The Entropian Experiance

Eterrnal

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Eterrnal JustFineAziz SkyPharaoh
Feeling a bit hesitant at the time of writing this post, due in large part to the acceptance/stigma the community places on beginning players, coupled with the excessive amount of intolerance and unnecessary grandstanding i see taking part on the forums. *deep breath* Now where to begin?

Firstly I should say I have never experienced such a game before, i found it instantly enchanting (as I am sure many of you have) and i am still to this day of the opinion that there is something extremely special about the Entropian Universe "BUT" ;) yep u knew it was coming, it did not take long for me to realize some things i found to be extremely troubling. And honestly as you all know quite well, probably better than me in fact, there are many, to be even clearer "too many." I know it will be impossible to touch on all of them in one post, nor do i know them all, so i will address the major ones that come to mind, which for me i can separate into two categories.

1.) Mindark

As a long time gamer It is almost beyond comprehension how a game that has been around for 10 years has so little official information in regards to the actual game play mechanics itself. Very minimal company visibility online, even the company's official website has very little concise info, and Mindark as a company seems to go out of its way to keep things muddy and unclear. Sticking to the standard business approach of splitting hairs and hiding behind technicalities, as well as dishing out generic responses in regards to player concerns, one we all know and love "ITS DYNAMIC"
This is troubling for any game, Need i mention that this is a Real Cash game.
Am i the only one that finds it odd that for such a expansive universe the only activities to do are the ones in which produce money for MA, and i know there will be some who point out things such as taking a walk, sweating, stone collecting, etc etc... but lets be real here those features are very minimal and in no way can these activities on there own be considered as playing the game.
Sweating Ah sweating, ill just say this about sweating, while it is often cited as one of the free activities and a way to play the game with no deposit, the truth is this, MA places no value on sweat, throw as much as u want into a TT. Be clear here "any money earned from sweating comes out the pocket of another player, never MA", therefore MA offers no free to play mechanic we the players do, and a very minimal one at that.
Let me address the "Gambling" issue in this game, while MA insists this is not gambling, the many correlations to the workings of a casino are hard to ignore, one being the lack of non MA revenue generating game features, they do not want us distracted from the the task at hand. "Making the house profit" But i digress.
There are many issues i have with MA and may at some point discuss others, but for the point of this post ill move on.


2.) The Community (Us)

For me i find this the most troubling.
Mindark has created an atmosphere where many of its players feel constantly defeated, cheated, undervalued and nickle and dimed out of every pec, this should not be so in a game, yet by choice we continue to log in and shoot/craft/mine away, after all we love this game and many of us have already invested time and money and are in many ways in it for the long run good or bad.
Now to touch on something i feel may be a bit touchy "The Value Of The New Player"
One who reads the forums would start to notice an underlying aspect, The Noob is doomed, as game mechanics in general favor the more seasoned player, whether it be through weapon choices, mob choices/MU loot or lack there of,events, skills, etc etc, the new player has a long tough road ahead of him or her, now couple this with the fact the new player is looked at as a bother for older players,(and that yellow/orange suit does nothing to help this fact) there only real value being getting them into the game to deposit money in which the do not have the knowledge nor the in game skills to utilize and will therefore trickle down the line and end up in anothers ped card. This is very discouraging, now couple it with the atmosphere already created by MA and u have what could feel like an impossible situation.
A situation i have seen many express in numerous ways on the forum, coming from both new and veteran players, those concerned with the games/ communities overall well being, and then u have some who for various reasons be it real life wealth, in game luck, acquired knowledge, are unaffected by the "DYNAMICNESS" of EU and therefore have a very different experience than the majority of players, and are able to enjoy more of the games positive aspects while being effected little by the negative ones (as the game should be) the problem here is that due to their own experience it becomes hard for them to identify with players thoughts and concerns on the opposite side of the fence and this creates a divide, a divide in which imo EU cant survive as players already are struggling to survive and exist in the conditions MA has created.


Now to summarize my points and provide info about myself...

My reason for the post? = To share my thoughts and concerns (hopefully in a manner conducive to positive results)
To see where others thoughts and feelings are. To maybe gain some personal insight, as i struggle with my love/hate for Eu
Are these all the thoughts and concerns i have? = Not nearly
Do i feel one group is to blame over the other? = nope, everything is cause and effect, we all play parts
I don't believe in 100% of the time, so take nothing i say as me implying something is always one way and not the other.
Have i personally deposited? = Absolutely
Do i Sweat? = Absolutely
Do i think MA is cheating players? = sadly so, though let it be said i do feel there are many fair elements of the game, they are just being diluted.
Do i believe MA is hindering its planet partners ? = Yes
Do i mind paying for entertainment? = Absolutely not, i do mind being cheated though.

