Please make enhancers to show tt value!!

aVaLON_52

Elite
Joined
Oct 20, 2013
Posts
2,729
Society
ᴄʀɪᴍꜱᴏɴ ᴅᴇᴠɪʟꜱ
Avatar Name
Avalon Butterfly Erupter
The randomness of enhancers screams LAS VEGAS BABY!! Come on down put some enhancers on your gear and roll the dice with Mind Ark!

But wait folks. THIS IS NOT A CASINO, so let's get that thought out of your head. OK!?

Pardon my sarcasm but I've been holding my tounge about enhancers for too long.

PLEASE SPREAD THE BALANCE AND STOP HIDDING THE RANDOM TT GARBAGE. Actually if you guys could also take out the randonymity from it as well that would be splendid.

Thank you very very VERY much in advance for implementing this.

And forgive me if there's already a thread on this :)
 
The randomness of enhancers screams LAS VEGAS BABY!! Come on down put some enhancers on your gear and roll the dice with Mind Ark!

But wait folks. THIS IS NOT A CASINO, so let's get that thought out of your head. OK!?

Pardon my sarcasm but I've been holding my tounge about enhancers for too long.

PLEASE SPREAD THE BALANCE AND STOP HIDDING THE RANDOM TT GARBAGE. Actually if you guys could also take out the randonymity from it as well that would be splendid.

Thank you very very VERY much in advance for implementing this.

And forgive me if there's already a thread on this :)

:D i think you put the word Sarcasm in the wrong spot, it should be in the end of your post.

Entropia universe has been, is, and will be dynamic, loot is dynamic, durability of enhancers is somewhat dynamic and so on.

They were made the way they are and they are still very widely used, nothing would change much, except maybe the use of them would drop, because people would see the real PEC/DMG or something like this.

Additionaly it would add one more way to scam noobs (sell almost broken enhancers to them).

If you want something that shows how much is already used up, then buy yourself a amplifier.

We have much more important things ingame that should be done.

Dont take this the wrong way, i am really glad to see players recommending what MA should do, but this current recommendation is pointless.
 
The randomness of enhancers screams LAS VEGAS BABY!! Come on down put some enhancers on your gear and roll the dice with Mind Ark!

But wait folks. THIS IS NOT A CASINO, so let's get that thought out of your head. OK!?

Pardon my sarcasm but I've been holding my tounge about enhancers for too long.

PLEASE SPREAD THE BALANCE AND STOP HIDDING THE RANDOM TT GARBAGE. Actually if you guys could also take out the randonymity from it as well that would be splendid.

Thank you very very VERY much in advance for implementing this.

And forgive me if there's already a thread on this :)

I had a similiar opinion but then I gave it an extra tought

If you trust MA implementation of a good random generator there is no problem, in fact there would be a problem if they didn't implement a random generator (it only requires a fair implementation of a standard one).




Let me explain.

Enhancers have a cost to make and it would not be fair that they broke on a fixed number of uses, would it ?
[MA wanted a method that would allow for them to be usuable in low turn over tools(/weapons)]

So the enhancer breaking rate had to be adapted to each item specific stats

Here comes 3 problems.

First is the rounding problem lets say that for a high ped turn over item the formula gives that the enhancer breaks every after 5.5 uses,
do you think that it would be fair that MA round it down to 5 ?

So instead of the item having consumed 10 enhancers after 55 uses it would had instead consumed 11 ?


Here is the second problem

People would try to play arround it and just keep 1 enhancer in the slot and try to take it out when it was due to break

That would mean that casual efficient gameplans would be much harder (and would generate grief for those who didn't want to micromanage every single click they make, - even if you are a fan of turn based strategic games there will be a point at which some automatization features will start to look useful).


3rd problem

In order to MA to balance this it would required to associate every single item with 10 extra parameters in their database (one per tier level) which most of the time wouldn't be in use
(using a random generator also as cost in terms of cpu use but from what I know it probably is lower than geting 10 values out of a database).

Database use isn't free and spending resourse for something that is rarely used and could be implemented in a way that gives some extra featured advantadges might been the deeciding factor.




