Teleporter Fees on the way, says President of the Virtual Reality...

If this charge is introduced I will simply fly or use some other transport. On the plus side as a miner the price of oil should go up a bit with all the extra fuel being used.

We forgot about Valkyrie T1

This idea may look good on paper, but not in reality.

Most people do not want this but, this is not a democratic game..The only thing to do, don't teleport with the game teleporters so as to not make it profitable..

the first horn needs to go suck his own horn

What I think a good compromise situation would be:
- Have a certain number of teleporters forming a basic network (for example, on Arkadia, my home planet) that could be formed by: celeste quarry, celeste harbour, sanctuary cove, all firebases and main arkadia UG - these teleporters could stay free and would let any player travel to the important points on the planet hassle free;
- Also have the teleporters from LAs free (since LA owners did paid for them and is not fair to confiscate them);
- I think we can all agree that all the other teleporters become a really commodity now and could be charged;
- Any further added teleporters would also be charged;
- To avoid confusion, they should use totally different models.

This way:
- impact on players will be minimal;
- MA will still make some money from deed selling (although they should probably scale down the amount);
- MA will still make some money from TP uses;
- There will still be some money for conscript jobs (not so many jobs, but still);
- As the game will grow (if) and new areas and teleporters would be added said income for both MA and jobs would increase.

Robin said:

Most people do not want this but, this is not a democratic game..The only thing to do, don't teleport with the game teleporters so as to not make it profitable..

Click to expand...

Or don't visit Rocktropia ever again. Vote with the wallet.

DoA said:

What I think a good compromise situation would be:
- Have a certain number of teleporters forming a basic network (for example, on Arkadia, my home planet) that could be formed by: celeste quarry, celeste harbour, sanctuary cove, all firebases and main arkadia UG - these teleporters could stay free and would let any player travel to the important points on the planet hassle free;
- Also have the teleporters from LAs free (since LA owners did paid for them and is not fair to confiscate them);
- I think we can all agree that all the other teleporters become a really commodity now and could be charged;
- Any further added teleporters would also be charged;
- To avoid confusion, they should use totally different models.

This way:
- impact on players will be minimal;
- MA will still make some money from deed selling (although they should probably scale down the amount);
- MA will still make some money from TP uses;
- There will still be some money for conscript jobs (not so many jobs, but still);
- As the game will grow (if) and new areas and teleporters would be added said income for both MA and jobs would increase.

Click to expand...

Still smells like shit to me.. Scrap the plan..

I wonder how many shop and LA owners would like a system were they could pay someone 10 -25 ped an hour to manage the land or run their shop...

Or a system for healers that automatically bills a hunter for an agreed hourly fee of fapping.

I would really like to see a system were we can trade written contracts for various activities and that places peds in a sort of stasis between the contractor and contractee. For example I could quickly create a contract that says this person will fap me for a period of 2 hours at 10 ped an hour and both parties could agree the contract in a trade like manor (with the exchange of the contract paper) and at the same time 20 ped could be deducted from my ped card which goes into holding. A small legal fee could also be deduced for every contract made which goes into a legal fee pool.

After the two hours I get the option to agree that the contract has been fulfilled (essentially signing the contract off) at which point the peds are transferred. If I feel the contract has not been fulfilled I can refuse payment or suggest a reduced fee. A "legal system" with a judge and jury etc could be established which are paid from the legal fee pool to investigate any contested contracts (with the aid of MA). It wouldn't be hard to prove that someone fapped me for an hour or so looking at chat logs and the locations of the two avatars. If the judge deems that I incorrectly failed to pay then I could be fined and the fapper rewarded. Some sort of reputation system could also be developed like a credit score which suggests how likely it is that someone will keep good on their contract (this would work for both parties - i.e. how likely is this person to actually fap me for 2 hours and vice versa how likely am I to pay that fapper if indeed he/she faps me).

This would be a much more dynamic job system imo.

If people do jobs they should be conducting useful work to the people who are paying them...

Ummmm, i smell the oil price gonna go up just like in real ^^

Oil price and tp chip usages. Good boost for noobs and nice wars on oil rig I bet, or mining ...

