Avatar Sharing is very clearly NOT allowed and...

jaydub · Jan 27, 2016

Here's the proof:

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/gallery/showimage.php?i=304459

The interesting thing is that this was posted as a terminus in the Merry Mayhem Free For All thread started by Bertha Bot as an official forum thread and once I posted response from support no further posts have occurred after being a very active thread like its being blocked. Is everyone else seeing this thread?

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/...rry-Mayhem-2015-Results-Free-For-All-Category

Regardless...this post refutes what so many including forum moderators believe about avatar sharing.

Brick

Alexis · Jan 27, 2016

jaydub said:
Brick is right. Taco is right. Serica is wrong. BAM! SLAM! Merry New Valentine's Spring Break!

Brick

If you keep patting yourself on the back like that you're going to break your arms. Then how will you shake the hands of the head honchos at Mindark for settling such a significant issue?

I give you credit for getting such a fast and definitive response. It leaves me wondering if one less person is working support over at Mindark, and if he or she understood the ToU themselves. In the past, I think answering such a question would have required two board meetings, five vacations, and a trip to Mars.

Venture Bros · Jan 27, 2016

Read the

ToS. Avatar sharing is 100% allowed. Using multiple avatars, so long as they are registered under seperate real people, is also allowed. Ulf <removed> is obviously wrong here.

Venture Bros · Jan 27, 2016

Whoever wrote that ticket was in error. As it states it is inadvisable but allowed. As also stated in the ToS.

READ THE TOS there is no debate here.

FOR GODS SAKE. READ THE TOS. YOU PLAY THIS GAME, READ THE TOS!

IF YOU DID, YOU'D KNOW AVATAR SHARING IS ALLOWED BUT NOT ADVISED DUE TO RISK.

I don't avatar share or anything, but

it infuriates me how this is even a discussion. Read the god damn ToS that you lie and say you read EVERY TIME YOU PLAY but have never actually read.

Venture Bros · Jan 27, 2016

States in ToS CLEARLY that it IS allowed.

You agree to accept personal liability for all actions that occur through Your Account or through the use of Your Login Details, whether done by You or by someone else using Your Account and/or Login Details. You must notify MindArk immediately if You suspect a breach of security or unauthorized use of Your Account and/or Your Login Details. You agree to hold MindArk free from liability for any improper or illegal use of Your Account. This includes illegal or improper use by someone to whom You have given permission to use Your Account. The terms of this agreement shall extend to anyone else using Your Account.

If You should happen to willfully or otherwise reveal Your Login Details, You have relinquished Your right to any assistance regarding the possible outcomes or consequences of Your actions. Your Account may be Banned and/or Terminated if You let someone else use it inappropriately or not in compliance with this paragraph 3.

The above states it is allowed, however the owner is responsible for any actions done.
They will ban you if the other person does things that are bannable offensives. Basically you ARE allowed to let others use your account, but you cannot say 'it wasn't me on my account, unban me my brother did it' as they will say it does not matter who uses an account.

Avon(AJ)Jerrix · Jan 27, 2016

No, I checked the thread for a couple of days to see if anyone posted anything new, and nothing. I guess your post slipped past after that.

Well, answer seems clear enough. If anyone wants they can submit another ticket and ask for themselves.

m0rr0w2 · Jan 27, 2016

Reply

Venture Bros said:
Read the ToS. Avatar sharing is 100% allowed. Using multiple avatars, so long as they are registered under seperate real people, is also allowed. Ulf is <removed> obviously wrong here.

I typically don't post my opinion on this forum but I can't seem to understand how you aren't banned yet? I have only been back for a month and I have never seen so much profanity and abuse from another person on this forum before that has yet to be reprimanded. Just my 2 cents but you have some major anger issues man that you need to sort out. I have read several threads that you have been involved in and you immediately jump down people's throats all the time. Relax its a game and is supposed to be fun. Hope you find your happy place.

