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[Arkadia Underground Deed] drop price ?

It's easy, every investor/CLD owner must bring 3 new investors/players if they want teir payots
 
Antrace said:
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i have some AUDs, we'll see how much they'll pay everyday and the AUD price will set on it
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Awesome info, i like that chart :) actuallydid a calc today, price of CLD - 1750~ and AUD at 68~, for 1750, you can get 25 AUD and 25 AUD for a week would pay out between 3.5-5.25, which is way better return than CLD gives. And soon enough you could buy an AUD ever 10weeks and quicker as it compouds :) Anyways, again, thanks for that pic, good info.
 
Since EU seems to be turning into a trading house rather than a game, let's look at RL for the moment.

In the UK the FTSE 100 (index for the top 100 companies in the UK) is trading today at 5890 with year high of 7103

That's 20.5% down on say 3 months ago. (7103/5890= 1.205)

It's pretty easy to buy into a tracker these days, via an ISA. Or even ishares.

You don't have a wait 3 months for your money if you sell, there's minimal fees, and you've got zero currency exchange risk (if you live in the UK).

My point being there're other good options and opportunities out there, it annoys me sometimes when people say you can't get deed returns this good anywhere.

Trackers on main indexs are pretty low risk to be honest.

If you were brave you could invest in oil stocks even bank shares. I often wonder if these market lows are manipulated for investment banks or hedge funds to make a few million.

I used to hold a lot of cash waiting for the big dips, buy in and get back out when the market recovers. you can get a free holiday every year doing that.

you need money to make money of course.

Rick
 
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RickEngland said:
Since EU seems to be turning into a trading house rather than a game, let's look at RL for the moment.

In the UK the FTSE 100 (index for the top 100 companies in the UK) is trading today at 5890 with year high of 7103

That's 20.5% down on say 3 months ago. (7103/5890= 1.205)

It's pretty easy to buy into a tracker these days, via an ISA. Or even ishares.

You don't have a wait 3 months for your money if you sell, there's minimal fees, and you've got zero currency exchange risk (if you live in the UK).

My point being there're other good options and opportunities out there, it annoys me sometimes when people say you can't get deed returns this good anywhere.

Trackers on main indexs are pretty low risk to be honest.

If you were brave you could invest in oil stocks even bank shares. I often wonder if these market lows are manipulated for investment banks or hedge funds to make a few million.

I used to hold a lot of cash waiting for the big dips, buy in and get back out when the market recovers. you can get a free holiday every year doing that.

you need money to make money of course.

Rick
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I have to disagree with your views here to be honest. Buying deeds in EU basically guarantees you some sort of payout on your money. Investing in the stock market is simply just that and finding stocks that would pay divends as high as the deeds do isn't going to happen. Yes your deeds resale value may fluctuate but your still guaranteed some sort of payout daily/weekly as long as the game stays up and running. You said it yourself that index 100 fund dropped 20% so you would've lost 20% of your money invested and there is never a guarantee or time frame for if that could turn around. Cool thing about deeds is even if you lose money on your deeds resale value there is a very high possibility that you can make it up with the payouts. Just may take some time. I think people need to have some faith here this game has survived for a long time. It's had its ups and downs but it isn't going anywhere.
 
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One other quick point to make for all the naysayers and negative people. If you don't feel confident investing in this game then honestly why play? You aren't truly happy in Entropia Universe and maybe it's time to truly rethink why you continue to play. This game needs a fun energetic player base not all these negative naysayers I constantly see roaming PCF. Nobody is forcing you to login and MA doesn't owe any of us anything. I own 3600 deeds and if I lost it tomorrow I wouldn't blame MA for it. I took the risk and I knew as soon as I made the deposit that there is a chance I may never see the money again. I just get tired of seeing all the bs on here. Move on already if this game sucks so much.
 
