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Svarog said:
I always quit the game just by closing the game window (playing in window mode), sometimes in the middle of a hunt right after killing last mob, and never lost anything, which suggests continuous saving of all stats.

To not speak from pure observations, I just did 2 small tests before submitting this comment - 1) killed a mob and immediately closed the game with [X] button; 2) killed a mob and immediately killed EU from Windows Task Manager. In both cases the game had no time to save changes, yet upon login back both loot and decay were present, and the proper amount of ammo was subtracted.
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Perhaps I was unclear.

I was referring to the times the area server *crashes*, or otherwise have no contact with the item/storage/<whateever we should call it> database.

You logging out, even if just by crashing the client, is perfectly fine so long as the area server still is in contact with the "item" server. Such a logoff event is synchronized.

EDIT: Meaning the server for the area you were in, will synchronize your ammo expenditure, and tools decay, to the "main" database.
 
Neil Stockton said:
Feel free to share them.
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1 year ago was server crash in shared loot of sand king as i remember.

after 1 week money was refunded with apearing a loot window showing that that action was logged, but calculated manually and refunded manually.
 
tamlin said:
I was referring to the times the area server *crashes*, or otherwise have no contact with the item/storage/<whateever we should call it> database.
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I see what you mean, but can't see how it can be tested from outside to (dis)prove continuous logging of everything.
 
ktpsmf said:
1 year ago was server crash in shared loot of sand king as i remember.

after 1 week money was refunded with apearing a loot window showing that that action was logged, but calculated manually and refunded manually.
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That sounds like evidence that logs ARE kept.
 
Neil Stockton said:
Feel free to share them.
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This was a request for me to provide proof that MA's system doesn't log every micro-transaction - f.ex. you shoot, you lose ammo, your gun decays, or the instances you can find here on PCF where a miner have dropped a few hundred bombs, gotten *nothing*, and "support" (rightfully) claims "We don't have that in our logs".

Neil, I won't bother. Call me a troll or whatever you like. I just hope just about everyone with any longer experience with EU would either already kniow this is how it works, or upon reading my previous explanation would say "Aha! So that's why I got ammo back!".

As a fun anecdote: When I started 2009 (I'm very young in EU), I used to think MA reverted my (L) gun decay and ammo, while letting me keep the loot, as a way of saying "Sorry for not being able to keep the system running. Here's a small token of our appreciation for your patience.".

That didn't last long before I realized it wasn't a "thank you for bearing with us" at all.
 
[sand king]
Neil Stockton said:
That sounds like evidence that logs ARE kept.
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Nope, quite the opposite.

MA had to walk through the "main" db to see what every participating avatar's inventory was before the event, then after.

Accept it - area-servers don't send info to the main DB every shot you take. It's simply not logged (as it's not feasible to do it). At all! It's not even on area-server local disks (and THIS is an area I'd fail them two thousand ways from Sunday if they were ever granted a banking license), to be able to play it back! It's THAT bad!

But hey, don't take my word for it - ask Kim, or better Björn!
 
tamlin said:
But hey, don't take my word for it - ask Kim, or better Björn!
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Your evidence could go either way as you've presented it. I'll wait for someone on the inside to comment on how it works.
 
Here is an excerpt on the new servers in 2009: http://hollywoodindustry.digitalmed...r-Technology-for-CryENGINE(R)2-Upgrade-704156

Here it is listed again: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/...R)2-Upgrade-(Marketwire)&highlight=Hp+servers

Here is another but can't get the page to load: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/showthread.php?159263-New-cages-for-the-hamsters!

Anyway, I'll look for more info later. Otherwise, it was time to update the servers for sure. As for how long it would take, I think it has already been discussed that these are not your run of the mill systems and are not going to be overnighted by any stretch of the imagination! I would like to know what systems they have upgraded to! :)
 
tamlin said:
Accept it - area-servers don't send info to the main DB every shot you take. It's simply not logged (as it's not feasible to do it). At all! It's not even on area-server local disks.....!
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So how are they able to refund players what seems to be the exact amount lost when it all goes wrong? Really by a inventory comparison? Seems a backwards way of doing it.

We had a very peculiar incident a few years back, cause by a part of a system being incomplete. We were refunded seemingly our exact ammo lost and decay, after support had dealt with the matter. No loot, but then there never was going to be loot.

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/showthread.php?228680-What-the-Hell!-!-!
 
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Alainax said:
We were refunded seemingly our exact ammo lost and decay, after support had dealt with the matter. No loot, but then there never was going to be loot.

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/showthread.php?228680-What-the-Hell!-!-!
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I was never refunded after ~600 PED lost in Hell in broken mission in similar situation as described.
So now I lost about 10-30-50 PED in lags, and giant sum of PED's in lost sales in my Shop, but I will not seek compensation because I don't recieve it all the same.
 
It appears that the MA has done something to their servers for everything I have whined over the last 3 years of the problems I have with the net and gameplay contact in the game (MA who blamed everyone else and that their internet dont work as it should) All these problems are gone now.

