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Do you have the skills to help develop Entropedia?

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As some of you might have noticed, there was a change in the appearance of maps in Entropedia today.

Presumably this is related to the anticipated change in the GoogleMaps API that Witte referred to.

The good news is that everything still appears to work, there's just some cosmetic changes to the zoom in and out.
Quite a personal relief, after the time I've put in to the 'map consolidation' project this year :)
 
Now that I've had a chance to look at the maps more closely, there's problems with adding data to polygons - such as to mob locations.

The polygon data now shows the first coordinate as "NaN" (ie Not a Number).

Any attempt to add or edit a polygon point will corrupt the display not only of that polygon, but of all mob polygons and locations.
 
Hello Everyone!

It should be ported to HTML5/Javascript/CSS for use not only on traditional PCs but any other device now out there.

I would be interested in reconstructing the website in this case. It could be a team effort as there are many aspects of the website that could be handled by individuals.

This also brings to question things like fluidity with our information resources (Entropedia, EntropiaLife, EntropiaForum, Planet Partners Forums, Mining Log, Player Logs, Entropiabay, PE Auction) and other future developments (Virtual Tycoon has the ability to construct, browse/buy/sell on auction, check storage, etc).

Why are these not encompassed in an all-in-one website? To me; Entropedia is that website. EntropiaLife is attempting to accomplish this it seems. Has giving EULife the source to handle been considered an option?

I like the concept of anyone being able to view the souce - edit/add and submit mods for approval. There are tons of free, open-source tools out there that could easily be modded for use with EU (pending MA approval).
 
TheGreat said:
It should be ported to HTML5/Javascript/CSS for use not only on traditional PCs but any other device now out there.

I would be interested in reconstructing the website in this case. It could be a team effort as there are many aspects of the website that could be handled by individuals.

This also brings to question things like fluidity with our information resources (Entropedia, EntropiaLife, EntropiaForum, Planet Partners Forums, Mining Log, Player Logs, Entropiabay, PE Auction) and other future developments (Virtual Tycoon has the ability to construct, browse/buy/sell on auction, check storage, etc).

Why are these not encompassed in an all-in-one website? To me; Entropedia is that website. EntropiaLife is attempting to accomplish this it seems. Has giving EULife the source to handle been considered an option?

I like the concept of anyone being able to view the souce - edit/add and submit mods for approval. There are tons of free, open-source tools out there that could easily be modded for use with EU (pending MA approval).
Click to expand...

The problem is MA has eternally been protective and proprietary about the in-game data. This has required a lot of extra effort to develop utilities that work around, rather than with, MA's design decisions:
  • Jdegre has had to fix the OCR for the skill scanner several times, when that heroic task could have been unnecessary with a simple to-the-decimal-accurate skills tab in the MA avatar account page.
  • my2pecs, peauction etc etc have all had to screen scrape the auction lots ending to get any information on market prices. It took years before MA made auction history available, and it still doesn't show things like unsuccessful listings, etc. Or a per-planet history.
  • calculating the actual decay of items is time-consuming some very clever methods have been proposed for some of the tougher situations (like non-ttable, etc. items). The tt value to full precision could be listed on the object info, or the actual decay given.
  • mining claim information must still be OCRed
  • only in the last few years has miss data been available in chat, which makes it much easier to investigate hit ratio, the affect of attachments, etc.
  • the list goes on and on...

This is in spite of requests to make APIs or feeds available for these things. One would think they'd welcome more market information sites, or encourage tools that let users track their progress in skilling. But no...

Anyway there are several "competing" products around and they all have their strong points and followers, but they also have differences in philosophy or bias that make consolidation neither possible nor desirable. Entropedia's strength and weakness has always been that it's nonpartisan and nonglamorous.

It would be fantastic to have a new, modern interface to the data there, but that's not a trivial task and as i said before, there would be many disagreements on the best way to go about it in many details. I'm sure 711 (entropedia is hosted by him now) would support such an effort once it's been proven, but that will take a lot of effort and it's rare to find new projects that can maintain the impartiality that entropedia has.
 
I'm the guy who originally built PEAuction and then sold it.

I think we're all incredibly grateful to the fine people who have built and maintained entropedia. We all use it. We NEED it. However, if this is going to be a group effort to maintain then I think we can all agree that there are more PHP programmers here than anything else. I would be interested in seeing just how impossible it would be to move the site into PHP (mediawiki or something). I agree that moving the current codebase and full DB on to github would be a great first step here. Browsing through the site should remind us just how much of a massive undertaking this would be but I think we should at least consider it.
 
