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the REAL profession level for maxing items (weapons)

DuncanS

DuncanS

Guardian
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Oct 26, 2007
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Poland
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Duncan DS Freedom II Sentrus
Entropedia states that TT fist (Castorian EnKnuckles-A) is maxed at level 5.

That's correct. Partially. Yes, at level 5 (Brawler) you do max: damage interval, hit ability, critical hit ability. At this point SIB no longer works.

However, you still haven't got attacks per minute maxed.

I believe there should be another column for that one. Maybe in SIB column instead of boolean (Yes/No) we should use float and insert "0" or "n/a" for ones without SIB and levels for another. "Maxed lvl" column could then do what it's name obligates to: show at what level you're capable of using 100% of item.

Cheers, DS

P.S.
Here's a screenie:
eu_not_maxed_tt_fist.jpg
 
I think you can create that column in entropedia yourself, right now? :S

Reloads usually stick to a common rule, but even having that column it takes people to fill it in. There are problems where reloads don't increase linearly the same way HA and dmg does (all current dps data assumes you are maxed on reload). YOu also need to need every weapon stat to be filled, or you get a disjunctive formula (having some weapons with maxed reload figures and other's without will causes problems in comparison (which would be the whole point of adding the column and not just creating your own spreadsheet and calculating it that way.


If you have a succinct solution to the above issues, I am sure it will be a welcomed addition.
 
I probably could add a column myself but wanna consult with people before altering anything :)

I might check it later, because now I have lots of exams to take care of, but it will be going through my mind, I'm sure. Like I said many times on EF, MA has some favorite formulas they apply to different things, so it might be possible. I'll let you know.

Still, if someone figured that out already it would be a good thing to share.
 
Entropedia assumes that reload speed maxes 20 (or was it 25%?) after the SIB period of the weapon in question.

It also takes into account this value.

So everything is working as it should be.
 
Hijacker27 said:
Entropedia assumes that reload speed maxes 20 (or was it 25%?) after the SIB period of the weapon in question.

It also takes into account this value.

So everything is working as it should be.
Click to expand...

Hmm, you are right some of those weapons work, but definitely not working for powerfists and other melee

After some investigation, I fOund that the column "maxed" needs have a valid field, or the formulation is as described in my previous post.

Examples:
powerclaw Mk6 (no max declared)
Dragons breath (no max declared)
dai-katana (max declared)
XT (max declared)
 
DuncanS said:
Entropedia states that TT fist (Castorian EnKnuckles-A) is maxed at level 5.

That's correct. Partially. Yes, at level 5 (Brawler) you do max: damage interval, hit ability, critical hit ability. At this point SIB no longer works.

However, you still haven't got attacks per minute maxed.

I believe there should be another column for that one. Maybe in SIB column instead of boolean (Yes/No) we should use float and insert "0" or "n/a" for ones without SIB and levels for another. "Maxed lvl" column could then do what it's name obligates to: show at what level you're capable of using 100% of item.

Cheers, DS

P.S.
Here's a screenie:
eu_not_maxed_tt_fist.jpg
Click to expand...

Is your Brawler (dmg) at level 5 as well?

Menace
 
As you can see from the screenie - no, my Dmg Brawler is not lvl 5. It's about lvl 8 or sth like that. Will check it later if you need precise data.
 
Immortal said:
Hmm, you are right some of those weapons work, but definitely not working for powerfists and other melee

After some investigation, I fOund that the column "maxed" needs have a valid field, or the formulation is as described in my previous post.

Examples:
powerclaw Mk6 (no max declared)
Dragons breath (no max declared)
dai-katana (max declared)
XT (max declared)
Click to expand...

Well of course, the formula is based off of the user inputted data, which in some cases is incorrect. The 'maxed' field should ONLY be for when the SIB period goes from 'yes' to 'not any more', which is just AFTER the HA ticks over from 9.9 to 10.0 (or the damage is finally maxed). Some of the data is inputted by people that don't know how to do this correctly, as with most of the (L) faps, people have been inputting the data as for when the uses/min is maxed, which is incorrect.

These people are to blame, and not the website.
 
Hijacker27 said:
Well of course, the formula is based off of the user inputted data, which in some cases is incorrect. The 'maxed' field should ONLY be for when the SIB period goes from 'yes' to 'not any more', which is just AFTER the HA ticks over from 9.9 to 10.0 (or the damage is finally maxed). Some of the data is inputted by people that don't know how to do this correctly, as with most of the (L) faps, people have been inputting the data as for when the uses/min is maxed, which is incorrect.

