Mob-trains allowed during MM in order to ruin for other people?

Infinity01 said:

Based on my observation.. a person or a team who can't stand a mob train has virtually no chance in winning a position among top 10.......And if someone is really doing it intentionally to harrass a solo player... is just wasting his or her valuable time and resources.

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Right, but that doesn't make the perpetrator any less of an asshole.

I was pleased to get the last laugh on some of these mob trainers, yesterday. I'm not competing solo this year, i'm helping a cat3 team, but i also went to kill a few feffs near Isslye for a while, in hope of getting decent returns by playing eco while everybody else was wasting PED (and making some progress with iron challenge). I was just about to TP out, when a nearby team used a valk to run a load of feffs at me. I couldn't TP for being hit, so i just had to stay and kill the lot. Hehe, I suppose they thought that a noob in Settler was gonna go down like a skittle, then they could clean up after.

jay

zen said:

Big F***ing Lier!!!

Running hundreds of big ass feffi mobs around me in circle and asking me to "die pls". Will ya pay for my decay and time lost for your idiotic beahavior?
Ahhhh, you seems to lead this behavior for your team cause u stepped into discussion while I was asking to stop it and you also swear at someone who said that he/she is going to report.
I'm not going anywhere, u go get ur own freaking LA to mob train ..I wont step inside at all.

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do you have screenshots?

zen said:

Big F***ing Lier!!!

Running hundreds of big ass feffi mobs around me in circle and asking me to "die pls". Will ya pay for my decay and time lost for your idiotic beahavior?
Ahhhh, you seems to lead this behavior for your team cause u stepped into discussion while I was asking to stop it and you also swear at someone who said that he/she is going to report.
I'm not going anywhere, u go get ur own freaking LA to mob train ..I wont step inside at all.

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We're a big team, i'll make sure to repeat to the team what the conduct of fair play is.

I'm also running a Imp Fap Healing service so if anyone can provide a screen. I will personally heal for decay only for 2 hours.

Again, i'm just representing a team here and I only have good intentions in mind. So, please try to avoid personal comments.

We've participated in MM before in a big team with a similar strategy last year:

MM 2009 - positive thoughts
MM 2009 bonuses

The vehicles did bring a new dynamic, so we're trying to find a way to utilize those as well.

Anyway, feel free to post your screens of misconduct... and we'll figure something out.


Some

ruslan said:

There's nothing a good set of armor can't fix, Selling Angel SGA (11 Cold!) See my siggy for more details.

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There ya going again, Ruslan, using your riches to get together a really huge team, then handing out condescending advice to those who clearly don't have your kind of PED balance (which is most of us). Just the same as last year. Oh, and also claiming that its a team event, same as you did last year, and that solo players have no place in it and no cause for complaiint; and they should do same as you, or at very least keep out off your way.

well, you get 10/10 for arrogance, zero for comprehension. This was never intended as a team event, as FPC have admitted several times over. But they couldn't enforce a no-teaming rule, so , until they come up with a decent fix, they, and we, have just had to accept that teaming will happen. I've decided to take the "If you can't beat 'em join 'em" approach this year but ffs please don't make a virtue of it. Don;t look down your nose at the brave few who still try to solo it, and don't get all self-righteous about brushing them out of your way. Don't make out that this event was created for you and your kind. It wasn't, and you're only displaying your ignorance by repeatedly claiming that it was.

jay

Next year, maybe they can make it so there is multiple MMs going on at the same time... one for teams and one for solo. If you team, you are disqualified for solo and vice versa. If you get "support" from others in solo and get caught you get disqualified from solo. Not sure how they could make that happen... maybe some sort of special rules added to event/quest system. Event system needs more fine tuning anyways.

Since so many like mobtrains... They should also, in some other part of the year do like a mob train contest... would be fun, especially if it gets combined with taming when it comes back somehow - got to herd the mob and get them in to a fenced in area for this special event or something and then attempt taming after that... lots of ideas to play with.

Pioneer|FPC said:

Sorry for not posting in this matter earlier, but...

The Terms of Use did not cease to exist just because of Merry Mayhem.

Play nice.

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Well, our team stopped couse of shitspawn & mobtrainers on the other spawn.. never saw an FPC official (didn't they say thay would keep an eye out?)
EPIC FAIL, again.. untill you applie the ToU to ALL players!

