Call for disciplinary action on the part of all UA cheaters during this years Merry Mayhem.

Corwin said:

If you are happily playing i guess you must thanks "passive" investors instead of blaming them. And again you did not understand a .... of what is the debate so read all before using your fingers to type.

The problem is not how this event affected cld revenue the problem is that ppc screwed up and made us one against each other only because the didnt gave and are not giving (at this time i guess on purpose) any information about exploiters or that the event was generous in order to attract old inactive players (not new ones because new ones were not able to do it at all) or just to give a better christmas to skilled hunters.

The fact we are in dark is the reason of the decreased cld value and cant be because ma wants to buy them back because it will never happen unless they do an event like this every month they will never go to a lower value than 1k each

so to reassume, the revenue could be sacrificed by players if ma communicate it b4 but the cld value its a piss off to all eu investors active and not. Also may be done on purpose according to all the people who bought aud from shop and sold them to buy stars to get half price ammo.

Click to expand...

Corwin The Prince

Hunting Stats
Favorite Mob: Snablesnot-Female
Highest Loot: 17 PED
Total Loot: 214 PED

Mining Stats
Favorite Mineral: NA.
Highest Loot: NA. PED
Total Loot: NA. PED

I'm sure all active players have to bow down to your amazing generosity for buying a few CLD's.
We all know it's the investors who never play the game who keep this game alive.

I mean, who needs the active players anyway?
They can all go to hell and leave the game for the true heroes, the amazing CLD owners!
That's the true recipe for success. It's a safe bet the value of your precious CLD's would go through the roof in no time.

Whenever the plain stupidity approaches infinity it's not even funny any more...

Fifth said:

Corwin The Prince

Hunting Stats
Favorite Mob: Snablesnot-Female
Highest Loot: 17 PED
Total Loot: 214 PED

Mining Stats
Favorite Mineral: NA.
Highest Loot: NA. PED
Total Loot: NA. PED

I'm sure all active players have to bow down to your amazing generosity for buying a few CLD's.
We all know it's the investors who never play the game who keep this game alive.

I mean, who needs the active players anyway?
They can all go to hell and leave the game for the true heroes, the amazing CLD owners!
That's the true recipe for success. It's a safe bet the value of your precious CLD's would go through the roof in no time.

Whenever the plain stupidity approaches infinity it's not even funny any more...

Click to expand...

U should be thankng me for playing and investing in this game since i play from august. and i already spent more than <removed>k dollars. How much did u deposited since ur playing? what if newbies like me stop depositing? i guess u wish that to happen.

<removed>

Corwin said:

If you are happily playing i guess you must thanks "passive" investors instead of blaming them. And again you did not understand a .... of what is the debate so read all before using your fingers to type.

The problem is not how this event affected cld revenue the problem is that ppc screwed up and made us one against each other only because the didnt gave and are not giving (at this time i guess on purpose) any information about exploiters or that the event was generous in order to attract old inactive players (not new ones because new ones were not able to do it at all) or just to give a better christmas to skilled hunters.

The fact we are in dark is the reason of the decreased cld value and cant be because ma wants to buy them back because it will never happen unless they do an event like this every month they will never go to a lower value than 1k each

so to reassume, the revenue could be sacrificed by players if ma communicate it b4 but the cld value its a piss off to all eu investors active and not. Also may be done on purpose according to all the people who bought aud from shop and sold them to buy stars to get half price ammo.

Click to expand...

Take one share of Coca Cola to their HQ and see how in the dark you still are about how they really run their company.

You are not owed any clarity.

Sunsout Gunsout said:

Take one share of Coca Cola to their HQ and see how in the dark you still are about how they really run their company.

You are not owed any clarity.

Click to expand...

this is why we need him


Famed Avatar, Virtual World Legend Jon NEVERDIE Jacobs Announces Run For ...
[SIZE=-1]PR Newswire (press release)[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]LOS ANGELES, Dec. 9, 2015 /PRNewswire/ -- Cyber-celebrity and entrepreneur Jon NEVERDIE Jacobs has just announced his bid to run for Virtual Reality President, an inaugural election put forth by Mindark, the developer of the Entropia Universe, the real ...[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]http://news.google.com/news/more?ncl=d58jR6YdG7_teHM&authuser=0&ned=us[/SIZE]

Sunsout Gunsout said:

Now back on topic, I would still love a list of names of who were the twats that exploited this, but I know they won't do it. However, in no event should anything ever be paid back to CLD holders. They accepted the risk. Life isn't always Candyland. Walk it off, tough guys...you bought ownership in a fucking business! Sometimes shit happens in business.

