Pyrite and damage enahncers

So... Pyrite. Stone that affects most hunters, some crafters and some miners. For miners it became so hard to find it that price went from 180% or so to 300%. Weapon damage crafters having problems getting it and final product - weapon damage enhancers went up by 200% or so (was ~270%, now 470%). In my eyes everyone loosing in this situation - miners loose because cant find it, crafters cant craft like usually and hunters dont want to use dmg enh when they at 450%+ so... turnover dropping everywhere, CLD tax dropping too. Game getting slow. Who is wining from that?!

Btw, here is some numbers:

Weapon damage enhancer I

In a year was sold 201.9k ped tt, that is 0.55k ped a day avarage, MU of 301%
In a month was sold 12k ped tt, that is 0.4k ped a day avarage, MU 381%
In a week was sold 2k ped tt, that is 0.28k ped a day avarage, MU 440%

Weapon damage enhancer II

In a year was sold 145.7k ped tt, that is 0.39k ped a day avarage, MU of 306%
In a month was sold 9.6k ped tt, that is 0.32k ped a day avarage, MU 386%
In a week was sold 1.4k ped tt, that is 0.2k ped a day avarage, MU 448%

Weapon damage enhancer III

In a year was sold 110.3k ped tt, that is 0.30k ped a day avarage, MU of 305%
In a month was sold 7.1k ped tt, that is 0.23k ped a day avarage, MU 387%
In a week was sold 1.1k ped tt, that is 0.15k ped a day avarage, MU 449%

That clearly show that consumption dropped around two times when MU went up. Most of hunters use less/dont use enh at all, that drop

I want to use dmg enhancers but the cost has to come down.

I stashed some enhancers when it was at it's lowest mu.

Eh, I don't really have problems getting Pyrite. Supply has been slow only because my suppliers are being lazy XD

Nightmare069 said:

Eh, I don't really have problems getting Pyrite. Supply has been slow only because my suppliers are being lazy XD

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Lazy you say Then you should try mine it

Bah you should be happy pyrite is dropping at all. Let me mention angel scales. Try to craft level 11 amps. Balance is not strong side whoever is in charge of it.

Cerberis said:

So... Pyrite. Stone that affects most hunters, some crafters and some miners. For miners it became so hard to find it that price went from 180% or so to 300%. Weapon damage crafters having problems getting it and final product - weapon damage enhancers went up by 200% or so (was ~270%, now 470%). In my eyes everyone loosing in this situation - miners loose because cant find it, crafters cant craft like usually and hunters dont want to use dmg enh when they at 450%+ so... turnover dropping everywhere, CLD tax dropping too. Game getting slow. Who is wining from that?!

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I think MA should think a bit more before making Pyrite available only in pvp4, the impact is to big, it affects all hunters as you have noticed.
It's OK to have some resources available on pvp4, like it was with Blood moss and Himi, those resources were needed for fap crafting and it was still a pretty big market that relied only on pvp4, but making enhancer market to depend only on pvp4 it's a mistake IMHO.
Lootable pvp is a business only for a handful of people I don't know why MA insist on it, PVP is simply not a working thing in a RCE, at least not in a RCE with such a "huge" population like EU.

Nightmare069 said:

Eh, I don't really have problems getting Pyrite. Supply has been slow only because my suppliers are being lazy XD

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Not lazy, but not enough miners want to risk going into pvp, most of those that are mining there are high lvl players that are also competing in events, not enough time to do mining and hunting in the same time.

combo22 said:

I think MA should think a bit more before making Pyrite available only in pvp4, the impact is to big, it affects all hunters as you have noticed.
It's OK to have some resources available on pvp4, like it was with Blood moss and Himi, those resources were needed for fap crafting and it was still a pretty big market that relied only on pvp4, but making enhancer market to depend only on pvp4 it's a mistake IMHO.
Lootable pvp is a business only for a handful of people I don't know why MA insist on it, PVP is simply not a working thing in a RCE, at least not in a RCE with such a "huge" population like EU.