DoA said:

What I think a good compromise situation would be:
- Have a certain number of teleporters forming a basic network (for example, on Arkadia, my home planet) that could be formed by: celeste quarry, celeste harbour, sanctuary cove, all firebases and main arkadia UG - these teleporters could stay free and would let any player travel to the important points on the planet hassle free;
- Also have the teleporters from LAs free (since LA owners did paid for them and is not fair to confiscate them);
- I think we can all agree that all the other teleporters become a really commodity now and could be charged;
- Any further added teleporters would also be charged;
- To avoid confusion, they should use totally different models.

This way:
- impact on players will be minimal;
- MA will still make some money from deed selling (although they should probably scale down the amount);
- MA will still make some money from TP uses;
- There will still be some money for conscript jobs (not so many jobs, but still);
- As the game will grow (if) and new areas and teleporters would be added said income for both MA and jobs would increase.

Click to expand...

Would you be willing to pay $15.00usd a month subscription to play this game? Yes you have claimed that you have played subscription based RCE games in the past without any issue. The question as well has to be asked why did you leave them?

OZtwo said:

Would you be willing to pay $15.00usd a month subscription to play this game? Yes you have claimed that you have played subscription based RCE games in the past without any issue. The question as well has to be asked why did you leave them?

Click to expand...

A subscription is a tax to login, there is no way you can adapt to it; you can't compare it with a tax for using a facility/commodity/luxury in game, which you can opt to simply not use and adapt (walk, run, fly, etc); you keep trying to make some points that simply make no sense.

Further more, I fail to see how my personal decisions are important here, but, anyway, I'll answer you.

I played sandbox games (also almost RCE) without any fast travel... travelling from your deed to the hunting grounds took 5 to 15 minutes (with horse / sail, not walking), travelling from one side to another side of the server took 30 minutes to 4 hours depending of server size (again using horse / sail, not walking), sailing from eastern most to western most servers (something like flying from two most distant planets in EU) took between 18 and 24 hours (depending on wind speed). Still people were playing and adapting and in many ways it was even cooler (buying locally actually made sense).

I played sandbox games with a subscription system (the game I talked in previous paragraph fits here too); it wasn't $15 per month, but about $10 (8 euros) and I didn't had only one avatar, but two (there alts were not only allowed or encouraged, but even mandatory - since you almost needed both a normal avatar and a priest); further more, on top of the subscription fee, I also had to pay my deed maintenance (something like apartment rent system) which in my case was about another $5 (4 euros), so yeah, I was paying about $25 per month in "subscription" fees. How is this possible when my whole "gaming budget" was lower than that? Simple, I was making profit in game, "withdraw" and use said money to pay the subscription fee, so most of the time I didn't even had to use any of my own money. Actually, if I think at it, I think I only invested from my own money $32 (two months of premium for each of the avatars), everything else was paid with profit from game itself; by the time I quit, I managed to sell my avatar, deeds and assets with a few hundred dollars, so a rather nice profit from a game where I also had tons of fun (just like I have now tons of fun in EU too) - my glasses, my phone, my bike as well as my initial EU investment were all paid with profits from said game.

Why I quit that game? The "trigger" was a fight I had with the Head GM and generally don't getting along with the "community" that was pretty much pi**ed that, while they were keep loosing money, I was making profit. But, excluding the trigger, the reason that brought me at the point where I could be triggered to quit was the fact that, no matter how cool a game, tv series or activity is, you eventually get bored of it and you want a change.

Happy with the answer?

DoA said:

This way:
- impact on players will be minimal;

Click to expand...

What you mean is, the impact on you personally will be minimal. This may also be the case for some of the other people who play EU on a very low level or in a mainly social context.

You do not understand the impact it would have on the people who play actively, i.e. the people who generate the income for MA. Please stop pretending that you do.

Oleg said:

What you mean is, the impact on you personally will be minimal. This may also be the case for some of the other people who play EU on a very low level or in a mainly social context.

You do not understand the impact it would have on the people who play actively, i.e. the people who generate the income for MA. Please stop pretending that you do.

Click to expand...