This whole mob training also affected me. When I log in, see 10 ppl around me and few team's names globalling in the chat I can only log off. No way to do merry mayhem in spawn, where big team hunts, because they will certainly lead mobs on you. So when my spawn is busy I can search for a free spawn wasting a lot of time or just log off. So maybe not enough of spawns? And why some of these spawns are so far from tp/outpost?! Anyway, teams will be always allowed because they generate a lot more turnover then single ones. But they should improve fair play of this event by preventing bad influence between ppl to happen.

xX Gently Xx said:

do you have screenshots?

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Screenshots and chat log but I want FPC to handle it first. If FPC still ask me to excuse this behavior or if I see more of those mob train then i'll follow post w/ it. Until, then lets leave the past behind and move on.

Peace.

i think there a way to do it it would solve 2 problem

if they did it like the LA event

the only thing it would be on LA event for a certain time limit say 1:30 min per session and 30 min break after the next round

for the damage done it could be like a team hunt its now how much damage you did if you only did 30% of the damage on a 10 point mob you get 3 point

and for the time well if it 1;30 MIN per event will do as many for a total of 30 min

the only problem is that have that many LA for all the people going in the event

jaywalker said:

There ya going again, Ruslan, using your riches to get together a really huge team, then handing out condescending advice to those who clearly don't have your kind of PED balance (which is most of us). Just the same as last year. Oh, and also claiming that its a team event, same as you did last year, and that solo players have no place in it and no cause for complaiint; and they should do same as you, or at very least keep out off your way.

well, you get 10/10 for arrogance, zero for comprehension. This was never intended as a team event, as FPC have admitted several times over. But they couldn't enforce a no-teaming rule, so , until they come up with a decent fix, they, and we, have just had to accept that teaming will happen. I've decided to take the "If you can't beat 'em join 'em" approach this year but ffs please don't make a virtue of it. Don;t look down your nose at the brave few who still try to solo it, and don't get all self-righteous about brushing them out of your way. Don't make out that this event was created for you and your kind. It wasn't, and you're only displaying your ignorance by repeatedly claiming that it was.

jay

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My mention of Angel was a sort of a serious joke in a way. This is RCE so, there are ways of avoiding some things.

Do I blame Universe United or Art of War for not giving others a chance at 1-2-3 place in Cat 3-4, NO, because they'd destroy all the odds. Our armors and guns have nothing against the items and DPS they posses.
They do things as a team, so do we. They chose the categories they have a chance at, so did we.

Do we whine about them going in teams - no, do we whine about them having deeper pockets and better items - no.
What we did do is we tried to utilize some of our friends to help us.

It is a team event whether you want it or not, until a proper system gets implemented, why do you guys limit your potential purposefully?


Some

well in the scip spanw at oshiri hearts there was 2 poeple whit cars one was DA from univers united <--- same soc as star i beleive i saw him do it a few time

and the other did it all night heehaw

if there nothing that can be done about it let me know next year you can hire me i will do the same to the other team that you dont want to win

the only problem its the decay it give you the second run we mad my decays was 100 ped less on a 400 PED HUNT

i cant see solo or small group trying to win whit people like that running aorund

i vote for next event next year ban all vehicule during the MM

PS IM not in the event just there for the hunt

JD RACING said:

well in the scip spanw at oshiri hearts there was 2 poeple whit cars one was DA from univers united <--- same soc as star i beleive i saw him do it a few time

and the other did it all night heehaw

if there nothing that can be done about it let me know next year you can hire me i will do the same to the other team that you dont want to win

the only problem its the decay it give you the second run we mad my decays was 100 ped less on a 400 PED HUNT

i cant see solo or small group trying to win whit people like that running aorund

i vote for next event next year ban all vehicule during the MM

PS IM not in the event just there for the hunt

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I totally agree, there are some things that get left open by organizers, so one team or another would definitely try to take advantage of some of these things.

ALOT of decay was taken on our part trying to get these spawns together and there were quite a few people chipping away at the spawns that we've gathered. I don't think they really mind the help they were given, and its totally fine with us, even tho we did try to tell em not to do that. But, there's really nothing we can do about it.

On a personal note:
The thing is and what is most disappointing is that some people don't choose to take advantage of some aspects of the game. I don't think there's a need to involve FPC and other types of regulation into the event systems.
The RCE and markets aspect of the game should be regulating these things. Whenever things get too expensive or not worthwhile the problem gets taken care of on its own.

