Would you still play for 95% Returns?

It already exists.
Go hunt something really small. Works with Daikibas and should work on all the tiny mobs. Might have to spend some time testing different setups (weapons/armor), not everything works equally well.

I'm pretty sure if u go a little higher on the mob ladder and figure out the right setups it still works. A smooth transition. Even small trox, the old gamble mob is pretty stable today.
The question is how high can u (afford) to go and how long can u keep playing on these low levels? It feels like killing flies, you are way too overskilled for em... Why play if there's no danger no excitement?

Another reason why it's boring: no risk, can't win much, can't lose much... and we're back to square one.

Just for the record I VOTED NO

This is a discussion thread not a proposal.

KijkkiJikki said:

In crafting, if you are depending on TT return to profit then you are doing it wrong. I only track MU cost vs MU sale price because really that's all that matters. MU cost and my perception of the MU is what I use to set prices. TT is not considered at all.

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This, I have no clue why people are talking about a "chance to profit" in the context of TT profit. Thats not a sensible longterm goal is it???

I hoped that the discussion would center on how this would effect MU and how the economy would re-balance so that people can still profit etc...

I also like the volatility because seemingly like most people who posted here I get a guilty twinge from the gambling and ofcourse the swirles

We all live for that swirlie sound in this game dont we ?

Billy Jean Ruby said:

No!
If they remove the possibility of ATH, even if I like the game so much, I probably stop.
With the way Entropia's world it is developed right now,
there is nothing else interesting to keep me playing.

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Wise words!

Since the algorithm change in january 2013 It was never the same.

One mega HOF droped from a mulmun (330k ped) but at same time one molisk can't even HOF for more than 500 ped, when before one molisk could HOF for 7K ped +/- !!!


Dream was completely removed, if I'm losing already why should I login to play more?



PS: At moment I'm on my biggest break ever!

the higher the tt return the more poeple are going to cycle the only player that dont want it is poeple that can hunt the creature that loot good mu that most of the regulor player cant reach

and for mining some said the make good profit if every one mine there would be no profit in it

for me i spent 200 to 500 a month for 4 years and now i spoend maybe here a 1oo a year

i spend that 100 or 200 on other games were i get to play for my value of my money

im not here to make money some of you are and dont want my money

from what i can understand you dont want poeple to cylcle ped you want it like more real life

make amo 1 ped shot and what ever loot the get will be wort something gun fail after 100 shot you need to by one from crafting

make it real world make it real expensive were you can realy make money if you have the goods

Just have to say this, needs to be said.

Higher returns will not make more people cycle, quite the reverse.

Higher returns means, in essence, less fun, less globals, less hofs, less action, less thrills.

The original populous (as far as i've known people ingame, and i know quite a few people) are here for the fun and thrills and what makes Entropia unique. We (yes myself included) are not interested in stability in absurdum, if we were, we wouldnt play an RCE, we'd play a monthly subscription based non-rce game which there are a multitude of.

The ONLY pit of the current situation is the EMPHASIS on money, emphasising on "make money here, make money there, think about the money, money money money" is what is currently hurting the ones still active ingame.

Continually talking about making money, be it on the forum, or in advertizements, is a game killing strategy, because this virtual reality, Entropia, is NOT about making money, the people that MAKE IT to be about making money, are killing it.

If people were just out to have fun and bang for the buck, there would im sure be ALOT more bucks in the lootpools to be collected, but when everyone swarms like a beeswarm towards that 1 activity, resource, mob, whatever, that is currently slightly profitable, it kills the markup on everything one by one.

What everyone seems to forget is, the average markup is not being ruined because of something MA did, but because of the mentality and mindset of the playerbase, yes, i'm blaming the playerbase for this big cockup, too many self indulgent weeners emphasising on making money in their spare time is indeed the one, and only reason why soon nobody will be able to even have the occasional profitable run that makes their bang for the buck last longer.

What is the cure?

Make money in your real life and just ENJOY this awesome universe, just like in real life some can afford to have ALOT of fun, some can afford to have a LITTLE fun, but if you can't afford an RCE, don't fricking come here and try to change (and lately, sadly succeed once in a while) it to a monthly sub game and kill it for the majority of others who are here for the very fact that this place IS different.

Kitch said:

I have no clue why people are talking about a "chance to profit" in the context of TT profit. Thats not a sensible longterm goal is it???

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I believe there's compensation globals/HoF's. U can even say this is what a global is, a periodic balance check by a system that resulted with over 50 ped compensation.
And, i believe there's a mob-specific (or system wide) lootpool that now and then throws out random HoF's and ATH's.
You can't make long-term TT profit with "regular globals" (would be kinda contradiction in terms) but i believe the system-wide HoF/ATH is yours to keep. If there's any truth in this, long term TT profit is possible.