m0rr0w2 said:
I have to disagree with your views here to be honest. Buying deeds in EU basically guarantees you some sort of payout on your money. Investing in the stock market is simply just that and finding stocks that would pay divends as high as the deeds do isn't going to happen. Yes your deeds resale value may fluctuate but your still guaranteed some sort of payout daily/weekly as long as the game stays up and running. You said it yourself that index 100 fund dropped 20% so you would've lost 20% of your money invested and there is never a guarantee or time frame for if that could turn around. Cool thing about deeds is even if you lose money on your deeds resale value there is a very high possibility that you can make it up with the payouts. Just may take some time. I think people need to have some faith here this game has survived for a long time. It's had its ups and downs but it isn't going anywhere.
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My point exactly. 5% ROI is emmense, it is a huge flow of money. It is enough that if that existed IRL and was as low risk as Entropia is, no one would work again that has any decent money.

There simply isn't a stock in real world that will pay 5% ROI, and be basically guaranteed to not drop below 5 each (what you paid for it).
 
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Venture Bros said:
My point exactly. 5% ROI is emmense, it is a huge flow of money. It is enough that if that existed IRL and was as low risk as Entropia is, no one would work again that has any decent money.

There simply isn't a stock in real world that will pay 5% ROI, and be basically guaranteed to not drop below 5 each (what you paid for it).
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What it comes down too is people are always going to find something to complain about. Returns are bad, not enough markup, deed payouts were low. Yes markup isn't what it used to be but there also weren't deeds in the past either. Now you can invest, sit on your ass and earn ped which I consider my markup on whatever profession I am partaking in. I think MA made the deeds system to help players offset the costs of playing the game. Instead of buying that expensive UL gear. Invest the money in deeds and use L gear. That's just my 2 cents.
 
Venture Bros said:
My point exactly. 5% ROI is emmense, it is a huge flow of money. It is enough that if that existed IRL and was as low risk as Entropia is, no one would work again that has any decent money.

There simply isn't a stock in real world that will pay 5% ROI, and be basically guaranteed to not drop below 5 each (what you paid for it).
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Dude... you a crazy. How on earth can you call this "risk free"? No, it absolutely not "Risk free". I know stocks that pays more than 5% dividend that have less risk than this. People from Sweden, and some other Nordic countries, probably know the bank "Nordea". If I would bet on which company will be left standing 10 years from now, I would bet on Nordea, not MA. Right now you will get a dividend of 7% if you buy stocks in that bank, and that to a risk that are less than buying AUDs.

I will point out, I don't necessary mean that buying AUDs will be a bad thing, it can give a nice profit if the payout increase. So if you really think the payout will increase and reach a stable higher level, sure buy them. But using a 5% ROI to do a valuation is just too low.
 
Dude, you cant only look at dividend when trying to figure out the economic trend of a item. Looking at what a item is worth right now in a vaccum isent a useful exercise.

Who will buy them?
Why will they buy them?
What market cap are we looking at?
Can the market handle that cap?
Is the price driven by speculation or long term holders?
How likely is growth in that particular area?
Who is selling deeds at the moment and why?
What price would a beginner be willing to pay to get on the deed ladder?
Is Arkadia growing or stagnant?
Whats the general perception of Arkadia and UG?

The average player want to play the game and thats the primary motivation behind buying the deeds, the money most people deposit, although they would get pissed if they lost it, is money most consider already gone for them, thats why its described as risk free to most people. Not because nordea has a more stable cashflow and can pay more but because the money is considered already burned for entertainment.

If we on a pure math basis took a look at the deeds then yes we are looking at 10-20years before the deeds are fully paid off and in contrast there are much better investment(even within Entropia if your willing to work hard), thats not a secret no one is aware of, but that fact alone will not drive people away or towards AUDs. Its much more crucial to most players to see a actual return on what they put into it.

So in closing: yes dividends is important but its not nearly enough information to find out what kind of market trend we will have for AUDs in the 1-2year term.

- Jonas
 
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melander said:
Dude, you cant only look at dividend when trying to figure out the economic trend of a item. Looking at what a item is worth right now in a vaccum isent a useful exercise unless you plan on buying them today and selling them within a few days or hours.