And, exactly this RCE aspect goes much deeper then the majority of the "solo player" types realize. But this subject may get way off topic.


Some

Here is what I posted in the other Thread about Mob Trains during this event ( Don't feel like editing it so I just copied and pasted :

Kinda funny I was just chatting away in Soc chat during the last 4-5 hours of Evi killing and I was mentioning this Mob Train crap I have been reading in my rest time. I was talking about how in this Feff Category there seems to be so much drama with mob train this and mob train that. I was mentioning that in my Evi Category within my 30 hours I have not experienced any hardships, cry babies, or anything like this. I started my first few hours at the Volcano then moved the last 20 hours to Cape Corinth. I had a blast. There was a 2 man team that was just tearing shit up and making a mess some times with the occasional KS, but it was not on purpose. If you hunted Cape Corinth you know what I mean. Most people there have been crazy friendly and made this event a great time for me. Im sure I did not make top 10, but dam, I had a blast. Ive been rescued by others when I was swarmed by Evi, Ive been assisted in killing 8s-9s even though we were competitors against each other, Ive even had people finish off a mob for me when I died knowing dam well they would not get the points in the last 1 or 2 kill shots for it. Of course I have returned this favor as well. So my list is entirely to long to write names of the great people I've encountered out there at Cape Corinth the last few days but you know who you are. We might not have chatted because of the flow of killing, but we have exchanged the silent remarks as we raced passed each other trying to get to the red dot first .

So on a happy note and I guess of topic: Thanks Hunters of Cape Corinth for an enjoyable MM 2010 .

Now back on topic: BoooHooo I understand the whole mob train, but sometimes it cant be helped. As for some of the people who think Mob Trains are funny, sure they are but, not during an event like MM. Its all fun and games when a Mob Train invades Twin Peaks or something on some innocent traders but MM, come on now, to purposely run a train at a competitor to disrupt his game play sounds like it violates the rules of EU, and just straight out childish un-fair play. If you are not apart of MM as in " You are not participating " then you have no idea about the concept of if I die or must fly away from a mob train, that take valuable seconds away that you could be earning Kill Points.

I think MM rules should be more strict. Right now you have teams where one person is doing MM with 5 support hunters shooting less damage, so the MM participant gets the kill + he saves a lot of time and peddage, so combined with mob-trains this really isn't something a solo hunter can hope to compete against.

mastermesh said:

Next year, maybe they can make it so there is multiple MMs going on at the same time... one for teams and one for solo. If you team, you are disqualified for solo and vice versa. If you get "support" from others in solo and get caught you get disqualified from solo. Not sure how they could make that happen... maybe some sort of special rules added to event/quest system. Event system needs more fine tuning anyways.

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Next year, hopefully beacons as instances will be in place. So we all can have our "own" cornundacauda valley / feffoid cave / eviscerator labyrinth / scipulor island where we hunt the mobs.

Saw a great post up here somewhere yesterday, where someone said that MM could be made on a LA, where teams are forbidden... and if you only do 30% dmg of a mob, you only get say 3 points instead of 10 that's the maximum....


That would cut away all teams and all support... Sounds good, if you ask me.

Merry Mayhem everyone

LangeTobias said:

Saw a great post up here somewhere yesterday, where someone said that MM could be made on a LA, where teams are forbidden... and if you only do 30% dmg of a mob, you only get say 3 points instead of 10 that's the maximum....


That would cut away all teams and all support... Sounds good, if you ask me.

Merry Mayhem everyone

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Good Idea!

So 'teams' do a number of things.

Fap
Pre-damage
Herd
etc.

You do not have to be in a 'team' to do any of these.

So if you are saying that every avatar has to be on their own when hunting, which is what I think you saying, then this is un-enforceable as I see it. Yes you can stop the damage assistance but not sure how you stop 'teams'

If you can stop 'teams' then you have the other problem which everyone will then moan about which is that those avatars with highest HP, best armour and highest dps guns will always win

At least the teaming attempts to level the playing field.

btw I think making scips the cat. 4 mob was an attempt to resolve the best armour and dps issue by having a mob that most mid-level and certainly all high level avatars can hunt easily unlike say spider stalkers last year.

So removing somewhat the dps issue but acknowledging that really only teams now have a chance in MM.