Not lazy, but not enough miners want to risk going into pvp, most of those that are mining there are high lvl players that are also competing in events, not enough time to do mining and hunting in the same time.

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You would be surprised how many normal miners are mining Pyrit in PVP4 and are actually doing really well.
Last few days the drop rate slowed down, so either MA adjusting or someone is hoarding.

(I would expect Hulk being the one, so surprised about this thread )

Combo, it isnt really like you saying. There are lot of miners you risk and go to lootable pvp (pvp4, arkadia, cyrene) to mine pyrite. Thing is that pyrite dont drop. I know lot of pvp4 miners who hit pyrite like 5 mins every 1-2 hours, all other time is lyst. I know one of the most skilled miner with UL amp who saying same - terible hard to find pyrite.

ecka, im one of lot of hunters who think that it is stupid to use dmg enh with 450%, not one of miners.

This issue was discussed not long ago and MA stated that nothing was changed, hoarding pyrite doesn't affect the drop rate as MA clearly stated, so the conclusion is that not enough miners are there or MA is lying and pyrite is not dropping because some people are hoarding pyrite.

Maybe much less miners are mining in general? Lots of people around me, me included, have said they hate mining right now, no fun, low tt returns etc. ??

Regards

combo22 said:

This issue was discussed not long ago and MA stated that nothing was changed, hoarding pyrite doesn't affect the drop rate as MA clearly stated, so the conclusion is that not enough miners are there or MA is lying and pyrite is not dropping because some people are hoarding pyrite.

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Thark said:

Maybe much less miners are mining in general? Lots of people around me, me included, have said they hate mining right now, no fun, low tt returns etc. ??

Regards

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Like "PW3CKA" told - you would be surprised how many mining in pvp4. And i did it few time now and before. Drop rate of pyrite is like 20 times lower then before (when enhancers was less then 300%).

There is another problem. Someone hold most of pyrite (that what i think, even when MA say there is no cap on it), or MA just turned it down a lot. No other way.

I stopped manufacturing damage enhancers, because the price of pyrite has risen too high. After dozens of attempts to find it myself in red PvP, I refused it,and this because I do not want the risk in a red PvP for hundreds/thousands PED of lysterium/caldorite/niksarium claims and 10-20 PED Pyrite claims.

Hoarding could indeed effect it. If I'm not wrong there is an official statement on the matter saying that only certain resources can be found in unlimited quantities. I am way too lazy to look it up.

Furthermore, there is the odd chance that MA feels that the enhancers overpower certain weapons and decided to ramp up the price.

...and amping limits the amount of available resources ever since "Got Ruga? ".

Cerberis, if you show up and watch my back I will happily mine some pyrite for you. If you pay the bombs I'll give it to you for TT. No guarantees though.

The most popular belief regarding pyrite shortage is that some people are "hoarding it". I personally don't like to agree with that idea. If that was true, then there wouldn't be a enhancer shortage, only massively huge enhancer % swings.

I think, MA is doing something with the pyrite spawn rates. Then blames it on "Dynamic system". That way, MA actually makes quite a bit of money.

Either way, from my experience, pyrite is not that hard to find even with shortages on auction.
Also, Arkadia pvp4 is a waste of space. It is supposed to be high risk/high reward zone but in the end you get mostly lysterium. Ore dynamic variety swings WAAAAY to often, for example you will find pyrite/niks/caldo on every drop for like 10 minutes and after that, it's gonna be only lyst for a while regardless of the depth you are at.

WhiningSkeptic said:

...and amping limits the amount of available resources ever since "Got Ruga? ".

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Funny thing you mentioned this... it's actually open for a debate. I think Marco once said that the ruga tower did not trigger any sudden changes in mining and finding rare resource towers.

WhiningSkeptic said:

Cerberis, if you show up and watch my back I will happily mine some pyrite for you. If you pay the bombs I'll give it to you for TT. No guarantees though.

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Cerberis, agree ASAP while such idiots didn't extinct fully!

