EU/MA/Caly is losing money to Chinese gold farmers.

Diomedes

Young
Joined
Aug 16, 2013
Posts
15
Hi -

A brief introduction about me:

I have an 18 year relationship with MMORPG's and ARPG's. For those of you who are familiar with the franchise I led the largest PK clan in Diablo 2 hardcore (BMPK, sorry I had to plug the name for old-times sake). I was at the helm of the group which introduced TPPK, an extremely unfair script program which annihilated a target's character at the blink of an eye, destroying thousands of hours of game-play. I also wrote some of the first guides for "botting" in Diablo 2 hardcore which was widely distributed through a Diablo2-dedicated hacking, scripting, and botting site.

In short - I have a good amount of experience in exploiting video games. The good news is that those days are behind me and that's not the reason I joined Entropia.

You're probably asking, "Great why are you here then?"

I just wanted to pop in and let you know that I think Calypso is losing a lot of money to Chinese gold farmers, botters, or exploiters in the Calypso Gateway new player questing area. I've been playing Entropia for about 3-4 days and I just did the Caly Gateway new player tutorial for the first time today (I started on Ark).

While I was doing these missions I found that there were a LOT of new players wearing the yellow jumpsuits who were all "Freelancers" and didn't belong to a Soc who knew exactly where to go, the fastest routes to get there, and were all non-responsive to inquiries or questions.

Usually, players who are new to the game will actively chat with other people. Not this time though. I was thoroughly ignored while these other avatars went through their tasks with impressive expedience. There were many times that I would be lost, or I wasn't exactly sure what to do with one of the training missions and I would just wait for someone in a full-yellow costume and a *Freelancer* tag to drive by and all I had to do was follow them until I got to the next checkpoint in the mission. All-in-all while I went through the Calypso Gateway missions I saw probably about 18-24 other players who fit this description exactly, and all were playing through the tutorial extremely quickly and they all knew the routes necessary to get from one place to another very quickly. I mean VERY quickly. These players all had little or no problem zipping through trees, around rocks, around lakes, and through streams at full speed in their roadsters while on a near-beeline for the next objective's target. They rarely hit anything or messed up when driving. From what I understand Entropia has a fairly small player base and they attract anywhere from 80-150 new players a week. I highly doubt that 1/6th of the new players were all playing at the same time at 9am on a Friday in Shanghai (Im an expat who lives in China).

To sum things up: I have experience botting and scripting for video games in the past. I think that Entropia is being victimized by botters or Chinese farmers for the 3-4 peds that can be gained in TT value when completing the Calypso training missions. Everyone I met in these missions filled the same description: non-responsive, full yellow suit, *Freelancer*, who knew exactly where to go in the fastest way possible.

For those who think that 3-4 peds isn't worth botting for, or it isn't worth spending a day doing.... it is perfectly normal for some people who live in the northern parts of China to think that $1.60/day is a "good" salary. It's about what a rural-town prostitute would make in a day. I think that it would be easy for someone to be running the training mission 8-10 times a day at the speed that they were doing it, so $3-4 USD per person per day.

My intention for making this post is not to spread information about a bug or an attempt to cause harm to MA/EU in any way; but to protect my own investment. I have deposited a decent sum of money into this game already (a little more than $1,000 USD) and I am interested in playing a game like this for the long-haul. I wanted to bring my observations to the attention of MA/EU Developers and Security staff and I don't really know how to do so other than these forums.

I'm not really sure if this is the right place to post this, or if these forums are controlled by MA or by another private party. If this is the wrong place or if it contains information that admins feel shouldn't be spread, please delete or redirect this post to the appropriate area.

Thank you.

Dio



Edit -

I am begining to understand that some EU players are not the same as traditional MMORPG players. So I've compiled a few links that may help you learn about the gold farming industry and how it may be effecting EU:

http://hi.baidu.com/yopmuwmyxcgmnye/item/bab1710417f86512cc34eac4

http://www.edge-online.com/news/feature-exposes-gold-farming/

Pictures of a Chinese Gold Farm for Diablo 3:
http://imgur.com/a/BlU1H
 
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While I was doing these missions I found that there were a LOT of new players wearing the yellow jumpsuits who were all "Freelancers" and didn't belong to a Soc who knew exactly where to go, the fastest routes to get there, and were all non-responsive to inquiries or questions.

Could be. People have been farming newbie accounts in the game ever since you could get "something for nothing".

I wonder if this is why Arkadia put the bulk of the tradable free stuff (mining probes) at the end of the new player experience, which I think takes a lot longer than 15 minutes since you've got to hoverpod all over the planet.

