Using Unfair Advantage @ Eomons

ermik said:

1. Items and / or globals have been in waves since the beginning of time, anyone who hasnt realised this with more than 1 year of playtime should really consider a different gaming career.

2. If you use a vtol to avoid getting hit while hunting its an exploit.

3. If you keep many mobs at low hp only to finish them off as a wave hits, its NOT an exploit.

When i did iron missions i often killed 3-5 mobs before looting any of them, often i could wait until a global popped up before looting all mobs fast ( unless it took too long before they risked timing out )

There is a good reason why there is a time out timer on dead mobs, havent you guys figured that out yet?

Loot collection pills is an invention for people who think its a feature, when in fact it makes you not controlling when the looting occur.

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Leaving a mob alive with low hp and killing a mob to loot at a certain point are 2 different things.

The waves are part of EU. Keeping the mobs low HP is not an exploit. Is a strategy anyone can employ.

MA can implement mob regeneration such as it is on spiders, on all mobs where is worth employing such a strategy. Is still hard for me to understand why mobs such as Eomon or Osseo have such a low regeneration rate.

Taking advantage of the fact that the mobs have low regen is a skill a hunter can and should use to take advantage of known game mechanics.

I do agree that the balancing team should work to prevent such strategies from being possible.

All I can say, is gratz to those who have the patience and skill to hunt like that. It takes knowledge and skills. Not anyone has the patience to do it. I Know for sure that I would not do it because I am that lazy.

Thread starter is probably as lazy as I am. But the frustration should be directed to one self. Not to those that are more skilled and better players than he is.

ermik said:

1. Items and / or globals have been in waves since the beginning of time, anyone who hasnt realised this with more than 1 year of playtime should really consider a different gaming career.

2. If you use a vtol to avoid getting hit while hunting its an exploit.

3. If you keep many mobs at low hp only to finish them off as a wave hits, its NOT an exploit.

When i did iron missions i often killed 3-5 mobs before looting any of them, often i could wait until a global popped up before looting all mobs fast ( unless it took too long before they risked timing out )

There is a good reason why there is a time out timer on dead mobs, havent you guys figured that out yet?

Loot collection pills is an invention for people who think its a feature, when in fact it makes you not controlling when the looting occur.

Click to expand...

Explain to me how the person in the video manages to get over 10 eomon down to low hp in the first place?? without breaking the no 2 point. Even at range and some serious dps they must be jumping into a vtol to avoid getting hit and agro unless they can tank 10 eomon then fair play to them they can keep doing it. Love to see some auto agro on these mobs based on damage done.

Way i see it avoiding aggression through other means then dieing is avoiding being hit its no different to the guys who are using dodgy tactics/exploits on warlocks and vanguards atm.

I am still surprised this conversation goes on , as I said in my post xx pages back, it's us players playing against MA and current return rates. You cannot blame people for doing so, it's just how the game currently works.

You don't use any external program, you are not playing with the EU code. Everyone is equal here..

BTW, I don't remember why they made the change that mobs are not attacking flying vehicles anymore.
Probably, because of mob training, but well.. what is worse?

High regen? Nah, I don't want that.. Rather make mobs attacking Vtols again

Time to chime in here.


While I agree that theoretically there is no EULA broken (if he died on each mob instead using VTOL to lose aggro - which I seriously doubt), there are two very serious issues with this kind of tactic:

1.
People using this tactic (let's call them farmers) 'steal' from the rest of community.
For argument's sake let's assume there is 15 weapons per wave.
If one will farm 10 mobs and kill them in time of item wave, he might end up with 10 weapons, leaving just 5 for another 100 hunters, most of whom were grinding non-stop as opposed to waiting for the 'right time'.
In the end hunters who are not farmers will get much less items then they would get from 'normal distribution'.
The more farmers, the worse effect for entire community.
Therefore this is first serious way that farmers damage entire playerbase.

2.
It's only a matter of time before MA will react to this tactic.
Given their history of dealing with such matters prepare to serious nerfs, that again will affect entire community not only those farmers.
Therefore this is second very damaging effect for entire playerbase.


I'm surprised there is so much hatred towards pirates (who also do not break EULA) yet so many people think its ok to farm mobs in this manner.

@Teiwaz Storm

This is not the same thing. Even if using the vtol to lose agro at some point, is not breaking the EULA, since you do not do it to avoid being hit and exploit the game, but to stop fighting that mob. It is strategy that works just fine. All people spawn a vehicle in some situations in game. For example when there is accidental agro, or respawn, or when player dies and healer is left alone.... There is no problem with doing that, and any sane person can see it.

