Info: For Fifth - Taming test

RickEngland

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Rickard Rick England
For fifth

Taming test. All tames where done on auto hit.
see windows time stamps, bottom right

First pic.

Not hunted any mob for good week, just trained pets

Tamed two dragons

Hit twice on each



Tame for a while

Now moved up to 4 hits damage per dragon tamed



Few more screens same results, much more than 2 hits per mob (I can post but lets keep it simple for now)

Rebooted

Still waiting for mob to crit so rebooted
Tamed another one straight away, only received one damage hit (nice and clean)




But lets move onto the crit (took a while but the dragon eventually crit me)

Forgot to add crit pic here it is.
Straight away my ava loses abilities.




7 mins after the reboot only

This is the next screen shoot straight after that crit. see windows time stamp.
Now my ava is a complete mess



Please Explain

thanks

Rick
 
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I'm just about to go to bed so my brain isn't working well, but I have no idea what you're talking about.

What is the test you're doing? why is your avatar a complete mess at the end?
 
Rick is very good at taming, if he says something about it, I tend to believe him.

Happy taming Rick. :whip:
 
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Your trying to make conclusions from a tiny tiny sample. Thankless job and also meaningless...

Yes, on the micro scale it's dynamic.
It's like trying to measure the temperature of boiling water, by measuring temperature inside each tiny bubble, and then next to the bubble, here and there. You can get very different readings this way.
Move down to even smaller scale, look at each molecule. U can see wonderful things there, some have extremely high energy, speeding away like rockets. Other's have very low energy, almost standing still.

Those tiny water molecules are your individual mobs...

If u really want to prove something, forget the screens with interesting occurrences. Move up to the macro scale and log the damage of several thousand mobs.

I can predict the results. All the wonderful dynamic disappears, no more Brownian movement.
 
I'm just about to go to bed so my brain isn't working well, but I have no idea what you're talking about.

What is the test you're doing? why is your avatar a complete mess at the end?

It was a debate, about how the ‘system’ sets your ava up on a mob ‘during’ a hunt.

Then at some point during that hunt the system will adjust your return either + or – (on that mob only...i.e. same mob grind).

It does this, by testing your ava with a calculation somehow using a crit hit from a mob, then immediately your ava will either improve or deteriorate in that current environment.

It would appear you can cancel the setting with a reboot, and your ava will return to a neutral state.

The other interesting factor was how damage hits to your ava increases as you get more into the hunt, within 10 mins.

So for the first few mobs, your ava is potentially at full performance, but deteriorates in defensive abilities extremely fast.

I tried to prove the effect without armour, it’s hard with screen shots, but pretty obvious to see it happening.

My point being that if your ava is adjusted per mob, why bother adding more defence costs.

Happy taming Rick. :whip:

thanks Mega

Your trying to make conclusions from a tiny tiny sample. Thankless job and also meaningless...

Yes, on the micro scale it's dynamic.

I hear you Fifth, its very hard to prove without posting tons of data which is hard in the forum.

ok how about this then:

There’s another interesting test regarding ‘moving up’ mob levels.

Say you hunted some prots.
Then switched to some tiny mob, like say taming Level 6 dragons.
Wait for you ava to be adjusted to dragons (give it good 30 mins, at least receive a crit)

Now go back to Prots and your defensive skills will be like a noob, until a critical hit from the mob resets your ava....hee,hee.

And I bet that crit will come pretty quick, because by now your ava is miles away from Prot settings.

If your setting are way off you will get quite a few crits while the system attempts to reset you. Each of these crits I bet changes another skill, or attribute. I reckon the higher your attributes the bigger the number of critical hits received

I’ve seen this happen so many times, it’s got to be true.

Regards

Rick
 
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thanks Mega

dont_let_the_bstards.jpg


You may not be aware of this.

There is a list
  • Mega
  • Taco
  • Maygar
  • Rick
Now you are aware, and such is my nature. I accidentally posted it.
 
dont_let_the_bstards.jpg


You may not be aware of this.

There is a list
  • Mega
  • Taco
  • Maygar
  • Rick
Now you are aware, and such is my nature. I accidentally posted it.

Doesn't seem like your doing nothing. I knew you were not a good man. (Refer to your sig)


LOL but seriously. Very interesting concept. Will have to test myself as well. Why do you use taming though? Any reason?
 