I followed all threads on this subject with great interest and there were a few recurring ideas that came over and over again:

- new players would be most affected ones (since 1 PED is a lot for a new player) and instead of increasing retention, this will decrease retention --- my idea would solve this; new players would still be able to travel to all essential places, they don't really need all others and since they wouldn't even know that all were at some point free, they would sure not bother the others

- flying from one side of the map to the other is not viable, so people will practically be forced to teleport (and pay money), since flying for one hour straight is not something realistic --- my idea would solve this; one could just teleport to the closest free teleporter to their area then get where they need by vehicle in 5-10 minutes or less

- it wouldn't be fair for land area owners that paid for their TPs --- my idea would solve this; their teleporters will stay free to use, so, if anything, they may attract more hunters/miners, just because of easy/free transportation

Sure, the big players, hunting/mining and traveling a lot would still be affected, but, then, again, if you afford to spend 100 or 1000 PED per hour hunting or mining, then 1 PED teleporting fee (which would be 1% or 0.1% extra cost for you) won't make or break your game.

And yeah, it will still be an inconvenience, but in this case I think the pros (bringing MA some extra income to ensure sustainability and created jobs for new players, hence increasing retention) would outweight the cons.

And yeah, maybe I'm wrong, but I'm as entitled to saying my point of view as anyone else.

DoA said:

A subscription is a tax to login, there is no way you can adapt to it; you can't compare it with a tax for using a facility/commodity/luxury in game, which you can opt to simply not use and adapt (walk, run, fly, etc); you keep trying to make some points that simply make no sense.

Further more, I fail to see how my personal decisions are important here, but, anyway, I'll answer you.

I played sandbox games (also almost RCE) without any fast travel... travelling from your deed to the hunting grounds took 5 to 15 minutes (with horse / sail, not walking), travelling from one side to another side of the server took 30 minutes to 4 hours depending of server size (again using horse / sail, not walking), sailing from eastern most to western most servers (something like flying from two most distant planets in EU) took between 18 and 24 hours (depending on wind speed). Still people were playing and adapting and in many ways it was even cooler (buying locally actually made sense).

I played sandbox games with a subscription system (the game I talked in previous paragraph fits here too); it wasn't $15 per month, but about $10 (8 euros) and I didn't had only one avatar, but two (there alts were not only allowed or encouraged, but even mandatory - since you almost needed both a normal avatar and a priest); further more, on top of the subscription fee, I also had to pay my deed maintenance (something like apartment rent system) which in my case was about another $5 (4 euros), so yeah, I was paying about $25 per month in "subscription" fees. How is this possible when my whole "gaming budget" was lower than that? Simple, I was making profit in game, "withdraw" and use said money to pay the subscription fee, so most of the time I didn't even had to use any of my own money. Actually, if I think at it, I think I only invested from my own money $32 (two months of premium for each of the avatars), everything else was paid with profit from game itself; by the time I quit, I managed to sell my avatar, deeds and assets with a few hundred dollars, so a rather nice profit from a game where I also had tons of fun (just like I have now tons of fun in EU too) - my glasses, my phone, my bike as well as my initial EU investment were all paid with profits from said game.

Why I quit that game? The "trigger" was a fight I had with the Head GM and generally don't getting along with the "community" that was pretty much pi**ed that, while they were keep loosing money, I was making profit. But, excluding the trigger, the reason that brought me at the point where I could be triggered to quit was the fact that, no matter how cool a game, tv series or activity is, you eventually get bored of it and you want a change.

Happy with the answer?

Click to expand...

I'm a bit tired of seeing your arguments constantly so I will address them.

Lets begin. I take a stance against the teleporter fees. While I understand that there is an argument for them, it is almost purely circumstantial. Such a massive change could possibly have positive effects, though it could also have severe negative effects (which I find likely). As such, I feel that the argumrnt for teleporters is relatively weak and I will explain why.

To address your statement that teleporters are a commodity/luxury, I disagree. Teleporters are a core function of the game. They have been around for years. It is not a commodity (I suggest you buy a dictionary). You used three words with completely different meanings to describe teleporters. Make up your mind please and use appropriate words Ms. Wikipedia.

Next, all of the issues with the update. Sure, it can provide jobs and profitable opportunities for players. However, there are so many things wrong with this. First off, a mod fap owner makes about 1/3 or 1/4 neverdie plans to pay these tp coin crafters, to put things into perspective. This money is generated buy PAYING PLAYERS. I, as a depositor, hold a vested interest in not paying $1 daily (as I average probably 10 teleports ler day) to a bunch of non-depositors. The argument is that this would boost markup on loot. Possible, but there is so much room for error. Simply put, a lot of players will be aggravated by this update and likely quit; a loss of the playerbase would mean that this fee would most likely fail as there would be too few players to sustain it. This idea requires a playerbase to sustain it and even the most minor changes in the number of teleport users will impact markup of loot.