Zac

Venture Bros · Jan 27, 2016

m0rr0w2 said:
I typically don't post my opinion on this forum but I can't seem to understand how you aren't banned yet? I have only been back for a month and I have never seen so much profanity and abuse from another person on this forum before that has yet to be reprimanded. Just my 2 cents but you have some major anger issues man that you need to sort out. I have read several threads that you have been involved in and you immediately jump down people's throats all the time. Relax its a game and is supposed to be fun. Hope you find your happy place.

Zac

I am having fun. You need to watch more Venture Bros. I am role playing Thaddeus Rusty Venture.

But in all seriousness, and staying on topic (which you very much are not, the reason I am not banned is my posts are all on topic... You should try that...)

States in ToS CLEARLY that it IS allowed.

You agree to accept personal liability for all actions that occur through Your Account or through the use of Your Login Details, whether done by You or by someone else using Your Account and/or Login Details. You must notify MindArk immediately if You suspect a breach of security or unauthorized use of Your Account and/or Your Login Details. You agree to hold MindArk free from liability for any improper or illegal use of Your Account. This includes illegal or improper use by someone to whom You have given permission to use Your Account. The terms of this agreement shall extend to anyone else using Your Account.

If You should happen to willfully or otherwise reveal Your Login Details, You have relinquished Your right to any assistance regarding the possible outcomes or consequences of Your actions. Your Account may be Banned and/or Terminated if You let someone else use it inappropriately or not in compliance with this paragraph 3.

The above states it is allowed, however the owner is responsible for any actions done.
They will ban you if the other person does things that are bannable offensives. Basically you ARE allowed to let others use your account, but you cannot say 'it wasn't me on my account, unban me my brother did it' as they will say it does not matter who uses an account.

Venture Bros · Jan 27, 2016

Avon(AJ)Jerrix said:
No, I checked the thread for a couple of days to see if anyone posted anything new, and nothing. I guess your post slipped past after that.

Well, answer seems clear enough. If anyone wants they can submit another ticket and ask for themselves.

Or just read the ToS which CLEARLY states that it IS allowed. You know, the ToS you LEGALLY CONFIRM READING EVERY TIME YOU START THE GAME. BUT HAVE NOT READ ONCE! You are a liar, you lie to entropia every time you start the game. Read the ToS... Or at least this portion I copied and pasted for you, since you like lieing about reading ToS and not doing it. Liar.

You agree to accept personal liability for all actions that occur through Your Account or through the use of Your Login Details, whether done by You or by someone else using Your Account and/or Login Details. You must notify MindArk immediately if You suspect a breach of security or unauthorized use of Your Account and/or Your Login Details. You agree to hold MindArk free from liability for any improper or illegal use of Your Account. This includes illegal or improper use by someone to whom You have given permission to use Your Account. The terms of this agreement shall extend to anyone else using Your Account.

If You should happen to willfully or otherwise reveal Your Login Details, You have relinquished Your right to any assistance regarding the possible outcomes or consequences of Your actions. Your Account may be Banned and/or Terminated if You let someone else use it inappropriately or not in compliance with this paragraph 3.

The above states it is allowed, however the owner is responsible for any actions done.
They will ban you if the other person does things that are bannable offensives. Basically you ARE allowed to let others use your account, but you cannot say 'it wasn't me on my account, unban me my brother did it' as they will say it does not matter who uses an account.

Venture Bros · Jan 27, 2016

To be clear, if you are not 100% sure multiple people on same avatar is allowed, you are legally a liar.

You have lied to MA likely thousands of times, if not more. Every time you click "yes" to reading the ToS.
If you did read the ToS, even once, you'd know it is 100% allowed.

m0rr0w2 · Jan 27, 2016

Reply

Venture Bros said:
I am having fun. You need to watch more Venture Bros. I am role playing Thaddeus Rusty Venture.

But in all seriousness, and staying on topic (which you very much are not, the reason I am not banned is my posts are all on topic... You should try that...)

