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WhiningSkeptic

WhiningSkeptic

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Heya,

At the moment I am using Viceroy together with 5b. I mainly hunt mobs that do cut, stab and impact so that is where my interest lies. The viceroy unplated provides me with 11 stab, 9 cut and 15 impact. Plated with 5b it gives me 19 stab, 18 cut and 27 impact.

I am now looking for an armor that offers me the same protectino as viceroy+5b. My main interest is the eco as I would like to lower the decay significantly. Since I haven't really grasped the armor tools on entropedia yet and I don't know the market for armors very well I would need some help.

So I am looking at two options here;

Armor + Plates that offer the same protection or slightly lower

OR

Armor that offers the same protection or slightly lower

While I am open to both I would prefer the second since that could be plated further if necessary. However, eco is what matters the most here. I have no interest in holding a debate on wheter or not the armor decay is returned in loot, I just want to get the numbers down. While I would prefer it to be as cheap as possible, I could stretch to around 10k if needed.

Actualy, multiple options where I could go on a slow upgrade path would be nice; 5k -> 10k -> 15k.

Thanks in advance.

Edit: Male avatar

Edit2: I might add, I use the Mod2350 for healing, so getting 25 heal per pec out of it. Perhaps that could be used to figure out the best combo as well. But from my understanding, armors are more eco per hp protected than that?
 
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u hunt mainly on arkadia right?

Polaris is king there
 
If you protect the same amount, you're going to rack up the same decay roughly speaking (unless, as always, things have changed.)

To reduce the decay, you need to increase your evade and dmg/sec.
 
change Your plates to Pulsar 8 (L), i know they are limited but they got better eco and protection than 5b.
I though that i wont use L plates but since i started to use pulsar 8 they are my only choice :)
 
I use Adj Musca for smaller mobs. Not sure about eco but its dirty cheap to repair.
And well balanced imp 8 burn 8 cut 8 stab 8 acid 3.


Know this is not exactly what youre asking in youre OP but try it out you like it ;)
 
Within the middle range - the classic Nemesis. Well balanced and versatile, add 5a/5b/8a(L)/Pulsar 8 or 3b/5c/6a/7a(L) for close or ranged combat, respectively. Very eco also, in this only beaten by Mah'ketta by a tiny margin, which you prefer if you also need its increased burn protection (tailor-made for Arkadian key instances). Either works great with Pulsar 2 for Eviscerator also, while Mah'ketta/Pulsar 2 is my solution for Steelbird (whose mission has lowest total no. of kills for stamina tokens).

Viceroy is a better Gremlin which I only take for mobs with acid damage, outside of Ark e.g. with Pulsar 8 for Rextelum, 4a on Kreltin, Aurli; with good dps weapons it might even work with Pulsar 4 on Proteron, but I didn't get to try that out yet. For standard mobs however it's not the most eco armour.

Edit- Previous postings mentioning preference for Pulsar 8 over 5b are absolutely correct. I try to avoid 5b like the plague, use it only if you really need the few extra points stab or as backup before you're caught with pants down in the field. Pulsar 8 has much better eco plus protects against cut like no other. It pays well to consult Entropedia before going on long grinding missions, even if dated it is still very useful.
 
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AkiranBlade said:
If you protect the same amount, you're going to rack up the same decay roughly speaking (unless, as always, things have changed.)

To reduce the decay, you need to increase your evade and dmg/sec.
Click to expand...

There is a difference in durability, and doesn't tt value affect the decay as well?
 
San said:
Within the middle range - the classic Nemesis. Very versatile, add 5a/5b/8a(L)/Pulsar 8 or 3b/5c/6a/7a(L) for close or ranged combat, respectively. Very eco also, only beaten by Mah'ketta by a tiny margin, which you prefer if you also need its increased burn protection (tailor-made for Arkadian key instances). Either works great with Pulsar 2 for Eviscerator also, while Mah'ketta/Pulsar 2 is my solution for Steelbird (whose mission has lowest total no. of kills for stamina tokens).

Viceroy is a better Gremlin which I only take for mobs with acid damage, outside of Ark e.g. with Pulsar 8 for Rextelum, 4a on Kreltin and Aurli; with good dps weapons it might even work with Pulsar 4 on Proteron, but I didn't get to try that out yet. For standard mobs however it's not the most eco armour.
Click to expand...

Mah'ketta looks like a good option. You happen to know price of it?

I'll see if I can make sense out of the armor advisor.
 