These people are to blame, and not the website.
Click to expand...

The website is to blame if it doesn't tell you what it needs :)
 
Hijacker27 said:
Well of course, the formula is based off of the user inputted data, which in some cases is incorrect. The 'maxed' field should ONLY be for when the SIB period goes from 'yes' to 'not any more', which is just AFTER the HA ticks over from 9.9 to 10.0 (or the damage is finally maxed). Some of the data is inputted by people that don't know how to do this correctly, as with most of the (L) faps, people have been inputting the data as for when the uses/min is maxed, which is incorrect.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure you understand what I mean. The thing is that on the site it's said that EnKnuckles are maxed at level 5. That is correct for SIBs, (Hit Ability, Critical Hit Ability and Damage) but maxing out SIB does NOT mean that you have maxed out the weapon because you don't reach max Attacks Per Min. So Entropedia shows when SIB is maxed correctly BUT it doesn't mean that WHOLE weapon is maxed. Only few attributes affected by SIB.

EDIT: Other-words, level at which SIB is maxed is a valuable info, BUT I'd also like to know at what level I would have maxed my weapon (not SIB!)! Those are 2 separate things!
 
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DuncanS said:
As you can see from the screenie - no, my Dmg Brawler is not lvl 5. It's about lvl 8 or sth like that. Will check it later if you need precise data.
Click to expand...

I assumed your Dmg was above lvl 5. HOWEVER, there was the slight chance that you chipped up to get your hit to lvl 5 but left your Dmg below lvl 5. then again.... I guess Hit is what affects your attacks/min anyway....

Menace
 
DuncanS said:
EDIT: Other-words, level at which SIB is maxed is a valuable info, BUT I'd also like to know at what level I would have maxed my weapon (not SIB!)! Those are 2 separate things!
Click to expand...
Hijacker27 said:
Entropedia assumes that reload speed maxes 20 (or was it 25%?) after the SIB period of the weapon in question.

It also takes into account this value.

So everything is working as it should be.
Click to expand...
But now I dont know if these figures are correct but seems to be from experience..


And about no max SIB levels for power claw Mk.6 maybe no one have had one maxed out and thought of adding it, as it's not every day you see power claw Mk.x (sure seems to been more low ones(Mk.2) lately tho)
And is the math correct for every weapon so you can calculate it?
 
jenny ferr said:
But now I dont know if these figures are correct but seems to be from experience..


And about no max SIB levels for power claw Mk.6 maybe no one have had one maxed out and thought of adding it, as it's not every day you see power claw Mk.x (sure seems to been more low ones(Mk.2) lately tho)
And is the math correct for every weapon so you can calculate it?
Click to expand...

Quite possibly nobody who has had one as also known about entropedia, its not exactly a common items in the Entropia universe. It is craftable item with no known blueprint recipe. But... given that a bunch of these will be handed out as second prizes in teh tournament, we should be able to learn more about its levels.
 
I'm 100% sure you guys are right with the high-level-super-sweet weapons (that they have no data on entropedia because almost nobody uses them, and if they do, they don't brag about it on the site)

However, what we really need is to check what's up with whole maxing the weapon thing. I'll soon check at what level those EnKnuckles are maxed and will tell you.

If anyone is close to maximizing their weapon/tool/whatever BUT have some item specs NOT maxed AND have already passed SIB period: please post what's the item, at what level SIB ends and at what level did you really max it out (and what was the attribute that needed over-SIB skilling). This could be very helpful.

Also, the question from the first post is still open: Who's for making another column to separate level at which SIB is maxed and level at which ITEM is maxed? Anybody against? Why?
 
img_20100929_21_23_01_288.jpg


for me the apis is not maxed yet, im over 31 blp hit & damage.

need more rifle skill or the reload is related to another skill :confused:
 
DuncanS said:
EDIT: Other-words, level at which SIB is maxed is a valuable info, BUT I'd also like to know at what level I would have maxed my weapon (not SIB!)! Those are 2 separate things!
Click to expand...

25% after SIB has ended.. duh.

If SIB starts at level 10, and ends at level 20, then you'll have it fully maxed at level 22.5.

A column doesn't need to be added, because the info is calculated, but perhaps a field should be added that shows the 'fully maxed' level in the item's info screen for those that are too lazy to read.
 
Hijacker27 said:
25% after SIB has ended.. duh.

