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How do you go faster in space with quad (L)

Position updates should be calculated server side - for some reason, MA relies on the client reporting correct position updates (read: speed), which obviously enables people to exploit the system...

If done properly, all the client has to report is direction and speed changes, this is enough to determine the position correctly on two different systems.


The CPUs millisecond counter only works when the CPU runs at it's designated speed, overclocking makes everything run faster, including fire rate of your gun.

Everything that is time based relies on that internal counter mechanism.
(checking the systems clock 100 times a second is an absolute no-go, resource wise)


Funny thing, because MA claims that they have systems in place to detect that kind of unfair advantage...


Clearly a design flaw, and something that should be fixed asap.
 
Neil Stockton said:
Yes, you are correct. I've edited the original post for clarification.
Click to expand...

Thank you Dah-ling :yup:

Besides im not much of a up the rear fan....Angular experimentation is where its at ^^ Just me or that read funny ^^ Nah tis ok....all angles baby.

DCF
 
jetsina said:
ty for your confirmation in #83 Neil :)
So, it is straight line catch-up, then, no triangulation.... next thing to wonder is by how much they can be faster.
Click to expand...

In my video, the pirate gained about .04 au in 10 seconds. In other words, if the quad is following you, you have 25 seconds from the time it appears behind you to when it is in firing range.

How far can a quad get by flying in 'the general direction' of where they want to go while being chased? Does this make most planet-dives from a space station relatively safe, even?
Click to expand...

No. The pirate should be able to catch up before you get the landing notice. Whether you can evade until able to land is another question.

When will we see the first cases of killed and looted 'after having accepted the payment of 2 peds', because a pilot made it there with low health and the atmosphere stopped his/her quad like a brick wall for a pirate's last few easier shots, and the servers may be too slow to react?
Click to expand...

Once you're out of your quad, you can't enter the planet, so I think if you're out of your quad, you won't be able to click to accept the landing notice that appeared before your quad was destroyed. Of course, the peds should only be taken if you actually land safely on the planet. But it's space and you never know, there are a lot of bugs. Would also be easy to test.

However, given the removal of the right-click 'guaranteed hit if shot fired' option, what is now the miss rate on an evading quad? Is it like trying to swat flies with chopsticks?
Click to expand...

I'm glad about that, it should make a difference in space. I've never used it there, not even for mob hunting, but I guess some of the pirates relied on it to keep from having to time their shots.

I tried some Skyflail hunting last week and it's really impossible to hunt them economically; the hit box is not a box at all (more like a mesh that appears and disappears as you move over the mob) and because the mob hops around, there's no way to avoid wasting ~15% of your shots. Well, no big loss, I guess, since the whopping 3% MU on loot made them not worth hunting anyway.
 
Neil Stockton said:
I tried some Skyflail hunting last week and it's really impossible to hunt them economically; the hit box is not a box at all (more like a mesh that appears and disappears as you move over the mob) and because the mob hops around, there's no way to avoid wasting ~15% of your shots. Well, no big loss, I guess, since the whopping 3% MU on loot made them not worth hunting anyway.
Click to expand...

A little bit offtopic but by my findings with skyflails and dropships who both have their issues with hitboxes is that when you teamtarget them and place all your shots in the little rectangle of the teamtargetbox then your shots wont go to waste - you will either have an hit or an registered miss.
 
John B Knight said:
A little bit offtopic but by my findings with skyflails and dropships who both have their issues with hitboxes is that when you teamtarget them and place all your shots in the little rectangle of the teamtargetbox then your shots wont go to waste - you will either have an hit or an registered miss.
Click to expand...

Is that with quad guns or MS guns?
 
.Stagger said:
The fact that this thread is constantly ongoing about this so called cheat
is because cry-babies (as Dan has made clear enough) keep shouting Cheat and Ban loud enough.

While the actual person being filmed isn't using a cheat,
he just has a great internet connection, and there is nothing anyone could put on him for being
and actual cheater.

I have explained myself in an earlier post,
this explanation, after confirmation with FDRX himself, was ofcourse the correct one.

If this was a bug, Nebula Virus would have made a video out of it and posted it to the public,
we support Honest gameplay, which means gameplay according to the game rules and limits.

There are a lot of people here, flaming as sport and lieing to get
a pvper in space banned.
This type of behaviour is low class in my eyes,
i want you people to realise that you are acting like babies trying to get someone punished just because you can't win.
( same scenario why i got removed from my Arkadian Advisor status,
i got labeled untrustworthy just because i preferred a certain type of gameplay)




i can confirm that using fraps or streaming is affecting your connection to the game,
therefore also affecting how fast you catch up with someone in a chase.
This is the main reason why i'm not streaming or frapsing all the time.

