true underlying value. Market price is what the good is going for in the market today.

There is little difference between B apartments in the same building within maybe 10 floors. So those apartments should have the same value.

But if you watch auction you'll see one person list a B apartment with a starting bid of +300. Then you'll see another person list a B apartment a few floors away with a starting bid of +400.

There is no difference in the value of those apartments. The difference is in the price.
 
Chrome said:
By the way, Treasure Island Silver Building - 9F has been on auction for a few days, start bid TT+0.99, currently at TT+251.99... not like you'll actually bid on it anyways.
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I guess your too stupid to realize that I am the one with the TT+251.99 bid.

Idiot.
 
I never said this.

I posted that market value is the true underlying value. Market price is what the good is going for in the market today.

There is little difference between B apartments in the same building within maybe 10 floors. So those apartments should have the same value.

But if you watch auction you'll see one person list a B apartment with a starting bid of +300. Then you'll see another person list a B apartment a few floors away with a starting bid of +400.

There is no difference in the value of those apartments. The difference is in the price.
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I hate dragging this thread on with another post.. but different floors make a big difference. When I had an apartment on floor 01 or 10 (I've had both), it's a lot easier for myself and anyone else then someplace on floor 06 or 12, etc. coming to the place since there's only one click on the televator. If you run a shop in an apartment where you have a shopkeeper, it's hard to get people up there, so every single thing you can do to make it easier for the customer is something worth paying for...
 
thoreau said:
But if you watch auction you'll see one person list a B apartment with a starting bid of +300. Then you'll see another person list a B apartment a few floors away with a starting bid of +400.

There is no difference in the value of those apartments. The difference is in the price.
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There is a difference in value in the apartments... same as a bunch of similar houses in a neighborhood all near each other. Some have a better yard, some have a better view, some are right next to the highway.

Because people perceive a different value for the houses in this scenario, the prices are different. Same with the apartments.





thoreau said:
I guess your too stupid to realize that I am the one with the TT+251.99 bid.

Idiot.
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No, I'm not stupid, and I'm not an idiot. I just didn't bother to look at the bidders.

No need to be rude, I haven't called you any names. :D


Good luck, I estimate that particular apartment will go between 550-650 ped... minimum.

I hope I'm wrong, and you get it for whatever number you have your heart set on... I'll be watching. :cool:
 
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