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New type of Ninja spawns mobs.

valentin

valentin

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Sir Valentin
Seeing that we have received a new type of ninja spawn mobs Type 2 as I call it, the first type 1 just showed up and attacked you immediately this new one is appears beside you, waiting for you kill the mob you are killing just now and when you killed it this one starts to attac you. so now we have two types of ninja spawn mobs.
 
valentin said:
Seeing that we have received a new type of ninja spawn mobs Type 2 as I call it, the first type 1 just showed up and attacked you immediately this new one is appears beside you, waiting for you kill the mob you are killing just now and when you killed it this one starts to attac you. so now we have two types of ninja spawn mobs.
Click to expand...

Immediately hit before they are really displayed in the game. (often the 1st hit is a critical hit).
Spawn in the opposite "Y" axis of your avatar (behind you).
Or simply spawn between you and your actual target.


Hard to believe MA agreed such feature, when they are still talking about exploits rules in their EULA....

But who are the biggest CHEATERS ever in the game ????....
No need to search very far

Nothing new.
 
Maybe it is an avatar that has controlled a creature? Seems odd to me that a mob would not attack you if it were next to you. If I was standing next to an Aurli or Atrox they would immediately eat me for lunch. :scratch2:

~Danimal
 
I've noticed it too... Sometimes they attack, other times not
 
Perception bias. You are sensitive to this because you are looking for anything to point at Mindark and say.. Ah HA! Cheaters, Thieves, exploiters they are! If you want to quit, quit. No need to justify it.. no need to complain about it.

It's dynamic after all. Ninja spawns are fun.. better than just sticking a thumb up your butt and hitting next target, auto-use.
 
Ninja spawns happen the most often when my back is facing the sun. Oh, and I've also noticed that if I Entropia Tracker isn't running, they happen a lot less often.

I started documenting it since the patch, here is what I found:

differences.gif


Long story short, always hunt facing the sun.
 
Well said Narfi. So many big words in there... hope people understood it.
 
MsPudding said:
Ninja spawns happen the most often when my back is facing the sun. Oh, and I've also noticed that if I Entropia Tracker isn't running, they happen a lot less often.

I started documenting it since the patch, here is what I found:

differences.gif


Long story short, always hunt facing the sun.
Click to expand...

I've always found that hunting naked IRL produces the best loots. Could you test this theory out, stream with webcam, and then post us the results? Fantastic. Thanks!
 
Ninja spawns seem to happen more often and closer to me than before, not sure about 'new type'. It seems they need to finish their wandering routines before aggroing, and mobs do wander more since the last VU.

However, it's just a couple dozen observations and hard to quantify, so I'd rather not jump to conclusions yet.
 
atomicstorm said:
I've always found that hunting naked IRL produces the best loots. Could you test this theory out, stream with webcam, and then post us the results? Fantastic. Thanks!
Click to expand...

So you eliminating ninja spawns... I imagine it would look something like this?

Tvdonutbeer.jpg

:p
 
atomicstorm said:
Perception bias. You are sensitive to this because you are looking for anything to point at Mindark and say.. Ah HA! Cheaters, Thieves, exploiters they are! If you want to quit, quit. No need to justify it.. no need to complain about it.

It's dynamic after all. Ninja spawns are fun.. better than just sticking a thumb up your butt and hitting next target, auto-use.
Click to expand...



At first I thought I had imagined me of their existence, but soon I realized that it was true because there was LT's who showed up and attacked you immediately and then there were those who just showed up in your surroundings, but those mobs who I'm talking about showed up while you were killing a mob to attack the you as soon as you killed the last mob.

And I can say to Atomicstorm to F-you because of this I have written about is not a complaining whining but only information that I have seen a new pattern of behavior in the mobs for if I had complained that I had mentioned, MA and their Nerfs.:wise:
 
I have pretty much only been doing wave events lately, but this sounds like a melee users dream. No need to tag, no need to run, swallow the pill and just hit next target each time you kill the one on you. Perfect grinding setup!
 
well that's proof. Narfi's ninja post did not immediately attack me.

Lets see what happens on edit.
 
You have a pattern of complaining, which is thr context of the post. -rep for having an uncivil response. Get your panties out of a bunch.
 
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Wouldn't it be cool if the mob spawn AI was so complex it locates every single avatar inside spawn area and then drops mobs onto these spots? Or even better, if there was a guy sitting in MA office tasked with harassing players by dropping mobs on them?
Wouldn't it be fantastic if the system was so incredibly complex that it even figures out the direction you are facing and places the mob behind you?

I think that would be very cool. Interactive and complex AI makes a more challenging and interesting game.

Hate to crush your dreams. The script controlling respawn is extremely primitive. There's nobody doing it manually either (except rare cases at events).

Truth is the game doesn't know if there's a player on this specific spot or not. In other words, the game doesn't care. There is no "ninja spawns", it's a myth.


_______________________________________________________________________
Here's how it works:

MOB SPAWN AI. Respawn happens at regular intervals filling up the spawn area - with impartial robotic consistency. The only variable in this extremely simple mechanism is a ratio: total number of players inside spawn area vs total number of mobs (more players forces the system to increase the spawn density).
That's it.