Some ppl have suffered terrible loss periods after a big HoF's that lasted many months, and then there's other ppl who didn't notice any changes in their average returns. Only MA knows how exactly it works, and they won't speak...

exsolvo said:

The original populous (as far as i've known people ingame, and i know quite a few people) are here for the fun and thrills and what makes Entropia unique. We (yes myself included) are not interested in stability in absurdum, if we were, we wouldnt play an RCE, we'd play a monthly subscription based non-rce game which there are a multitude of.

The ONLY pit of the current situation is the EMPHASIS on money, emphasising on "make money here, make money there, think about the money, money money money" is what is currently hurting the ones still active ingame.

Continually talking about making money, be it on the forum, or in advertizements, is a game killing strategy, because this virtual reality, Entropia, is NOT about making money, the people that MAKE IT to be about making money, are killing it.

If people were just out to have fun and bang for the buck, there would im sure be ALOT more bucks in the lootpools to be collected, but when everyone swarms like a beeswarm towards that 1 activity, resource, mob, whatever, that is currently slightly profitable, it kills the markup on everything one by one.

Click to expand...

This is basicly all we need to read to understand, embrace and try to cure, to get back to where we were.

Having fun.

There can only be compensation globals if MA tracks our spending, which they've stated they don't.

If you believe that statement its another matter but if you don't trust them regarding this then why hand over cash to them.

But yes I'm one of those who also believe the emphasis on the high payout, high risk EU has ruined the gameplay and enjoyment of EU for the playerbase as a whole.

How we get back to the old ways is the problem, it would probably be easier to start again, which one PP has decided to do by not being part of EU and is going it alone.

SpikeBlack said:

How we get back to the old ways is the problem, it would probably be easier to start again, which one PP has decided to do by not being part of EU and is going it alone.

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I didnt hear about that but was wondering whether that would happen, are they going with cryengine then or basically just making a whole new game?

So in 5 years there could be 4 established MMO RCE RPG's out there...

exsolvo said:

Higher returns will not make more people cycle, quite the reverse.

...

The original populous (as far as i've known people ingame, and i know quite a few people) are here for the fun and thrills and what makes Entropia unique. We (yes myself included) are not interested in stability in absurdum, if we were, we wouldnt play an RCE, we'd play a monthly subscription based non-rce game which there are a multitude of.

...

Make money in your real life and just ENJOY this awesome universe, just like in real life some can afford to have ALOT of fun, some can afford to have a LITTLE fun, but if you can't afford an RCE, don't fricking come here and try to change (and lately, sadly succeed once in a while) it to a monthly sub game and kill it for the majority of others who are here for the very fact that this place IS different.

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Great post!


"We (yes myself included) are not interested in stability in absurdum, if we were, we wouldnt play an RCE, we'd play a monthly subscription based non-rce game"

This is exactly my thinking at this moment, that's why I don't login in EU for more than one month now!


The unique atmosphere and thrill that Entropia offered us 5 years ago has nothing to do with current game situation. The HOF list looks ridiculous these days, uber mobs always on top with a limit of 4/5k ped, after place 15º/20º it decrease to only 500 ped. Where is the dream these days?


If they don't even let us dream why should we continue to play a RCE game?

Fanan said:

If they don't even let us dream why should we continue to play a RCE game?

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Afaik, there's compensation globals ("normal globals") and there's system-wide globals/HoF's (means, the reward is yours to keep no strings attached).
Also, in both cases the game only generates the multipliers, on what level you play is up to you.

This isn't enough for u? Fair enough, go play WoW.
Hate the ppl who don't play and only crawl out of their burrows to whine on the forums!

Fifth said:

Afaik, there's compensation globals ("normal globals") and there's system-wide globals/HoF's (means, the reward is yours to keep no strings attached).
Also, in both cases the game only generates the multipliers, on what level you play is up to you.

This isn't enough for u? Fair enough, go play WoW.
Hate the ppl who don't play and only crawl out of their burrows to whine on the forums!

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You should hate and also -rep Mindark instead for changing the maximum loot algorithm without any explanation!!! (I still waiting the notes from that VU! Jan 2013!!!)


Go out hunt cornundacaudas, argonauts, molisks, drones, etc and then tell me if the 10/20ped globals really satisfy you, specially when you already lost 8k ped in only 6 months!

Yes I don't play for around one month now! Did you missed me so much?


When during 3 months I can't even add a friend to my friend list it is not fun anymore!



PS: just go on entropia life and open the mob molisk. check the maximum loots pre january 2013 and after! take your own conclusions!!!

don't we already play for less?

Farmer Smurf said:

don't we already play for less?

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the hypothetical question is would you play if every mob looted .95 of the cost to kill basically

Kitch said:

the hypothetical question is would you play if every mob looted .95 of the cost to kill basically

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Everybody seems to agree, extreme stability is not a solution.
Gotta get the average up to .97 - .98
If the playerbase won't grow bigger by a magnitude this will never happen.

Fifth said:

Everybody seems to agree, extreme stability is not a solution.
Gotta get the average up to .97 - .98
If the playerbase won't grow bigger by a magnitude this will never happen.