The fact that a change will be implemented, is clear. And that will probably be adding more regen on all mobs above a certain level of HP. Or even fast regen to full HP on a mob that takes no damage for 1 minute. Is easy fix, and it is not a nerf. After adding regen on mobs in EU, those mobse were the most popular mobs over night. So is more of a wanted feature.

People hate pirates because they steal from other players. And even tho is "legal", is deeply immoral to steal. When playing the game as is, and you kill your own mobs, is your business how you spend your own money. If the system has a problem with that, the system can just remove all loot from those mobs. Or whatever. But they do have expenses in doing that.

Another thing, is that this is considered a bonus if the ELM's are rareish and have markup. If MA hates the way they looted their guns, they would add them on argo and make them 200% and all that effort would be for nothing. There are lots of things MA can do to adjust things.

PW3CKA said:

it's us players playing against MA and current return rates.

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slick27 said:

Explain to me how the person in the video manages to get over 10 eomon down to low hp in the first place?? without breaking the no 2 point. Even at range and some serious dps they must be jumping into a vtol to avoid getting hit and agro unless they can tank 10 eomon then fair play to them they can keep doing it. Love to see some auto agro on these mobs based on damage done.

Way i see it avoiding aggression through other means then dieing is avoiding being hit its no different to the guys who are using dodgy tactics/exploits on warlocks and vanguards atm.

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shoot mob to 10%
die
fly VTOL back
repeat

BlackHawk said:

Dont Fap me.

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I apologize to BH, but I felt like doing the above, because I wasn't aware he was still an active player.


And because the forum could do with a bit more levity.

how do u think he got away from mobs

Xen said:

Unfortunately, unless I missed something in that video there is no trapping or vtol hunting, just damaged mobs.

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to do what is on the video zina would have to use vtol to get away or just die or use decoy.

PW3CKA said:

it's us players playing against MA and current return rates. You cannot blame people for doing so, it's just how the game currently works.

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If there are let's say 100 ELM weapons in the loot pool and it's regardless of how the mobs are killed, it's not "us" aginst MA, it's the Group who pull mobs aside, waiting to kill them until the wave comes and thereby getting a higher amount of ELM/person vs those who don't to it.

To roughen it up; among those who are hunting eomons, it's "you" vs everyone else - the more successful "you" are in cashing in the ELM weaopons, the less chance is for everyone else to get ELM weapon.

In the longer run, the more successful "you" are in doing this, the higher the chance is you don't have to use the ELM weapons you loot, but the more ELM weapons you will have to keep in storage until the event is over and to sell over time, while normal hunters who use their looted ELM weapons for their own hunting will quickly run out of theirs.

The more people are using silly tricks to corner in advantages, the higher the risk is also that MA will come with the nerf bat (people trapping boss mobs in instances "We don't do anything wrong" --> tens of mobs easily gets stuck in "dungeons" when MA Wakes up).

If this ends up with 20% of players get happy because they've found out a smart way to loot more ELM weapons and get hither returns from the markup, it means 80% of players will get more upset of bad returns, and if 80% of depositors get upset of bad returns it will mean 80% longer time for you to wait for your withdrawals...

BlackHawk said:

After adding regen on mobs in EU, those mobse were the most popular mobs over night. So is more of a wanted feature.

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When regen came, I practically stopped hunting the regen mobs when they came. Now I got a slightly faster weapon than Before the regen mobs came, though if Eomon would become regen I wouldn't have any weapon for them (that I'm guaranteed to have availible throughout migration).

I don't know how many hundred PEDs that has vanished into the black hole because of the regen of zombie/king kong on RT (I guess regen was mandated by MA to allow that size mob).

Maybe regen mobs have split players into two parts; those who like it because of the higher chance of loot (especially during the 10k atrox Young during the casino era), and those who hate it because it feels like a PED sink - especially when you have "mid level" gear.

I got the feeling that Vulcan Drakes (most recently hunted on SI) has gotten regen... and I don't like it. At one time my weapon amp silently died and I wondered wtf the Health s going up instead of down, and noted ammo didn't go down... until I looked in system tab (I had event chat open) and saw 10 of those those "an attachment has reached low condition". And I can bet I didn't get that lost HP back in loot.