From what I understand Entropia has a fairly small player base and they attract anywhere from 80-150 new players a week.

It's actually a lot higher than that. I think it's somewhere in the neighborhood of 100 or 150 per day on Arkadia and I assume it's more than that on Calypso). As I understand it, planet partners have to pay Mindark for every ped of starter equipment given away by these newbie missions, and it does add up to some real cash, even if those newbies don't actually withdraw any money in the end. That's money that would otherwise have been spent by Calypso for development or advertising or what have you, so yes, it's definitely in the players' and CLD holders' interest to stop people exploiting the system.
 
... I have deposited a decent sum of money into this game already (a little more than $1,000 USD) and I am interested in playing a game like this for the long-haul. ...

Are you planning to buy a planet or something???? :eyecrazy:


PS. Welcome to entropia.
 
I submitted a support case for Arkadia quite a few months ago, for almost exactly the same thing. Over a period of maybe 5 minutes 20-30 avatars all logged in after each other with random gibberish as names moved to a specific location and then logged out.

So very valid.
 
Are you planning to buy a planet or something???? :eyecrazy:


PS. Welcome to entropia.

No, just some CLD's. Remember the guy who bought $2.5m worth of CLD's when they came out? He's $1.25M richer now (even though he sold some back).

Thank you for the welcome.
 
One would assume that the electricity alone would offset those "free" peddies ... but hey.

In terms of exploit, MA is the dumbest company I have met in my entire life. Their annual reports back this up. Bugs are not being fixed, communication with the player base is almost non existent, fuck ups happen so often and last but not least ... exploits are not being eradicated (although, usually if its costing MA money they are slightly faster at fixing stuff).

I would say that if its true the PP are paying for it, you'll see the exploits going on forever, if its MA's money, there might be a chance it gets fixed.

Rather then writing a support case, go to the ARK forum and post it there ... Usually the Arkadia team is a lot smarter and willing to fix stuff (if they can)

Welcome to EU ... Even though it sux, its still the best game out there by lightyears, lol


Angel
 
No, just some CLD's. Remember the guy who bought $2.5m worth of CLD's when they came out? He's $1.25M richer now (even though he sold some back).

Thank you for the welcome.

The guys who bought Microsoft shares when they first started are richer today aswell, but that doesent mean its a good idea to buy MS shares today :)
 
Rather then writing a support case, go to the ARK forum and post it there ... Usually the Arkadia team is a lot smarter and willing to fix stuff (if they can)

Odd his original post was deleted..but he was talking about bots in the Calypso Gateway.

Edit: This was what was delete from the database itself:

EU/MA/Caly is losing money to Chinese gold farmers.
Hi -

A brief introduction about me:

I have an 18 year relationship with MMORPG's and ARPG's. For those of you who are familiar with the franchise I led the largest PK clan in Diablo 2 hardcore (BMPK, sorry I had to plug the name for old-times sake). I was at the helm of the group which introduced TPPK, an extremely unfair script program which annihilated a target's character at the blink of an eye, destroying thousands of hours of game-play. I also wrote some of the first guides for "botting" in Diablo 2 hardcore which was widely distributed through a Diablo2-dedicated hacking, scripting, and botting site.

In short - I have a good amount of experience in exploiting video games. The good news is that those days are behind me and that's not the reason I joined Entropia.

You're probably asking, "Great why are you here then?"

I just wanted to pop in and let you know that I think Calypso is losing a lot of money to Chinese gold farmers, botters, or exploiters in the Calypso Gateway new player questing area. I've been playing Entropia for about 3-4 days and I just did the Caly Gateway new player tutorial for the first time today (I started on Ark).

While I was doing these missions I found that there were a LOT of new players wearing the yellow jumpsuits who were all "Freelancers" and didn't belong to a Soc who knew exactly where to go, the fastest routes to get there, and were all non-responsive to inquiries or questions.

Usually, players who are new to the game will actively chat with other people. Not this time though. I was thoroughly ignored while these other avatars went through their tasks with impressive expedience. There were many times that I would be lost, or I wasn't exactly sure what to do with one of the training missions and I would just wait for someone in a full-yellow costume and a *Freelancer* tag to drive by and all I had to do was follow them until I got to the next checkpoint in the mission. All-in-all while I went through the Calypso Gateway missions I saw probably about 18-24 other players who fit this description exactly, and all were playing through the tutorial extremely quickly and they all knew the routes necessary to get from one place to another very quickly. I mean VERY quickly. These players all had little or no problem zipping through trees, around rocks, around lakes, and through streams at full speed in their roadsters while on a near-beeline for the next objective's target. They rarely hit anything or messed up when driving. From what I understand Entropia has a fairly small player base and they attract anywhere from 80-150 new players a week. I highly doubt that 1/6th of the new players were all playing at the same time at 9am on a Friday in Shanghai (Im an expat who lives in China).

