Get involved: Help test hunting

Mikeemooo

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This is a spin off from this thread: "Loot related to the cost of the kill - Eco goess out of the window!".

I'm set up and ready to test this. I could do with a huge amount of data, though - so if anyone can help then I'd REALLY appreciate it.

There's 2 different tests I'd like help with:

1) Opalo + E amp 15
2) Opalo + A101

Here's how to run the test:

1) Team up with someone who is NOT hunting. (Ask a trader or a crafter.)

2) Head to Atami's Paradise TP.

3) Make sure you're at Atami's Paradise! I don't want different/no tax rates to change the outcomes. Why atami? because I was close to it when I started the test ;)

4) Clear your chat log completely

5) Kill ONLY molisk youngs. There's quite a few there. Don't worry about what armor/fap you have as I'll be ignoring that for the sake of these tests.

6) Make sure you kill and loot a mob before starting the next mob. Make sure you don't do any damage to any other mob because it'll skew the results.

7) If you loot any items with 'repair' bars, after looting type the following into team chat:
"tt: 22.52" or whatever the value is. Make sure you keep it in that exact format.

8) If you have any issues - for example accidently killing another mob, type "INVALID" into team chat. If you can type a description of what just happened into team chat that'll help me out a lot.

Kill as many molisk youngs as you can. :)

Now somehow somehow send your chatlog over to me with information about what weapon/amp you used. You can either email me (mikeefranklin@googlemail.com) or find some other way to get it to me.

I'll keep the 2nd post in this thread free for information on how to get the raw data.

The more data we can collect the better, so PLEASE help out if you can.

If you want to confirm that you're doing things correctly, please kill just a few, send me the chat log and I'll confirm that everything is ok.
 
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For now concentrating on base loot (under 10 ped) until I have a lot more data.

https://spreadsheets.google.com/spr...NvdEZIRVN5WTJqTDdTUjRHa2hoWUhxTGc&output=html

molisk_loot_test_283886.gif


Code:
			[B]Average Weapon Cost[/B]	[B]Average Loot[/B]
[B]A101[/B]			0.778			0.3723
[B]E-Amp 15[/B]		2.225			0.8561
 
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Interesting to see conclusions on this one. At least I am not involved in hunting anymore. I suspect it could change the value on some items, as eco is not as important as some feel. Then again... maybe it is.
 
What kind of result do you expect hunting a high-regen mob with low weapon ? :scratch2:
I can understand the Opalo + A101 versus Opalo + E-15, but only if it is on a 50-150 HP low-regen mob.

Or is it only a hidden LA advertising? :laugh:
 
What kind of result do you expect hunting a high-regen mob with low weapon ? :scratch2:
I can understand the Opalo + A101 versus Opalo + E-15, but only if it is on a 50-150 HP low-regen mob.

Or is it only a hidden LA advertising? :laugh:

I don't think the amount of regen makes any difference to this test, so long as the damage/sec done by the two weapons is consistent and the total damage done is the same.

The two set ups have very similar DMG/sec.
 
I am a strong believer in that no matter how much you waste your will get your 80% at the end story, but unfortunately with hunting markups below 10% i see no reason for longterm-testing it.

And i dont see a reason to give away another 4% of Opallo+E-Amp 15 Turnover for Taxes.
 
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There's 2 different tests I'd like help with:

1) Opalo + E amp 15
2) Opalo + A101

Shouldn't the test be Opalo + E amp 15 vs Opalo + Boom CCC ? These two setups have the same useful amplification, 101 underamplifies Opalo.
 
Shouldn't the test be Opalo + E amp 15 vs Opalo + Boom CCC ? These two setups have the same useful amplification, 101 underamplifies Opalo.

Hi,

If people wish to submit tests with other amps please feel free. It could be nice to have a range of data.
 
Ok, post #2 in the thread updated with the latest figures.

All I can say is....

Wow. :eek:

I didn't believe this for a second...
 
So some valid questions could be :
1. For how much loss does the more loot make up
2. Could it be a valid method to hunt item-mobs with high MU items whichc regularly drop in HOFs to hunt them waste style in order to accumulate more loss to make up for the higher TT-loss with Item-MU ?

Well when i calculated right the cost of the e-amp version is 2.8something higher
but loot just increases by factor 2.29something, but atm the datacollection is still too small to jump on conclusions, just looks interesting so far
 
So some valid questions could be :
1. For how much loss does the more loot make up
2. Could it be a valid method to hunt item-mobs with high MU items whichc regularly drop in HOFs to hunt them waste style in order to accumulate more loss to make up for the higher TT-loss with Item-MU ?

Well when i calculated right the cost of the e-amp version is 2.8something higher
but loot just increases by factor 2.29something, but atm the datacollection is still too small to jump on conclusions, just looks interesting so far

Exactly this ^!
 
So some valid questions could be :
1. For how much loss does the more loot make up
2. Could it be a valid method to hunt item-mobs with high MU items whichc regularly drop in HOFs to hunt them waste style in order to accumulate more loss to make up for the higher TT-loss with Item-MU ?

Well when i calculated right the cost of the e-amp version is 2.8something higher
but loot just increases by factor 2.29something, but atm the datacollection is still too small to jump on conclusions, just looks interesting so far

Yep too early to say, but hey, lets do it anyway:

A101 = 47.9% return of weapon cost
Eamp 15 = 38.5% return of weapon cost

Updated graph with profit/loss line
 
So some valid questions could be :
1. For how much loss does the more loot make up
2. Could it be a valid method to hunt item-mobs with high MU items whichc regularly drop in HOFs to hunt them waste style in order to accumulate more loss to make up for the higher TT-loss with Item-MU ?

