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You guys are out of your mind, whoever started this 90% rumor years ago is dumb. I'm using proper equipment with solid eco for what I'm hunting [and I have killed thousands of a single mob] with no where near that amount. The white knights are out in fury today!
 
Rave said:
You guys are out of your mind, whoever started this 90% rumor years ago is dumb. I'm using proper equipment with solid eco for what I'm hunting [and I have killed thousands of a single mob] with no where near that amount. The white knights are out in fury today!
Click to expand...

Prove it with logs. There isn't much else to be said....
 
Teiwaz Storm said:
Around 90% long term average, meaning over long period of many hunts.
100 PED per hunt can be a lot or nothing, depending what mobs you hunt. What matters is a number of loot actions.
If you spend 100 ped to kill 2 mobs then you have 2 loot actions that can result with very bad loot or very good one. But overall with 2 mobs killed you have lower chance to even out this good/bad luck loot.
If you spend 100 ped on killing several hundred of small mobs, then you have much higher chance to even out to around 90%.

Hope it is clearer now.
Click to expand...

And how does this look, when you cycled 100k peds and it is far away to be 90%. I just want play longer for my deposite, otherwise EU is death for me! No game in this world cost that much to play, maybe this is the case, why dont much ppl play and a lot left and noobs stop after a week.

IT JUST COST TOO MUCH! :wise:
 
Anyone else notice that the ones that refuse to keep track have lower returns then people that keep logs?
Maybe MA lowers the returns from people that don't keep track since they won't see it anway? Best not post here that you don't keep track :dunce:
 
Rave said:
You guys are out of your mind, whoever started this 90% rumor years ago is dumb. I'm using proper equipment with solid eco for what I'm hunting [and I have killed thousands of a single mob] with no where near that amount. The white knights are out in fury today!
Click to expand...

First of all it's not a rumor, it's a fact supported by many people who do little effort of properly tracking return, not by assessing it like you do.

Before you start calling people dumb check how you calculate your repairs... wrote about it in my previous post.
 
Neil Stockton said:
Prove it with logs.
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Since you are so sure of yourself, how about you pay me the PED difference to get back to 90% return if I turn out to be right?

I can do my 6000 Proteron killpoint mission and log it. I'm using POE (M) / 5B, Regen UL XI, and T5 Ranked Scorpion / a105. All nice and economical (I rarely heal or get hit, so my armor and heal costs are minimal).

I've clearly stated here that I have tracked my hunts often before (some are even posted here on PCF). Just not in the last week. But I can still clearly see the difference.

Teiwaz Storm said:
First of all it's not a rumor, it's a fact supported by many people who do little effort of properly tracking return, not by assessing it like you do.

Before you start calling people dumb check how you calculate your repairs... wrote about it in my previous post.
Click to expand...

You're right, I accidentally doubled it. So, even with that said, 40-50% isn't any better than 30-40%.
 
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Harmony. said:
Anyone else notice that the ones that refuse to keep track have lower returns then people that keep logs?
Maybe MA lowers the returns from people that don't keep track since they won't see it anway? Best not post here that you don't keep track :dunce:
Click to expand...

hm, maybe your right :)
 
Ask Girts Smilgs Niedra :) He know how to profit
 
Angel O2 Mercer said:
Well, I'm gonna leave this here:

5k Merp

10k Foul

10k Cornundacauda

10k Argonaut

60k Traeskeron

Combined that's more than 28k ped cycled. Steady return well over 90%.

I'm no uber, but it should be enough for most. I'm still doing logs of everything, returns have not changed.

Your time to share now 50% guys :)
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You can see in previous replies on here that we were speaking about the issue with big mobs returning (because of the update). These logs are up to 2 years old with much smaller mobs.
 
Rave said:
You can see in previous replies on here that we were speaking about the issue with big mobs returning (because of the update). These logs are up to 2 years old with much smaller mobs.
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What is a big mob for you?

Is Eomon Old-Provider big enough?
This year's migration doing Eomon Bronze I got tt return 88.94.
Close enough to 90% ?
 
Loot changes, sometimes globals are more frequent, sometimes less so, but in ANY case, 5000 ped on prots is less than 500 youngs (even less if you're killing matures and up). You'll have to do more than that to "guarantee" a good return. Even if you're rarely getting hit, I'd like to see the actual repair bill (to some people "minimal" armor decay means 10%).
 
Teiwaz Storm said:
What is a big mob for you?

Is Eomon Old-Provider big enough?
This year's migration doing Eomon Bronze I got tt return 88.94.
Close enough to 90% ?
Click to expand...

Anything above, lets say, level 40-50 (and higher). My usual hunts are Proteron, Aurli, Araneatrox, SEG, Dasp, etc. And you keep saying (and a few other people), well I got 90% return!!! You do understand that a small number of people getting 90% return or profit do not necessarily represent the majority? Everyone else in my soc (we are a high ranked soc, btw) has had issues with return over the last week. Myself and this OP are not some anomaly.

Is it possible that any moment I get a big HOF and even out? Of course, this is Entropia after all. But I'm far more comfortable with higher average returns steadily than waiting for a big return to even it all out.
 