Depending on stuff, like Witte remembering where he uploaded the code, starting with the db and remaking everything might be the only option anyways. Good thing is everything should be in db really.
 
It wouldn't be too entirely hard to re-program the site to work under JSP and MySQL. In fact I think this may be the easier approach as you could 'standardize' dummie wiki pages and any pre-filled information could be superimposed onto the dummie wiki pages to create a new wiki page (this would be useful for addition of new items due to the ever increasing EU platform). This would eliminate the need to create THOUSANDS of wiki pages by hand.

I'm not sure why or who thought to originally use ASP framework but that is just garbage :) I know both ASP and JSP as well as PHP but would much rather work with JSP then ASP any day.

Edit: I forgot to add that JSP does allow the use of connection pools (something that is convinient when setting up something such as an admin group) This would be helpful in implementing a group of administrators that could monitor the site for changes etc..

~Danimal
 
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I know one Entopian that could handle it. No idea he´l do it for free or want around 5k ped fee after.
I l go ask him when he´s online.
 
TheGreat said:
It should be ported to HTML5/Javascript/CSS for use not only on traditional PCs but any other device now out there.
Click to expand...

entropiawiki.com uses a MySQL database.. why would you want to use HTML5 with that? Wouldn't it be easier to use something like ASP, JSP, PHP? :) I'd like to make less work for myself and future individuals as possible and to me the logical approach would be to use JSP and Servlets. This way if you would need to update the existing webpage for display purposes you could easily inject Java or HTML into the JSP page and if you needed to update the code to "talk" to the database then you would just need to update the servlet that handles the request. PHP is nice because you can build the code onto the webpage itself.. but then when it comes time to update the visual display of the page you have to also know what the hell you are doing in PHP in order to restructure the code to work with the visual display of the page.

I would be willing to work on the new updated website as well as administer it. During my free time I could program a few pages, but without really knowing what the database looks like I really can't do much more then design a few 'dummie' pages to work off of. Now may also be the time to redesign the 'look' and 'feel' of entropiawiki.com as well :)

Here is what I have come up with so far... this is just a rough design though and I tried to make it look visually as much as wikipedia.org as much as possible to keep with the wiki 'standard' but of course this could change too depending on the design scheme/layout that is chosen.

entropedia_mock_up_page.jpg


As I have stated previously, I do not mind working towards this endeavor because it will allow the community to benefit from this project and information could be shared with everybody. I do not expect to be compensated for helping to create the new website but donations are always accepted! :D

~Danimal
 
Has there been any update on this from whitte? I would really like to begin working on the website as soon as possible. All I really need are access to the database or at least an SQL that had the partial database in it with the cells and tables set up already so I could build the web pages from that offline and then when whitte is ready we could upload all of the new pages.

I could also host the website too, I really don't care.. so long as the community has a functioning wiki page that can be used and someone(s) could administer it.

The longer we wait to get any headway on this the more 'broke' entropedia will be.

~Danimal
 
Very nice initiative Danimal!
I think it speak for many when I say I would be really happy to get an up-to-date wiki again.

Wish I also could help with the website but my experience is very limited.

But as I said, nice to see people wanting to help the community :yup:
 
Axel Foley Head said:
Very nice initiative Danimal!
I think it speak for many when I say I would be really happy to get an up-to-date wiki again.

Wish I also could help with the website but my experience is very limited.

But as I said, nice to see people wanting to help the community :yup:
Click to expand...

I have always enjoyed playing EU and have always contributed to the wiki by updating whatever new information was not on there. I have always felt that the entropeida.info wiki was made by the people and for the people to use freely. Information about EU should be shared and not hoarded, that's why I have always tried to update new information as it came along. I believe that anybody working on this 'new' wiki should want to help the community grow in knowledge and I am willing to offer (what little) time I have to working on this new website for free.

I only would hope that there are others willing to help out in this endeavor as well, even if it is just to administer the new website.

~Danimal
 
danimal01 said:
Has there been any update on this from whitte? ...

I could also host the website too...
Click to expand...

The last email response I received from Witte (on 18 November) said that he would be taking 2-3 weeks off work in December/January and would be at home and able to sort things out then.

The site is currently hosted on one of 711's servers.
 
Serica said:
The last email response I received from Witte (on 18 November) said that he would be taking 2-3 weeks off work in December/January and would be at home and able to sort things out then.

The site is currently hosted on one of 711's servers.
Click to expand...