To sum things up: I have experience botting and scripting for video games in the past. I think that Entropia is being victimized by botters or Chinese farmers for the 3-4 peds that can be gained in TT value when completing the Calypso training missions. Everyone I met in these missions filled the same description: non-responsive, full yellow suit, *Freelancer*, who knew exactly where to go in the fastest way possible.

For those who think that 3-4 peds isn't worth botting for, or it isn't worth spending a day doing.... it is perfectly normal for some people who live in the northern parts of China to think that $1.60/day is a "good" salary. It's about what a rural-town prostitute would make in a day. I think that it would be easy for someone to be running the training mission 8-10 times a day at the speed that they were doing it, so $3-4 USD per person per day.

My intention for making this post is not to spread information about a bug or an attempt to cause harm to MA/EU in any way; but to protect my own investment. I have deposited a decent sum of money into this game already (a little more than $1,000 USD) and I am interested in playing a game like this for the long-haul. I wanted to bring my observations to the attention of MA/EU Developers and Security staff and I don't really know how to do so other than these forums.

I'm not really sure if this is the right place to post this, or if these forums are controlled by MA or by another private party. If this is the wrong place or if it contains information that admins feel shouldn't be spread, please delete or redirect this post to the appropriate area.

Thank you.

Dio
 
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Odd his original post was deleted..but he was talking about bots in the Calypso Gateway.

I agree.

Thank you for all the information that can be found on this site. Without it I'd have a hard time getting to know the game.
 
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This coincides with attacks on several EU related websites. Strange.
Diomedes might have powerful enemies.. ?

:scratch2:
 
Simple solution would be to make these starter items non-tradeable and only tt-able for zero peds.

This coincides with attacks on several EU related websites. Strange.
Diomedes might have powerful enemies.. ?

:scratch2:

or he's just stating what he knows and being honest. Why is it a crime to be honest?

Anyway what he says sounds about right.
 
This coincides with attacks on several EU related websites. Strange.
Diomedes might have powerful enemies.. ?

:scratch2:

heh it was, but some will want to say it was MA who deleted the original message :)
 
This kind of practice allready players do ....but don't know why they doit when is written :"Only one account" like I said before peeps don't read ToU and EULA...
They farm over and over the Valkyrie (what noob sell in 1st day his car ...when his desire is exploring)
We allready saw auto-bots sweaters (there is somewere a theard)....
and could be many other things that we don't Know...

Auto-bots sweaters ---to bad they removed the photos ....

but also is so easy to create similar avatars to "trick" players ingame
 
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MA should have GM :eyecrazy: that could judge and see what is wrong or not realy wrong :monkey:
 
Good to have such experince from earlier games. I'm sure it will make u more wise on the choises u do here

Gl
 
heh it was, but some will want to say it was MA who deleted the original message :)
I can bet part of MA staff is still on holidays and the rest is recovering from holidays. :laugh:

So u saying they don't have time to post a message per week here on the forum, but at the same time they are carefully monitoring every thread, in case someone would make a post about possible alt accounts?
Well, then they can't do even this job right, because they totally missed a long thread with much more technical details and even ingame screenshots. Only some screens were removed few days later, but for a reason and by the forum mods.

U know, sometimes i have doubts if my suspicions about something are valid or maybe it's just some misleading (paranoid) tendencies in my brain? Those biological computers (of our brains) can work very effectively but tend to have pretty low error protection. Intellect is the best medicine in this case, all those "side-effects" have one weakness, they can't stand a strict logical analysis. I can kindly recommend it to everyone. :smoke:
 
if I am not mistaken, freebies are avatar bounded except for NI colourator and armour. but those need u to hunt for items beforehand.
 
If I am not mistaken the Valk has now become untradeable. A few months ago I traded some pixie armour parts with another player for 5 valks and just put them in staorage. Yesterday i tried to sell one to another avatar but got the message " This item is not tradeable". If you check the AH there have not been any sold for a while but I know they were on (usually at 2 ped each) a couple of months back. So if these items are now not tradeable then the farming is pointless.
 