(you can FAP him for decay also)

dr3w said:

Cerberis, agree ASAP while such idiots didn't extinct fully!

(you can FAP him for decay also)

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Why is that stupid?

If I get all my expenses paid and there is no risk, it is free skills. Then we probably should work on the details in case we find an ath...

Satans said:

Also, Arkadia pvp4 is a waste of space.

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Not only space. Also waste of time.
Yesterdays run (600-pedder), without any Pyrite Claim, without any Niksarium Claim, 25 PED Caldorite, 16 PED Wenrex, all other - is HUGE amount of Lysterium. Sure, about 85% return
Last 6-7 attempts was similar as yesterdays. Now I have no desire to spend time and money, as well as at risk area. I will mine up telfium with more pleasure

All ore drop rates fluctuate but in most cases you get more miners going for the good markup and this keeps the price from going too high (although it does still increase). Problem with pyrite is that it's only found in pvp4 and most miners won't touch that place. Blame MA for making lootable pvp.

Satans said:

I think, MA is doing something with the pyrite spawn rates. Then blames it on "Dynamic system". That way, MA actually makes quite a bit of money.

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Cant find ANY way that it could help MA to make more money. Miners stop mining, because too low amount of pyrite, crafters do not craft as much as they could and hunters do A LOT lower turnover. Lets say all people got 90% return. So on a lot smaller turnover, MA gets a lot smaller cash from that 10%...

slither said:

All ore drop rates fluctuate but in most cases you get more miners going for the good markup and this keeps the price from going too high (although it does still increase). Problem with pyrite is that it's only found in pvp4 and most miners won't touch that place. Blame MA for making lootable pvp.

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And again about same... People who never go to lootable pvp say that noone go there. But you wrong. Pyrite gone and people who where mining it for years still trying to find it. It was posible to mine it all the time, but now it is few minutes every hour. So i is NOT about lootable pvp.

slither said:

Problem with pyrite is that it's only found in pvp4 and most miners won't touch that place. Blame MA for making lootable pvp.

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You would be surprised to find out the actual number of miners grinding that place Blame MA for creating "friends list nearby" function

Cerberis said:

Cant find ANY way that it could help MA to make more money.

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While it's true, that all signs show that, but also take into account that MA is not stupid. They care about the money they make and it's hard to believe that they are unaware of what is going on right now.

I'll make two points on this topic, in two separate posts to keep the discussions clean.

First, about the Pyrite price.

In the real cash economy its still supply and demand at the end of the day. Whether there is massive hording going on or MA balance managers tweaking drop rates, the players determine the price they want to pay for their needed Damage enhancer based on the value they expect to gain from it. Miners determine sell price based on their time spend in lootable pvp and the risk they run loosing part of their finds when they get shot.

So if price goes up, it might be because of the increased value of using damage enhancers; more on that in my second most. Or, at the same time, the associated time spend and risk exposure to miners has increased. This might be due to the reduced drop-rate or hording. Also the fact that there are more active and efficient PK-ers hunting miners can have an effect. This can be a spiralling effect even as price increase in Pyrite makes it more profitable to camp lootable pvp for a fat miner full of pyrite.

At some point in time more people that are not mining will realize there is good money to be made to grab a finder and probes and get in pvp and pull Pyrite. First to do so will be hunters who want to use enhancers but don't want to pay the increased markup, but instead spend some of their time to find their own pyrite. Interesting enough, this will not be recorded on the auction as they craft and use their own enhancers and the sale of pyrite and enhancers is not registered... thus the data on pyrite and enhancers turnover is not the full picture.

My point is that at increased prices, they auction data on pyrite and enhancers becomes less reliable for what really goes on; the only person to have the full overview is the balance manager. At the end of the day, MA will watch the economy and should due to a lack of pyrite the Land Deed payout drop, I'm sure action will be taken in one way or another.

I think the dynamics on the market are very interesting, and I hope the Balancing Team will let this ride out to see where it takes us.