But... sure. MA added regen to Proterons (and made them hit harder). So I guess it will eventually happen with Eomon. Eomon (and mutated chirpy) that seems to have started to hit slightly harder than Before (not scientifically proved though, just a personal note).

Sorry zina zina

Okay so i watch my first video and saw that ZINA was using decoy to get away from mob and the video shows no expolit. it is okay to farm eomon to low hp and wait for elm wave to come and then kill all the eomon.

thats why i sent in the video and MA says its okay. here is the first video http://www.twitch.tv/gameoverptp/v/10853866

On 2015-08-13 14:00:47 SUPPORT replied:
Hi TheProfit,

Thank you for contacting us.

We have to say that this is borderline tactics, but it is not considered to be an exploit.

These ways of hunting have been discussed back and forth, and we have come to the conclusion that we wont interfere if a person chooses to do this.

Kind regards,
Hank | Entropia Universe Support
On 2015-08-12 23:39:36 you wrote:
http://www.twitch.tv/gameoverptp/v/10691099 not sure if this is abuse

My only interest in this action is 1.

Why people got warnings if it is allowed.


//mg Joda VVV VVV

mg Joda VVV said:

My only interest in this action is 1.

Why people got warnings if it is allowed.


//mg Joda VVV VVV

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I dont think anyone outside WSS got warning.
People cry to much and send a bunch of supportcases and lie to support, thats why support write warnings to that people.


But some people used Vtol to escape an that is not allowed and have never been

not pointing to anyone in particular but loot system on a timer is just plain wrong

with mining its the pyrite and eomons now also

loot should be random and not using set interval

Cerberis said:

You should see how Zina trap mobs using 2 x IFN - Medical Partition. He put them close to each other, forming V, put mob there and shoot from other side while mob cant reach him Good it was pvp, so killed him, took his furnitures and made support... Im sure some BA would say it was smart way to hunt...

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my name is Hulk the last 2 years i have used my second avatar blessing as a fap bot with auto clicker to hunt naked with imk 2. Still i find time to moraly judge people on forum who try to find advantages like i do.

SKULL69 said:

not pointing to anyone in particular but loot system on a timer is just plain wrong

with mining its the pyrite and eomons now also

loot should be random and not using set interval

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what he said !!!!!

its just plain wrong that waiting afkish for the "right "time to hunt/mine gets rewarded and those that grind/mine all day long get shafted

dont get me wrong,its smart to do it for those that do it,but it isnt exactly motivating to decay/cycle an lot..and that should be ma-s priority

fluske said:

what he said !!!!!

its just plain wrong that waiting afkish for the "right "time to hunt/mine gets rewarded and those that grind/mine all day long get shafted

dont get me wrong,its smart to do it for those that do it,but it isnt exactly motivating to decay/cycle an lot..and that should be ma-s priority

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u mean like the aurli bone where some people waited all day afk to get the profits

Since i was curious about if its allowed or not i asked support, seems i got the same answer as profit.
Always good to know whats allowed or not

I simply tought it'd be an exploit as some people do, they get told its exploitable which means bannable,
Others do the same, is fine

Gets hard to know whats allowed or not since the rules keep bending for certain people.


Reminds me straightr away of mob training in pvp.
always an issue that made a lot of tissues being used. everyone called each other on mob train.
I know of few that got banned for it, that admited / I been told about by good sources,
Some that done it and never got banned, got others locked by reporting them

Few weeks later MA decides to allow mob trains and leave those "offenders" unpunished when they broke rules when it was still rules.
Weird way of thinking.

One of these days I'll be affraid of using TT since someone might be offended with the fact i use a blue terminal to buy ammo

Gunz aka Gunzy said:

u mean like the aurli bone where some people waited all day afk to get the profits

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In this case we lost 3 friends from soc because all the drama and they had warnings from MA for the very same behavior that is defended when you (BA) are doing it. Despite YOUR personal hate versus a few this really seems bad at least in my eyes??

I'm still quite confused. People were clearly using vtols to pre-damage all those eomon when I visited the area the day this thread started.

Make up your mind or fix the loot waves MA. pls. thx.

Angel O2 Mercer said:

I'm still quite confused. People were clearly using vtols to pre-damage all those eomon when I visited the area the day this thread started.

Make up your mind or fix the loot waves MA. pls. thx.

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Ofc as soon as nobody is on radar they will use vtol, its only possible way to keep em like this without making them unreachable and in a big pile........try yourselfs, if claiming to die as they get low Im curious how to keep them others agro away and none is unreachable.

