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valentin said:
Their PR for the game is weak (for some reason they do not know how they will do it).

They have tried to do much outside the game's frames to get some revenue - this has not succeeded.

Personally, I think the fault lies in their line because they have a rigid agenda that they refuse to change no matter how it goes.

They also have a very poor customer support where they let the customer wait for years, and they also lie to their customers.

They say that they listen to their customers and do what most people want it - has proved time and again that it is not true.

I do not think they are greedy but they are working hard to destroy the game's reputation.

:twocents:
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Yet we are still here, repeating ourselves, over and over again.
Thats what somehow amazed me over the last 8 years of beeing an Entropian.
​
 
:offtopic:

Just look at this info. Its not about how much i gain or lost its about ingame play.


6.5 years in game,depo a lot and total global and hof over 10k in the game sense Entropia tracker No 41 all time in hunting and just over 700k in tracker ( best loot just weeks after i depo 33k $ it was at 27k peds ).

6.5 years her and same no whitdraw only depo, lvl hunter over lvl 100 and the skills is about 450k total nowdays i think its a bit more.

Have over 260 in hp.

Missions done..
At Calypso 336 done. ( Sorry its only 335 done ).
At Arkadia simple attribute missions done.
At Rocktropia most simple attribute missions done.

Best looted items so far. 1 Jaguar foots M (ul) and 3 Marber plasma rifles.

No uber ATH.

Best looted items so far. 1 Jaguar foots M (ul) and 3 Marber plasma rifles.

How do you think a player would think about this result, there's almost no chanse to development on the avatar in the game.
 
I would imagine that the castle was bought to safe tax back in a time when it looked like account registration numbers would go up soon quickly.
Since they now have it , there is not much point to hurry selling it as long as they dont need the money.

However i agree that there are lots of ways on how promotion could be improved by things as simple as giving the own participants the choice to aquire fan articles like shirts, caps, cups, banners, posters, magazines, figurines, etc. or even giving out rewards ingame over time if a new player registered based on the ID/name of an existing player and generates continuous income for mindark.
 
valentin said:
How do you think a player would think about this result, there's almost no chanse to development on the avatar in the game.
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I think: Dont hunt for ATH, dont hunt for ultra rare Items, collect your daily Bread&Butter-Markup and you will play for cheap at least...
 
John B Knight said:
I would imagine that the castle was bought to safe tax back in a time when it looked like account registration numbers would go up soon quickly.
Since they now have it , there is not much point to hurry selling it as long as they dont need the money.
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Well the upkeep of such a place ain't cheap, its not like you lock the door and it costs nothing. Seriously doubt that the renovation cost was paid cash, more likely a loan was taken, which would be fine if they were making a company profit (tax reduction) but they're in loss, so not much of a help there either. Ped sink (uhum Euro/sek whatever :)

Btw, mindark is in constant need of money, just look at withdrawal time increase=cash flow problem.

I really really do hope the top brass of Mindark (ie the humble one reads this) feels :ahh:
 
Why did they paint the castle yellow? :scratch2:
 
McCormick said:
Yet we are still here, repeating ourselves, over and over again.
Thats what somehow amazed me over the last 8 years of beeing an Entropian.
​
Click to expand...

Damn yea ... :wise:
 
BBpunisher said:
Why did they paint the castle yellow? :scratch2:
Click to expand...

Perhaps there was an increase in yellow paint looted and they cleared auction for a low price... Deal of the century
 
All very nice reads about marketing, failed attempts etc, but I'm convinced there is an in-game matter which is more important to solve before doing succesful marketing or making each decision with the outside world a success.

As long as you can loose a lot of money in a short timespan, people will not come in masses.
(even we know you recover it by using your so-called 'non-personal loot pool' shortly after).

Example (real info over the last 2 weeks) :

0. I was doing well and was making profit lately (not tracked)
1. I was playing for about 4-5 hours one day and made >200 ped tt profit in the end (incl. all costs)
2. I was playing another 3 hours in wof that day and lost more than 900 ped (54% return, incl. all costs)
3. I was playing 3 hours in wof and won >200.