MOB AI. The single mob AI has (and always had) a variable "delay before attack". It could be 0 or it could be something like 15-20 sec (never measured, approx number).
There's another variable "player already under attack" that could be 0, 1, or more (the number of mobs on you). If this variable is not 0 there's a higher probability that AI will roll out a larger number for "delay before attack". If this happens you will see the mob "wandering aimlessly" pretending it doesn't see you althou it is inside the larger aggro range.
As every experienced hunter already knows, each mob has 2 aggro ranges - a smaller aggro range that causes the mob to attack immediately and a much larger one that has (relatively) bigger delay.

That's just basics, the mob AI is much more sophisticated than that. Also, the variables are different for different mobs and maturities.
Mob spawn AI, however, is extremely simple.

Just sayin'. Take it or leave it.
 
Last edited:
Fifth said:
Wouldn't it be cool if the mob spawn AI was so complex it locates every single avatar inside spawn area and then drops mobs onto these spots? Or even better, if there was a guy sitting in MA office tasked with harassing players by dropping mobs on them?
Wouldn't it be fantastic if the system was so incredibly complex that it even figures out the direction you are facing and places the mob behind you?

I think that would be very cool. Interactive and complex AI makes a more challenging and interesting game.

Hate to crush your dreams. The script controlling respawn is extremely primitive. There's nobody doing it manually either (except rare cases at events).

Truth is the game doesn't know if there's a player on this specific spot or not. In other words, the game doesn't care. There is no "ninja spawns", it's a myth.


_______________________________________________________________________
Here's how it works:

MOB SPAWN AI. Respawn happens at regular intervals filling up the spawn area - with impartial robotic consistency. The only variable in this extremely simple mechanism is a ratio: total number of players inside spawn area vs total number of mobs (more players forces the system to increase the spawn density).
That's it.


MOB AI. The single mob AI has (and always had) a variable "delay before attack". It could be 0 or it could be something like 15-20 sec (never measured, approx number).
There's another variable "player already under attack" that could be 0, 1, or more (the number of mobs on you). If this variable is not 0 there's a higher probability that AI will roll out a larger number for "delay before attack". If this happens you will see the mob "wandering aimlessly" pretending it doesn't see you althou it is inside the larger aggro range.
As every experienced hunter already knows, each mob has 2 aggro ranges - a smaller aggro range that causes the mob to attack immediately and a much larger one that has (relatively) bigger delay.

That's just basics, the mob AI is much more sophisticated than that. Also, the variables are different for different mobs and maturities.
Mob spawn AI, however, is extremely simple.

Just sayin'. Take it or leave it.
Click to expand...

I don't think there is anyone controlling ninja spawns at MA but there is something that causes it. I know for certain after what happened to me at Jurra a while back.

I was out hunting Atrox for the 10k Iron mission doing young and up mostly. Using my two Katsuichi Honor swords and only wearing Gnome armor no plates. The area is nearly all young and mature with a few old and even fewer scattered Providers and very, very few rare Guardians. Honor sword is slow and respawn around there is sometimes little faster then you want when other people are hunting in the area and you are using a slow weapon like the Honor sword I was using.

So I have about 5 or more young on me and 3 or 4 old. Not having too much problems since Atrox are slow hitters and I had at the time mid 30's Evader. I watch my radar while I hunt so I see incoming mobs and new spawns. I like to kill new spawns next if possible since I have often had globals on them.

Within a span of about 30 to 40 seconds I saw 3 Atrox Providers spawn directly next to the mass of Atrox around me. This shouldn't happen since providers are almost always scattered out with only one in an area there.

My only thought is that since I hunt so often with lots of mobs on me rather then pulling them in one at a time is that the system likes to match your hunting style and give you challenges at times.

I was not having problems until that happened.:D
 
I have noticed the same thing lately. I'm doing atrox iron atm and quite a few times a mob appear next to me while I shoot at some mob. And it doesnt attack until after a while, often not until I'm finished with the first.

nero
 
Talania said:
Within a span of about 30 to 40 seconds I saw 3 Atrox Providers spawn directly next to the mass of Atrox around me. This shouldn't happen since providers are almost always scattered out with only one in an area there.
Click to expand...
Just killed a few k trox at Jurra few weeks ago. Don't remember if it was different few years ago but right now Providers are pretty common, 2 on the radar is normal. Don't think i have ever seen 3 new Providers spawning at once but it's still reasonably within bounds (of the normal random spawning).
As opposed to - if there's this evil script that systematically drops mobs on you then it wouldn't be just one case you remember as something special, right?

Or maybe it was Kim this time, having a little fun in the office? We would never know... :)

Also, there's this effect of new players entering the spawn area. On the old CND where you had a considerable part of the dome (=spawn area) on your radar u could see how a group of ppl entered the dome and the next respawn cycle increased the mob density significantly. Which usually resulted in a few white dots here and there... :)
With openworld spawns like atrox you might not see when more ppl come in, you would only see the aftereffect - as a "ninja spawn".


