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3.50 ped per week does not give 27-30% ROI

Qwackers said:
While there are significant variances in this method it is a good GENERAL indicator of what the CLD payout would have been over the last 25 weeks. To keep it simple I have only used hunting globals from all planet partners.
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i'll say there are significant variances, but how on earth can you know on the basis of one datum??? and after claiming its a good general indicator, you include non-calypso and exclude mining and crafting. :scratch: if you're going to do this, do it right.
 
I am still waiting to see my payout from the deeds I bought. So far nothing, if I open pay flow center I just get a screen open that i can not move or close that says waiting. Have left it running over 15 minutes, have logged on and logged off several times.

Must not be too widespread, I have not found any other posts of people not getting their dividend.
 
its not supposed to be a real land area is it?
 
SnowLeopard said:
The "Become a Citizen of Planet Calypso" announcement claimed a "potential ROI of 27% - 30%".
3.50 PED per week is only 182 PED per year, which is only 18.2% -- that's substantially less than what was predicted (5.19 to 5.77).

I would have much preferred an honest announcement claiming 15-20% (which is still good). At least I wouldn't feel like I have been lied to (yet again). :mad:


Edit: 27-30% ROI will be true of price of deeds drops to around 600ped a piece.
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am i the only one that noticed the word POTENTIAL ROI and gz guys 17 percent is still amazing
 
ilike money said:
its not supposed to be a real land area is it?
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Nope, you're just supposed to be able to claim a small land lot for each deed you have and, if you have 3x3 of those claimed, build a house. This is for the future tho
 
Johned said:
I am still waiting to see my payout from the deeds I bought. So far nothing, if I open pay flow center I just get a screen open that i can not move or close that says waiting. Have left it running over 15 minutes, have logged on and logged off several times.

Must not be too widespread, I have not found any other posts of people not getting their dividend.
Click to expand...

Did you use right click on PED Card or Icon in Action Library?
I were stucked with that Waiting when I rightclicked PED Card, but when
I used the Icon from Action Library it worked.
 
What amazes me is the amount that Calypso (population + off-planet and on-planet avatars) generated. Let me limit "customer" to the (majority) subset defined by these, in the below writing.

Let's assume 3.5 PED/deed/week (it seems to be close enough).
3.5 * 60k = 210,000 PED payout = 840,000 lost/paid by MA's customers to MA during this period.

84k USD customer losses to MA, in a single week. That's not peanuts! That's extrapolated 4,368 million USD lost by customers/year - and this was during a very slow week. From Calypso income only.

That's a VERY large amount more than what MA claimed Calypso to be worth in their annual 2010 report. In that, The value of Calypso was 2009-12-31 only worth 385k USD (take or leave - it was documented to be 2,8 mil. SEK IIRC).

As for the recent (insane) drop in returns/increase in cost - anyone ever thought MA would accept even one of its wholly owned subsidiaries to "give away" money? Would it not make more sense they at the very same time increased the cost of doing one of the three endorsed activities with at least as much as the 60k shares would suck from them?

60k shares, giving its "owners" "up to" 30%/year, they have most likely accounted for payout of 1,8 mil USD/year, and therefore based it on 7,2 mil USD total income from Calypso. Again, this is from what MA claimed in their annual report was only worth a few hundred k USD.

Given the choice between getting 1,8 million less revenue from their own baby, or rising the cost of participating for customers to cover it, it doesn't take another Einstein to suspect MA has made us pay more - especially with their documented economy.

So, to pay "someone else" (the deed holders) 25% (I'm confident they don't account for the obvious probability that many will cycle these weekly amounts back into EU, and I'm equally sure they also count on it), they need to rise the cost for everyone. And not only by 25%! No, not only do the customers get 25% of the total gross revenue - in the books it will read as debts! So MA the "PP" (Planet Partner - perhaps it's AR or whatever, perhaps its not) will not only get 25% less gross revenue, MA will have 25% to write up as debts!

With a "loss of predicted gross revenue" 25%, they in a stroke of genius (?) managed to revenue magically disappear, while effectively retaining all of it!

Also, that loss has to be covered. But why settle for only covering it, when it can be increased; hence the sharp drop in of "returns" (also known as sharp increase of cost to be an MA customer).

Still only a hypothesis, but I think many can validate the loss-of-returns since the deeds were introduced.
 
tamlin said:
What amazes me is the amount that Calypso (population + off-planet and on-planet avatars) generated. Let me limit "customer" to the (majority) subset defined by these, in the below writing.

Let's assume 3.5 PED/deed/week (it seems to be close enough).
3.5 * 60k = 210,000 PED payout = 840,000 lost/paid by MA's customers to MA during this period.

84k USD customer losses to MA, in a single week. That's not peanuts! That's extrapolated 4,368 million USD lost by customers/year - and this was during a very slow week. From Calypso income only.