In the end I'm doing fine but ...

How do you explain (step 2) to anyone for whom 900 ped (30$/hour) is a big deal ?
How do you explain a WOW person that what he spent in 5-6 months subscription (+-) can be lost here in 3 hours.

Answer :

You don't, you scare them off and they'll never join.
Most people I know find the barrier to start and risk to loose a massive amount of money to high.

I even have a friend who spent like 15.000€ in this game and at some point he quit. After those many years he played he recovered in redrawing more than 15.000€ ... so in the end he played for free (and believe me when I say he wasn't playing very wisely :)). Nevertheless he wants to come back but can't ... "reserving" another high amount of money in game is simply not possible in his current economic situation. Make him play for average 20$ a month, and he is back ...

The "ups" and "downs" in this game are to steep for a regular "normal" player.

I'm happy advertising & marketing didn't attract all these people yet, at least not until this problem above is solved. If it isn't solved, we'll never get the amount of people we need ... or they will have left before they even started.

Not to mention all those that tried and didn't stay because of this fear ...

Atami
 
mindarketing.jpg


Great Post :) +rep

MindArk has consistently performed like a bunch of clowns getting out of a tiny car..

Slightly comical, but just a distraction while they rake in your cash...
 
AtamiKiangola said:
The "ups" and "downs" in this game are to steep for a regular "normal" player.

I'm happy advertising & marketing didn't attract all these people yet, at least not until this problem above is solved. If it isn't solved, we'll never get the amount of people we need ... or they will have left before they even started.
Click to expand...

Exactly this. We loose and loose our huge potential playerbase because MA dosnt realize this. Atm for me (since around 10 days) loot sucks bigtime and I lost enough to go on a small holiday trip which I really had prefered than....

Loot is often really or quite good but I bet one of theese downswings will kill me and most other people one day :(
 
AtamiKiangola said:
.... How do you explain a WOW person that what he spent in 5-6 months subscription (+-) can be lost here in 3 hours. ...
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Sure, in principle i understand the concerns but how can a newcomer lose 9000 ped in 3 hours? edit: upps, 900 not 9000, my bad
Let's see:
  • Hunting - Opalo-class weapons can't even cycle that amount of peds in 3hr, and the average returns on tiny mobs are pretty stable. OK, there's extreme examples: u could go and shoot all your ammo in the air but that's prolly not what u meant.
  • Mining - If i remember it correctly the rookie scanners are also slower and use less probes per drop, similar to rookie guns.
  • Crafting - with low level BP's, even if u click on condition... idk, haven't exactly tested it but gotta feeling it would take long time until u manage to get really disastrous results
  • Finally, u can always waste any sum simply by buying stuff, nobody can possibly block this for a newcomer... but that's prolly not what u meant either.

Seems to me this isn't actually a newcomer's problem, the troubles with choosing the right level of gameplay u can afford comes a little later, when u actually have a choice between different weapons/mobs/scanners/BP's.. (?)

If so, how could MA possibly address this problem?
By taking away our freedom of choice?
Again, i can see this is a serious problem but, regretfully, can't imagine any realistic solutions... :(
 
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Fifth said:
Sure, in principle i understand the concerns but how can a newcomer lose 9000 ped in 3 hours?
Click to expand...

Its quite easy to loose 900 Ped for a Newcomer but at the end it dosnt matter if we kill newcomers or older players...
 
Fifth said:
Sure, in principle i understand the concerns but how can a newcomer lose 9000 ped in 3 hours?
Let's see:
  • Hunting - Opalo-class weapons can't even cycle that amount of peds in 3hr, and the average returns on tiny mobs are pretty stable. OK, there's extreme examples: u could go and shoot all your ammo in the air but that's prolly not what u meant.
  • Mining - If i remember it correctly the rookie scanners are also slower and use less probes per drop, similar to rookie guns.
  • Crafting - with low level BP's, even if u click on condition... idk, haven't exactly tested it but gotta feeling it would take long time until u manage to get really disastrous results
  • Finally, u can always waste any sum simply by buying stuff, nobody can possibly block this for a newcomer... but that's prolly not what u meant either.