Who will buy them?
Why will they buy them?
What market cap are we looking at?
Can the market handle that cap?
Is the price driven by speculation or long term holders?
How likely is growth in that particular area?
Who is selling deeds at the moment and why?
What price would a beginner be willing to pay to get on the deed ladder?
Is Arkadia growing or stagnant?
Whats the general perception of Arkadia and UG?

The average player want to play the game and thats the primary motivation behind buying the deeds, the money most people deposit, although they would get pissed if they lost it, is money most consider already gone for them, thats why its described as risk free to most people. Not because nordea has a more stable cashflow and can pay more but because the money is considered already burned for entertainment.

If we on a pure math basis took a look at the deeds then yes we are looking at 7 - 10 years before the deeds are fully paid off and in contrast there are much better investment(even within Entropia if your willing to work hard), thats not a secret no one is aware of, but that fact alone will not drive people away or towards AUDs. Its much more crucial to most players to see a actual return on what they put into it.

So in closing: yes dividends is important but its not nearly enough information to find out what kind of market trend we will have for AUDs in the 1-2year term.

- Jonas
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Corrected that for you :)
 
melander said:
Dude, you cant only look at dividend when trying to figure out the economic trend of a item. Looking at what a item is worth right now in a vaccum isent a useful exercise.


So in closing: yes dividends is important but its not nearly enough information to find out what kind of market trend we will have for AUDs in the 1-2year term.

- Jonas
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Yes I know all this, but I'm talking about the low ROI of 5% that some thinks is "good enough" because the "deeds are risk free". I'm arguing that 5% is too low. The argument is which yearly long-term return of the investment should we have compared to the risk we take. After knowing that we can take the next step and talk about the short and long term trend of the price.

1. You decide the ROI you want on the investment
2. Make a guess of the future cash-flow. And this means guessing how many players will spend money in the underground. Will it increase? and in that case how much? Will it decrease?`Will the game still me online in ten years? The ROI will not matter if the game is not up on running in ten years.

When you know 1+2 you can make a valuation. But of coerce as you say, if we are talking about the original question, will the price go up or down? In the short-term it's a bit more random depending on variation in the demand/supply. In the long-run it's the fundamental things like cash-flow, the ROI demand and the future of the game that will decide how the price will move.
 
Venture Bros said:
Except it's not 5%.
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I did not say it was, I was responding to your post, on some other, that said "5%" was fantastic ROI. I just say it's not "fantastic" or even good.
 
billairboy said:
I did not say it was, I was responding to your post, on some other, that said "5%" was fantastic ROI. I just say it's not "fantastic" or even good.
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5% is fantastic, show me indexes and shares that pay that much interest for 5 USD.
 
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I will keep collecting my 2-3 pec / day payouts while you naysayers keep living in denial :)

Let's see if CLD come even close this week.
 
Venture Bros said:
5% is fantastic, show me indexes and shares that pay that much interest for 5 USD.
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Sure. One stock in Swedish phone-company "Telia" is priced around 40 SEK right now, that is a bit less than 5 USD. They will this spring give a dividend of 3sek, next year probably at least 2 sek. That means 3/40 around 7% this year and at least 5% next year.
 
m0rr0w2 said:
I will keep collecting my 2-3 pec / day payouts while you naysayers keep living in denial :)

Let's see if CLD come even close this week.
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lets see what cld :D pay :)
 
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James Francis said:
lets see what cld :D pay :)
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so the last 7 days AUD paid 16 pec / deed. If we take the weekly MU of CLD which is 1670 ped and the weekly MU of AUD which is 67 ped and divide them then we get 25 AUD / 1 CLD. We then multiply to 16 pec * 25 = 4 ped. So CLD need to have a payout of at least 4 ped / deed this week to be able to compete with AUD at current prices. I think with that Feffoid event there is a possibility we may see it.

The ROI for AUD this week at current price is right around 12.5%. Not a bad investment in my opinion.
 
This is just my personal opinion but...whenever I read or see the word "investment" in the context of this "game" called "Entropia Universe"...I can't help feeling - "its a recipe for disaster in the making".

If people were to have been using "not a bad purchase" or something like that instead, then it most probably wouldn't have irk me as much...perhaps.