This is a delicate game. You simply cannot experiment with such an established economy as it may severely damage it. I've already described what could go wrong. Not only that, but this game is hard enough for new players. The money is supposed to fund a marketing plan to bring new players, yet there will be teleport fees to make this game even more of a turn off.

The idea isn't a bad one, but it needs to be better thought out. I wouldn't mind paying for teleports if this is carefully and intelligently designed and executed. On the contrary, I do not place any faith in Neverdie's ability to execute something like this. Could the idea be better thought out to the extent that it positively impacts all three professions, then I might consider it.

As it stands though, this does not help to improve the game. The fact is that profit comes from players. If you make profit off of hunting markup, someone will be losing money for that in the end, it's simple. Therefore, we need something to promote depositing, not something to anger depositors to quit and leave a lot of profit hungry people.

I've stated my argument and have given it a good amount of support. In all, this update favors non-depositors and lacks the thought that the idea needs. This isn't something to be executed and displayed through a little pamphlet, it needs seep thought on how to promote depositinf, bring new players, raise markup and opportunities, and still retain a playerbase. I think it has potential, but as it stands I believe it will likely fail.

I feel that you, DOA, have a biased argument and a vested interest in teleporter fees. Either way, I know you are bullheaded and I expect you to ignore most of my argument in order to support your own. GL.

DoA said:

I followed all threads on this subject with great interest and there were a few recurring ideas that came over and over again:

- new players would be most affected ones (since 1 PED is a lot for a new player) and instead of increasing retention, this will decrease retention --- my idea would solve this; new players would still be able to travel to all essential places, they don't really need all others and since they wouldn't even know that all were at some point free, they would sure not bother the others

- flying from one side of the map to the other is not viable, so people will practically be forced to teleport (and pay money), since flying for one hour straight is not something realistic --- my idea would solve this; one could just teleport to the closest free teleporter to their area then get where they need by vehicle in 5-10 minutes or less

- it wouldn't be fair for land area owners that paid for their TPs --- my idea would solve this; their teleporters will stay free to use, so, if anything, they may attract more hunters/miners, just because of easy/free transportation

Sure, the big players, hunting/mining and traveling a lot would still be affected, but, then, again, if you afford to spend 100 or 1000 PED per hour hunting or mining, then 1 PED teleporting fee (which would be 1% or 0.1% extra cost for you) won't make or break your game.

And yeah, it will still be an inconvenience, but in this case I think the pros (bringing MA some extra income to ensure sustainability and created jobs for new players, hence increasing retention) would outweight the cons.

And yeah, maybe I'm wrong, but I'm as entitled to saying my point of view as anyone else.

Click to expand...

Your idea is less shit than the other idea...its still really shit though.

we need NEW depositing players...simple as.

DoA said:

And yeah, maybe I'm wrong, but I'm as entitled to saying my point of view as anyone else.

Click to expand...

No-one, as far as I've seen, has said that you are not entitled to an opinion. Suggesting otherwise is no way to win your argument.

DoA said:

- it wouldn't be fair for land area owners that paid for their TPs --- my idea would solve this; their teleporters will stay free to use, so, if anything, they may attract more hunters/miners, just because of easy/free transportation

...

And yeah, maybe I'm wrong, but I'm as entitled to saying my point of view as anyone else.

Click to expand...

I agree with what you said about Land Areas completely. That might actually be a pro I hadn't considered. Regardless, that basically pushes hunters and miners to go on LAs, which I disagree with.

Also, nobody said you werent entitled to an opinion, a lot of us just disagree with it.

DoA said:

Happy with the answer?

Click to expand...

Yes, but mostly from the private PM you just sent me claiming that you do not have the money so you can't use the TP fee yet you say you can use the system to get a job. Sorry but a lot of people will not like that since you are saying more or less that you are feeding off the 'rich' (as you have said). You are spending your time on the corner begging for money. Plan and simple.

So my question to you was would you be willing to pay and your answer was: NO I do not have the money.