Regards

Zyloc

IMO lets wait until the points are actually in before we start making any conclusions. A lot of people seem to be ignoring what a massive change the teams rule was for this year. Until we see the points, we have no idea what needs to be done for next year.

Cheers,

-Sky

I think FPC|Pioneer, with help of FPC|Hanne, should begin to create a vast survey,
of what people want from a Merry Mayhem event.
It should be created rather quick, so there are enough of time to create something
different from what excist today.
It should have from basic fundamental questions, as "Will you join MM at all?" down
to details of stuff.

If the result shows that a huge improvement is needed in system, FPC must then
convience MA to do some coding in eventsystem. Timer, feature to prevent
abuse of system, better AI and so on, will fit eventsystem in general, so it
must not be just for MM.
If people now so happily want "teamevents" as MM is today, recreate Landgrab
so they are as MM is today.

Imo, there are solutions for future MM to increase interest from more people:
Use mob where there is no need for fapper, with extremly dense spawn.
Unique area for MM, like gigantic caves with 4-6 closed caves for each class,
and people are assigned to every entrence in advance due to class they belong,
so there are no chance to set up teams.
Timer that starts and ends when entering and leaving the cave.
Vehicles are disabled in area.
And a lot more alternatives....

Most teams today join MM to seriously trying to win or at least get a MM armorpart.
Some suggestions above might reduce the fun for some, but did they honestly joined
the MM event for fun only from the beginning?

My guess is that we will not see much changes in future sadly.
I still "hunt" the potential in EU, but it is as ingame hunting, a lot of "No loot" there...

Yes, sorry I was jumping to conclusions

Hope your Mayhem is going well

The thing is and what is most disappointing is that some people don't choose to take advantage of some aspects of the game.

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Take advantage of seems to be the optimal phrase there...

I don't think there's a need to involve FPC and other types of regulation into the event systems.

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Dude, this event was CREATED BY FPC! If they were not involved there would be no MM at all. Removing the people that organized this event from overseeing it would idiotic to say the least. Next time you organize an event, lets make sure you are not there to watch it unfold so that people can cheat at the event and win unfairly.

The RCE and markets aspect of the game should be regulating these things. Whenever things get too expensive or not worthwhile the problem gets taken care of on its own.

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Sounds like you are saying only those with the biggest pedcard should always win everything in game?!? That's silly. It might be the way things were prior to the introduction of L items, but everything is different now.

And, exactly this RCE aspect goes much deeper then the majority of the "solo player" types realize. But this subject may get way off topic.

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In other words you like having friends in low places that can help you manipulate the market so as to have a major advantage vs those playing solo in the RCE?!?... Maybe you are saying that folks should not be allowed to have a fair chance if they play solo? That's crazy. One reason "all trades are final" and there is no loan or renting system in game other then the bank is because the RCE is intended for people to play as individuals, not as corporations. Sure societies exist for some team things, and teaming exists for some things, but solo player types are the real reason the RCE exists, and MM is really meant to be played solo based on what the rules and FPCs comments about the rules seem to say.

LangeTobias said:

Saw a great post up here somewhere yesterday, where someone said that MM could be made on a LA, where teams are forbidden... and if you only do 30% dmg of a mob, you only get say 3 points instead of 10 that's the maximum....


That would cut away all teams and all support... Sounds good, if you ask me.

Merry Mayhem everyone

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Rationing of the points for damage done is an excellent idea! Not that it will keep people from mob training or totally eliminate teaming, but at least the "participants" will be forced to actually show off some hunting prowess.

Oh Nevermind......

Good luck in MM whether you want an LA or a Diploma

mastermesh said:

Take advantage of seems to be the optimal phrase there...

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Read it as "to gain an edge over others". This is a competition, and that's what everyone does, either by using better guns, armour, tactics.

Dude, this event was CREATED BY FPC! If they were not involved there would be no MM at all. Removing the people that organized this event from overseeing it would idiotic to say the least. Next time you organize an event, lets make sure you are not there to watch it unfold so that people can cheat at the event and win unfairly.

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FPC can't oversee everything all the time, there already was a few people blaming FPC for not being able to oversee all.
It's a fundamental flaw and is no one's fault, but there are ways to control things by making em more expensive and not beneficial to use (vehicle decay, per say). It's a moral hazard leaving these things open for interpretation.