Good that you finally done something about it ( in itself, you had no choice because everything crashed), this just proves how greedy you are and how much you're lying but i have no problems with the gameplay now.
 
valentin said:
It appears that the MA has done something to their servers for everything I have whined over the last 3 years of the problems I have with the net and gameplay contact in the game (MA who blamed everyone else and that their internet dont work as it should) All these problems are gone now.

Good that you finally done something about it ( in itself, you had no choice because everything crashed), this just proves how greedy you are and how much you're lying but i have no problems with the gameplay now.
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Valentin, people who stand in twin peaks and dance all possible dances does not feel lag.

only hunters like you or miners can describe lag they feel
 
Failed to save client chat settings to server

Uber lag/stand still atm in the game which started near 12h50 MA time,
now 13h11 MA time when I post this, nothing moved.

Notice that Exit the game do not work.



I suppose this is affecting the whole game.
 
Same error as akbar, on a different server aswell.

Exited by terminating the EU process, after that not possible to login.
 
Akbar said:
Uber lag/stand still atm in the game which started near 12h50 MA time,
now 13h11 MA time when I post this, nothing moved.

Notice that Exit the game do not work.

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on my screen you were dead =) i managed to kill the mob atleast before all froze in hell.
 
same same (RT), not possible to log in
 
ermik said:
Exited by terminating the EU process, after that not possible to login.
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Same solution as ermik, killed the game to exit.

Larethania said:
on my screen you were dead =) i managed to kill the mob atleast before all froze in hell.
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On my screen I was alive during all this time until I leave the game,
I even did 2 videos...
 
feels like each time i want to log in server fails...guess it's RL time :eyecrazy:
 
nutrageti said:
feels like each time i want to log in server fails...guess it's RL time :eyecrazy:
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yeah...time to take a bath two days early this week I suppose :)
 
Svarog said:
I see what you mean, but can't see how it can be tested from outside to (dis)prove continuous logging of everything.
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- Imagine the amount of storage required, not to mention bandwidth, to log every single shot a user takes to a central database. MA don't even log that on local storage on the area-servers (guess why the empty sand king or what it was took so long to sort out).

- Trust what MA reps state as facts (in this case), that they have no logs.

- Extrapolate logic, in that support/MA states "if you want data from over 6 months back, you have to pay us" means they have to access off-line (prolly) backups (and therefore requires you to pay for it).
 
tamlin said:
- Imagine the amount of storage required, not to mention bandwidth, to log every single shot a user takes to a central database. MA don't even log that on local storage on the area-servers (guess why the empty sand king or what it was took so long to sort out).

- Trust what MA reps state as facts (in this case), that they have no logs.

- Extrapolate logic, in that support/MA states "if you want data from over 6 months back, you have to pay us" means they have to access off-line (prolly) backups (and therefore requires you to pay for it).
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Lol like that's a problem today. If it was I can't even imagine how big trouble google and facebook is in :D

Offline! Do you think they print the longs out on paper and put it in a archive?
 
Tamlin is correct. There have been times where certain game servers would crash quite frequently and when you came back you would have the same loot you had before but your amps would be partially or fully repaired and you would have lost some of your skill gains. This suggests that not all micro transactions are constantly logged, loot, however, is, which is better than some major MMOs where you can lose loot on a rollback.
 
Karmic said:
Tamlin is correct. There have been times where certain game servers would crash quite frequently and when you came back you would have the same loot you had before but your amps would be partially or fully repaired and you would have lost some of your skill gains. This suggests that not all micro transactions are constantly logged, loot, however, is, which is better than some major MMOs where you can lose loot on a rollback.
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I'm not questioning what he claims to be the truth about what's logged or not but how he came to that conclusion. There is no problem doing this with 2014 software/hardware.

You also only assume/guess so we should leave it at that ^^
 
This morning and afternoon the Boreas server seems to have many crash issues again.

So again I seem to have to move my home base to another server. :laugh:
 
minim said:
I'm not questioning what he claims to be the truth about what's logged or not but how he came to that conclusion. There is no problem doing this with 2014 software/hardware.
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While correct, MA runs a system designed over a decade ago. When disk space was expensive, and to get more than a few thousand (if even that) IOPS you'd have to go EMC or similar, or design the software properly for the task.

Back in the early 90's I wrote a multi-user system that pushed 10k IOPS+ to a single disk, on a Pentium-90! I'm quite certain MA has written no such software.

EDIT: To spell it out; you simply batch transactions in RAM until you get a timeout (back then I used 10ms IIRC) or have gotten enough data to flush. Once the whole batch is written to secondary storage, you retire the hundreds or even thousands of simultaneous transactions. Sure, you get a number of ms delay for each transaction individually, but the overall total throughput reaches close to streaming I/O speed to storage media.
 
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Alainax said:
So how are they able to refund players what seems to be the exact amount lost when it all goes wrong? Really by a inventory comparison? Seems a backwards way of doing it.
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Indeed, but that's the only tool they have - and that's why it took so long.

Alainax said:
We had a very peculiar incident a few years back, cause by a part of a system being incomplete. We were refunded seemingly our exact ammo lost and decay, after support had dealt with the matter. No loot, but then there never was going to be loot.
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Same procedure. they were looking at the accounts "now" (at the time they started investigation). Roll back and add/subtract transaction-by-transaction.
 
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