Click to expand...

Regarding the payback, any time a company recuperates funds in a manner directly related to a loss of funding, all shareholders are normally compensated. The compensation is normally part of the next dividend payout, and is reflected as simple profit, though if you check the P&L statements you can see that the additional profit came from this resource.

Recompense/refund/payback would be a reflection of the adjustment of profit on the company's side.

Magyar_Republic said:

I dont believe the entire crowd exploited. However I believe that many people who bought stars may have purchase them from folks who were illegally obtaining them.

Click to expand...

You are making this thread without even knowing what the exploit was since you didn't even participate in MM.
There was no way to obtain the FFA stars illegally. Someone had to grind FFA to obtain them. You are even childishly namecalling Svena who's been playing for years for purchasing the extra 5k points needed to make his 10k point ammo bonus. As soon as Caly turned the FFA rewards off it was probably worse for your precious CLDs because then speculators were able to buy points for 10-12 pec, I had even seen offers of 5 pec per point which would be a profit of 2k ped UA.
This was the first Merry Mayhem that Caly implemented the Universal Ammo prizes as opposed to UL Items and the fact that the UA rewards were affecting CLD payouts means that odds are CLD holders would be footing the bill for the event anyways. The smartest thing for Caly to do would be to buy back CLDs from investors since they're paying 15% interest on the initial price and maybe this is a step in that direction.

Sadly, people have exploited more than $250 of untradable ammo in this game and are still able to log in to this day, so the likelyness of any santions being imposed on these avatars are slim to none. If you don't like the outcome of this then sell your CLD and buy AUD.

Disclosure: I farmed a relatively decent amount of points but did not make any alts to turn points in.

<removed>
Without people like me actually playing this game your CLDs wouldn't be worth a shit, so if anything you should be thanking me <removed>.

Cheers

If Magyar isn't going to listen to the 30 or so 5-11 year players that have tried to impart some knowledge to him he just isn't going to listen

Since this thread has degraded to just shit talking and deleted posts I vote it should just be closed

So many deleted posts.

ZPF said:

So many deleted posts.

Click to expand...

Incoming!

Reason
3.2 - offtopic

Magyar_Republic said:

Regarding the payback, any time a company recuperates funds in a manner directly related to a loss of funding, all shareholders are normally compensated. The compensation is normally part of the next dividend payout, and is reflected as simple profit, though if you check the P&L statements you can see that the additional profit came from this resource.

Recompense/refund/payback would be a reflection of the adjustment of profit on the company's side.

Click to expand...

I wanna be disciplined! Discipline Me First! Me ME!

Buck Wyld said:

If Magyar isn't going to listen to the 30 or so 5-11 year players that have tried to impart some knowledge to him he just isn't going to listen

Since this thread has degraded to just shit talking and deleted posts I vote it should just be closed

Click to expand...

I'm one of those 5-11 year players.

Here's my first EL global





This puts my account at older than this, since you dont start off hunting Maffoid.

But hey, let's toss a bullshit stat around to try to get some crowd appeal! This is how people on this forum argue. You're telling me that type of argumentative nonsense is worth listening to?

It's not.

So far I've shown very clearly why the "dont trust MA" argument is complete hogwash, and I've illustrated repeatedly that this does not apply to all MM participants, but rather to a select few.

I've also responded very respectfully to posts that have been respectful towards me, even if disagreeable. Posts that imply or suggest my stupidity though I respond to with the hostility they deserve. I'm smart enough to realize when somebody is suggesting I'm an idiot, and I'm smart enough to know that no matter what I say, those people will continue to think that way. So I speak my mind freely, and let them know exactly what their opinion is worth <removed>

All you've said is that I wont listen to you because you think I'm wrong, once you remove those rather popular points.

I'm waiting for a response that isnt typical forum drone from the Magyar sucks and he's so stupid crowd. There have been some intelligent posts in here from folks who have had counterpoints to my points. But not from that group.