One could just use decoys... the eomon is stupid and will always go for the decoy.

krogfan said:

In this case we lost 3 friends from soc because all the drama and they had warnings from MA for the very same behavior that is defended when you (BA) are doing it. Despite YOUR personal hate versus a few this really seems bad at least in my eyes??

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not shure im understanding what u mean? u quoted what happend on cp but im guessing ure replying to me calling hulk a hypocrit?
I never comented on the issue that op states, but as i understood it the reason zina dident get a warning when others did was cos he dident use any vehicle. Me personaly dont like bending the rules to maxmize profit but i understand people who do it when they feel others are taking advantage of the system, in the end its mas fault for creating the retarded migration rules they could have just kept it as last year.

Decoys are a tactic you could use on these which is completely fair. But yes the bulk people are useing vtols etc to avoid agro. I made a petition back in 2014-12-06 21:36 regarding the use of such vehicles as i saw people using the same tactics on large tide claws to avoid agro and being hit by flying away everytime it got close.

The response i got back then was

Hi shaun27,

Thank you for your report.

I have forwarded the issue to members of the responsible team for further investigation and any irregularities found will be adjusted as soon as possible.

This does not have to be a exploit but we appreciate the reports since the mob might not work as intended.

Please stay tuned to the News and Release Notes sections on the website for further information and developments.

Thank you for your patience.


is hunting eomon as i have seen some people hunt them both useing vtols and wave rubbish an intended way to hunt them ??? With that above reply i certainly wouldn't want to risk my account put it that way, far from concrete answers.

GameOverPTP said:

On 2015-08-13 14:00:47 SUPPORT replied:
Hi TheProfit,

Thank you for contacting us.

We have to say that this is borderline tactics, but it is not considered to be an exploit.

These ways of hunting have been discussed back and forth, and we have come to the conclusion that we wont interfere if a person chooses to do this.

Kind regards,
Hank | Entropia Universe Support

Click to expand...

Thanks for posting your support case response. That's exactly what I thought would be the answer. The OP could do with being updated with your answer to distinguish between what is an exploit (using VTOL) and what is not (using decoys etc).

GameOverPTP said:

Okay so i watch my first video and saw that ZINA was using decoy to get away from mob and the video shows no expolit. it is okay to farm eomon to low hp and wait for elm wave to come and then kill all the eomon.

thats why i sent in the video and MA says its okay. here is the first video http://www.twitch.tv/gameoverptp/v/10853866

On 2015-08-13 14:00:47 SUPPORT replied:
Hi TheProfit,

Thank you for contacting us.

We have to say that this is borderline tactics, but it is not considered to be an exploit.

These ways of hunting have been discussed back and forth, and we have come to the conclusion that we wont interfere if a person chooses to do this.

Kind regards,
Hank | Entropia Universe Support
On 2015-08-12 23:39:36 you wrote:
http://www.twitch.tv/gameoverptp/v/10691099 not sure if this is abuse

Click to expand...

sachi.mk2 said:

Thanks for posting your support case response. That's exactly what I thought would be the answer. The OP could do with being updated with your answer to distinguish between what is an exploit (using VTOL) and what is not (using decoys etc).

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thank you Profit for posting the response to your support case, which proves the answer to Divinity's case was clearly referring to the use of VTOL to escape aggro and had nothing to do with pre-damaging!

It's official! Pre-damaging NOT CONSIDERED AN EXPLOIT!!!
That should end the drama (though it probably won't)

PRE DMG IS an exploit if x number of elm drops in each wave as it is....

ffs! Bring the ban hammer or im calling Thor on this one!

ProActive Mango said:

PRE DMG IS an exploit if x number of elm drops in each wave as it is....

ffs! Bring the ban hammer or im calling Thor on this one!

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Well, MA says it's not... so why do you think it's an exploit?...

would pre-damaging be an exploit if there was no loot waves?
is it an exploit to hunt Eomon only during the waves?

GameOverPTP said:

On 2015-08-13 14:00:47 SUPPORT replied:
Hi TheProfit,

Thank you for contacting us.

We have to say that this is borderline tactics, but it is not considered to be an exploit.

These ways of hunting have been discussed back and forth, and we have come to the conclusion that we wont interfere if a person chooses to do this.

Kind regards,
Hank | Entropia Universe Support

Click to expand...

In a way I can see the debate going on within MA about this and in an odd way I can see why MA will side allowing it since at the end it just will bring the MU down for the item in the wave and well MA will loose less.