As for why a "recipe for disaster in the making"?

Well...because those kind of sentences gives off a flair (to me) that if something goes south, they would "most likely" be the exact same persons whom might be coming forth...shouting in the forum...that they've just lost tons of money...because of MA...failing to recognize that its also partly due to a bad decision...that they've made entirely on their own.

And if they already understood the inherent risks involved...then everything's peachy. Fine...just fine. :laugh:

Note: “Past performance does not guarantee future results.”
 
m0rr0w2 said:
so the last 7 days AUD paid 16 pec / deed. If we take the weekly MU of CLD which is 1670 ped and the weekly MU of AUD which is 67 ped and divide them then we get 25 AUD / 1 CLD. We then multiply to 16 pec * 25 = 4 ped. So CLD need to have a payout of at least 4 ped / deed this week to be able to compete with AUD at current prices. I think with that Feffoid event there is a possibility we may see it.

The ROI for AUD this week at current price is right around 12.5%. Not a bad investment in my opinion.
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first of all roi for any deed depends on you paid for the deed... assuming you acquired your deeds at 50 ped each.. the roi for the past few weeks has been at an average of 20%

second you stated that aud paid out 16 pec a deed... that has never been true in the history of aud's.... obviously you are miscalculating
 
aVaLON_52 said:
second you stated that aud paid out 16 pec a deed... that has never been true in the history of aud's.... obviously you are miscalculating
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His maths are correct, you are reading it wrong. he says 16 pec per week, not per day.
 
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aVaLON_52 said:
first of all roi for any deed depends on you paid for the deed... assuming you acquired your deeds at 50 ped each.. the roi for the past few weeks has been at an average of 20%

second you stated that aud paid out 16 pec a deed... that has never been true in the history of aud's.... obviously you are miscalculating
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I apologize I guess I shouldn't have assumed that people would know that I was calculating ROI based strictly on what the current weekly MU prices were on CLD and AUD. I thought this would give a good comparison for potential buyers. I bought my 3600 @ 50ped each so I obviously know my ROI would be much different.
 
m0rr0w2 said:
I apologize I guess I shouldn't have assumed that people would know that I was calculating ROI based strictly on what the current weekly MU prices were on CLD and AUD. I thought this would give a good comparison for potential buyers. I bought my 3600 @ 50ped each so I obviously know my ROI would be much different.
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Just looking at the last week average is a to short time-period, at least we should look at the last two-three month. In the first half of December it was more like 1pec/day for AUD.
 
billairboy said:
Just looking at the last week average is a to short time-period, at least we should look at the last two-three month. In the first half of December it was more like 1pec/day for AUD.
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BillyBob and it seems you are just looking at the AUD payout not really knowing what is going on over on Arkadia as of this point and why the payouts have changed in the last month or so. Key word: VU.
 
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billairboy said:
Just looking at the last week average is a to short time-period, at least we should look at the last two-three month. In the first half of December it was more like 1pec/day for AUD.
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Why bother honestly? When it comes to these deeds I don't believe a reflection of the past will show us anything about the future. We could go back to when CLD first came out and payouts were huge weekly but that isn't ever going to happen again unless something drastically were to improve on Calypso. AUD payouts have been consistent for 5-6 weeks now because Arkadia implemented drastic improvements in the underground. I have to be honest I put way more trust in Team Arkadia than I do in the team running Caly. Only the future will tell however I am only worried about the present and the day's going forward and as of right now the AUD looks like a more solid investment than the CLD. Let's see how the CLD payout looks later and we can go from there. It may be huge.
 
m0rr0w2 said:
Arkadia implemented drastic improvements in the underground. .
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What are these drastic improvements? I'm looking at the recent updates on Arkadia forum and I don't see them. Are you referring to smuggler missions?

Sorry I'm an Arkadia noob :dunce:
 
ZPF said:
What are these drastic improvements? I'm looking at the recent updates on Arkadia forum and I don't see them. Are you referring to smuggler missions?

Sorry I'm an Arkadia noob :dunce:
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Yes and some other new instances opened up as well.
 
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