Doesn't seem like your doing nothing. I knew you were not a good man. (Refer to your sig)


LOL but seriously. Very interesting concept. Will have to test myself as well. Why do you use taming though? Any reason?

Well, give it time, been here 9.5 years. I'm Chaotic Good and not a hypocrite.

Anyone does what I've done, I say nothing.

Be very aware most people who say "xxxxxxxxxx is bad have never ever ever tried it." Trust me on that one.


Chaotic good, I warn you, you make your own choices after that, I'm good. :)

I'm always your best friend, I even help those who hate me.
 
I'm just about to go to bed so my brain isn't working well, but I have no idea what you're talking about.

What is the test you're doing? why is your avatar a complete mess at the end?

Refer to this post for what the thread's all about.
https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/...ers-worth-it&p=3455662&viewfull=1#post3455662

...

It does this, by testing your ava with a calculation somehow using a crit hit from a mob, then immediately your ava will either improve or deteriorate in that current environment.

It would appear you can cancel the setting with a reboot, and your ava will return to a neutral state.

...

Any possibility that the critic hit is just another "observed effect" as a result of some changes in the parameters of the system?

I do believe that the system does "hold" some kind of parameters to determine how good your loot will be as well as how often you hit, miss or do critics...take hits and receive critics (in a particular "period" of time). However, I can't tell if its applied in general to the whole population on the server or is it down to the particular individuals' level (no...I'm not talking about the "level of your character"...but rather the scale it affects).

Furthermore, I don't know, but don't think, that a mere "reboot" would help you in resetting the effects though. (Nothing short of a server-side reboot.)

If you take a look at Ardorj's Kill Log on Hadraadas,
https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/...rj-s-Experiment-of-Kills-per-Hunt-on-Hadraada

You can see that there's "something" (in play) that affects your loot returns (the TT size of the loot your getting) and how much it takes you to kill a particular mob at a particular timing.

I think these "parameters" might be in tandem with how loot comes in "waves" as well.

Just my :twocents:
 
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Ahh, so I jumped in halfway thu a conversation :)
 
This is an interesting topic and I'm in the mood... so I'll tell u a story. :cool:

This is a true story. It's from another game but it might shed some light on how the things described by Rick might be possible and how it all might work under the hood. This another game was pretty much a clone of the early PE: AfterWorld Alpha (AW).
(Hope the mods won't mind the examples from another game that's long dead and gone so there's no danger we could possibly lure any players away from EU).

All the main game mechanics in AW were the same as in PE/EU but there was one important difference. In EU almost the entire game's non-PvP, only small areas PvP. In AW the picture was reversed, almost all the game PvP with only small areas non-PvP. As a result, there was constant wars between (alliances of) soces.

What was, again, similar to EU - it was relatively easy for the high level player to kill a newcomer or a medium lvl player but very difficult if the skill levels and gear was more or less equal. Try to kill someone with supremacy and a good fap in 1 vs 1 battle... If he knows how to move and doesn't just stand there like sitting duck u will never succeed. All the same was true for AW.

OK, one picture is better than 100 words. There's a short (~2 min) video below.

It starts with the biggest and meanest mobs in AW (Drone-29), then we can see a (failed) attempt to overkill a mob (team vs team). About @1:20 we can see 2 Vs. 1 PvP battle between equal opponents (all 3 belong to absolute Top10 skill-wise and have the best gear in the game).

(As you can see, it's pretty much impossible to kill an equal opponent in PvP...)


And then one day all we knew about the game flew out of the window.

There was no seamless world in AW, each server was a separate map. On the server border you were transferred to the next map/server.

There was 3 of us that day. We had just arrived to some godforsaken distant map(/server) in the middle of nowhere and by a coincidence 2 of our greatest adversaries arrived to the exact same spot just a few minutes later.
It wasn't an ambush, both sides were caught by a surprise. The shootout that followed was fierce and short, 1st enemy went down almost instantly, 2nd one followed shortly.

WTF just happened? Why did they go down so fast? Maybe they didn't have their PvP armors on? (It wasn't possible to tell in AW, you could make Pixie look like Supremacy, and vice versa). Or maybe we just scored some lucky crits?