--
edit
--
seems like my earlier post with the explenation has been miraculously physically removed without a proper reason, there was no troll in there towards anyone.
just a proper explanation of what could have happened in that situation.
Click to expand...

I was trying to explain before that I think it's that he has a fast processor and good connection, but no one wants to listen. I don't see any reason to ban someone for having a good connection and processor. This is obviously a reaction time issue, and the fault of MA. Vehicles do go slower and faster due to lag and processor speed I've seen it myself. Haven't run my tests yet (recently) but when I do it should confirm what I've been saying.
 
DanTheManKae said:
I was trying to explain before that I think it's that he has a fast processor and good connection, but no one wants to listen. I don't see any reason to ban someone for having a good connection and processor.
Click to expand...

It's not "having a good processor". There are plenty of people here who run insanely expensive, top-of-the-line systems with great internet connections and they don't fly any faster in their quads. You'd have me believe that a few of the pirates just happened to buy the two or three best computers in all of EU within the last few weeks? I don't think so.
 
All theory is grey.

Anyone with an overclocked rig out there who is willing to do some tests to confirm/debunk this?
 
Damn, too bad I don't have my old P4 anymore. Could get some crazy high OC with the right cooling.

Actually, this sounds like the most likely situation assuming nobody is just talking out of their asses about what they have experienced. Some lucky bastard probably found out after over clocking the hell out of their rig to run EU that they moved faster. Probably some old single core that worked more on GHz gain to get OC power. That or someone is using some emulation software to screw with how the system is reporting clock cycles.

Totally would fit with how MA programs if they made activities like position reporting clock cycle based, like some ancient ass game :lolup:
 
John B Knight said:
A little bit offtopic but by my findings with skyflails and dropships who both have their issues with hitboxes is that when you teamtarget them and place all your shots in the little rectangle of the teamtargetbox then your shots wont go to waste - you will either have an hit or an registered miss.
Click to expand...

I tested it just now and it does not work for me. Crosshairs in the team target box still misses most of the time (not registered misses, but real misses), especially since the team target box is not aligned with the jumping, temperamental hitbox. Maybe you're able to do it because you're very close when you're shooting these things from the MS? Or maybe the bigger guns have a bigger area of destruction? Either way, it's on my "do not hunt" list. :laugh: I did send in a support case about it, btw.
 
wizzszz said:
Position updates should be calculated server side - for some reason, MA relies on the client reporting correct position updates (read: speed), which obviously enables people to exploit the system...

If done properly, all the client has to report is direction and speed changes, this is enough to determine the position correctly on two different systems.


The CPUs millisecond counter only works when the CPU runs at it's designated speed, overclocking makes everything run faster, including fire rate of your gun.

Everything that is time based relies on that internal counter mechanism.
(checking the systems clock 100 times a second is an absolute no-go, resource wise)


Funny thing, because MA claims that they have systems in place to detect that kind of unfair advantage...


Clearly a design flaw, and something that should be fixed asap.
Click to expand...

He could have overclocked it cause it was the only way to run EU. A lot of older comps won't run it at all. In this case he all the sudden found out he could go faster. I agree needs to be patched asap. I think this was more likely stumbled upon than done on purpose. Either way MA needs to fix they're timing issues. I knew from the start this was a timing issue. Now we will no doubt be having experienced players making alts and overclocking they're cpu to do this ><. I think this guy was an honest noob, he def acted like one when I met him. One thing we can all agree on is this needs to be fixed asap. Positive input is always good, screaming for a ban when it could be an honest mistake is never the right way to go. Everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt and when stuff like this happens it's more of a design flaw. If overclocking my cpu was the only way to run EU I would have done it myself to be honest, and don't think players should be blamed for timing issues and design flaws.
 
DanTheManKae said:
He could have overclocked it cause it was the only way to run EU.
Click to expand...

Overclocking your CPU will not help you running EU - unless you are overclocking your gfx card... but that will not make you fly faster.
 