States in ToS CLEARLY that it IS allowed.

The above states it is allowed, however the owner is responsible for any actions done.
They will ban you if the other person does things that are bannable offensives. Basically you ARE allowed to let others use your account, but you cannot say 'it wasn't me on my account, unban me my brother did it' as they will say it does not matter who uses an account.

No but seriously do you want to start an EU anger support group in game with me? I think we could both benefit from it and maybe others

Zac

mastermesh · Jan 27, 2016

Venture Bros · Jan 27, 2016

And every time it is discussed as being fully allowed. You can see how it is driving me crazy. :lolup:

carle · Jan 27, 2016

jaydub said:
Here's the proof:

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/gallery/showimage.php?i=304459

The interesting thing is that this was posted as a terminus in the Merry Mayhem Free For All thread started by Bertha Bot as an official forum thread and once I posted response from support no further posts have occurred after being a very active thread like its being blocked. Is everyone else seeing this thread?

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/...rry-Mayhem-2015-Results-Free-For-All-Category

Regardless...this post refutes what so many including forum moderators believe about avatar sharing.

Brick

First of all Joda did not have multiple persons playing his avatar.
I did an half assed attemt in FFA when collecting the 10k for bonus and did 7k in 1 day (1 500 pointer thats all).
If ive gotten team up and realy been hitting it winning the entire thing would be easy.

Second to reply on your PM from support.

His reply is not very solid since first part he only claims its inadvisable (not wise, sensible, or reasonable : not advisable) pointing towards the Eula.

Then he says no its not allowed even tho the Tou that one have to agree on to log on clarily states its allowed

"You agree to accept personal liability for all actions that occur through Your Account or through the use of Your Login Details, whether done by You or by someone else using Your Account and/or Login Details "

Next line
You must notify MindArk immediately if You suspect a breach of security or unauthorized (Meaning your allowed to have Authorizered use) use of Your Account and/or Your Login Details

More line

You agree to hold MindArk free from liability for any improper or illegal use of Your Account. This includes illegal or improper use by someone to whom You have given permission to use Your Account. The terms of this agreement shall extend to anyone else using Your Account.

But sure you can always contest what is impropper use and unauthorized access but come on, if you dont want more the one person on account all you have to do is add it into TOU

Sunsout Gunsout · Jan 27, 2016

The yellow text you highlighted, Rusty, doesn't say it IS allowed, it says you are responsible even if YOU gave permission to someone else. It doesn't say whether or not it is ok to give such permission, just that you are responsible IF you do.

I love when idiots try to explain legalese.

ToU and EULA, Condo docs, Association By-laws, Employment Contracts etc all inevitably leave things open to interpretation. Then idiots try to pick and choose parts of it and twist them to suit their stance on the issue. But this doesn't work. Ever.

A court would ask one simple question..."Did MA intend for all of us to play on accounts that are not bound to our unique account info?" Hell-fucking-NO! It does NOT expressly allow that anywhere, and after reading through it all, it would never be construed to be their intended business model either.

Does it happen, yes. Does the fact that it happens make it ok? No. MA cannot ratify avatar sharing because it is nearly impossible for them to know for sure. So the fact that it is allowed to happen does not make it legal either.

If you read through ALL the rules, the most clear, and therefore most likely to be upheld, interpretation is that you can ONLY use the avatar that is assigned to your unique log-in info.

This position is supported by numerous statements from MA.

So it is illegal, however it is very hard to enforce. And just because people do it and don't get caught doesn't make it legal, YOU IDIOTS.

billairboy · Jan 27, 2016

It's pretty obvious the purpose is that avatar-sharing is NOT allowed, even if the ToU don't directly says that, but indirectly you can understand it in other things they say in the ToU. But they will probably not care much if you let some in the family use it now and then.

It's no doubt that having multiple avatars is NOT allowed, "You may only register one Account" and also "You can only join an Entropia Universe Planet by creating an Entropia Universe Account that is uniquely associated with Your participation" as it say in the ToU. If you use use multiply avatars or sharing your avatar with some other, the account/accounts are not "uniquely" associated with you.