Next day we read on the forum we were using some hack. It turned out they did have their best PvP armors on, and the logs showed that we didn't score any more crits than usual. Instead, the log showed we simply delivered the max normal damage with every single shot. Which was not statistically possible in AW (cuz unlike EU in AW the defensive skills decreased the incoming damage, not just less successful hits but every hit delivered less damage for a player with high defensive skills).

So, obviously something extraordinary had happened.

For this battle those 2 ubers had reverted back to total noobs. No wonder they were furious and suspected we had used some hack or cheating somehow... But none of us had used any hacks or tricks.

After series of tests we finally figured it out. When avatar was entering the game the skillsystem initialized properly (skillsystem 1st, then the 3D model of the avatar, then the hitbox was enabled).
When you moved from one server to another, however, avatar and it's hitbox sometimes materialized before the skillsystem was properly initialized. Without skill data the engine reverted back to defaults - a skillset of the newcomer when he 1st enters the game.


* * *

I don't know what exactly happened in the OP's example, but it seems to point to something similar - some kind of glitch in the system.

The conclusion that Rick draws from this, however, is wrong IMO. There's loads of evidence that the skillsystem in general is working exactly as it should, i.e.:

Since I passed the evade requirement for troxes they are just dancing around me but they don't hit, almost not at all. It doesn't matter how long I hunt them. Even if they eventually manage to crit me, my skills still won't change. The troxes still just dance around me and hardly ever hit...
I chose the example of troxes cuz they have very sharp and noticeable reaction to the evader lvl. Just a little bit below the required lvl and u being hit constantly, just a little bit above and your almost like in God-mode.
If your skills were really changing, even a small change would have drastic consequences. But there's nothing, no change whatsoever.


So yeah, I would dare to assert there has to be some other explanation than "skills are worthless" and "what's the point"... ;)
 
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Well, give it time, been here 9.5 years. I'm Chaotic Good and not a hypocrite.

Anyone does what I've done, I say nothing.

Be very aware most people who say "xxxxxxxxxx is bad have never ever ever tried it." Trust me on that one.


Chaotic good, I warn you, you make your own choices after that, I'm good. :)

I'm always your best friend, I even help those who hate me.


I was just poking fun at your signature. Glad I didn't offend you :)
 
This is an interesting topic and I'm in the mood... so I'll tell u a story. :cool:


After series of tests we finally figured it out. When avatar was entering the game the skillsystem initialized properly (skillsystem 1st, then the 3D model of the avatar, then the hitbox was enabled).
When you moved from one server to another, however, avatar and it's hitbox sometimes materialized before the skillsystem was properly initialized. Without skill data the engine reverted back to defaults - a skillset of the newcomer when he 1st enters the game.

The conclusion that Rick draws from this, however, is wrong IMO. There's loads of evidence that the skillsystem in general is working exactly as it should, i.e.:

Since I passed the evade requirement for troxes they are just dancing around me but they don't hit, almost not at all. It doesn't matter how long I hunt them. Even if they eventually manage to crit me, my skills still won't change. The troxes still just dance around me and hardly ever hit...


So yeah, I would dare to assert there has to be some other explanation than "skills are worthless" and "what's the point"... ;)

That was a really interesting read thanks for posting Fifth.

Sadly God mode has gone in EU (as well) without wearing any armour. Back in the day I see many avas hunting Trox Doms naked, taking no damage. When Atrox where considered big mobs.

Actually I think EU had another under the hood change the last few months, I think we can set for timed profits especially after a deposit (debate for another time).

Even if you work it all out, MA throw-in another twist. I still think it's all smoke and mirrors, and I still believe in 'selection' here. i.e. individual players get their chance to shine, for a period of time.

thanks again for long post

Rick
 
Actually I think EU had another under the hood change the last few months, I think we can set for timed profits especially after a deposit (debate for another time).

Even if you work it all out, MA throw-in another twist. I still think it's all smoke and mirrors, and I still believe in 'selection' here. i.e. individual players get their chance to shine, for a period of time.
Who knows, u might be right there. We have been asking for this and MA might eventually listen.
It would be rather sad thou, if it would go down that road. The magic of EU is that it's unfair. It's damn hard to bear when u down but still, I believe this should never change.

U prolly onto something with your OP as well. We'll figure it out one day.
 
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