Read back thru from the start. There are lots of posts that are not just don't trust ma posts. There are also many posts calmly explaining why your call for refunds and player punishments are not going to happen, not applicable, or just plain wrong. You obviously think you as an investor are entitled to something you are clearly not. Just because you in invest a little cash in a company does not give you any guarantied income or say in how the company is run. Your continued whining and accusations and beating this dead horse is rediculas and clearly illustrates your lack of business knowledge as well as social skills. What I was calling for was and is the closure of this stupid thread as it serves no purpose except for showing us all what an ass hat you have become because you feel that someone screwed you over a few hundred bucks.

Buck Wyld said:

Read back thru from the start. There are lots of posts that are not just don't trust ma posts. There are also many posts calmly explaining why your call for refunds and player punishments are not going to happen, not applicable, or just plain wrong. You obviously think you as an investor are entitled to something you are clearly not. Just because you in invest a little cash in a company does not give you any guarantied income or say in how the company is run. Your continued whining and accusations and beating this dead horse is rediculas and clearly illustrates your lack of business knowledge as well as social skills. What I was calling for was and is the closure of this stupid thread as it serves no purpose except for showing us all what an ass hat you have become because you feel that someone screwed you over a few hundred bucks.

Click to expand...

You're putting words in my mouth. It's not me who needs to reread something. It's you, who already had an opinion about the topic and is allowing their pre-existing opinion to influence how they read the words.

Call for a closure of 'this stupid thread' all you want. I guess its OK for you to call for something, but when somebody else calls for something they're concerned about, unless they agree with you they are stupid and need to shut up.

Got it.

My god you remind me of my kids at 8 yrs old. I'm done. Not gonna waste my time anymore
Hope the clds have a nice big 2pec return for a month or 2 just to make you happy. Cya

I think the major problem for all of us is the lack of transparency and timely, effective, clear communication from MA.

I can't count the number of threads or posts firestorms that are created because MA can't be bothered to communicate effectively. I guess it's great for 711

All this does is cause discontent, confusion and anger for most that feel like they are the tail getting wagged by the MA dog. MA is shooting themselves in the foot because of it. They take advantage of the fact that a lot of people - for the most part - want to enjoy participating, have a lot invested in time and money, and have hope for the virtual universe MA created and therefore have reasonable expectations that they will be treated with the respect they deserve as an investor and customer and be communicated to.

The fact that MA ignores all of that is problematic, at best and threads like this are a manifestation of it and that is not going to change until MA changes. I can't see that happening as long as people continue to pay, play and "invest". Why should they? They can continue to carry on. They are like the drug dealers or casinos that don't give a damn about their customers because they know they will keep coming back or be replaced when they OD and die. They will continue to sell them the heroin they need to get their fix, or pour them a drink so they can relax, depo some more and pull the handle again.

Mac said:

I think the major problem for all of us is the lack of transparency and timely, effective, clear communication from MA.

I can't count the number of threads or posts firestorms that are created because MA can't be bothered to communicate effectively. I guess it's great for 711

All this does is cause discontent, confusion and anger for most that feel like they are the tail getting wagged by the MA dog. MA is shooting themselves in the foot because of it. They take advantage of the fact that a lot of people - for the most part - want to enjoy participating, have a lot invested in time and money, and have hope for the virtual universe MA created and therefore have reasonable expectations that they will be treated with the respect they deserve as an investor and customer and be communicated to. The fact that MA ignores all of that is problematic, at best and threads like this are a manifestation of it and that is not going to change until MA changes. I can't see that happening as long as people continue to pay, play and "invest". Why should they? They can continue to carry on. They are like the drug dealers or casinos that don't give a damn about their customers because they know they will keep coming back. They will continue to sell them the heroin they need to get their fix, or pour them a drink so they can relax, depo some more and pull the handle again.

Click to expand...

True. No matter what argument has been presented in this thread (aside from the ones that say how much I suck) all of the arguments are pointing back at MA and their communication in some perspective or another. We all want that to improve. Despite various new CEO's and directives towards better communication, it's really gotten worse.

The only time communication improved a little was when Kim was here, and honestly I felt sorry for him. Players would beat him up all the time over trivial, inconsequential things.\

MA needs a serious PR department. Not some 3rd party group like what NEVERDIE has that basically struggles to produce bits of fluff. But a real PR group meant to handle community issues and concerns, and who's sole objective is communication. It doesnt need to be big, but it does need to be at least 3 people plus player volunteers in order to be effective. These folks need to bridge the gap between MA and their constituents.

here are the prize this week we sacrifice cld revenue to pay ffa prizes next week we do to pay solo prizes, but only half of it next week, does it looks something already happened b4?