Sure, it does not say "You are forbidden to share your account" or "You can only use use one account", but the different statements in the ToU ends up in that. And that in combination with statements from the support would make it clear. Use only one account, don't share it with someone else.

Venture Bros · Jan 27, 2016

Sunsout Gunsout said:
The yellow text you highlighted, Rusty, doesn't say it IS allowed, it says you are responsible even if YOU gave permission to someone else. It doesn't say whether or not it is ok to give such permission, just that you are responsible IF you do.

I love when idiots try to explain legalese.

It does, it says you are responsible even if you give permission. Thus stating you can give permission. It doesn't state weather or cannot do it, but it does state you can do it. Thus it is allowed. If you give permission you are responsible, thus it is allowed. If it was not allowed they would say it is not allowed rather then saying you are responsible for actions of others on your account.

I someone is responsible for actions of others, then that clearly means that others are allowed to use.

I won't debate this with you, I thought you were smarter then that taco... You're hatred for others is even clouding your opinion of concise definitions. You are literally going mad. :eyecrazy:

All you naysayers, read the other fucking 30 threads before you post here. You've been proven wrong again and again...

Sunsout Gunsout · Jan 27, 2016

Venture Bros said:
It does, it says you are responsible even if you give permission. Thus stating you can give permission. It doesn't state weather or cannot do it, but it does state you can do it. Thus it is allowed. If you give permission you are responsible, thus it is allowed. If it was not allowed they would say it is not allowed rather then saying you are responsible for actions of others on your account.

I someone is responsible for actions of others, then that clearly means that others are allowed to use.

I won't debate this with you, I thought you were smarter then that taco... You're hatred for others is even clouding your opinion of concise definitions. You are literally going mad.

All you naysayers, read the other fucking 30 threads before you post here. You've been proven wrong again and again...

Holy shit...just because it says you are responsible IF you give permission DOES NOT mean you are expressly allowed to give permission. What kind of backwards way of looking at this are you doing? You are twisting. You are implying. You are lying. Stop talking.,..forever.

You just don't understand...because they have been unclear about it in the past, and because they are unable to enforce it much, that does NOT mean it is allowed by the ToU!

The ToU does NOT expressly allow it, and ALL intrepations in its current revision would lead to a court finding it was NOT allowed.

That is all I am saying.

So quit trying to justify your actions with the ToU....IT DOESN'T MAKE IT LEGAL.

narfi · Jan 27, 2016

Sunsout Gunsout said:
I love when idiots try to explain legalese.

I love it when people take support case responses at face value........ (effing morons! (support and those who believe them both))

Like it, hate it, agree with it, dissagree with it.... it doesnt matter what the tos or support says, the fact is that MA doesnt give a crap, and unless it hurts their bottom line they wont do anything about it.

Thats the facts.

For my opinion on how I read it.... well, I have logged onto other peoples accounts and my wife has logged onto mine before from time to time as well. My take on it is that MA says it is not advisable because of security issues and you as the named owner of your account ARE responsible for ANYONE you give access to your account as well as anything they do while logged into your account.

Witch hunts are fun, but unless MA makes more specific rules, you cant pick and choose or change the color of lenses used when reading depending on who it is applied to or the situation.

This means Husbands/wives/roomates/etc...
This means warpship owners
This means Shop owners
This means estate owners
This means Crafting accounts
This means orginized scammers
This means professional Uber accounts run 24/7
This means your ex girlfriends brother whos ID you borrowed once
This means everything.

Just because you don't like one or more of those types of accounts being shared doesn't make it against the rules unless MA decides to make changes which they have not.

Venture Bros · Jan 27, 2016

Sunsout Gunsout said:
Holy shit...just because it says you are responsible IF you give permission DOES NOT mean it is allowed to give permission. What kind of backwards way of looking at this are you doing? You are twisting. You are implying. You are lying. Stop talking.,..forever.