Seems to me this isn't actually a newcomer's problem, the troubles with choosing the right level of gameplay u can afford comes a little later, when u actually have a choice between different weapons/mobs/scanners/BP's.. (?)

If so, how could MA possibly address this problem?
By taking away our freedom of choice?
Again, i can see this is a serious problem but, regretfully, can't imagine any realistic solutions...
Click to expand...

* 900 ped, not 9000 ped in 3 hours

You are right ... this particular case does not look like it is a newcomers problem.
But those numbers apply for newcomers in smaller amounts.

* I remember my first deposit of 50€ (a game costs 50€ to, so lets have fun)
* I remember one of my next deposits of 70€, wow ... I was rich !

Still, even back then a blink of the eye and you would have lost it ... not even taking into account gear to buy.
As Marco said in the past, "we never said it was going to be cheap".

The friend I was mentioning did come back to play a bit with mining without amplifiers but kept loosing his 20-30$ deposit per week in like a couple of hours or 1-2 days max. So he gave up and quit completely.

As a hunter, once you are using an opalo you will want to move up. And isn't the fun in being able to grow and become better and finally be able to kill those nasty big proteron or daspletor in the end ? Been there, done that ... I know the path from jester D1 to MM SGA I use now.

It isn't normal that the better you get the more $/h one should pay
... or beter said, risk to pay (the steep decline)

If the message is that everyone better stays noob and uses an opalo, then I see no bright future ;)

Try to calculate your cost / hour, not your return % is a wise advice which can open your eyes ... or close them for EU ... unfortunately.

Atami

PS : Getting off-topic, sorry mccormick ; you are right about the initiatives though and I like your post.
 
I've recently returned to the game after 4 years away. I have chipped out & cashed out twice before, the last time being in late 08.

So here i am after a couple of months back & the old feeling of wanting to throttle the incompetents running the game is rapidly gaining on me. Far too many points to mention & besides they have all been talked about ad nauseum on the forum anyway....we all know MA's history.

MA have not changed the way they operate...in fact in some respects i think they have actually become worse.
I followed EU from time to time over the last 4 years as i was fully expecting the company to announce it was insolvent & for another group to buy it up for a song, step in & take it over.

This could still be a reality at some time in the not too distant future when they can no longer magically pull land deeds out of their hat & there are no customers in line to develop any more new planets(or purchase any existing ones that may or may not be flailing).

They are experts at driving away existing customers & beyond woeful at attracting new ones.

The general consensus from the remaining player base (the masochists) is that MA couldn't give two hoots about them...rightly or wrongly so...this is the perception & MA have not lifted a finger to try & change this perception...so one would assume that they actually don't care or we would have seen some drastic action on their part to try & halt the mass exodus. Instead we saw, heard, read....nothing...except broken promise after broken promise adding further to the player discontent & mistrust.

You have to ask yourself...do these guys not understand? Do they understand & not care or do they just not understand? Do they understand but lack the acumen to address the issues?

It's pretty basic really....the only other permutation i can think of not covered above is that the company exists solely to provide a tax write off for other financial entities that we are not aware of.

This is all purely speculation on my part but my last hypothetical makes the most sense to me personally as it explains to me what appears to be more than just extremely poor management but deliberately poor management.

Having said all that i still look forward to the day the whole mess is bought up for pennies on the dollar & a bunch of moderately average business people take over & turn the game into what it could & should be.


I'm sure some will take issue with what i have said, perhaps even the moderators, but i call a spade a spade & nothing i have said in this post could not be disproven in a court of law. In fact if i was arguing this issue in a court of law i would be far more aggressive & exactingly specific!
 