Okay, well hopefully; we hear from him soon then because it is now December/January :D

Basically, as stated above all I need to begin work on the new site is the database setup (access to it or a simple SQL script which I can run offline) and if possible some of the website code/pages that are up now (although I don't really need this as I am planning on re-writing the whole site from scratch and using JSP instead of ASP) it would just be nice to look over the previous work and possibly incorporate it into the new JSP website design.

~Danimal
 
What's with all the talk about changing the design and navigation? Those things are fine. What we need are some back-end updates to include some of the functionality that has been added to the game but not yet to Entropedia, e.g. decay absorption, buffing items.

There's no point in fixing what isn't broken. The current structure and layout of Entropedia won't be improved by making it more like Wikipedia, quite the opposite.
 
While I've done what I can to keep Witte informed, I have no way of making him respond - or even knowing if he is checking the email address I have for him.

Any decision about what happens with Entropedia is entirely up to him.
 
Oleg said:
What's with all the talk about changing the design and navigation? Those things are fine. What we need are some back-end updates to include some of the functionality that has been added to the game but not yet to Entropedia, e.g. decay absorption, buffing items.

There's no point in fixing what isn't broken. The current structure and layout of Entropedia won't be improved by making it more like Wikipedia, quite the opposite.
Click to expand...
+rep
Totally agree, wish I had the skills to do it.
 
jenny ferr said:
+rep
Totally agree, wish I had the skills to do it.
Click to expand...

Those that are offering to help have more 'skills' in PHP or JSP and some even have experience in ASP or limited ASP knowledge (those that offered to step up and help 'update' entropedia anyways).

While I agree with Oleg that the current design is fine the way it is, I don't have any clue as to how the pages are programmed in C# they could be individually hand jammed or computer generated who knows. That is why I proposed to use JSP instead because if there were ever something like this to happen in the future you would have the following:

-Update to database or website design needed: Simple with JSP just update the 'design' page or Servlet (saves manpower hours and time from sifting through pages of code of ASP and PHP, reduces the need to read thousands of lines of code)
-Need to add more admins: Simply update the admin pool to reflect whichever user(s) that need to be added in the case of now where Whitte is the only one able to administer updates to the wiki i.e. new damages items etc..
-Need to add a new algorithm/formula/damage calculation type: simply create a new function and place it into an existing servlet or create a brand new servlet. (Think of servlets as drivers that you can plug-and-play with, if your hard drive is outdated simple unplug it and plug in a new updated hard drive and transfer the old stuff over)

For the reasons above, simplicity and ease of implementation is why I proposed changing the backbone of the website to JSP. I only mentioned changing the design layout because it has been the same for years and if the community wanted they could vote on a new design layout that was more streamlined and professional looking that helped with the flow of the website.

This will be a big undertaking to update the code to JSP though but it would ease my work load if I could see how the database was set up then all I would have to do is modify some servlets I have already pre-programmed and voila-la computer generated 'dummie-holder' pages so when someone goes to input an item that item is 'grafted' onto those dummie pages (similar to how it is now when you add new items). This reduces the server response time as well making the website faster.

Again, I am only interested in helping the community and I am a firm believer that the wiki should stay free for all to use and therefore should be developed for free as well. I am WILLING to put my free spare time into this project. If someone else has some better ideas I am all ears as well and willing to work with anybody and anyone who is also wanting to help out with this undertaking.

Edit: Ideally, I would like to implement the MV2 and DAO architecture design into the website so that this could never happen again where there is need for one person to update the website.

Edit2: Let me be extra clear so that my inbox stops blowing up with off topic PMs. When I am speaking of JSP I am referencing JAVA Server Pages and NOT JavaScript. JSP is a combination/hybrid/dynamic page that combines HTML + JAVA code + Servlets/Beans in order to create pages 'on-the-fly' or 'on-the-query'. It would also be rather time consuming to try and code an entire website completely from JavaScript and it would be rather unsecured.

~Danimal
 
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The maps feature on Entropedia needs fixed and are new updated stats being added to Entropedia or the stats are outdated?
 
Korin Dante MDe said:
The maps feature on Entropedia needs fixed and are new updated stats being added to Entropedia or the stats are outdated?
Click to expand...

Some things that need to be updated/added come to mind are:
-Ability to add proper decay to mind force implants
-Ability to add 'enhancements' to the weapons section i.e. the thorfoid helmet + weapon
-Ability to add % Increase for using pills etc..
-Update Entropedia (google) Maps API
-Ability to have more than 1 administrator
-Ability to add newer item categories such as some specific loots and how they are looted/dropped and the way they link to other items in the wiki
-Ability to calculate proper decay from plates + armors i.e. Adj/Imp/Mod Mark.5b (gives ability to block % of attacks)
-Ability to add attachments to melee weapons
-The list goes on.. but those are some of the ones that come to mind immediately when asked.