That is again is the issue. WE DO NOT HAVE THE MONEY TO SPEND AS WELL ON THIS NEW FEE

But yes I know you will go on and on and on about how poor you are and how you need to feed of us. My bet is that this is why you love the game so much. Well sorry I really think MA needs to fix this. I really think MA needs to remove sweating. I really think MA needs to remove the oil rigs. It is you that is making me think this. It is you that I'm saying that if you think this way then sorry, this game must be for people who only deposit and if you do not deposit you are not welcome in game.

1. ND sucks
2. MA dont try to suck only money out of us but give us a reason to hunt or mine (= markup = let us loot stuff that other players need)

microdot said:

Your idea is less shit than the other idea...its still really shit though.

we need NEW depositing players...simple as.

Click to expand...

Zenzile said:

As it stands though, this does not help to improve the game. The fact is that profit comes from players. If you make profit off of hunting markup, someone will be losing money for that in the end, it's simple.

Click to expand...

And that's personally fine for you to disagree with me (the only not nice part was the one with sending me to the dictionary; you know, we're not all native English speakers).

And I actually do agree with what you're saying that the game needs more depositing players.

But reality is that there is very low incentive at this moment for someone that hears about EU for the first time today to join the game and become a depositor as we all wish.

Look at what almost any F2P game in the world does... they all (starting from the very simple mobile phone games to the most complex MMOs) follow a simple principle:

1) attract the players (with a solid, well targeted, marketing campaign)
2) hook the player (allow him to have fun and play for free for weeks)
3) once hooked (committed to the game, advanced enough, got to love it) convert it to a "depositor"

Problem with EU is that it lacks the second step (the hooking the player part) - and no, expecting someone to get hooked to the game via sweating (which gives $0.1/hour) is almost as unrealistic as expecting someone to deposit from day one. That's probably the main reason why we have horrible retention rates. And with less players joining the game (and sticking around long enough to become depositors) than leaving the game, is clear that EU is on a (shorter or longer) road to bankruptcy.

Neverdie is definitely completely delusional (or even a blunt liar) with his numbers, but please for a moment forget about the numbers and focus on the principle... what he attempts to with all these jobs thing is to improve the first step and to create the second step in the process I outlined before.

1) It could make a great marketing campaign "Don't pay $15 for subscription fee; make $15 instead!"
2) By giving people 150 PED per month (15 hours of conscript work * 10 PED / hour) they would be able to hunt, mine, travel and get hooked to the game.
3) Once they'll be hooked to the game - start leveling up, getting some gear, etc, they'll realize that those free 150 PED per month won't get them far enough, and (hopefully) many will start depositing.

Now that is something I really think that could work.

Of course, the money would have to come from somewhere. MA could simply silently dial the loot buttons down (and make everyone get 1-2% less, just enough that we can't say for sure we were nerfed) and use said money for that. I think that would be wrong. Instead they proposed a transparent system which everyone could choose to not use (and fly/run instead). I think that is right. And yeah, I'm sure that they would be open for discussion to find the best solution to achieve that, while minimize the negative effect on the players; and that was the direction of my proposal.

On the other hand, don't think the subscription for these deeds as a subscription for EU public transport system, but maybe as a subscription for the saving / survival of EU. We'll have their annual financial report soon and that may be more obvious by then time.

OZtwo said:

Yes, but mostly from the private PM you just sent me claiming that you do not have the money so you can't use the TP fee yet you say you can use the system to get a job. Sorry but a lot of people will not like that since you are saying more or less that you are feeding off the 'rich' (as you have said). You are spending your time on the corner begging for money. Plan and simple.

So my question to you was would you be willing to pay and your answer was: NO I do not have the money.

That is again is the issue. WE DO NOT HAVE THE MONEY TO SPEND AS WELL ON THIS NEW FEE

But yes I know you will go on and on and on about how poor you are and how you need to feed of us. My bet is that this is why you love the game so much. Well sorry I really think MA needs to fix this. I really think MA needs to remove sweating. I really think MA needs to remove the oil rigs. It is you that is making me think this. It is you that I'm saying that if you think this way then sorry, this game must be for people who only deposit and if you do not deposit you are not welcome in game.

Click to expand...

LIES!

1) I didn't cried that I'm poor and I didn't begged for anything; heck, I didn't even proposed this, but just tagged along when I saw the idea.

2) My PM was simple "You have answer to your forum message" - I didn't begged you for anything or something like that; it was you that asked me if I will use the TP and I ANSWERED TO YOUR QUESTION and said no, I won't, and I'm cheap (not poor) enough that I won't even use vehicles, but I'll just run from point A to point B. Is an option everyone has (take the TP and pay, use a vehicle, run).