My wish? = For MA to love this game as much as we do... But ill settle for the community realizing...

It is about survival, OURS if they = MA wont change for the better, then we must...
 
2.) The Community (Us)


Oh please!!! Ask anyone for help especially an older player and there will be dozens of players and societies willing to help you. This is the most New player friendly game I have ever played when it comes to community.

I couldn't be bothered to read the majority of your post since it just seems like a negative rant.
 
I agree with Pig... <removed>. This game has a real cash economy, what do you expect MA to do? Tell everyone how the loot system works, and when things will drop? MA has their faults but they are by no means as bad as you claim. As for #2, as Pig said the community is very willing to help new players and are quite happy and content with the game. Dont base your claims off of a couple whiny posts...

Just read the end of your post. You have played for a very small amount of time and clearly have done no research before ranting. Loot is quite balanced just look around and see...
 
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Too much text. What's your freaking problem? Just leave if you don't like or understand it. Yes, it IS unique. Adopt it. Maaaaannnn!
 
Its good that you more or less have formed your own opinion of how the game's core is like. I won't say whether its right or wrong, but its your opinion and frankly, that's all that matters.

Now as to how you should take on this game, in my opinion, you should probably gauge how much your willing to spend on this game per month, deposit that much and then manage it accordingly so that it lasts you for at least that much time (entertainment/enjoyment).

60 USD/month and plays for 60 hours per month? Then you should aim to not spend more than 8-10 peds per hour in your activity and scale appropriately.

Play and deposit for as long as this game entertains you.

Keep it like that and you should do just fine.
 
Hmmmm

I dont expect everyone to agree with me, yet i would at least expect the courtesy of being respected, for i have not disrespected anyone, nor do i have any intention too.

@ Pig ~I dont believe what i was tryng to get across was either negative nor that the player base wasnt friendly, you said yourself you didnt bother to read it in its entirety. Its your opinion/ view and your entitled to it.

@Zenile ~ I dont see the need for the name calling, yet i'm the negative one, go figure. And i dont believe what i was saying in any implied i wanted to know in detail how the loot works, nor what will drop when and where.

@ Kristin ~ Too Many words huh :scratch2: some of us require alot of words. I never said i dont like nor dont understand, i have no intentions on leaving, im honestly confused at where ur coming from.


Guess this was the example of friendly community, :eyecrazy:

Honestly i expected some to disagree, but i didn't believe what i was trying to get across would be lost, i guess it was. Its what i was afraid of when i was writing this, and to answer the question again it could be why i used so many words. And yes i am a new player, but does this mean i am not entitled to my own views...
 
Nice post, I understand your frustration, you will become cynical like the rest of us and just give up and play. MA is a company with little to no public relations ability. It never has and never will. As long as players deposit daily, the game goes on as usual. Just come and play, get your 90% TT return over hours of grinding and whatever you do, don't invest big as the depreciation in value is huge!
 
Look, I chipped out a few years ago and am still here. I own a nice house at Minopolis, bought from 711 ;) I wear some rare clothes and I like to be an asshole. That's my pleasure. It's possible HERE, nowhere else.
 
Posting your thoughts about EU on PCF is useless...you can now look forward to being beaten for 18-20 pages by the fanboi's about how much you suck and how groovy EU is. lol

welcome to Entropia Universe! ;) By the way the forum beating is free...enjoy!
 
Posting your thoughts about EU on PCF is useless...you can now look forward to being beaten for 18-20 pages by the fanboi's about how much you suck and how groovy EU is. lol

welcome to Entropia Universe! ;) By the way the forum beating is free...enjoy!

:lolup: And now you tell me... Its cool though, i have a thick skin and i meant no malice. Ill consider it initation :laugh:
 
Posting your thoughts about EU on PCF is useless...you can now look forward to being beaten for 18-20 pages by the fanboi's about how much you suck and how groovy EU is. lol

welcome to Entropia Universe! ;) By the way the forum beating is free...enjoy!

Well, tbh ... I feel good in Entropia Universe (PCF is another issue ...). But okay, I am at Calypso since 2006 or something like that. I suck nothing. I am not really a "fanboy" - lol. I simply love Entropia Universe.
 