<removed>

Now returning intopic, i totally agree with maygdar that even one payed expert to communicate to public may be a very good assets to keep investors trust and everything. EU is everything but a casino, i would consider it a virtual world that covers and invest more in the social aspect than in pve or pvp (more s3cond life than ev3), because talking about that we still have a very dated combat system that i remember in old games like dark age of camelot, or space that you cant even go around a planet.

So MA when i red in the news page "The new Merry Mayhem Free For All category was very popular, and we look forward to refining it further in future years" i laughed and said refine? u have to crush mayhem down and if possible also change its name because this was a real disaster for ingame economy. And im pretty sure MA will pay some consequences when people used the ammo and press the magic withdraw button all in once.

I expect much from MA, and i give much of my time and money if possible. but they have to give a signal that they are economically or mentally stable and the "refining" thing seems .........

now mayhem prices in UL ammo will be dectracted also from cld revenue i think at this point and that is the proof that we wont have any refund back (aldo cld value will have other 300 ped decrease at least).

also they made sure in news when they announced solo prizes that they will be payed "early" "next week" i guess in order to make them effect to cld revenue of next week.

I finished my words.....
no wait a sec
postit: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/showthread.php?281831-Gross-Revenue there was something wrong and i couldnt find out and thats it. In my country gross revenue means at the gross of expenses, so we basically arguing when there is nothing to argue, nor calypso or mindark should have make any money that week in order to payout 0.

Corwin said:

<removed>

Now returning intopic, i totally agree with maygdar that even one payed expert to communicate to public may be a very good assets to keep investors trust and everything. EU is everything but a casino, i would consider it a virtual world that covers and invest more in the social aspect than in pve or pvp (more s3cond life than ev3), because talking about that we still have a very dated combat system that i remember in old games like dark age of camelot, or space that you cant even go around a planet.

So MA when i red in the news page "The new Merry Mayhem Free For All category was very popular, and we look forward to refining it further in future years" i laughed and said refine? u have to crush mayhem down and if possible also change its name because this was a real disaster for ingame economy. And im pretty sure MA will pay some consequences when people used the ammo and press the magic withdraw button all in once.

I expect much from MA, and i give much of my time and money if possible. but they have to give a signal that they are economically or mentally stable and the "refining" thing seems .........

now mayhem prices in UL ammo will be dectracted also from cld revenue i think at this point and that is the proof that we wont have any refund back (aldo cld value will have other 300 ped decrease at least).

I finished my words.....
no wait a sec
postit: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/showthread.php?281831-Gross-Revenue there was something wrong and i couldnt find out and thats it. In my country gross revenue means at the gross of expenses, so we basically arguing when there is nothing to argue, nor calypso or mindark should have make any money that week in order to payout 0.

Click to expand...

I just hope Taco doesnt read this...

I wholeheartedly agree with this. Mindark needs to take this seriously.

hottygurl said:

I wholeheartedly agree with this. Mindark needs to take this seriously.

Click to expand...

Won't happen. Too many members of the community participated and dont have the sack to admit to it.

Magyar_Republic said:

Won't happen. Too many members of the community participated and dont have the sack to admit to it.

Click to expand...

No, you got it backwards.
Read the topic title over again. You claim people were cheating with UA during the Marry Mayhem. You claim there was illegal activity on such a massive scale that it influenced CLD payouts for several months. You are claiming it was exploiting done by the players, not players following the rules that were flawed and out of balance.

Those are extraordinary claims. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. All you have is one press release mentioning exploits and investigation. Nobody I know has never heard about anyone who was disciplined in any way as a result of this investigation. Have you? There was nothing, not even a warning...
Does it look like exploiting on a massive scale to you?

Behave like a man, admit you were wrong and we were right, this time. That's what reasonable human beings do - sometimes u have to accept the reality for what it is, not what u would like it to be.

I don't think it has ever said what the actual "exploiting" even refers to.

step 1 of court proceedings: DEFINE THE CRIME

passing judgement and sentences without defining the crime

Fifth said:

Behave like a man, admit you were wrong and we were right, this time. That's what reasonable human beings do - sometimes u have to accept the reality for what it is, not what u would like it to be.

Click to expand...