That's a VERY large amount more than what MA claimed Calypso to be worth in their annual 2010 report. In that, The value of Calypso was 2009-12-31 only worth 385k USD (take or leave - it was documented to be 2,8 mil. SEK IIRC).

As for the recent (insane) drop in returns/increase in cost - anyone ever thought MA would accept even one of its wholly owned subsidiaries to "give away" money? Would it not make more sense they at the very same time increased the cost of doing one of the three endorsed activities with at least as much as the 60k shares would suck from them?

60k shares, giving its "owners" "up to" 30%/year, they have most likely accounted for payout of 1,8 mil USD/year, and therefore based it on 7,2 mil USD total income from Calypso. Again, this is from what MA claimed in their annual report was only worth a few hundred k USD.

Given the choice between getting 1,8 million less revenue from their own baby, or rising the cost of participating for customers to cover it, it doesn't take another Einstein to suspect MA has made us pay more - especially with their documented economy.

So, to pay "someone else" (the deed holders) 25% (I'm confident they don't account for the obvious probability that many will cycle these weekly amounts back into EU, and I'm equally sure they also count on it), they need to rise the cost for everyone. And not only by 25%! No, not only do the customers get 25% of the total gross revenue - in the books it will read as debts! So MA the "PP" (Planet Partner - perhaps it's AR or whatever, perhaps its not) will not only get 25% less gross revenue, MA will have 25% to write up as debts!

With a "loss of predicted gross revenue" 25%, they in a stroke of genius (?) managed to revenue magically disappear, while effectively retaining all of it!

Also, that loss has to be covered. But why settle for only covering it, when it can be increased; hence the sharp drop in of "returns" (also known as sharp increase of cost to be an MA customer).

Still only a hypothesis, but I think many can validate the loss-of-returns since the deeds were introduced.
Click to expand...

The "only" loss MA will get is the lack of deposits, due to people cycle dividend back
in to the system, and if someone do a withdraw.
Whats within EU is still MAs, so no difference there if the PEDs are on my PED Card
or if they are within system which is controlled by MA.
If a PP had got it instead, MA had obviously been forced to pay out 100% in USD.

The positive effect for MA, is the PED-turnover, that is often used in marketing and
advertising. Even thou' it says zero about reality, it still can show some pretty nice
numbers, for those who don't know much about Entropia Universe.
 
ilike money said:
its not supposed to be a real land area is it?
Click to expand...

I think he mean that the current estate system hasn't had much of development since it came,
and therefor the phase for CLDsystem where we can claim land and build houses will also be
delayed way longer in to the future than 2013. ;)
 
aridash said:
i'll say there are significant variances, but how on earth can you know on the basis of one datum??? and after claiming its a good general indicator, you include non-calypso and exclude mining and crafting. :scratch: if you're going to do this, do it right.
Click to expand...

Mining (25 MPed) and crafting (8 MPed) are significantly lower amounts than hunting (57 MPed) and are maintained at pretty constant week to week levels. They do not fluctuate anywhere near as much as hunting, thus changes in hunting has the greatest effect on week to week ROI. Including the other professions would decrease the variation across the board and thus lower the ROI average based on 3.50 Ped. As for excluding other planet partners, most of the decay generated on these planets are from ex Cals on which a portion goes back to Planet Calypso. Again, removing the mobs of other PP only lowers the average ROI.

The graph posted is best case, additional processing only makes the 26 week ROI lower. The six month global data is freely available on Entropia Tracker for anyone to assess.

Added correction: For some reason ET only sent the last months crafting globals so 8 MPed is for approx. 4-5 weeks so 42 - 52 MPed if crafting globals are relativly constnat across the 26 weeks.
 
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Nighthawk said:
Nope, you're just supposed to be able to claim a small land lot for each deed you have and, if you have 3x3 of those claimed, build a house. This is for the future tho
Click to expand...

ahh then they will prolly release a new server for Land deeds
 
Threads merged (and perhaps more to be added to this topic.)
 
I think land deeds will be an excellent barameter to see how well this company is doing. The rate of return will be a vital statistic to income being produced.
 
Joat said:
Did you use right click on PED Card or Icon in Action Library?
I were stucked with that Waiting when I rightclicked PED Card, but when
I used the Icon from Action Library it worked.
Click to expand...

I have done it from both locations.
 
What I find interesting; the EULA's application to land deeds and their value/ownership.
 
ilike money said:
ahh then they will prolly release a new server for Land deeds
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No, I dont think so... Based on official posts, areas around towns and in the wilderness will simply be made available for anyone sith a deed.