Posting your thoughts about EU on PCF is useless...you can now look forward to being beaten for 18-20 pages by the fanboi's about how much you suck and how groovy EU is. lol

welcome to Entropia Universe! ;) By the way the forum beating is free...enjoy!

Thnx for the welcome... :wtg:
 
Too much text. What's your freaking problem? Just leave if you don't like or understand it. Yes, it IS unique. Adopt it. Maaaaannnn!

Judging from that post i'd judge you to be an intolerant asshole, who could care less about how anyone else feels ...you may disagree with the op's assesment of EU...but acting like a dick about it just kinda shows exactly what you are. Hope the op is paying attention. :p
 
Judging from that post i'd judge you to be an intolerant asshole, who could care less about how anyone else feels ...you may disagree with the op's assesment of EU...but acting like a dick about it just kinda shows exactly what you are. Hope the op is paying attention. :p

As mentioned above ... I love to live in this given enviroment. I may not love details ... bugs, because I paid a lot of RL money for some items, but I love it in general. If I wouldn't I would leave it immediately.
 
As mentioned above ... I love to live in this given enviroment. I may not love details ... bugs, because I paid a lot of RL money for some items, but I love it in general. If I wouldn't I would leave it immediately.

Hi Kristin, i think thats what i was trying to get across as well, that we all do have a love for this game, and no its not perfect, nothing is, but we love it regardless...
 
As mentioned above ... I love to live in this given enviroment. I may not love details ... bugs, because I paid a lot of RL money for some items, but I love it in general. If I wouldn't I would leave it immediately.

I paid assloads over the years pumpkin....you think that makes you special?? lol

I love this game like no other game I ever played...or I wouldn't have spent what I spent and plugged the hours I spent either. Wanna compare Pumpkin? I'll show mine if you show yours...;) If I spent more does that mean I love it more than you??? :rolleyes: So I can't love the game, think it has great potential but hate the way the game is run??

Why are you so convinced your fucking opinion is the only one that matters? A new player isn't allowed to share his/her opinion and impressions of the game? Really??? what the fuck makes you so high and fucking mighty??

You should climb off your high horse, actually go read the OP...who know's, even someone that knows it all might learn something. :D
 
1.) Mindark

As a long time gamer It is almost beyond comprehension how a game that has been around for 10 years has so little official information in regards to the actual game play mechanics itself. Very minimal company visibility online, even the company's official website has very little concise info, and Mindark as a company seems to go out of its way to keep things muddy and unclear. Sticking to the standard business approach of splitting hairs and hiding behind technicalities, as well as dishing out generic responses in regards to player concerns, one we all know and love "ITS DYNAMIC"

Unfortunately this is the approach chosen by the company and does as much harm to the game as it brings gain. If there were a clear set of information many issues would be resolved trustwise and negative publicity would be lowered.

This is troubling for any game, Need i mention that this is a Real Cash game.
Am i the only one that finds it odd that for such a expansive universe the only activities to do are the ones in which produce money for MA, and i know there will be some who point out things such as taking a walk, sweating, stone collecting, etc etc... but lets be real here those features are very minimal and in no way can these activities on there own be considered as playing the game.

They can, and they are - the problem here is that if you offer free beer to ppl they will come, along with the gold farmers who will feed upon the game and slowly but surely try to destroy it - this is especially true in an RCE.


Sweating Ah sweating, ill just say this about sweating, while it is often cited as one of the free activities and a way to play the game with no deposit, the truth is this, MA places no value on sweat, throw as much as u want into a TT. Be clear here "any money earned from sweating comes out the pocket of another player, never MA", therefore MA offers no free to play mechanic we the players do, and a very minimal one at that.
Let me address the "Gambling" issue in this game, while MA insists this is not gambling, the many correlations to the workings of a casino are hard to ignore, one being the lack of non MA revenue generating game features, they do not want us distracted from the the task at hand. "Making the house profit" But i digress.

Sweating is this way to prevent ped leaking from the system and causing mass inflation. If sweating were to bring a real profit no-one would depo and the game soon run out of money to continue. On the other hand creating a surplus of money ingame would cause mass-inflation as people having more money would strive to buy more things, which in turn would pump the prices. It would, of course also cause people to deposit more (because of the higher prices), but MA's aim has been on lowering gear prices - not on increasing them, they also want to stabilize the game, not destabilize it with mass inflation.