/Slupor

My promised second post on Enhancer price

We need to factor in that in the last year, the tier rate of guns has increased. Players have been screaming for this long time and MA gave in. The effect is that we now have Tier 10 Mod Merc and Terminator, and more guns will follow. All these guns eat damage enhancers at a proportionally larger rate, thus pushing up the demand for Enhancers.

Apparently some of the owners/users of these big tiered weapons make enough profit from using their toys fully enhanced, and they can still afford to pay increased pricing on the enhancers. Others conclude they can't justify the price and stop using enhancers.

My theory is that the average hunter will stop using enhancers for daily hunting as the value add is too low. The only people using enhancers is those who have the top weapons and want (or need) to go full speed in events (which MA unleashes to us at ever increasing rates, there's hardly a weekend without events anymore!) In either case, there is a rationale for using or not using damage enhancers and the price paid reflects the value. I doubt top players want to spend their time in pvp finding small claims of pyrite to make their own enhancers so they will continue to pay the markup, to a point where even they don't see the value add and will stop buying.

The coming merry mayhem and WoF will have very interesting effects on the pyrite and enhancers market. I predict it will be more crowded in pvp.

/Slupor

Cerberis said:

Cant find ANY way that it could help MA to make more money. Miners stop mining, because too low amount of pyrite, crafters do not craft as much as they could and hunters do A LOT lower turnover. Lets say all people got 90% return. So on a lot smaller turnover, MA gets a lot smaller cash from that 10%...

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You know, sometimes you can do very good by just reducing expenses? (smile.jpg)

Or you one of believers that "MA doing profit from decay" i.e. "PEDs"?

Cerberis said:

People who never go to lootable pvp say that noone go there. But you wrong. Pyrite gone and people who where mining it for years still trying to find it. It was posible to mine it all the time, but now it is few minutes every hour. So i is NOT about lootable pvp.

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I'm not saying people don't go into pvp or that the drop rate hasn't reduced. Drop rate changes for all ores periodically. But if pyrite was outside pvp4 then every miner ingame would be working out if it's worth their time mining pyrite instead of only those miners who are willing to go into pvp4.

N1: miners in pvp4 is clouds. Especially in the last days there are many more than normal.

N2: Pyrite drop is in recent days, radically reduced. I personally think that someone actually stacking it. because whenever someone produces enhancers small limited amount of pyrite begins to fall.....

This situation angers me personally from the position of Minera ... I will not spend hours daily in lotable pvp for 2 hours lysteria drops and then 5 minutes pyrite ......

Stoya said:

This situation angers me personally from the position of Minera ... I will not spend hours daily in lotable pvp for 2 hours lysteria drops and then 5 minutes pyrite ......

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Interesting, I am alone idiot, who thinks that lysterium is just simply "diluter" in PVP4, which is simply "capping" profit of "smart asses", and same time keeping high MU for crafters, because of capped supply and high demand?

And there is nothing even close to "free" market and "natural" supply-demand mechanics?

dr3w said:

Interesting, I am alone idiot, who thinks that lysterium is just simply "diluter" in PVP4, which is simply "capping" profit of "smart asses", and same time keeping high MU for crafters, because of capped supply and high demand?

And there is nothing even close to "free" market and "natural" supply-demand mechanics?

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Yep, just like oil/melchi/other crap dilutes Energized and Dianthus and so on. So MA can decide how much they would like to "dilute" miners MU%.

Can agree about market - just a few doom switches and settings, operated by "hamster". And right now "hamster" is drunk/angry and got access to Crafting/Mining folders Atleast thats how I see that.

Well, would be nice to have an idea about the return in pyrite of your run today...

Gratz you found it

Cerb Hulk Beris Pyrite Stone 65 PED NA 14:23
Cerb Hulk Beris Pyrite Stone 55 PED NA 14:17
Cerb Hulk Beris Pyrite Stone 90 PED NA 14:13
Cerb Hulk Beris Pyrite Stone 52 PED NA 14:13
Cerb Hulk Beris Pyrite Stone 71 PED NA 14:12