Well when i calculated right the cost of the e-amp version is 2.8something higher
but loot just increases by factor 2.29something, but atm the datacollection is still too small to jump on conclusions, just looks interesting so far

Hmm. Dammit. I don't have the loot data for all this as I started discarding it.

I'll start from scratch tomorrow with loot data included.

I'd really really like others to help with this - if anyone can spare time and then please get involved :)
 
Well when the Global/HOF frequency raises i think it is valid to assume those items which drop mostly in HOFs ( high MU LR/CB/HL... ) could be triggered more often that way to drop ( again a big maybe since there could be other factors too influencing the droprates per se ). And 10% less TT can be worth it when you can loot a higher % of 180% items instead of ( insert TT-Food here ). So mostly interesting would be if the average Global rate raises as the higher base loot would indicate it does ( relation to kills, not ped spent ).
 
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Interesting findings, the only problem I see with the test is if 100 people hunt 100ped, it will only indicate how these hunting styles effect short term loot. If it takes months or even years for loot to balance out for players, we'd need players to cycle alot of ped, and is there anyone who will risk that.
 
We see increase in loot for using higher amp on weapon, even if it is overamped.

What about with the same am and two different base weapons?:scratch2:

Example:
Opalo + A101 vs hl8+a101
 
We see increase in loot for using higher amp on weapon, even if it is overamped.

What about with the same am and two different base weapons?:scratch2:

Example:
Opalo + A101 vs hl8+a101

It seems to be nothing to do with the amp as such, it's more just the dmg/pec of the weapon you're using.

Got a test (hopefully) lined up for the weekend with two high DPS weapons at two extremes of the dmg/pec range. It should be very interesting.
 
Mike really is revolutionizing what we know about EU!

:yay:
 
Mike really is revolutionizing what we know about EU!

:yay:


Na, I'm just repeating tests some others have made in the past, but just collecting and releasing the data sets for people to see :)
 
Shouldn't the test be Opalo + E amp 15 vs Opalo + Boom CCC ? These two setups have the same useful amplification, 101 underamplifies Opalo.
The point of this test is to compare an eco setup with one that is intentionally (and excessively) uneco. Opalo + A101 is more eco than Opalo + CCC, so for the purposes of this test, A101 is better. I see you did read the other thread, so high dmg/pec vs. low dmg/pec is the idea.

I'd like to help out, but I'm low on PEDs right now, so probably can't. :(
 
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Quite interesting results so far, and something I was not expecting based on the data collected in this thread, Jimmy B's famous "utterly insane" tests:

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/showthread.php?101842-Some-utterly-insane-tests

Especially the data collected in post 240 (one-shotting some plumas) and the subsequent analysis, which seems to show that overkill isn't compensated in the loot, at least in the short term.

The data you have collected seem to show that poor economy is partially compensated in the short term, in line with Poppy Fuzzy's comments in the other thread.

So overkill and poor economy may be apples and oranges as far as the loot system is concerned.

It also makes me wonder about two things.

Kill-stealing, for which there is some evidence (tests done by Fluske in a Merry Mayhem 2008 thread) that the damage done by unteamed shooters of the same mob doesn't contribute fully to the loot.

High regen mobs, is the regen fully or only partially compensated? Jimmy B did a few tests on that in his insane tests thread, and there have been a few other tests in some other threads.

What I'm really wondering, once you have enough data for a model...will your model be able to explain eco/uneco loot, kill stealing loot, and regen loot? Would be cool if it could.
 
This looks very interesting so far, esp the graph. So, how will this pay out in ragards to amp eco when not overamping? I'm specificly thinking about cases like :
  • Eamp 14 vs A204 on laser carbine with more than 40 max damage
  • Eamp 13/14 vs A104/A105 on carbines with more than 40 damage
 
This looks very interesting so far, esp the graph. So, how will this pay out in ragards to amp eco when not overamping? I'm specificly thinking about cases like :
  • Eamp 14 vs A204 on laser carbine with more than 40 max damage
  • Eamp 13/14 vs A104/A105 on carbines with more than 40 damage
Let me borrow an A204 and I'll be happy to run the first test! :laugh:
 
Let me borrow an A204 and I'll be happy to run the first test! :laugh:

If I had it, i'm sure you could have it for testing if you had collateral. My account is after over 1.5 years in game probably worth less than the markup on A204.

A203 would be the same damage, low decay companion to Eamp 13, but A104 (which i have) is fairly close match, and there are a lot more of those around. But of course, on a Riker UL3(L) Eamp 13 vs A104 does not have such a huge difference in eco (2.760 vs 2.921), so I'm not sure how it would work out and probably needs a longer test.

Let me think about this.
 
After some crazy experiments last night with some friends, decided I'm not going to go and generate any more stats for this thread.

I'll happy compile the data and update the stats if anyone sends me some, though. Just do it in the same format I mentioned in post #1.

I expect anyone who knows what I'm like can guess what kind of experiment I did last night (a spin off from this thread), and, well - it's thrown me a bit. Maybe taken a bit (lot?) of enjoyment out of the game for me because of the way I personally enjoy playing this game.

But hey, I'm sure I'll find other things that I enjoy doing ;)
 
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