If SIB starts at level 10, and ends at level 20, then you'll have it fully maxed at level 22.5.

A column doesn't need to be added, because the info is calculated, but perhaps a field should be added that shows the 'fully maxed' level in the item's info screen for those that are too lazy to read.
Click to expand...

Last time I checked, 25% of 20 was 5 :) Or maybe it's 25% of level at which SIB starts? :)

I've been using Entropedia for a long, long time and haven't really seen anything about items maxed at SIB+25%. I don't say that it's not out there, but WHERE is that information anyway? You mind showing where exactly is the thing I'm too lazy to read?

Yeah, well a field on item page is OK, BUT people sometimes use the table (item comparison) to find an eco weapon they have skills to use at 100% or anything like that. You must agree that a column stating 'maxed' is pretty confusing, ain't it? Especially for newbies, because ones playing long enough can figure out things on their own.

Besides, I may be no top player but, like I said before, I do spend lots of time on research in EU, looking for useful data on Entropedia, making a site using some of Entropedia info and I haven't for once seen any information about the "real maxed level". Anywhere. So if there IS one, point it out for me :) Maybe I've really missed it somewhere but if I've missed it so many times and for such a long time, maybe it SHOULD be more "exposed", right?

(Hope this does not sound harsh :) No mean no disrespect :smoke: )
 
DuncanS said:
Yeah, well a field on item page is OK, BUT people sometimes use the table (item comparison) to find an eco weapon they have skills to use at 100% or anything like that. You must agree that a column stating 'maxed' is pretty confusing, ain't it? Especially for newbies, because ones playing long enough can figure out things on their own.
Click to expand...
Making the "true" maxing the stats in these list will be much much more confusing for people and making some edit in some other data and shortly making the lists useless depending on so many confused values added.
The current system is perfectly clear to everyone, no need to change (maybe add that % in a more eye catching way tho)

And sure you use those list, but then when you go in and buy a weapon or tool, dont you look at it's stats in the game??
sorry to say but do you rely so much on a page anyone can edit you shouldn't complain about making a faulty purchase or what it is you're afraid of...
it's two clicks with your mouse before buying to see your own stats on anything in game...

And a newbie who are so eco seeking and that dont get the eco is less when the reload isn't maxed should also do his study again or ask his mentors for better advice...

ENTROPEDIA is a great source of information and other useful tips and trick but dont forget it's the community and not MA who made it what it is
 
Hijacker27 said:
25% after SIB has ended.. duh.
Click to expand...

NB VIII starts lvl 11, HA=10.0 @ 34, 0.25*(34-11)+34=4.6

Chip maxes attacks at least 0.4 before that formula predicts >.>

Don't get me started on NB VII :p

DuncanS said:
Last time I checked, 25% of 20 was 5 :) Or maybe it's 25% of level at which SIB starts? :)
Click to expand...

25% of the SIB interval, not 25% of the profession level that HA=10.0

(see above calc)
 
Calculations for reload are in the discussion tab (although I found an error in it, so I shall correct that). It is set to be maxed 25% after learning period. I am not sure if this is correct, or if it is the same for all weapons, I think I only checked it for 2 or 3 weapons. So some extra data is welcome.

I could make the additional data available in a tool tip.
 
Would be lovely, thanks Witte. :)

@jenny
Actually, I don't even buy weapons these days :) OFC everybody should double-check the info.
But sometimes newbies don't, sometimes people are to eager. Sometimes you can forget or whatever. The point is that this info really should be more "visible" :) exposed or how do you want to say it. I don't read EVERY (more like none :D ) discussion tab on Entropedia and I'm pretty sure most people don't.
I thought that discussion area is a place to ask for help and opinion and if ppl decide that info is correct and helpful - it should be put up front. So I really didn't feel the need to read every discussion on every page and every comment in it :)
 
Last edited:
Coop_ said:
Or at least appears to max attacks. It could be a rounding issue.
Click to expand...

Hmm, yes I never looked at this as the reason, or into this set of formulas (not sure why). I calculated using the above case that the rounding formula MA uses must therefore occur between 36.87 and 36.9 reloads (the profession levels I compared were37,8 and 38.2, 36.87 and 36.9 would be the reloads returned by the established formula

wtg programming geniuses@ MA -.-

I guess a minor detail in this rounding is if it is % based or numerically based (i.e. is the round-up switch consistently between 99.66% and 99.73%, or consistently between n-.13 n-.10 reloads
 
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