Well, I stooped playing for a while and connect time to time to "see" what happen to this universe. I still deposit but only to buy things at auction, stacking TT peds in this game is a good saving IMO.

What I seen lately is that graphics improve a lot since first release of Cryengine. Game Brio was excellent, period, but I'm pretty sure it is possible to enhance CE2 to the "nostalgic" and "surreal" level of Game Brio.

This is a call to you, McCormick :)

You know we are very old players of this game so we know a lot of things, a lot of facts, a lot of legends. We know first players back in 2003/2004 who left and forgot about PE, we know some who stay but do not play anymore, we know how money took over the universe, we know about legendary items, legendary scammers, legendary mobs who vanished, the Mindark's errors and features. We did things that newcomers will never experiment but it is part of the universe.

All of this is part of the universe and we are a sort of memory of it. We can speak about this game and the past with Nostalgia, with passion !! And when you speak about something with passion, newcomers can be charmed.

For many years, PE was my second home. Back to work then connect for hours. A real virtual home for my mind and most of my sense !

This is very psychological issue after all and many newcomers should take EU with philosophy. This is a universe with a huge potential, even today, with a true and very old story and I'm charmed about it, even today.

So, dear McCormick, why not bringing a project to Mindark, about our planet (I don't care about other planets, I'm a colonist of calypso), I think about a book who can be looted in-game about the roots of Calypso. You spoke about Oblivion ?? there is books in Oblivion. I think a lot of players like housing and a lot of player will take time to read books in their apartments, to learn about the planet, the legendary spots and many things.

It cost you nothing to ask and I'm sure it will contribute to the Planet history, even bringing back some nostalgic players :)
 
OK, there's 2 possible approaches -

- decrease the fluctuations, make returns more stable both in the long run and in short timeframe; regretfully the risk (to lose big) and the gain (possibility to win big) can't be separated - so it would all simply boil down to: how boring do we want it? lol

- leave the fluctuations as they are (more stable on low levels... up to... very unstable in a short timeframe on top level) BUT increase the overall return %

I can see only one realistic way out - and it inevitably brings us back on topic :)
As the fixed costs don't depend much on the size of the playerbase, more players would mean lower cost to play for everybody.

That's a vicious circle - wanna get more players have to lower the cost to play; but, to lower the cost to play u need more players... gotta love the irony of this! :)
 
Fifth said:
OK, there's 2 possible approaches -

- decrease the fluctuations, make returns more stable both in the long run and in short timeframe; regretfully the risk (to lose big) and the gain (possibility to win big) can't be separated - so it would all simply boil down to: how boring do we want it? lol

- leave the fluctuations as they are (more stable on low levels... up to... very unstable in a short timeframe on top level) BUT increase the overall return %

I can see only one realistic way out - and it inevitably brings us back on topic :)
As the fixed costs don't depend much on the size of the playerbase, more players would mean lower cost to play for everybody.

That's a vicious circle - wanna get more players have to lower the cost to play; but, to lower the cost to play u need more players... gotta love the irony of this! :)
Click to expand...

More players = more income, not lower cost per player ... that is the cornerstone of every company ;)
 
Entropia is a "game" base on slot machine mechanics. No way to solve the issue with whatever magic marketing. Target masses are gamers which prefer the thrill compared to gambling. They can't attract gamblers since the "mechanics" is a secret and not regulated by any law.

Bottom line is MA target market is extremely small and by chance. A gamer wanting to experiment but has gambling issues. Once he's hooked then MA has a customer.

The End!
 
AtamiKiangola said:
PS : Getting off-topic, sorry mccormick ; you are right about the initiatives though and I like your post.
Click to expand...

No problem, I know how it is all getting linked together in the end. :S

I really appreciate people like you, joining me in here, offering their support through words.


Hulyss said:
All of this is part of the universe and we are a sort of memory of it. We can speak about this game and the past with Nostalgia, with passion !! And when you speak about something with passion, newcomers can be charmed.

For many years, PE was my second home. Back to work then connect for hours. A real virtual home for my mind and most of my sense !