Teiwaz Storm said:
What is a big mob for you?

Is Eomon Old-Provider big enough?
This year's migration doing Eomon Bronze I got tt return 88.94.
Close enough to 90% ?
Click to expand...

Noting against you, Teiwaz, but it seems for me and all other ppl where lost a shit load in that game, that you be one of those how get that mystic 90%.

I dont ask to get 90% but geting 50% over and over is a shame, and it don't make ppl deposite a lot. Thats the reason of this thread.
 
Only killing and looting the mobs that give nice loot helps a lot. (when you are a hunter)
 
SHY said:
http://www.entropialife.com/profile.aspx?P=23878&M=globalList&V=hunting\

Right
Click to expand...

Are you referencing EL? This doesn't show how much PED has been cycled. You can get plenty of globals and still get bad returns.

Neil Stockton said:
Loot changes, sometimes globals are more frequent, sometimes less so, but in ANY case, 5000 ped on prots is less than 500 youngs (even less if you're killing matures and up). You'll have to do more than that to "guarantee" a good return. Even if you're rarely getting hit, I'd like to see the actual repair bill (to some people "minimal" armor decay means 10%).
Click to expand...

I'll start logging exact armor/heal costs.
 
Rave said:
Are you referencing EL? This doesn't show how much PED has been cycled. You can get plenty of globals and still get bad returns.
Click to expand...

I think it was in reference to "near everything from puny to uber mobs"... when tracker doesn't show any small mobs.

Ofc those small mob hunts could have been in team.
 
Rave said:
Are you referencing EL? This doesn't show how much PED has been cycled. You can get plenty of globals and still get bad returns.



I'll start logging exact armor/heal costs.
Click to expand...

trance said:
near everything from puny to uber mobs, since i try to find other mobs pay a bit better. And I also do mining, but mining get near the same bad returns. So no matter what I hunt or do, it ends in a hug ped los.
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Last global: Mon, 21 Jul 2014 03:36:30

Tracker also is showing that his hunts lasts for aprox 1 hour.
I also suggest to look at his previous other posts...


Whining...Whining...Whining...Whining....Whining....Whining....Whining
 
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Rave said:
Anything above, lets say, level 40-50 (and higher). My usual hunts are Proteron, Aurli, Araneatrox, SEG, Dasp, etc. And you keep saying (and a few other people), well I got 90% return!!! You do understand that a small number of people getting 90% return or profit do not necessarily represent the majority? Everyone else in my soc (we are a high ranked soc, btw) has had issues with return over the last week. Myself and this OP are not some anomaly.

Is it possible that any moment I get a big HOF and even out? Of course, this is Entropia after all. But I'm far more comfortable with higher average returns steadily than waiting for a big return to even it all out.
Click to expand...


trance said:
Noting against you, Teiwaz, but it seems for me and all other ppl where lost a shit load in that game, that you be one of those how get that mystic 90%.

I dont ask to get 90% but geting 50% over and over is a shame, and it don't make ppl deposite a lot. Thats the reason of this thread.
Click to expand...

I honestly don't think I'm any exception. I spoke with quite a few people who also do log their hunts and their results are on par or better than mine.
Honestly guys you dismiss us saying that around 90% is a normal return, but you continuously refuse to log hunts to prove it otherwise.
I'm not aiming to convince you to believe me, I try to convince you to see it on your own. And only way to do it is to log.
Assessing loot in tt is very inaccurate, believe me, I was doing the same before friend convinced me to log to see REAL numbers.

Anyway, nothing more for me to add here.
Have fun and gl!
 
Neil Stockton said:
I think the point was that his tracker doesn't show any recent smaller mobs, just bigger hp ones.
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Oh, yeah that is true. But it was stated on page 1 how bigger mobs have been somewhat gimped lately (so showing hunting globals from bigger mobs would be appropriate).

It seems like some people have misunderstood the OP. This isn't about how returns are (and always have been) awful. It's about recent returns, which to be fair, seem to be poorer during hunting events [outside the event mob].
 
Rave said:
I can do my 6000 Proteron killpoint mission and log it. I'm using POE (M) / 5B, Regen UL XI, and T5 Ranked Scorpion / a105. All nice and economical (I rarely heal or get hit, so my armor and heal costs are minimal).
Click to expand...

Proterons with POE + Regen UL XI + Ranked Scorp + A105??
And you call this ECO setup? :DDDD

I must laugh, sorry.. :D , maybe few years ago, but nowadays?
 
PW3CKA said:
Proterons with POE + Regen UL XI + Ranked Scorp + A105??
And you call this ECO setup? :DDDD

I must laugh, sorry.. :D , maybe few years ago, but nowadays?
Click to expand...

Since, as I said, I rarely get hit or need to heal... it comes down my weapon setup, which is 2.9 damage/pec. Unless you are using an i2870, MM, or imk2, 2.9 is about as good as it gets. Most UL SIBs are far worse (2.7-2.8).
 
If you think bigger mobs are looting so poorly. Try shooting something smaller? Atrox? Rext?
 