You just don't understand...because they have been unclear about it in the past, and because they are unable to enforce it much, that does NOT mean it is allowed by the ToU!

The ToU does NOT expressly allow it, and ALL intrepations in its current revision would lead to a court finding it was NOT allowed.

That is all I am saying.

So quit trying to justify your actions with the ToU....IT DOESN'T MAKE IT LEGAL.

My actions? I am the only one who uses my account and I don't use others.
Once again going on the blame game, just because someone is defending something doesn't mean they do it.

Taco, you're the idiot trying to explain legalese. If something is not expressly forbidden, it is allowed. That is the law.

Sunsout Gunsout · Jan 27, 2016

narfi said:
I love it when people take support case responses at face value........ (effing morons! (support and those who believe them both))

Like it, hate it, agree with it, dissagree with it.... it doesnt matter what the tos or support says, the fact is that MA doesnt give a crap, and unless it hurts their bottom line they wont do anything about it.

Thats the facts.

For my opinion on how I read it.... well, I have logged onto other peoples accounts and my wife has logged onto mine before from time to time as well. My take on it is that MA says it is not advisable because of security issues and you as the named owner of your account ARE responsible for ANYONE you give access to your account as well as anything they do while logged into your account.

Witch hunts are fun, but unless MA makes more specific rules, you cant pick and choose or change the color of lenses used when reading depending on who it is applied to or the situation.

This means Husbands/wives/roomates/etc...
This means warpship owners
This means Shop owners
This means estate owners
This means Crafting accounts
This means orginized scammers
This means professional Uber accounts run 24/7
This means your ex girlfriends brother whos ID you borrowed once
This means everything.

Just because you don't like one or more of those types of accounts being shared doesn't make it against the rules unless MA decides to make changes which they have not.

That is what I am saying here...The ToU does NOT allow it, but of course it happens in tons of ways. When my nieces or nephews come over, I let them shoot a few mobs or drop a few bombs. MA doesn't care about that.

I have a problem with some people doing it when they do it to threaten or troll me or do it to win events, yes, that is plastered all over the forum. I am not hiding that.

I also don't like people lying about it...that is what most of my issues in the forum about shared avatars have been...just admit it, if you think it is so legal.

But this thread is attempting to interpret what MA's stance on it is. And people are twisting the ToU and making it look like it says things that is DOES NOT.

The ToU does NOT allow it, but MA allows it to happen. True. That is the only answer. It is also true that due to MA's indifference, some shady stuff happens because of it, but lots of harmless activity occurs too. I am not saying any way is the right way, but I AM saying that people interpretations of the rules is horseshit when they do it to prove their point. Rusty says it IS allowed by the TOU...he is wrong. It is allowed by MA's indifference...period.

I know people need to share avatars all the time. But it IS possible to admit some shared use doesn't hurt the game AND still hate that it is allowed to happen so people can take all the prizes in all the events (old MM, old Goldrush etc...it hasn't happened as much lately, I will agree)

MA needs to make some clear statements...either way I am fine with it as long as they keep making the events less and less winnable by shared avatars running 24/7. They are doing that it seems.

Dan59 · Jan 27, 2016

We just need better events where avatars witch can play 4 or 6 hours a day have same chance as avatars witch can run 24/7 and does not matter if is run by no lifer, by friends or by very sophisticated third party software or script.

atomicstorm · Jan 27, 2016

Please don't try to argue with a lawyer about law. It is about as useful as trying to teach Christianity to a satanist.

Sunsout Gunsout · Jan 27, 2016

Venture Bros said:
Taco, you're the idiot trying to explain legalese. If something is not expressly forbidden, it is allowed. That is the law.

Ok...you sound like a kid trying to get out of trouble..."mommy, you never told me NOT to eat 14 pounds of bacon at once...so I thought it was ok..."