So I don't look at it as true randomness.

Yes,
there is a random generator being used (and probably can be improved)
we are sure that they can and did improved the formula for enhancer breaking

But if properly implemented a pseudo random generator (MA isn't probably using a true one even if could find a way to do it)

will just tell the formula when it is time to break

Let have the above example in which the enhancer breaks after 5,5 in average

what the random generator would do is set a random call for a number up to 11 and if it gets a 1 or a 2 it would break the enhancer,
of if you look at breaking after 5,5 uses average as 0,181818181818

then the random generator could be a set to get a number for 1 to 10000000000000 and if the number got was 181818181818 or lower the enhancer would break

(if for example the item gets low enhancing qualities and the breaking rate is only once per 234567 uses, 0.000004263174 probability
in 10000000000000 random generaterd number if the number is lower than 4263175 it would break).


Therefore using a random generator in the enhancer breaking formula will allow for:

A)much lesser rounding error
B)less hassle for casual users (and no easy "exploitation" of the system even for those who wanted the trouble).
C)better resourse use
 
Last edited:
What I would have a problem is would be a poor/unfair implementation of a random generator.

For example of a problem would be
the formula for the probability of the enhancer breaking giving a 0.0000001 result
and the random generator be set to get a number from 1 to 10000 and always breaking at 1.

(it should always break at a certain value, lets say the least = meaning 1, but the draw number pool is much lesser than the precision of the formula then fairness issues will become obvious in in low turnover (low enhancer bonus) items.
always breaking at 1 in a 10000000000000 draw is a very small error, if the system isn't bias to get 1).
 
Additionaly it would add one more way to scam noobs (sell almost broken enhancers to them).

Enhancers have a tt now. Its just random and you dont see. They aren't created with an unlimited tt and random break, that would be ill logic.

The tt cerain doesnt replenish in the trade window or in the auction, it the enhancer has already been used then currently the noob DOES get shortchanged he gets less of a random thing.

If joe scmoe fills slots 1-5 on his gin, fires off 4000 rounds, 3 break. He puts other 2 on auction. At competitive mu.

Man cant wait to buy those RANDOM HIDDEN TT ALREADY BEAT UP POS enhancers.

Bang bang break.

Better luck next time.. but not a scam.
 
Enhancers have a tt now. Its just random and you dont see. They aren't created with an unlimited tt and random break, that would be ill logic.
that is not true, i have crafted enhancers and they have broken on the very first use. So no way to use 1999 times and sell the last click etc.
And wouldnt the hidden tt value be pretty much the same, only fair way to avoid scam? everyone is equal.
It is indeed random and it has been proved.
 
Enhancers are stateless: there are no server variables to define their "tt value" beyond the tt value they always have. Each time they are used, a "random number" is generated, and if it fails against the equation for the break rate of the enhancer on its current weapon/tool, it breaks.

When your "random number" generator is in a "dynamic" state that you tend to "roll" very low numbers a lot, you can have several enhancers break in a short period of time. In contrast, one wil occasionally last for 3-4 times the mean (average) life. This is all consistent with the mechanism above, but not with this "hidden tt value" that those with little education in statistics keep inventing.

I don't find the enhancer break mechanism problematic. Over large numbers, the average break rate settles on a consistent value. That a few last a few shots and an occasional "lucky" enhancer lasts much longer than average isn't a big deal in that context... much like the way loot works.
 
A bit confusing concept used sometimes... enhancers have tt value, they just don't decay and brake at random?
 
random is the blanket explanation, but in this game, random is not very random at all.

The core issue is that people cannot track it very easily or predict it, and they don't like that.

Welcome to EU, This has been the case with all of their algorithms, and have been keeping us busy with theories for over a decade.

In the end there is a reason, there are benefits gained, and it is adjusted accordingly...in a seemingly random manner.
 
Please make mobs show exact tt value of the loot they carry, because current randomness screams Las Vegas :)

But wait... this is how the game does work :scratch2:
 
Please make mobs show exact tt value of the loot they carry, because current randomness screams Las Vegas :)

I approve of this message :thumbup:
 
Back
Top