This is very psychological issue after all and many newcomers should take EU with philosophy. This is a universe with a huge potential, even today, with a true and very old story and I'm charmed about it, even today.
Click to expand...

Very well written Hulyss. Very well explained. A second home indeed. :love:

Project Entropia is still omnipresent in my heart, in my soul. Psychological issue indeed. :)

One might call us "loony"...and I wouldnt even have a problem with it. Im amazed by myself, that Im still here, that I even could enjoy space or do some mining now and then. Arkadia helped a lot for sure, not Calypso.

But over time I became one of those, that will no longer shut up and Ill try to continue showing up the bitter aftertaste, as it also became a part of our "Project Entropia". (theres no way you can negate that)

I like to discuss especially these things. (always without official comments of course)

Maybe there is hope...far, faaaar away. This thought never left my head.


Hulyss said:
So, dear McCormick, why not bringing a project to Mindark, about our planet (I don't care about other planets, I'm a colonist of calypso), I think about a book who can be looted in-game about the roots of Calypso. You spoke about Oblivion ?? there is books in Oblivion.
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I mentioned Oblivion for 2 reasons :)

1.) The game Oblivion was using the gamebryo engine and it looked fantastic.
2.) My thread, called "Content of Oblivion" (which shows all the stuff that has gone missing from the world of Entropia)

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/...205880-Content-of-Oblivion&highlight=oblivion

Back in 2008 Mr. Simmonds had plans for a weekly series about Entropia involving me. He even mentioned a new render trailer back then, which was just mentioned again recently. Will it ever hit the daylight ? Who knows.

Some emails got exchanged now and then, I throw in some ideas, asked for material, but in the end, the "project" somehow got left behind and eventually forgotten. Mr. Simmonds never phoned me again.

Though, Mr. Simmonds was always very sympathic and very friendly.

Then there was Frank Campbell, asking me about doing "tutorial videos" in 2009(?). He even wanted to pay me 1000 PED out of his own pocket as there was no covering from Mr. Timkrans at that time. It was all more or less in-official and I had lots of work to do by that time in reallife and was not really interested, as, I want to be honest, 1000 PED did not sound very fair, for hours and hours of working out a great introduction video for beginners. Frank also was very friendly, but I told him that Im not interested.

Since then time has passed and AkiranBlade did some really nice tutorial videos for the community by then.
(Dont know if he got payed or even contacted by MA though)

All further attempts in getting in contact with MA failed. It felt like I was suddelny put to ignore. Email, SMS, facebook...no answers anymore.

For the last time I was talking to Marco Behrmann, Jason Peterson, David Simmonds and Justin Sorrell at the Leipzig Games Convention. It ended with standard entropia small-talking and in the very end, Justin handed us out tons of boxes with Atrox/Hogglo/Longu figurines and some T-Shirts. Ya, that was great. ;p

Many months later I did not even get answers regarding small questions about my movie project, like, dates about the old odysseus probes or the date Calypso got finally inhabitated by the 1st humans. Just dates. (Too bad there are no dates in the old text files)

Are Frank and Justin still with MindArk btw. ?

I gave up getting in contact then.

Im in no way on a trip of revenge. I dont want to harm anyone. I just want to show up things in my very own way. And I always did that, by mainly doing sarcastic videos, filled with random nonsense here and there.

And as long as 1 community member is with me, I will continue my work. ;)

Most of my threads include many positive comments. I cant be that wrong, can I ?

Thank you all for your support ! I really appreciate that.
 
Wow so my posts got censored. Nothing against JC, since I doubt it was his decision, but really, that broke the rules?

2.2 - Insults/Flaming
Personal attacks, insults, rudeness, racism, threats, name calling or unnecessarily inflammatory posts are not permitted. Posts of this nature will be edited or deleted by the Community Staff without notice and the offending member may be temporarily or permanently banned without notice. It is important to keep in mind that PlanetCalypsoForum is a global community and what might be acceptable behavior or language in one country may not be acceptable in others. Common courtesy, politeness and respect for fellow members and forum staff, along with constructive posting of opinions is essential in preventing posts from being edited and/or deleted, or having threads locked.
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I did not insult any PCF staff members or users, so what gives? It was meant towards MA and quite obviously so. It wasn't even anything inappropriate, either.
 