Rule 2.1: says that you can ONLY join by creating an account, and that all participation must be done (uniquely associated) with that account.

That is as close to expressly forbidden as it can get.

Them allowing it is a different matter. Because it is nearly impossible to enforce, it happens, but the ToU sure as hell doesn't say it is ok.

All I am trying to say is that Rusty and the Mod's in other threads are wrong to say the ToU allows it. It doesn't.

If construed by the court, on its face, the ToU very likely forbids sharing avatars.

SO just quit lying...

Most people shared avatars at one time or another...like I said, that is fine for the most part...in some situations, it hurts the game, and MA seems to be fixing those situations, but for the most part, it seems to be deemed ok by MA.

But that DOES NOT MEAN THE ToU EXPRESSLY SAID IT WAS OK.

You are trying to arrive at the same location by wishing and not by just driving there.

Get over the fact that the ToU is a poorly worded document, and quit trying to twist it to suit your purpose. You don't need to. MA allows it.

OZtwo · Jan 27, 2016

Venture Bros said:
Taco, you're the idiot trying to explain legalese. If something is not expressly forbidden, it is allowed. That is the law.

Rusty?? You having a bit of issues today? :drink:

Sorry but you are wrong here and by posting over and over text that you simply do not understand is making you look well. :scared:

jaydub · Jan 27, 2016

None of that states...

Venture Bros said:
I am having fun. You need to watch more Venture Bros. I am role playing Thaddeus Rusty Venture.

But in all seriousness, and staying on topic (which you very much are not, the reason I am not banned is my posts are all on topic... You should try that...)

States in ToS CLEARLY that it IS allowed.

(AVATAR SHARER)

The above states it is allowed, however the owner is responsible for any actions done.
They will ban you if the other person does things that are bannable offensives. Basically you ARE allowed to let others use your account, but you cannot say 'it wasn't me on my account, unban me my brother did it' as they will say it does not matter who uses an account.

(AVATAR SHARER)

...it is allowed. That is the dumbest assertion and overread almost possible.

Brick

jaydub · Jan 27, 2016

I'm not an attorney...

Sunsout Gunsout said:
The yellow text you highlighted, Rusty, doesn't say it IS allowed, it says you are responsible even if YOU gave permission to someone else. It doesn't say whether or not it is ok to give such permission, just that you are responsible IF you do.

I love when idiots try to explain legalese.

ToU and EULA, Condo docs, Association By-laws, Employment Contracts etc all inevitably leave things open to interpretation. Then idiots try to pick and choose parts of it and twist them to suit their stance on the issue. But this doesn't work. Ever.

A court would ask one simple question..."Did MA intend for all of us to play on accounts that are not bound to our unique account info?" Hell-fucking-NO! It does NOT expressly allow that anywhere, and after reading through it all, it would never be construed to be their intended business model either.

Does it happen, yes. Does the fact that it happens make it ok? No. MA cannot ratify avatar sharing because it is nearly impossible for them to know for sure. So the fact that it is allowed to happen does not make it legal either.

If you read through ALL the rules, the most clear, and therefore most likely to be upheld, interpretation is that you can ONLY use the avatar that is assigned to your unique log-in info.

This position is supported by numerous statements from MA.

So it is illegal, however it is very hard to enforce. And just because people do it and don't get caught doesn't make it legal, YOU IDIOTS.

...but I do play one on Planetcalypsoforum.com.

Brick

atomicstorm · Jan 27, 2016

He is an attorney...

OZtwo · Jan 27, 2016

Nvm.....................

Mac · Jan 27, 2016

I am not an attorney.

Avatar Sharing is very clearly NOT allowed and...

Old Alpha

Dominant

Elite

Elite

Elite

Guardian

Guardian

Elite

Elite

Elite

Guardian

Mutated

Elite

Prowler

Elite

Elite

Elite

Elite

Elite

Elite

Elite

Stalker

Slayer

Elite

Stalker

Old Alpha

Old Alpha

Slayer

Stalker

Marauder