Go to Cyrene - unlock level Rank 1 and 2 Vendors and have those beatifull (L) armors avaible at NPC exchanged for shrapnel (markup = 101%):
Rank 1: A.R.C. Inaugurates (L)
Rank 2: A.R.C. Patrol (L)

Pros of having (L) armor:
  • high durbility (12k) makes it much more eco than ANY other UL armor with similar protection (example: (L) Aquila at 117.20% is exactly as eco as UL Aquila due o having higher durability - (L) will be decaying less for same protection). Usually having 10k more in durability means roughly +10-15% more eco (rule of thumb).
  • (L) gives same protection all the time oposite to UL that when decayed offers less and less protection

Cons of having (L) armor:
  • you probably will want to buy 2-3 sets and replace them from time to time. Consider those peds frozen in TT armor on extra sets as peds frozen in markup if you would buy UL armor ;).

Falagor
:bandit:
 
I just checked Mah'Ketta versus Viceroy +5b. The end results are as follows for mutated beladoth, which is one of the mobs I hunt:

MaturityMak'hettaViceroy+5b
DamageDecayDamageDecay
Young13.43.2231.24.798
Old 23.4 3.368 4.95.076
Mature17.93.3102.44.942
Provider 29.63.4448.55.282
Dominant 43.13.53518.7 5.564

I am not convinced the armor itself is very eco, the benefits seem more like they come from the lesser protection. The damage taken is no issue, question is if healing is more eco.

Edit:

Can't get the armor advisor to work, is it broken?

Edit:

Got it working. The most efficient armors seems to offer 13 hp protection per pec of decay. Perhaps I should just go for as small of an armor as possible since the FAP is more eco if I read that correctly.
 
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Depends on you FAP :)

Ultimately you want to avoid FAP battles so reaching a decent breakeven is important.
 
WhiningSkeptic said:
(...)
I am not convinced the armor itself is very eco, the benefits seem more like they come from the lesser protection. The damage taken is no issue, question is if healing is more eco.

Edit:

Can't get the armor advisor to work, is it broken?

Edit:

Got it working. The most efficient armors seems to offer 13 hp protection per pec of decay. Perhaps I should just go for as small of an armor as possible since the FAP is more eco if I read that correctly.
Click to expand...

The more damage is absorbed per hit the less eco armor gets. This example will help you understand this:
Absorbing two hits 10 dmg each will decay armor less than absorbing one hit 20 dmg (as long as minimum decay is passed - which is other problem with armors - since there is minimum decay value on each armor that is based on total protection points - this should be considered against overprotecting).

Thats why best option is to split dmg done by mob in this manner:
- ~33% damage is absorbed by armor
- ~33% damage is absorbed by plates
- ~34% is taken by your avatar and healed later.

This way you will not be overprotecting yourself and having armor + plate combo damage split 33%/33% will generate less decay than having one armor without plates that will be absorbing same amount worth 66%.

@edit:
best eco you can get on armor is around 18-20 dmg absorbed/pec but those are very small armors that protect like 1-3 dmg (yet its more eco than healing in most cases).

Falagor
:bandit:
 
Beladoth do 40/40/10 c/s/i so paradox looks like a nice choice with it's 33/16/11 protection.

Where would you get a full set of paradox you ask, well I just happen to have a set for sale ;)



Seriously though, if c/s/i mobs are your priority then paradox is a great choice. Liakon offers the same 60 protection but more evenly spread with 20/19/21 but it's low tt can be a pain (254tt liakon v 780tt paradox).

Emine is nice but suffers from the same low tt problem as liakon. Jag is overpriced imo, but ghoul/phantom could work.

Paradox has it's problems (low impact means you won't be hunting pure impact mobs like ambu with it). but if you hunt c/s/i, c/s, s/i, c/i then it's a great armour.
 
WhiningSkeptic said:
Mah'ketta looks like a good option. You happen to know price of it?

I'll see if I can make sense out of the armor advisor.
Click to expand...
Should be able to get it around TT+600-650, up or down a bit depending on luck or how much you are in a hurry. I sold mine to afford Nemesis, but will definitely get it back one day because 23 burn fills a gap none other serves. If it wouldn't feel so silly looking at that helmet, but that's just personal taste.

Take the armor advisor with a grain of salt, I believe MA changed the algorithm a bit since the last time Entropedia was touched by its programmer. I use the advisor for general direction and then check with armor vs. mob with a few combos I've narrowed it down to. But the overview of protection points of every set and plate is still invaluable.

But hey, seems you got some cash to burn, er, invest? Just saw this thread...
 
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I wouldn't buy Mah'ketta during a robot event.

Just my 2pec.
 
If you were female, I'd loan you my mah'ketta set, it's nice for low level bots, but I haven't tried it for beladoth.
 
slither said:
Paradox has it's problems (low impact means you won't be hunting pure impact mobs like ambu with it). but if you hunt c/s/i, c/s, s/i, c/i then it's a great armour.
Click to expand...
And a repair bill from hell! I can only see it as solution for special problems like Phasm (with Pulsar 8) if you can't afford a true über armour.