Remember that ALL land deeds together only really covers a small part of a server
 
Johned said:
I am still waiting to see my payout from the deeds I bought. So far nothing, if I open pay flow center I just get a screen open that i can not move or close that says waiting. Have left it running over 15 minutes, have logged on and logged off several times.

Must not be too widespread, I have not found any other posts of people not getting their dividend.
Click to expand...

I had the same issue but was not on calypso at the time, as soon as i got to Caly i could access the Ped flow centre.

Hope this helps
 
hmmmm really you should send support cause i can see the funds from hell
 
Qwackers said:
Mining (25 MPed) and crafting (8 MPed) are significantly lower amounts than hunting (57 MPed) and are maintained at pretty constant week to week levels.
Click to expand...

fair point on the Calypso players abroad on other planets, but this "significantly lower" ammount is a third the total that you are simply dismissing out of hand.
 
If you are expecting this week to be better - don't. Lots of bugs keeping people from being as active as they would be otherwise remain, with no fix date announced.
 
Joat said:
I think he mean that the current estate system hasn't had much of development since it came,
and therefor the phase for CLDsystem where we can claim land and build houses will also be
delayed way longer in to the future than 2013. ;)
Click to expand...

Some people think different about that and thus believe that I am a 14 year old child with almost 9 years experience in Entropia :scratch2::laugh:.

John_connor said:
Calypso Land Deeds (CLD)?!
<This is coming soon>
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Norbert said:
I had the same issue but was not on calypso at the time, as soon as i got to Caly i could access the Ped flow centre.

Hope this helps
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Thanks, I will have to try that. Interesting limitation they have set up for that.
 
remontoire said:
If you are expecting this week to be better - don't. Lots of bugs keeping people from being as active as they would be otherwise remain, with no fix date announced.
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yes it seems MindArk have been busy shooting themselfes in the foot as usual. However I don't think that these 2weeks will reflect the normal ROI well. In fact I think its a POSITIVE sign that the ROI is still so high despite the fact that a large part of the playerbase is unable to participiate in the game. I guess that will be solved ASAP as its in MAs own interest.
 
XeroX2 said:
yes it seems MindArk have been busy shooting themselfes in the foot as usual. However I don't think that these 2weeks will reflect the normal ROI well. In fact I think its a POSITIVE sign that the ROI is still so high despite the fact that a large part of the playerbase is unable to participiate in the game. I guess that will be solved ASAP as its in MAs own interest.
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Well, I don't think its true that large part cannot participate ... I think its an increasing part that cannot / won't participate becuase auction is not working as desired[1], or lot of mob loot tables being in a interesting state. Not all mobs are "broken" though. Discoveries on Argonauts must have helped with hunting too. But I expect increasing numbers of people to run into issues over time.

[1] Its not that its not working at all or that things don't still sell
 
Strash said:
forgot to mention if you have deeds and wanna sell at 600ped a pop i will buy :)
lookin for more....

:dunce:
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I second this, I will gladly buy any for 600 peds.
 
Lol, you can not base a ROI on the first week..


You might get 8ped next week....

I am almost certain with events and when people increase there playing time again, you wil get 25% atleast....
 
remontoire said:
Well, I don't think its true that large part cannot participate ... I think its an increasing part that cannot / won't participate becuase auction is not working as desired[1], or lot of mob loot tables being in a interesting state. Not all mobs are "broken" though. Discoveries on Argonauts must have helped with hunting too. But I expect increasing numbers of people to run into issues over time.

[1] Its not that its not working at all or that things don't still sell
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I was referring to the space bugs but well those things will probably be fixed tomorrow.
 
Futurama said:
I second this, I will gladly buy any for 600 peds.
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I'll do better! If folks really hate their deeds and really want to show MA how unhappy they are, I am willing to generously buy your land deeds for 100 PED.

:eyecrazy: YOWZAS!!! What a deal! :eyecrazy:

That's right. Using my exclusive service for the cant be beat bargain price of 100 PED I will personally take posession of your land deed, and send an embossed letter to MA on your behalf stating how unhappy you are with their service.

For an extra 100 PED I will take posession of any other items of interest on your account. Got some Shadow SGA? 100 PED and I will take it off your hands. Got one of those pesky Outback Land Areas? 100 PED and you can wave goodbye to all your worries there.

This deal is too good to pass up! Get paid by me. Magyar "BIG MONEY" Republic is KNOCKING OUT THE COMPETITION! :boxer:
 
It would be very interesting to have someone with a financial/investment background calculate a fair valuation of the land deed as if it were a real traded commodity. To be fair, the closest approximation is probably a $100 5 year bond.. For which an 18% dividend is actually quite awesome. The problem is, it's not a true bond (which would always be redeemable for $100 at the end of the term unless the issuer became insolvent). Instead the value of this 'bond' is whatever the market will bear in 5 years, and that is very much up in the air and difficult to predict.
 
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