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  1. #11
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    Hey,

    I extracted some data from my mayhem solo runs (Thx bettlejus for the idea with the chat.log)

    I was doing my normal MM runs, so candy cranes and kill strike plus arso chip. The tracker splits the chat.log after 10 mb or so and i took one that went on for 4 days.

    The problem was, that i used excel to get the numbers. I managed to exclude the arsonistic hits and crits by only using 3 digit dmg numbers (as my weapon does not do less than 3 digit dmg hits) But then I still had the evades in there and i couldn't get rid of those.

    So what i did then was, i assumed the arso chip would on avg hit 10 times. So I added 1/10th of the 2 digit hits to the hits and included the crits, as they only show once on first hit.


    Using that method I got the following numbers:

    Total Shots: 82593
    Hits: 72099
    Crits: 2235
    Evades: 8259

    That results in:

    87.3% - Hit %
    2.71% - Crit %
    10.00% - Evade %


    I think the arso chip still screws with the results a little but i minimised it as best i could think of.

    With this sample I can not confirm that it screws with the evade percentage but rather as expected a larger part of the actual hits are crits.

    Do with this what you will, I just wanted to provide some more numbers, I will not upload the unedited chat.log so if you don't think the numbers are viable that's cool too :P

    Regards
    Thark
    Last edited by Thark; 01-16-2014 at 10:18.

  2. #12
    Marauder sitram's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bettlejus View Post
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    I can reproduce this anytime if you give me a Liakon set (F) and Kill Strike nanobots (3)
    I had to rent a set yesterday and buy Kil Strike at 40 and 45 ped to test this

    or you can read the facts closely and have in mind this is not a loot test and the only difference appeared when using % more crit damage, almost no difference with the others, do you really don't see this as something that can be thought as fact?
    I think you can reproduce easily first test scenario without any investment in nanobots. You can also hunt other mob if you can't find a suitable armor for MM mobs.

    Can you tell me for sure you will get the same precentages every time you repeat Test 1?

    What if you get similar precentages with those from Test 2 if you do another Test 1?
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  3. #13
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    Nowhere near enough data.

    As someone said, you haven't even proved that these results are repeatable - so your method isn't validated.

    Considering you have an increased critical rate with the 1%+CR, and an increased damage output with the 10%+CD, shows plainly that the boosts work. You cannot however compare accurate values of CH, HR, Evade until you've at least repeated the test once (where you will see wild variations in HR and evade).

    Plus don't forget there's variability in damage output too.

  4. #14
    Marauder sitram's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thark View Post
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    Hey,

    I extracted some data from my mayhem solo runs (Thx bettlejus for the idea with the chat.log)

    I was doing my normal MM runs, so candy cranes and kill strike plus arso chip. The tracker splits the chat.log after 10 mb or so and i took one that went on for 4 days.

    The problem was, that i used excel to get the numbers. I managed to exclude the arsonistic hits and crits by only using 3 digit dmg numbers (as my weapon does not do less than 3 digit dmg hits) But then I still had the evades in there and i couldn't get rid of those.

    So what i did then was, i assumed the arso chip would on avg hit 10 times. So I added 1/10th of the 2 digit hits to the hits and included the crits, as they only show once on first hit.


    Using that method I got the following numbers:

    Total Shots: 82593
    Hits: 72099
    Crits: 2235
    Evades: 8259

    That results in:

    87.3% - Hit %
    2.71% - Crit %
    10.00% - Evade %


    I think the arso chip still screws with the results a little but i minimised it as best i could think of.

    With this sample I can not confirm that it screws with the evade percentage but rather as expected a larger part of the actual hits are crits.

    Do with this what you will, I just wanted to provide some more numbers, I will not upload the unedited chat.log so if you don't think the numbers are viable that's cool too :P

    Regards
    Thark
    The same buffs apply to all the weapons you use.

    If you are maxed on both weapons I would include in the calculation all damage, misses and critical hits.
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  5. #15
    Prowler bettlejus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sitram View Post
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    I think you can reproduce easily first test scenario without any investment in nanobots. You can also hunt other mob if you can't find a suitable armor for MM mobs.

    Can you tell me for sure you will get the same percentages every time you repeat Test 1?

    What if you get similar percentages with those from Test 2 if you do another Test 1?