So I've been informed that I was misunderstood. I never said he did it by overclocking his cpu. Other people mentioned it and I jumped in after saying if this is the case it is ma's fault. I never got the chance to talk to him about it. I just wanted to find out the truth. As much as some of you would scream bs, a lot of us pirates have a high sense of honor and integrity. If a pirate is cheating yes I want to know about it, but want facts not crucifixes. What a lot of you don't understand is that most of us are very competitive and simply love pvp. I am NV and I wear it proudly, so of course I want to know if there is shady crap going on in my faction. For the few that tried to help figure out the prob TY, and for the guilty until proven innocent people FU!
 
DanTheManKae said:
So I've been informed that I was misunderstood. I never said he did it by overclocking his cpu. Other people mentioned it and I jumped in after saying if this is the case it is ma's fault. I never got the chance to talk to him about it. I just wanted to find out the truth. As much as some of you would scream bs, a lot of us pirates have a high sense of honor and integrity. If a pirate is cheating yes I want to know about it, but want facts not crucifixes. What a lot of you don't understand is that most of us are very competitive and simply love pvp. I am NV and I wear it proudly, so of course I want to know if there is shady crap going on in my faction. For the few that tried to help figure out the prob TY, and for the guilty until proven innocent people FU!
Click to expand...

U can see with ur own eyes. Why bump a thread again they leave alone for a reason (yes they're guilty as hell and it's very hot under their feet).
This is exploiting at it's best. Surely you know all about it and there's no honor in the whole exploiting bunch at all. I wouldn't even call them pirates but abusers rather.
Now why don't you stop posting BS yourself as either you take part of it or you are totally clueless what's going on and just chose to back up a side you know nothing about. My guess is the first option but that's a guess.
 
Neil Stockton said:
I tested it just now and it does not work for me. Crosshairs in the team target box still misses most of the time (not registered misses, but real misses), especially since the team target box is not aligned with the jumping, temperamental hitbox. Maybe you're able to do it because you're very close when you're shooting these things from the MS? Or maybe the bigger guns have a bigger area of destruction? Either way, it's on my "do not hunt" list. :laugh: I did send in a support case about it, btw.
Click to expand...

Have u tried tagging the mob by left clicking it and then u aim under the greenish arrow...i hit all the time when i do that...but ive only tried in MS so far.
 
In average, i have met less a$$holes and more nice people among pirates than on Calypso.
Probably just a coincidence and it sure doesn't mean all pirates are cool chaps, and everybody down on the surface are bastards.
My point is, scrap all your prejudice if you wanna see the truth. ;)
 
Could it be that space being 3dimensional affects this.

If A travels in a straight line, standing still on level X & Z and only moving in X. A perfect X travel. And traveler B moves in X, but also slightly in Y and nothing in Z. A will gain on B cause of more perfect line and end up within shooting range.
See the picture for a scetch of the concept.



 
.Stagger said:
Luckycharm,
i want you to know that you are one of the people currently engaging in a type of
harassement which is from very low class.

You are behaving yourself exactly one of the trolls that do all the effort
they can to ban a player from a game just because you can't win from him yourself.

If any member of my crew will be banned without a proper reason,
and i can find a way to proof his innocence, i will also find a way to rebound this on you.
Crime has to be punished, this type of harassement is leaving the universe, therefore against the EULA.
Click to expand...

Hmmmm amd ummm and hmmmmm again :scratch2:
 
Nirfu said:
Could it be that space being 3dimensional affects this.

If A travels in a straight line, standing still on level X & Z and only moving in X. A perfect X travel. And traveler B moves in X, but also slightly in Y and nothing in Z. A will gain on B cause of more perfect line and end up within shooting range.
See the picture for a scetch of the concept.



Click to expand...

Problem is B (an exploiter) is gaining on A (traveller) at godspeed
 
Nirfu said:
Could it be that space being 3dimensional affects this.

If A travels in a straight line, standing still on level X & Z and only moving in X. A perfect X travel. And traveler B moves in X, but also slightly in Y and nothing in Z. A will gain on B cause of more perfect line and end up within shooting range.
See the picture for a scetch of the concept.



Click to expand...
That could work... IF they started flying from the same spot at the same time, but the problem has been described that, the trailing ship goes out of radar, and then gains up on you, so.
 
Nirfu said:
Could it be that space being 3dimensional affects this.

If A travels in a straight line, standing still on level X & Z and only moving in X. A perfect X travel. And traveler B moves in X, but also slightly in Y and nothing in Z. A will gain on B cause of more perfect line and end up within shooting range.
See the picture for a scetch of the concept.



Click to expand...