With the JSP proposal that I have stated above all of this would be easy to implement into the website if it were using JSP + Servlets. All you would simply need to do is update the JSP to do a call to a function that would, say, calculate proper decay for mind force implants and then returns that value(s) to the JSP for the user to view. In the future if the formula is updated simply update the servlet (think of this as a hot-swappable usb item that you could change out when a "newer" version comes out) This implementation would solve the problem of having to redo most/all of the web page (in reference to mind force implants) code just to add, say, a single line of code. You simply swap out the old 'usb' and add the new 'usb' in and voil-la updated/new content is added to the website quickly and doesn't take weeks/months.

JSP (Java Server Page)
User clicks on mind force implant and selects heal chip i ----> Call to function calculateMFDecay(whatChip)----> Calculations are done -----> returns to the JSP and displays the proper number .#### pec decay.

User sees -----> Heal Chip I .#### pec decay :yay: Mission Complete :cool:

^Simple version of what-the-heck-is-Danimal-talking-about

~Danimal
 
Korin Dante MDe said:
Entropedia is undergoing maintenance?
Click to expand...

Long story short: EU had changes which cannot be reflected in the current version of entropedia. Lead developer of Entropedia has no time to develop new functions. Community is discussing how a possible future of entropedia could look like. Basically that is what this thread is about without all technical details.
 
Has there been any update on this? Would like to see what danimal01 talked about :)
 
Hello,
I am a programmer now, and I see that Entropedia is in need of help.
I am not saying that I am going to take it on, but I am considering.
If I am, I plan to use on the server side PHP with the framework Codeigniter and HMVC module and on client extJS.
Let me know if you are interested in seeing entropedia moving that way.

The good thing is that the serverside would be in a popular server side framework really easy to understand and use by anyone using it, and as long as entropedia remains free, extjs is free to use for development, and is probably the strongest framework out there. It is a learning curve to learn how to use it, but what you can do and how fast can you do it makes it worth the trouble. Let me know if you are interested in this.
I can offer the complete development and if is a must, I will look into paying for the hosting of the site if I get some input about the traffic I must expect and what package I need to buy to make it all work.

I plan to let the code out there for free so if I ever give up developing, anyone can pick up where I left off, if I ever start (and then stop) doing it.

There is a catch. I have no clue how to do the dynamic maps, and if no one would help with that part, until I learn what is all about, I won't touch such a feature.
 
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While I've raised this with Witte in email a couple of times, he hasn't yet indicated what his intentions are now.

Going by one of his recent posts here, it's possible he intends to continue to maintain the site himself now:
Witte said:
... I hope to do some maintenance next weekend so that all things that got broken after the server move are fixed again.
Click to expand...
 
Serica said:
While I've raised this with Witte in email a couple of times, he hasn't yet indicated what his intentions are now.

Going by one of his recent posts here, it's possible he intends to continue to maintain the site himself now:
Click to expand...

I am doing some small updates so that the site will run more smoothly, but I am not going to add any new functionality. I don't think its a good idea to rewrite the site to another language/enviroment. I do think that its a good idea to share the code on a repository among some people willing to improve the site.

Bottem line is, the people in the EU community will need to come up with a plan, and I will be happy to help out to get things on track.
 
Response times improved

Visiting entropiawiki.com recently I have experienced that the loading times are quicker. Seems like your tinkering is doing the trick. Thanks Witte, keep up the good work :wtg:
 
Witte said:
Bottem line is, the people in the EU community will need to come up with a plan, and I will be happy to help out to get things on track.
Click to expand...

Entropedia needs Windows to run, right?

So I would propose that we :
  • get a repository in github to which to push the code and initial / limited db dump
  • get an amazon windows instance to set up the test system

A github account that can make private repositories costs $7/mo. If the repository is not private, then its free, however, everybody will be allowed to fork the repository. The model is described here: https://help.github.com/categories/63/articles

I propose we use a simple system where:

  • everybody who has requested account can commit
  • the code gets checked out periodicly from repository and compiled
  • the compiled code is pushed to test system
  • if it works, it gets moved to production a week later
  • for communication, we use the subforum here.

I could do some of the initial funding of it all, if needed.

Edit: though we probably fit snuggly in free tier.
 
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