Sounds like you are saying only those with the biggest pedcard should always win everything in game?!? That's silly. It might be the way things were prior to the introduction of L items, but everything is different now.

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Only if it's worthwhile, if its not, then no one would bother.

In other words you like having friends in low places that can help you manipulate the market so as to have a major advantage vs those playing solo in the RCE?!?... Maybe you are saying that folks should not be allowed to have a fair chance if they play solo? That's crazy. One reason "all trades are final" and there is no loan or renting system in game other then the bank is because the RCE is intended for people to play as individuals, not as corporations. Sure societies exist for some team things, and teaming exists for some things, but solo player types are the real reason the RCE exists, and MM is really meant to be played solo based on what the rules and FPCs comments about the rules seem to say.

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I like having friends everywhere and as long as everyone benefits its a good thing in my book.
What i'm saying is that solo players make their choice, and it's silly to think that everyone should be going solo in an event that does not restrict teaming.

I'm not gonna claim i know why there is no renting system, but i suspect it has something to do with the risk assosiated with having a RCE, as well as trying to avoid monopolies and price setting. It's not the solo players that make RCE it's the private interests that make it up, whether its a team or a solo player, as long as there's someone who benefits.
And as for MM, let's just stick to what it is, rather than what it could've been if circumstances were different. You can't expect everyone to do things the way you envision it, it's not a perfect world we have here.


Some

Here's my suggestion for future events which are designed as solo events:

The system already tracks damage per avatar, so it should be possible to determine whether an avatar has inflicted 100% damage on a mob.

How about a "Full Kill Bonus" of an extra point if the mob is killed solo? This would provide an incentive to the solo hunters, and perhaps a bit more balance to the competition. At the very least, it would be another factor to consider when deciding on a strategy for the event.

Another option has been suggested earlier, whereby the points allocated are modified by the percentage damage inflicted. Again, this is using existing info within the system, with a slight tweak to the points allocation routine.

From what FPC has been saying, there are technical issues around the whole team/support/solo issue. These suggestions shouldn't require massive change to the underlying system, and may be relatively easy to implement.

Shadowsong said:

Here's my suggestion for future events which are designed as solo events:

The system already tracks damage per avatar, so it should be possible to determine whether an avatar has inflicted 100% damage on a mob.

How about a "Full Kill Bonus" of an extra point if the mob is killed solo? This would provide an incentive to the solo hunters, and perhaps a bit more balance to the competition. At the very least, it would be another factor to consider when deciding on a strategy for the event.

Another option has been suggested earlier, whereby the points allocated are modified by the percentage damage inflicted. Again, this is using existing info within the system, with a slight tweak to the points allocation routine.

From what FPC has been saying, there are technical issues around the whole team/support/solo issue. These suggestions shouldn't require massive change to the underlying system, and may be relatively easy to implement.

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I doubt it's hard to convience FPC to agree to these changes, the problem here is MA.
MA has to adjust and modify code.

Joat said:

I doubt it's hard to convience FPC to agree to these changes, the problem here is MA.
MA has to adjust and modify code.

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Certainly, so let us provide FPC with quality ammo for dealing with MA on our behalf. It may be a pipe-dream, but I have to believe that it can be done.

I'm not suggesting it can be implemented for this one, but if we push hard, we have a year to get something in place for the next one, and even time for a "dry-run" of the system before the real thing.. We can't talk to MA, so we have to push FPC to talk for us.

Shadowsong said:

Certainly, so let us provide FPC with quality ammo for dealing with MA on our behalf. It may be a pipe-dream, but I have to believe that it can be done.

I'm not suggesting it can be implemented for this one, but if we push hard, we have a year to get something in place for the next one, and even time for a "dry-run" of the system before the real thing.. We can't talk to MA, so we have to push FPC to talk for us.

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Agree, and some more changes to eventsystem should increase more options
to run other events too, as a Timer and so on.

Shadowsong said:

Certainly, so let us provide FPC with quality ammo for dealing with MA on our behalf. It may be a pipe-dream, but I have to believe that it can be done.

I'm not suggesting it can be implemented for this one, but if we push hard, we have a year to get something in place for the next one, and even time for a "dry-run" of the system before the real thing.. We can't talk to MA, so we have to push FPC to talk for us.

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Yeah, and it'd be nice if the new changes could be tested beforehand to see how the systems/rules may affect the event.

It's like with everything, you hope for the best, but prepare for the worst.


Some