Yup this does work, and was used alot on the beggining, was a fun way to gain. However, the "Allign Horizontal" button changed all that. The only chance of this way of gaining working is if your target has forgot to hit the button. Once a ship is alligned perfectly flat on the map, and heading in a straight line towards its desitnation, only a fast quad could catch it ( in theory).

I've flew in space since day dot, on both sides of the coin. Ive got many nice pirate friends, and many nice knight friends - had many space battles and too many hours of flying around to claim to actually have a real life.

However this one intrigues me. I was casually flying from ark ss to ark, said hello to a few friends hanging around, and made my way out. I was in team and one of the team mates had tagged an un known pirate. I dropped settings from high to low, I alligned horizontal, heading straight for destination, and spun the camera around to watch the space station dissapear.

I noticed the team target disappear then a few moments later it re-appeard at 0.19.. 0.18... 0.17 ... 0.16... "Hmm thats cheeky" - I thought, "wonder what hes up to. " Needles to say I didnt think any more of it and made my merry way to planet. First time id ever seen it.

The faster pc stuff doesnt really wash with me, for so many months all (L) quads were equal, wether the chaser or the chasee. Ive flew with my PC plugged in to tinternets, and my laptop sucking rubbish wireless out of the air - both go the same speed. Id never once seen a faster (L) quad until the other week.

I like that the UL quads have a little advantage, makes it fun and dynamic, ducking and dodging etc. The amount of that advantage is fun, as you may be able to evade ( but more likely need to fight), or they may catch you depends on all the things above. However Kinda feel sorry for those guys if there is a speed bug as fast as this one appears to be - destroys the fun in that little advantage.

:)

Makes no odds to me anyway, Just my tuppence worth... I never did figure out how to fly a helicopter faster ;)
 
Alainax said:
Yup this does work, and was used alot on the beggining, was a fun way to gain. However, the "Allign Horizontal" button changed all that. The only chance of this way of gaining working is if your target has forgot to hit the button. Once a ship is alligned perfectly flat on the map, and heading in a straight line towards its desitnation, only a fast quad could catch it ( in theory).
Click to expand...

Nope, had align horizontal set and someone named "Stoney" in a quad caught up to my quad.

Sure seems like an exploit to me. Hope you enjoyed your no loot. :nana:
 
In some other games were known baned ones for hacking directx files to gain speed as well as manipulating send packets.
 
Had the same issue, flying in a straight line and being caught up by the same type of quad.
A solution to this would be great.
 
Could anyone being followed attempt to change attitude to that the pursuing quad is EXACTLY behind the line of sight? If they can catch up at any angle and matching angles then it's clearly a serious bug.
 
Nirfu said:
Could it be that space being 3dimensional affects this.

If A travels in a straight line, standing still on level X & Z and only moving in X. A perfect X travel. And traveler B moves in X, but also slightly in Y and nothing in Z. A will gain on B cause of more perfect line and end up within shooting range.
See the picture for a scetch of the concept.



Click to expand...

That would mean that it is a bug.


Speed = travelled distance over time, no matter which axis.

Or in other words:
sqrt(deltaX²+deltaY²+deltaZ²) for A = sqrt(deltaX²+deltaY²+deltaZ²) for B
 
Luckycharm said:
U can see with ur own eyes. Why bump a thread again they leave alone for a reason (yes they're guilty as hell and it's very hot under their feet).
This is exploiting at it's best. Surely you know all about it and there's no honor in the whole exploiting bunch at all. I wouldn't even call them pirates but abusers rather.
Now why don't you stop posting BS yourself as either you take part of it or you are totally clueless what's going on and just chose to back up a side you know nothing about. My guess is the first option but that's a guess.
Click to expand...

There you go assuming again. You just implied I was part of some scam or exploit, without presenting any evidence to back this up. You are prejudice against pirates and automatically assume I am a scumbag because I take part in space pvp. As for choosing to back up a side I know nothing about, I had already stated I knew this player in game and believed him an honorable man as far as I knew. All I asked for was proof of his wrong-doing witch I never received. I also mentioned that I believe there was a descent chance that this was stumbled upon and not plotted.

Furthermore I have been playing EU 10 years off and on and have never once been accused of scamming or exploiting (aside from daisy joking with me saying switching seats in my quad was an exploit). So before you spit out your garbage assumptions you need to know your a noob compared to me, and I am a credible witness as I go by facts not emotions. To bad we can't say the same for you. Anytime you reply to my posts you always seem to be against me. You even posted in my withdraw thread stating that maybe they are taking so long because they want to make sure i didn't scam or exploit to get the ped
 
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