3) Yes, I try to minimize my costs as much as possible (I don't even heal, but just wait for regen); is one of the "perks" of being only 16 - you are billionaire in time.

4) Yes, one of the main reasons I like the new system is that it will allow me to make more money per hour than sweating (10 times more via the conscript job).

5) Yes, I intend to buy my next computer with money earned in EU.

6) I really don't think that is wrong; the idea that you can play for free and/or profit was always (one of) the main attraction points towards the game; if anything I think that any such shared "success story" is free advertising for the game.

7) If MA would remove me the option to profit from game, I would hold no grudge towards them, withdraw what ever money I would have at that time and move towards a different game, without crying, whining or anything like that.

8) Despite all that, I'm not a "freeloader" as you say... I deposited my fair share of money (which probably for me was a bigger effort than your deposits are for you), is just that instead of wanting to spend them, I want to multiply them (and yeah, far now I'm in profit).



You can also check my hunting log here https://drive.google.com/open?id=1vjm0z2sCQ8cEsI9WRzXFa-qCpj1atSYQvL3ZM2bjsb4 - 30.000+ mobs hunted, and I'm at 99% TT return rates, and clear profit counting things like MU or mission rewards, just because I hunted smart and eco.

Now if you want me out of game, you also want of game all players that deposit hoping that they will make profit and withdraw more? Or is just me, because I actually manage to stick with a plan and be on green, not on red?

PS: If you still think that things are different than what I said and you want, I publicly allow you to post here the whole discussion (or any other discussion we ever had in private); the only requirement is if you publish it, to do it integral, not only partially to make it look like you are right.

DoA said:

A subscription is a tax to login, there is no way you can adapt to it; you can't compare it with a tax for using a facility/commodity/luxury in game, which you can opt to simply not use and adapt (walk, run, fly, etc); you keep trying to make some points that simply make no sense.

Click to expand...

I have played subscription based games and guess what, quit all of them.
Some of them made me money at the end, by selling my account.

Subscription is the cost to play.
Adding a fee in RCE is increasing cost to play.

Subscription based games, the subscription is normally the only cost to play, if MA manages to bring down cost to play to 15$ a month on high end hunting or crafting, then and only then I may consider accepting a TP fee.

I do FAP jobs with Imp FAP regularly, my charge is 50 PED / hour and my customers pay that without discussion.
One mob where hunters like hire a FAPer like me is Dasp at FOMA.

During a hunt it happens that the hunter gets killed 10-20 times a hour, some even more often although they have a very good FAP in the back. They simply die from crits or ninja spawns.

Back to hunting there only way is using a TP --- 20 death on 1hr hunt on Dasp is additonal 40 PED, because if hunter die, FAPer die too.
Go there, hire a FAPer, hunt Dasp and then come back here and tell me you are willing to pay additonal TP fee on such a hunt!
If MA really make the TP fee 1 PED / use, FOMA and CP hunting is instantly dead ! The owners of this stations will be very happy with that.
It would also impact mining turnover at FOMA, as a lot FOMA miners do suicide drops in the domes with big mobs. No way they will do it, when TP cost additional 1 PED each time they die.

Thats the extreme negatives of this TP fee.

Now lets get down planetside:
There is 3 daily missions from terminal, anther 3 daily from mission brokers.
Doing all 6 daily hunt missions, means 6 different locations. Flying 30 min between each of it -- LOL 3 hours wasted for nothing, without any turnover for MA. Or using a TP, 6 PED a day x 30 days = 180 PED TP fee or 18$ each month (additonal cost to play).

You have no clue how high end players act in EU. This high end players is the heavy depositors that make MA the money. Not the sweaters and freeloaders make MA money, its these crazy hunters I love so much who cycle several thousand PED every day, who pay for MAs bills.
You want this players to pay even more to create options for non-depositors to make PED (jobs) on their back.
Well if I would be a non-depositor I maybe would like that idea, but I am depositor aswell. My deposits don´t last long, I am broke very fast, when hunting or crafting at my level. I refuse to pay any additional fee, that just increase my cost to play.