2.) The Community (Us)

For me i find this the most troubling.
Mindark has created an atmosphere where many of its players feel constantly defeated, cheated, undervalued and nickle and dimed out of every pec, this should not be so in a game, yet by choice we continue to log in and shoot/craft/mine away, after all we love this game and many of us have already invested time and money and are in many ways in it for the long run good or bad.

Some people cannot handle virtual reality and do not understand how it works. Then they proceed to blame everyone else for their mistakes. They scream, shout and rant about being the victim where it only takes half a braincell to test things and base their actions upon these tests. Instead they expect to be rewarded for their stupidity and for the devs to do their bidding however bad this might be for the game. The only thing you can do with such people is ignore them, work with them or kick them out. Unfortunately MA is very bad at option 2 and tends to prefer option 1. So they keep on ranting.

Now to touch on something i feel may be a bit touchy "The Value Of The New Player"
One who reads the forums would start to notice an underlying aspect, The Noob is doomed, as game mechanics in general favor the more seasoned player, whether it be through weapon choices, mob choices/MU loot or lack there of,events, skills, etc etc, the new player has a long tough road ahead of him or her, now couple this with the fact the new player is looked at as a bother for older players,(and that yellow/orange suit does nothing to help this fact) there only real value being getting them into the game to deposit money in which the do not have the knowledge nor the in game skills to utilize and will therefore trickle down the line and end up in anothers ped card. This is very discouraging, now couple it with the atmosphere already created by MA and u have what could feel like an impossible situation.

Please remember that respect is earned, not given. Everyone will respect you for what you are, sometimes more, sometimes less, but in general you get what you deserve. I can name you a great array of people who have earned my respect by doing what they do (whether depositing or not) and an equal number of people who are just worth little respect. Personally I have rarely seen older players looking down on others, whoever I spoke to, whichever way I went - there was always someone more experienced I could talk to , they were kind, they were helpful (with the occasional douchebag, yes). It is new players I often find that expect to be treated special for not doing anything.


A situation i have seen many express in numerous ways on the forum, coming from both new and veteran players, those concerned with the games/ communities overall well being, and then u have some who for various reasons be it real life wealth, in game luck, acquired knowledge, are unaffected by the "DYNAMICNESS" of EU and therefore have a very different experience than the majority of players, and are able to enjoy more of the games positive aspects while being effected little by the negative ones (as the game should be) the problem here is that due to their own experience it becomes hard for them to identify with players thoughts and concerns on the opposite side of the fence and this creates a divide, a divide in which imo EU cant survive as players already are struggling to survive and exist in the conditions MA has created.

The dynamics of the game are: for maxed weapons & tools you get back 94% of tt spent over time. For unmaxed weapons and tools you get back less, so don't use them. The 6% missing and fees you have to cover with markup - if you happen to loot something worth 20k ped you are well off, if you have loot that has 120% markup you are well off too. Otherwise you have to deposit like the rest of us or stick to sweating and slowly work your way up. If you fail you can blame yourself, but you will probably just end up blaming it on the company - it is easier than trying to improve.
 
Think it was a good post, I can relate to and understand many of your thoughts and feelings about EU.
I see no rant here, so nevermind the three asshats in the beginning :)
 
I skimmed over this post...and passed.
 
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I am happy to stick my 2 peds in.

First off - Eternal - welcome to EU

It has already been mentioned but the very nature of the game being RCE means it is essential for MA to remain aloof, not interact too much with players and not give out too much information. This is a learning game - my avatar is just about 2 years old and I learn stuff every day. Yesterday I learnt why damage enhancers are the price they are. The game is full of your good ideas that lead down blind alleys or worse to places where others have already taken your good idea and made a profit from it.

Remeber every ped profit you make is not from MA it is from other players who are either silly enough to part with their money or its more financially viable for them to pay for a service in game. As an example back to damage enhancers on weapons. I can craft but my skill level is not nearly good enough to craft damage enhancers. I have 2 options.

1. Spend a fortune now in game building skills so that I can craft enhancers. Great as many crafted enhancers as I want, however when you weigh the cost of skilling up it will far outweigh the cost of buying the enhancers - unles you use them for say 15 years at which point you may break even on your skill investment. I could then start producing enhancers and sell them to other players to get my skill investment back. Again this sounds good but trust me there are always plenty of players who started this years ago and already have the market sewn up.