    I still need Liakon to test that, but I can tell you I won't get any different results and in no way close to test 2 percentages and also need to have same results because I would need to compare them with my initial ones

    Why I need Liakon, because i only want to test this with Kerberos S3 where I am able to shoot constant and not fap

    Thark, you need to be very exact with the chat log file for the results to be conclusive

    I must find public ftp or something to upload my chat log so any non-believer can check for himself

    Adi, do you really want to make a bet with me for this? ( remember, I have 4 hours with accuracy where I saw that same DPS i produce only the balance between miss and crit and hit rate is changed)

    oh and btw, I had 2 hours with Kill strike but I haven't said about the first because I had 1 minute lag, but even so I have with 4,1K more damage then normal or with Accuracy
    Last edited by bettlejus; 01-16-2014 at 10:18.
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  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by bettlejus View Post
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    I must find public ftp or something to upload my chat log so any non-believer can check for himself
    I think it is not about nonbelievers but about not enough data (so those logs wont help us at all, unless you do some more testing).
    I also believe any kind of incresed hit or increased dmg should increase dps, but in this test you havent proven it.. yet....

  7. #17
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    One more interesting thing:

    when excluding the arso chip completely (as stated above - easy for my sample), and ingoring evades then:

    Normal hits = 67465
    Crits = 2090
    Total Hits = 69555

    Crits/Total Hits = 3% (3.00482)
    Normal Hits/Total Hits = 97% (96.99518)

    Which in theory means that the 1% increase is a perfect match! Sure there are evades in there as well BUT they shouldn't interfere with the ratio of hits and crits. It's just hard for me to exclude the arso evades from my data sample.

    So there you have it. I think 70k hits spread over 4 days is a fairly large sample and the randomnes shouldn't play as much of a role anymore.

    Also i'm to lazy to go through the log manually and i dunno how i could automate it so i dunno how many hours of hunting that was, but i didnt loose much dps so for 30h or mayem my weapon would have done 57*60*30 = 102600 uses, so maybe this sample is over a period of 20.5h of concentrated MM solo hunting.


    Regards
    Thark

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by sitram View Post
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    The same buffs apply to all the weapons you use.

    If you are maxed on both weapons I would include in the calculation all damage, misses and critical hits.

    well yeah and no.

    The chat log shows hits of the arsonistic as 10 different lines with the following format:


    You inflicted 34.9 points of damage.
    You inflicted 34.9 points of damage.
    You inflicted 34.9 points of damage.
    You inflicted 34.9 points of damage.
    You inflicted 34.9 points of damage.
    You inflicted 34.9 points of damage.
    You inflicted 34.9 points of damage.
    You inflicted 34.9 points of damage.
    You inflicted 34.9 points of damage.


    and when i count the lines i get all those single hits as seperate hits. But an evade is only shown once. so by design it's impossible for me to get an accuarte count, especially since they don't always show as 10 seperate dmg numbers but maybe only as 8 when there is lag or something. That's why, at least with my method of using excel, the arso screws with me.


    But you are right, the arso chip will follow the same rules as all other weapons. But my way of evaluating the sample doesn't play nice with it :P

    but ignoring the arso, the post above this has some nice info!

    Regards

  9. #19
    Prowler bettlejus's Avatar
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    Thark, you don't have a proper chat.log for measuring data

    whiteknut, are you bad at math, ignoring facts or what?

    Why do you say I haven't proven an increase in DPS?

    when I used Kill Strike (10% ore crit damage) I have 5K more HP damage in same time interval, same shoots

    because this is vas very important for the test to have same time interval and same shoot just to be able to measure damage output

    and if normal hour I had 243K damage and kill strike hour I had 248K, you just have to split 3600 second once by 234 and second to 248 and there you have better dps when using kill strike

    Crucial thing about this test is the same time interval and same shoots, this allow me to measure damage output / DPS
    ATH is chasing me, but I'm faster!!!

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by bettlejus View Post
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    Thark, you don't have a proper chat.log for measuring data

    whiteknut, are you bad at math, ignoring facts or what?

    Why do you say I haven't proven an increase in DPS?

    when I used Kill Strike (10% ore crit damage) I have 5K more HP damage in same time interval, same shoots

    because this is vas very important for the test to have same time interval and same shoot just to be able to measure damage output

    and if normal hour I had 243K damage and kill strike hour I had 248K, you just have to split 3600 second once by 234 and second to 248 and there you have better dps when using kill strike

    Crucial thing about this test is the same time interval and same shoots, this allow me to measure damage output / DPS
    - Actually I do, just think about it for a minute, i mean really think about the problem and the solution I used.

    - What whiteknut is saying is that a sample of some 3k odd shots is too small to be absolutely certain that digits after the comma are reliable.

    - It is actually not at all important in what time frame you shot the 3500 shots. All we are trying to figure out is if more of your hits are criticals when using a 1% more crit chance buff. It doesn't matter if you shoot the shots in 1 hour or over a week (assuming MA doesn't change anything inbetween). Once this is known, the dps can easily be calculated for any given gun etc.

    Regards
    Thark

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