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isn't first 2 line contradiction each other

Kitch said:

the hypothetical question is would you play if every mob looted .95 of the cost to kill basically

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And the answer was >>> No.

And as someone said earlier, you can have it if you want(if you dont mind a Rubio being your main weapon)

Kitch said:

the hypothetical question is would you play if every mob looted .95 of the cost to kill basically

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I understand the question..I would love to see .95 returns from any activity. would be an improvement.

Farmer Smurf said:

I understand the question..I would love to see .95 returns from any activity. would be an improvement.

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You can... that's not difficult to get 95% TT return in mining or hunting if you're using a good eco setup with no armor.

Neil Stockton said:

You can... that's not difficult to get 95% TT return in mining or hunting if you're using a good eco setup with no armor.

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Every time I go hunting I use a F105, and every time I go mining I wear my eco pixie..I am unsure what I am doing wrong.

RCE dont mean dreaming about HOFs/ATHs thats why casino is created. RCE means your virtual stuff have monetary value.
Im never played for them and im never got one. Why im constantly ending to play? Because game thinks i need to get 80% tt return constantly. So i really wish to see 95% TT return so i can enjoy more playtime.
Also 95% tt return can be made interesting with variations. But most of all i want more meaning from skills so i feel im progressing and im closing that 95% otherwise i feel like skills only make my losses bigger and i feel going down with each level gained.

Both are bad depending on circumstance..

If MA truly wanted to make large profitzors they would obliterate average TT return to something like 75% long term.. But also make sure that markups were high.. Average mining resources ~20%... average hunting resources ~20%..

Thus you have bigger tt-decay.. for explosives gamblers.. and it makes getting loot more fun knowing you can actually sell the sh*t..

No idea how to make this happen now though.. I suppose some utterly ridiculous crafting overhaul, but even then if more people hunt than mine (ehm...) you'll still have hunting markup being lower than mining markup on average.

Obviously tweaks would need to be made in this circumstance.

In this environment gamblers lose, and lose big.. eco actually becomes important.. and noobs have a chance to actually sell their 10 TT stacks on auction because they can do so at 140% or even more.

In a perfect world..

qamori said:

This is true!

The reason we are all still here is the "Gamble" chance of getting something nice!
to get 95% return always, I would rather play a game that is not RC.
And If I wanted to lose always I would go play for Spain on the World cup! ( just a joke)

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^^ This, I am an ex-poker player and a lot of the attraction for EU for me is similar to the attraction of Poker, you need to be aware what you are doing and also have a bit of luck. Constant 95% return would bore me stupid in a week.

I have had a low loot swing for a couple of months, I tried forcing the situation at the top of my game, which any player who has played for a few years knows is a pointless exercise. So I took my own advice and went back to Grinding Small Tiarak. I do this when my loot swing is low because I can skill on the small ones - currently short blades, plus I like the hides they make nice textures. They drop some MF chips and the odd low level piron weapon. Best of all is that they are cheap to hunt and dont break the ped card in 20 minutes flat.

EU needs the high and low swings to make it interesting, without it the RCE element is poinrtless. You would never see a global or a HOF let alone an ATH, keep the loot swings and keep the overall fun.

NB if you play long enough the swings always come and go. Don't lose your shirt

Without the inkling of a chance to get that big hit someday to cover all the losses from proir weeks months years to just plain even always returns would turn me away and to other games almost instantly.

what would be the fun in doing any of the 3 activities at all. Lets face it all three are grinding and really are not all that fun to do, take away that jackpot sensation you have nothing at all to make you want to do any of them.

Under 70% return in mining, in the long run, so yeah i would still play. For now... another big break, will depo 1k USD maybe in 6 month, and give a try, to see myself getting shit loot again. And going for another break.

No.

I would guess 90% of people playing EU are broke students, people in a shitty job, crazed alcoholics ( possibly I am included in that list, according to some ) or generally people who are reckless in general.

However, the overused term " economy of scale " certainly has use in a place like EU.

If there are ( maybe ) 5000 players, you are going to lose 90% of the time.

If there are 500 000 players, 50%. 5 000 000, 10%.

It is simple economics at the office level, trying to maintain a business model, kinda like the Soviet Union in the 1970s; trainloads of food rotting on the railroad while people stood in line for food.

We know how that ended.

Peezle said:

I would guess 90% of people playing EU are broke students, people in a shitty job, crazed alcoholics ( possibly I am included in that list, according to some ) or generally people who are reckless in general.

However, the overused term " economy of scale " certainly has use in a place like EU.

If there are ( maybe ) 5000 players, you are going to lose 90% of the time.

If there are 500 000 players, 50%. 5 000 000, 10%.

It is simple economics at the office level, trying to maintain a business model, kinda like the Soviet Union in the 1970s; trainloads of food rotting on the railroad while people stood in line for food.

We know how that ended.

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I love you Peezle, your post warm my heart.

95% return rate? 90% Return Rate?

Both are something we tell our selfs that we get or can get to sleep well at night