Smart ppl see things wich me or we usualy dont because we are not inclined to run after not intended acts or maybe exploits and we dont need to fight for evry single pec or we are too lasy to do so..
Maybe described model is working - like create ava, do quests, sell what you can, boot sweating, sell skills, create new ava.
I have seen many times auction with a lot of skill implants with TT value under 1 ped.
Cud be just reseler job but cud be result of described farming model too.
Diomedes shud send his post to support instead posting here.
I have read all thread not because i find something new here but because i cudnt understand where is first post and cudnt find it.
So someone not only deleted post but renumerated posts in entire thread?
First reply i see from Neil Stockton and is reply is show as first post in this thread "#1".
Maybe we discower wery powerfull farmers Boss here able to delete what he want but dubit is a case.
Must be a bug because all other replies shud be deleted as replies on deleted post.
Well if nothing i had some fun here.
Will newer stop to learn.
 
...
So someone not only deleted post but renumerated posts in entire thread?
First reply i see from Neil Stockton and is reply is show as first post in this thread "#1".
Maybe we discower wery powerfull farmers Boss here able to delete what he want but dubit is a case.
...

I can confirm the original OP of the thread was not deleted by the mods here.
I'm wondering however if he edited it to add a link, and that has triggered an automatic action by one of the forum's anti-spam protection layers. :scratch2:
Wherever it went, it's not anywhere that I can see.

Back ontopic though, item farming has been observed and reported ever since the first Gateway missions were introduced. I don't recall it being a major issue before that, other than back in the old sweat-cap days, as there was no financial advantage to having a new avatar.
(You could include the evade-farming from bot avatars that went on for some time, but personally I'd categorise that differently.)
 
Spending some time in Gateway (Thule) yes, I do see a lot of new players zipping through not interacting at all.

There are some free ammo given which can be sold and I think the bukin blade / armor parts at the end in Camp Icarus also are still tradable.
 
Simple solution would be to make these starter items non-tradeable and only tt-able for zero peds.

Yeah.

As the skullcandy armor is unrefundable they could do it with the free handouts aswell.

Something I've got a mixed feeling about is the people who sell Valk S1(L) at Camp Icarus.
On one hand it's cool beginners can get a car when their first one is broken.
On the other hand, I'd guess that some of the cars comes from people who are farming new players.

It would be better to make them undradable, and then have a second mission when they have the chance to get a second one (besides graduation). Maybe give them a second one when they have gotten 1000 skill points/professional level 5 or 10, or when they reach a key location such as Twin Peaks, or they could get an Omegaton branded car when they reach Omegaton Western Habitat.
 
MA should have GM :eyecrazy: that could judge and see what is wrong or not realy wrong :monkey:

Oh not again lol

I said it in another thread, but the word "GM" is too floating. It could mean anything between a fulltime employed superuser at MA, down to a voluntary guide who's just checking around.
 
The original opening post did not contain any links to external sites.

Apparently Diomedes later edited the post and added links to external sites. Since his account is brand new and has a very low post count, the forum's automated anti-spam tools kicked in and sent the opening post to the moderation queue, causing it to become invisible to normal forum members and visitors. I have now approved the post and it is once again visible.

Thanks for sharing your knowledge and information Diomedes. :thumbup:

The best way to communicate your info to MindArk is to submit a support case on the official Entropia Universe account website.
 
Something I've got a mixed feeling about is the people who sell Valk S1(L) at Camp Icarus.

The Valkyrie T1 given from the tutorial missions have been untradeable for at least a few weeks, by now... Since last VU or so.

EDIT: Or at least not auctonable... I don't think tradeable otherwise either, though?
 
I have now approved the post and it is once again visible.

Sorry, still invisible to me. When I search for all his posts, it shows "Listing post 1-2 of 3".

The best way to communicate your info to MindArk is to submit a support case on the official Entropia Universe account website.

I usually use the ingame thing. The web page is needed though to send pictures (screenshots) and to handle suppot cases with looong texts included (typically log file snippets). (Support tickets with too long text in it looks empty using the ingame thing).

The ingame support ticket system is easily reachable through right click on background -> Support Center. You see your support ticket(s) immediately without need to login in an external browser.
 
So you want MA to get rid of sweating and anything free ?

(I just read the title, skim read your post for about 5 seconds, but I assume your saying there is someone Chinese farms sweating and selling the sweat for peds then withdrawing)

If I am wrong about the bit in brackets, ignore this please.
 
So you want MA to get rid of sweating and anything free ?

(I just read the title, skim read your post for about 5 seconds, but I assume your saying there is someone Chinese farms sweating and selling the sweat for peds then withdrawing)

If I am wrong about the bit in brackets, ignore this please.

ignored :)
 
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