2. Buy the enhancers from another player and use them. In the short term this is a better idea as your cost are reduceded (you are not paying for materials - blueprints - failed crafting runs)

The key to the game is to find some ability - trade or talent that other players will pay for. I wont tell you what i do as wont most players as they like to keep it to themselves. I often combine my activities but I still have to depo - although not nearly as much now as I used to.

Just either accept it and get on with enjoying the game or walk away, it's simple The MA business model has kept them afloat for 10 years - through the worlds largest recession in 80 years so why should they change it. Part of the joy of the game is the enigma and not having any of the answers

GL

2.
 
Some people cannot handle virtual reality and do not understand how it works. Then they proceed to blame everyone else for their mistakes. They scream, shout and rant about being the victim where it only takes half a braincell to test things and base their actions upon these tests. Instead they expect to be rewarded for their stupidity and for the devs to do their bidding however bad this might be for the game. The only thing you can do with such people is ignore them, work with them or kick them out. Unfortunately MA is very bad at option 2 and tends to prefer option 1. So they keep on ranting.

Think it was a good post, I can relate to and understand many of your thoughts and feelings about EU.
I see no rant here, so nevermind the three asshats in the beginning :)

These guys got it and there are more of us like this, some of us prefer to stay quite tho. It's better not to wake the vampires....
 
I think its ok MA keeps that certain mystery around the core mechanics, its part of the challenge. It was originally the idea, that community figures the economy of weapons, workings of attachments, mob damage types etc. And so it still is. Player is supposed to do research to cope. These days there are more sources of information there used to be in original PE.

But it is beyond my comprehension why MA has kept so low profile all these years. The only reasonable explanation I can figure is that they simply lack the budget something like Blizzard or EA has. Which they sorely do.

I can also see the activities for a beginner are tedious, to say the least. A person coming from, say WoW where he/she gets *bling*bling* spells first minute after logging in, is here supposed to, uhm, gather animal "sweat" for all eternity. And missions are just damn dangerous lottery, you never know if you pick wrong one and end up to some outpost surrounded by the deadliest creatures you have ever seen anywhere, and no way out :D

(Ok, the social aspect really helps in this, as it helps in gathering information. But it is propably hard to see, first, after other games, how important it is.)

At least MA should introduce more some free *bling* *bling* here, I don't know what, but something that operates on its own level, separate from the hardcore economic level that can very well coexist with it. You know, things like naming your weapon, or, car, or adding personal, cheap plates to it, or having fabulous tree of different achievements, or ability to custom pick a profession, like "poet", or "misogynist", pet fights just for fun, miniarcade consoles, what not, none of that needs to clash with the all-important economy itself.

But I am sure its always again matter of resources. MA propably does not have much more left, the size it is now, after taking care of the balancing and security which really have to come first... (another matter is, that not all want any cosmetics, many accepted the much simpler Entropia in its early days, and would still do)
 
Look, I chipped out a few years ago and am still here. I own a nice house at Minopolis, bought from 711 ;) I wear some rare clothes and I like to be an asshole. That's my pleasure. It's possible HERE, nowhere else.

Can you please be an asshole somewhere else?
 
...Be clear here "any money earned from sweating comes out the pocket of another player, never MA",...


Stopped reading at that point.
You seriously believe MA are going to give you, not only a fantastic sandpit to play in (for free if you want), but also money out of their own pocket whilst you play in it?

Grow up!
 
Great post

Thanks for sharing this with us.

to start, the forum community here is very negative and much players even dont bother to post or even read here.


only thing i want to add is that the gambling part is much not understood.

Technically this game is not gambling because of the skill system. By the skills you can influence your outcome. But the entire game system is surely based on a casino payout style.

Maybe if you oversee your story with this information it will make sense.

Mindark doesnt tell shit also because it would give advantage to smart people. They give more information in game lately by new features and i do my advantage with it. So its actually best for the community if mindark says nothing at all about game mechanics



greetings
 
Great post

Technically this game is not gambling because of the skill system. By the skills you can influence your outcome. But the entire game system is surely based on a casino payout style.
greetings

So true Sostoned.(This is not gambling bec of skill-system). If the game was entire a gambling system it should not for sure be allowed under the swedish lottery inspector law.

http://http://www.lotteriinspektionen.se/en/Gambling-responsility/

http://www.lotteriinspektionen.se/en/Amusements-games/
 
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