Im sure that banks keep wery acurate logs and track our spendings / deposits into EU.
Dont know why lol? but they dont belive that we spend only 10% as we get 90% back, their logs show bank account that have always 100% loss in form of deposits into EU.
 
i totaly take the points about ppl not being happy with returns

however i do have a problem with this "Big Mobs" thing

to me the mob size is risk... want low risk, u hunt low risk mobs, eg low hp mobs
if u want high risk then hunt high hp mobs

where i have a problem is ...
I want to hunt high hp mobs with the risk lvls of a small mob

We make the choice on what to hunt and we should know how this relates to risk. If i go nuts on big aurli, i MIGHT hit a big one, but I MIGHT not, and if i dont i MIGHT loose my ass.... thats high risk!

dont be one of those guys who takes the high risk route, makes a loss and then keeps raising the risk to hit a big one to cover the losses!!
 
Lighterthief said:
to me the mob size is risk... want low risk, u hunt low risk mobs, eg low hp mobs
if u want high risk then hunt high hp mobs
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For me, what makes me decide what mobs to hunt is the (historical) chance of loot some nice, useful items. Preferably repairable. And since 2007 or something like that, the nicest items have dropped from the biggest mobs.

If someone would give an indication it's possible nowdays to loot a 7a2 rifle from a (small) foul, or an imp fap from a Little molisk, I would go for it. Or, goes without saying, if it would be possible to loot an oldschool VIII chip (wormhole chip, firestorm chip) from small thorifoid shamans.

Markupwise, the sanest mob on Calypso to go for would probably be punies and collect the bones. Though then I'd collect them for myself first :laugh:. No idea what other mob to go for. Some week ago me and my disciple did a short run on small fouls, and we did not get any "foul specific" (bones or hides). Dunno if we just had bad luck or of the drops have been changed that way. And, well as you know, gazz drops have been nerfed from drones, and ever since that VU, I haven't gotten a single caldorite stone from thorifoid. (Honestly, I didn't collect the stones properly, but on the other hand, I remember those Days I could take the stones from the thorifoids and the stones from the drones and Craft one or two oreamps and hten take those low-TT oreamps to go do a mining run.

On Arkadia, the only mob I normally go for there are oratan lancers, those who know me know why.

On calypso often people ask if I want to join on proteron, and there are tons of Atrox events. I just answer; no, no please no.

I might go for Mulmun elites, but it's mostly because of their rarity. Let's say I see around four a year I have an opportunity to kill.

Eomons this yera was for blood samples (looted C, bought A and B from auction). Well now I know eomons are over for now, so I'm closing the hope to get samples for higher level amp (bought a level 1 amp from auction mainly to try the technology). Looting a repairable XI heal chip would had been nice but it seems like none of those dropped this "year". Also as far as I know no Tango (or Mod LR-53?). I looted an (L) rocketlauncher level 60:ish (which is far above my level).
 
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Even at 90% tt return, the amount of ped people cycle nowadays due to high powered guns + enhancers, combined with very low MU, a ped card can get decimated pretty quickly with 90% tt return.

I agree with what another guy said about Marco. This game and it's economy was designed 10 years ago and it was designed for much smaller mobs and weapon setups than we currently have.

The amount of resources that are being looted will never be consumed because the player base is lower than 2007 but the players who are playing are cycling 3x-5x more. It's the only way MA can keep revenue high, but I personally think it's killing the (consumable) economy.
 
We shouldn't be penalized for hunting bigger mobs. I've worked hard to get where I am with the capability to hunt what I do... I'm not asking for mad HOFs and Ubers, but a better average loot would be nice.

Example stats from last Proteron mission run [small]:
300 PED ammo
90.71 PED in weapon/amp repair (Ranked Scorpion UL + a105, 2.923 eco)
20.16 PED in armor repair (POE UL + 5B, 9930.48 efficiency)
3.33 PED in chip repair (Regen XI UL, 7.98 eco)

414.2 PED total use

TT return: 246.22 [including a 98 PED global]

Return %: 59.4


So, my weapon setup is pretty economical unless compared to something such as an MM, i2870, or imk2. Most SIB UL weapons have an eco under 2.9 (2.7-2.8 range). So there isn't much room for improvement without a large amount of PED. I could hire a Mod Fap and go unarmored, save maybe 10-13 PED on defense costs.

This could bring me to 400 PED used for 246.22 PED returned. Before anyone says it, yes, 300 PED of ammo is not a big enough stat point to reasonable make assumptions off of. I generally go about 1500 PED ammo per run (repairing several times per run, of course, bringing total costs to 2000 PED per run). These stats have not changed much over the last 5 days, my return is almost always within this range (I've had 5 globals and 1 HOF in the last 5 days). My HOF only covered the losses from part of one run.

My costs are static, my returns have barely fluctuated beyond or below what you see here. However, I have even had some returns at about half this (mostly yesterday). Long ago, you could expect at least enough return to cover ammo, and maybe a global or two would cover decay costs. But as stated above, the average loot tables have never been scaled properly.

It's fine if you want to hunt small mobs, but for those of us who are trying to work on high level missions, its rather disappointing.
 
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