Now, all that said, i know another game (AW) that has quite similar overall logic to EU. There the mob spawn AI started to increase the maturity if you kept killing the mobs very quickly (meaning, if your dps was high enough).
At times i have wondered if EU spawns might have the similar system but never quite could figure it out for certain. As both possibilities seem equally likely the principle of the Occam's razor suggests there is no such system, just random coincidences.
 
This ninja spawn thing reminds me of yesterday...

I was mining on a cow LA and got my claim near a cow. Then I landed with my sleip in a empty area, well out of cow aggro radius and summoned my claim. While I had to wait the 30 seconds, I went to the ladies room quick. After I came back, I found my self killed, so I jumped back with TP chip and found out that a cow had spawned on me. I pulled the cow away with my tag weapon and while doing so, another cow spawns on me. I die, TP back, pull the cows away from my claim, start extracting and not that far from me another cow spawns. I managed to extract my claim before the stupid new-spawn cow ran to me.

And that LA doesn't even have that big of a cow spawn/density anyway.
 
Fifth said:
Wouldn't it be cool if the mob spawn AI was so complex it locates every single avatar inside spawn area and then drops mobs onto these spots? Or even better, if there was a guy sitting in MA office tasked with harassing players by dropping mobs on them?
Wouldn't it be fantastic if the system was so incredibly complex that it even figures out the direction you are facing and places the mob behind you?

I think that would be very cool. Interactive and complex AI makes a more challenging and interesting game.

Hate to crush your dreams. The script controlling respawn is extremely primitive. There's nobody doing it manually either (except rare cases at events).

Truth is the game doesn't know if there's a player on this specific spot or not. In other words, the game doesn't care. There is no "ninja spawns", it's a myth.


_______________________________________________________________________
Here's how it works:

MOB SPAWN AI. Respawn happens at regular intervals filling up the spawn area - with impartial robotic consistency. The only variable in this extremely simple mechanism is a ratio: total number of players inside spawn area vs total number of mobs (more players forces the system to increase the spawn density).
That's it.


MOB AI. The single mob AI has (and always had) a variable "delay before attack". It could be 0 or it could be something like 15-20 sec (never measured, approx number).
There's another variable "player already under attack" that could be 0, 1, or more (the number of mobs on you). If this variable is not 0 there's a higher probability that AI will roll out a larger number for "delay before attack". If this happens you will see the mob "wandering aimlessly" pretending it doesn't see you althou it is inside the larger aggro range.
As every experienced hunter already knows, each mob has 2 aggro ranges - a smaller aggro range that causes the mob to attack immediately and a much larger one that has (relatively) bigger delay.

That's just basics, the mob AI is much more sophisticated than that. Also, the variables are different for different mobs and maturities.
Mob spawn AI, however, is extremely simple.

Just sayin'. Take it or leave it.
Click to expand...

You're kinda... WRONG.

Unless a person (avatar) is in that area, there are no mobs. Period. The program does in fact locate each avatar and then spawns mobs according to what that area the avatar is in calls for. If it calls for nothing, it spawns nothing, if it calls for mid range Atrox in big large numbers, then that's what it spawns.

The game would be lagged to the point of being frozen if every mob in EU was spawned at all times everywhere. There has to be an observer (avatar) present for the area and mobs to even exist. This is how all games, single-player, MP, MMPOG, old timey MUDs etc. work.

The ninja spawning is deliberately done in order to hammer your armor for decay. This is universally recognized as as a douchebag move in damn near every game. But it's MA's main method of operation.
 
Ape Drape said:
The game would be lagged to the point of being frozen if every mob in EU was spawned at all times everywhere. There has to be an observer (avatar) present for the area and mobs to even exist. This is how all games, single-player, MP, MMPOG, old timey MUDs etc. work.
Click to expand...

You are right.

Best example to observe this is to simply teleport to some LA and upon your arrival the turrets will start shooting mobs around you. If the mobs were spawned at all times, then the turrets would shoot them at all times and you could see dead mobs around TP's at all times.
 
Satans said:
Best example to observe this is to simply teleport to some LA and upon your arrival the turrets will start shooting mobs around you. If the mobs were spawned at all times, then the turrets would shoot them at all times and you could see dead mobs around TP's at all times.
Click to expand...
Yes. I knew u guys would figure it out on your own. Not only all the AI scripts will be stopped for mobs when nobody's watching. Areas not visited for some time will go into sleep mode and contain only a "skeleton crew" of mobs. Flying over that area won't activate it, u have to actually go and land there, then the system starts populating it again until the correct density of mobs is reached.

So, here's the answer to the mystery of a lonely miner entering the seemingly empty LA and after a while getting harassed by mobs, one after another that keep spawning out of nowhere seemingly for no reason. It's the work of the Devil! Btw, are u guys relatives by any chance? ;)


Ape Drape gets an F+ thou. F for not understanding a word i wrote, + for at least attempting it.
 
When i wrote about "new type of ninja mobs " who i called Ninja mobs type 2 you should have seen how much criticism I received and was called many things but now when someone else calls it for wandering mob then you become immediately interested and would like to make a comment on this.......


:nana:
 
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