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

<removed>

It's not the crooks fault. Its the accusers fault for not being able to point specifically to the intricacies of the crime.

It does not matter that the money was obviously missing. It doesnt matter that various peoples hands are suddenly wealthier at the exact same time. Nothing occurred.

See what I mean? The community does not have the sack to admit that they stole from the product. They'll sit on their laurels happy that MA decided not to prosecute, and call that enough to exonerate.

The reality is this: It was too widespread to punish. MA likely ran an analysis on who did it, and found that in removal of those players they would lose more money long term than would be financially prudent.

Any time you use a loophole in the system to get free stuff, that's an exploit. Any time. I twas an exploit when extra stats were gained on Rocktropia. Those were rolled back. It was an exploit when people perched, shooting high end creatures who's danger depended at least in part on the damage they could produce, without risk to themselves. That was remedied. And it was an exploit when folks turned in these stars to get free ammo, when the stars were generated by creating and running alts through a simple course, though what that course was is completely unknown to me at this time. Why? Because I didnt do it. I can only guess at what may have happened... and those guesses will continue to be picked apart by those who seek to create a defense for their actions.

The money is missing.

The cookie jar is empty.

Cookies dont eat themselves.

Money doesn't get up and walk away on its own.

<removed>

I think fifth is right and you are wrong Magyar.

Harmony. said:

I think fifth is right and you are wrong Magyar.

Click to expand...

That and $3.50 will get you a cup of coffee. Which is to say, so what? Who cares what you think?

The money is missing. That much is math. You cant honestly think that the development team didnt crunch numbers on their event beforehand, can you?

Of course they did. They just forgot to take into account a simple loophole, and players exploited it.

Occams Razor. The simplest explanation is usually the correct one. Is it simpler to say that the development team that has created this product suddenly forgot how to do basic mathematics on an event that they had all year to plan out, but did fine just about everywhere else, or is it simpler to say that through a human error they left a loophole in which when discovered was exploited mercilessly by a player base that has a history of exploiting the system and each other for financial gain?

Let me see: One takes basically sudden onset alzheimers which then magically goes away after the holidays. A side effect of this alzheimers is a sudden rain of money down on anyone who learns the magic dance.

The other takes into account that people make mistakes, and others (who have a history of being jerks whenever a person makes a mistake) are jerks about it.

Which is simpler?

Magyar_Republic said:

Which is simpler?

Click to expand...

That Fifth is right and you are not. <removed>
Someone in here has an appropriate signature : ' consider a cockup over a conspiracy '

Magyar_Republic said:

Occams Razor. The simplest explanation is usually the correct one.

Click to expand...

Why didn't you simplify that even further and leave out the word 'usually'? Because it then wouldn't be correct maybe?

Anyway, put simply as well, enough people who I am prepared to believe have stated their (approximate) costs to acquire the bonuses that I am satisfied that even without any of the unverified exploiting, the balance was way off.

It has even been discussed why the imbalance may have been intentionally so as well.

We don't need to see behind the obvious - the obvious adds enough weight as it is!

The money is missing, yes. I made profit from MA's cockup, there's a log you can look it up how exactly I did it and if there was anything shady about it.
I'm not top level player, there's lots of ppl who have better skills and much better gear than me. They were able to use the opportunity much better than me and many ppl mentioned how much profit they made.
On the opposite end of the scale there's ppl for whom profit is a rare exception. Usually it's either lose a little or lose alot. If the latter happens some of em end up venting on the forum. How many whining threads did u see this year? There was a few who gave up before they even reached the higher UA rewards but nobody who made it till the end.

What does that tell us? Something was different this year. We both agree on that. There's no question some ppl were cheating, there's been some every damn year. In fact I know some of them and I know how. It was simple, finish the missions with main char, then repeat with alt. Both times according to the rules but getting twice as much profit as those who were not cheating.
I'm sure MA found it out too, or at least they suspected who most likely did it but, well, they can't prove it so they let it slide.
Which has been happening every year anyway. Alts and cheating is part of MM. Business as usual... unfortunately.

But you didn't try to tell us there was some cheating. You were not saying it was just our usual suspects getting a few hundred peds extra. You were saying this year the exploiting was the MAIN reason. Exploiting and not MA's cockup.

Be honest man, you don't believe it yourself. You can keep denying it, it's ok. Just so you know, we know.

Lets call it a draw. Let it be.