Huskie said:
I did not insult any PCF staff members or users, so what gives? It was meant towards MA and quite obviously so. It wasn't even anything inappropriate, either.
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It is clear that since a while, certain moderators are, or out-passing their rights, or simply think that because they have god powers, they must act like gods... and we are stupid sheeps...

Time to grow up, or do it one day... I just wish not too late ! for you...

And there was nothing against PCF indeed,
I know because I did a screenshot of Huskie's post for my personnal archives...
May be tell the truth is forbidden too in this forum ?...
 
Forum Rules said:
2.14 - Administrator/Moderator Criticism
Criticism of these forum rules, or Forum Staff implementation of these forum rules is NOT permitted in any publicly viewable area of the forum. Such content will be deleted without notice. If you disagree with how the forum is being moderated or administered, please use the Contact Us link at the bottom of any forum page to contact the Forum Staff. If you are unclear about the purpose or interpretation of one of the forum rules, either contact an administrator via private message, or consult the PlanetCalypsoForum Rules Discussion thread.
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Most edited/deleted posts happen as a result of a complaint by another forum member using the report post button. We mods are not perfect and occasionally make mistakes, but ranting about things you think moderators have done wrong on the public forum doesn't help anyone, and just creates an air of negativity around the place.

In the first instance, please PM the moderator involved and ask for an explanation/reversal. If following that you're still unsatisfied, contact 711 and the other moderators.

In this case, perhaps I can help. Directing the comment 'greedy incompetent bastards' towards MA breaks forum rules: 2.2 (insults), 2.7 (profanity), 2.9 (excessive complaining), 2.11 (EULA violation: public defamation of MA).
 
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Franklon said:
Entropia is a "game" base on slot machine mechanics.
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Heeh, that's like saying "The real world is black-and-white" or "The physical universe is based on slot machine mechanics" - it's not exactly wrong or right, it's more like: how simple u wanna make it? ;)
 
AtamiKiangola said:
Make him play for average 20$ a month, and he is back ...

Atami
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You know it is possible to just deposit $20 a month, and no more, right? Needs a bit of creativity, but you CAN last for a month with that money. It just requires a bit of depo-discipline.
 
It is kind of funny, how everyone on this forum (myself included) always refer to MA as one big entity. And often, it is seen as an entity which makes error upon error.

But...

1) There have been quite a few personell changes over the years. New people = new ideas, so this can explain all the new initiatives.

2) It is often seen as good business not to "throw good money after bad". Yes, they came with many ideas and initiatives. And many got trashed. But what good would it be to continue developing a bank, when you realize it's never going to be profitable (especially with the banking crisis, and tighter rules, which make it nigh impossible to start up a bank)?
Or is it good business to keep working on a stock market, when you realize you lack the expertise to develop it into a proper online trading platform, where you can buy and sell RL shares?

With many of the replies, I sense a negativity which comes from frustration (yes, I notice that in myself too), but does our perception actually have correlation with reality? Well... no, not necessarily.

The OP is very interesting to read, that is true, it gives great history of the project, but it also feeds a sense of negativity which is just too omnipresent in our Universe.

And while there is a LOT which needs improvement (cost to play as you progress being a very important issue), EU still is a great game to play. Yes, game. Not slotmachine, not investment, but a great time to pass some time.

EU needs to make some changes; in their platform, in the structure of the game, but most important, it needs to regain trust. And as we all know, trust comes on foot, but it departs on horseback. This is going to be a long term project for them.

Perhaps even it would be good to indeed sell the game to another company. Even if that company is fully owned by those who own MA, it still would create a clean slate, giving them a fresh start.
 
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