Scurvy Sityl said:
If you were female, I'd loan you my mah'ketta set, it's nice for low level bots, but I haven't tried it for beladoth.
Click to expand...
I have, can confirm it works great (w/ Pulsar 8 again).
 
WhiningSkeptic said:
I just checked Mah'Ketta versus Viceroy +5b.
Click to expand...
Try comparing them both without or both with the same plates.
WhiningSkeptic said:
I am not convinced the armor itself is very eco, the benefits seem more like they come from the lesser protection.
Click to expand...
It's the most eco I found within its range of protection, closely followed by Nemesis. There is no such thing as e.g. an Adjusted Pixie with double the damage. Only some limited armours are even more eco, if you want take a look at Zombie (L). Its markup is nigh zero and therefore you won't find it on auction often, but some crafters on Caly stock it or can make it on request. Check it with Pulsar 8 (again lol) against Feffox...
 
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San said:
And a repair bill from hell! I can only see it as solution for special problems like Phasm (with Pulsar 8) if you can't afford a true über armour.
Click to expand...

If you want more protection you have to pay more decay, you're gonna get that with any armour.

I love mah'kette but it's only 3 points better for c/s/i than viceroy and the thread is about getting set that that give similar protection as viceroy+5b but unplated. Paradox does that, 60 protection unplated against viceroys 64 plated. It also gives better protection distribution against beladoths (ie. heavy on the cut/stab and lighter on impact instead of viceroys heavy on impact and lighter on cut/stab)
 
slither said:
If you want more protection you have to pay more decay, you're gonna get that with any armour.

I love mah'kette but it's only 3 points better for c/s/i than viceroy and the thread is about getting set that that give similar protection as viceroy+5b but unplated. Paradox does that, 60 protection unplated against viceroys 64 plated. It also gives better protection distribution against beladoths (ie. heavy on the cut/stab and lighter on impact instead of viceroys heavy on impact and lighter on cut/stab)
Click to expand...

I'm actually asking for the same protection I have (or slightly lower) at a lower cost. :)
 
Disclaimer: I've been wrong before, as my early meddlings in one or two threads conserve for posterity. If there is better advice, I am watching closely.

One reason for having made this tool is to verify/falsify any such theoretical musings.
 
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The problem with the wiki amour tool is that it gives info on the old plate system, it would take a lot of calculating to work out the best eco armour with the new plate system.

Viceroy+5b is probably gonna be about as good as you'll get eco wise with similar protection, no need to swap to mah'kette or anything else if you're happy with the vice+5b.

To get similar protection with unplated armour will cost more in decay but also gives the option to add plates for further protection.

So stick with what you have if you're happy with it :)
 
slither said:
Viceroy+5b is probably gonna be about as good as you'll get eco wise with similar protection, no need to swap to mah'kette or anything else if you're happy with the vice+5b.
Click to expand...

Obviously, the easy way to decrease the armour decay and increase your FAP usage would be to just remove the plates and see how you get on. If you're hunting mobs that rarely miss, I don't recommend this move, if you hunt mobs that rarely hit, then you're good to go.
 
I've had another think :)


Given that beladoth only give 20% impact dam (according to wiki) then you don't need the 15 impact that viceroy gives (or mah'kette). Find an armour that give the same cut/stab with a lower impact and that should save a few pec over using viceroy.

Vigi has 14/14/7 so would give better protection and not waste so much overprotecting the impact. Musca might be enough with 5b. Improved B.E is a possibility but rare and expensive for what it is.
 
AkiranBlade said:
Obviously, the easy way to decrease the armour decay and increase your FAP usage would be to just remove the plates and see how you get on. If you're hunting mobs that rarely miss, I don't recommend this move, if you hunt mobs that rarely hit, then you're good to go.
Click to expand...

Going without plates would work for most of the mobs, but the bigger maturities would mean a bit of fapping. It would also slow down my pace a bit.

Hmm.

Perhaps I should just get smaller plates?
 
To further qualify, I have a set of Adj. Pixie. It's a bit less protection than the Viceroy for the most part, but it means I can use that and take larger hits if I choose (without plates) or I could don the Viceroy + 5B and handle more damage.

So, another option could be to just pick up another set of armour, cheaper maybe, or even go down the gremlin route, put the Gremlin or whichever on, see how you go, if you're hitting the FAP way too much, easily swap to the 5B'd Viceroy.

Does that make sense?
 
WhiningSkeptic said:
Perhaps I should just get smaller plates?
Click to expand...

I was going to also say, perhaps some 5A's on your 'other' set would be an option. I'd recommend the multiple set thing, because I can't be arsed with detaching and re-attaching all the time.
 
[A.R.C. Patrol Thigh Guards (M,L)]
18 impact
18 cut
18 stab
14 acid
cost 101%
What else do you need?
 
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