Personally I use TP 10-15 times a day, when playing full time (what I can´t atm, due to a lot RL work), but when my actual RL project is finished, I am back to full time playing 8-10 hours a day, and then I would bleed a lot with TP fees.
I have customers I need to meet fast (use TP), have business partners I need to meet fast (use TP), I have disciples I need to meet fast (use TP), I have a shop that needs to be operated (use TP).
I generate a lot decay, directly and indirectly that makes MA a lot of money, every day. They don´t need me to pay more.
What MA needs is new players, that start to deposit at some point to enjoy the game to its full extend.

To get a better retention rate, the game has to be attractive to new players. TP fee, that needs 2hrs sweating to use TP once, is not very attractive

If MA would start to fix the bugs and balance the economy (crafting vs looted), then EU could get back some of its old charm and players like me, testing it for a while, would start to deposit and enjoy it, but as long MA changes everything that EU is reduced to a pure gambling game vs TT (no matter what proffession), retention rate will be very low.
If MA continues dropping more and more deeds that generate income out of game, to allow more and more people to play without deposit, we have a ponzi sheme, where new depositing players pay for the older no longer depositing players (what would be illegal in my country), and new players will learn that very fast and ragequit after a few days.
So please stop this damn deeds and stop this damn TP fee idea.
Get back to the roots of EU and make a game that is fun to play, even if it is the most expencive MMO on the world, it is charming and highly addictive (at least it was, when I started).

Has anyone considered the following?...

1000-2000 deeds at 1000 ped each. One deed per person, and deeds give you free teleport use and a small cut of teleporter profits.

This would give hardcore teleport users an opportunity to avoid fees.

Let's please take a look at my post from which discussion started and see if it solves (most of) your problems:

DoA said:

What I think a good compromise situation would be:
- Have a certain number of teleporters forming a basic network (for example, on Arkadia, my home planet) that could be formed by: celeste quarry, celeste harbour, sanctuary cove, all firebases and main arkadia UG - these teleporters could stay free and would let any player travel to the important points on the planet hassle free;
- Also have the teleporters from LAs free (since LA owners did paid for them and is not fair to confiscate them);
- I think we can all agree that all the other teleporters become a really commodity now and could be charged;
- Any further added teleporters would also be charged;
- To avoid confusion, they should use totally different models.

This way:
- impact on players will be minimal;
- MA will still make some money from deed selling (although they should probably scale down the amount);
- MA will still make some money from TP uses;
- There will still be some money for conscript jobs (not so many jobs, but still);
- As the game will grow (if) and new areas and teleporters would be added said income for both MA and jobs would increase.

Click to expand...

GoNi said:

I have played subscription based games and guess what, quit all of them.
Some of them made me money at the end, by selling my account.

Subscription is the cost to play.
Adding a fee in RCE is increasing cost to play.

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As said before, I played a RCE game that had both a subscription and in-game currency buying.

Anyway, that was not about subscription; that was OzTwo idea; I only talked about TP fee.

GoNi said:

One mob where hunters like hire a FAPer like me is Dasp at FOMA.

...

If MA really make the TP fee 1 PED / use, FOMA and CP hunting is instantly dead ! The owners of this stations will be very happy with that.

Click to expand...

DoA said:

- Also have the teleporters from LAs free (since LA owners did paid for them and is not fair to confiscate them);

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Since CP / FOMA / Monria were sold as they are, they are basically land areas, so using said teleporters would be free in my model - problem solved, yeah?

GoNi said:

Now lets get down planetside:
There is 3 daily missions from terminal, anther 3 daily from mission brokers.
Doing all 6 daily hunt missions, means 6 different locations. Flying 30 min between each of it -- LOL 3 hours wasted for nothing, without any turnover for MA. Or using a TP, 6 PED a day x 30 days = 180 PED TP fee or 18$ each month (additonal cost to play).

Click to expand...

DoA said:

- Have a certain number of teleporters forming a basic network (for example, on Arkadia, my home planet) that could be formed by: celeste quarry, celeste harbour, sanctuary cove, all firebases and main arkadia UG - these teleporters could stay free and would let any player travel to the important points on the planet hassle free;

Click to expand...

Someone could just use the basic teleporters network to get close to the area, then fly for five minutes (not 30) to their hunting spot; if even that sounds too much, then yeah, I think they can pay for it.

GoNi said:

You have no clue how high end players act in EU. This high end players is the heavy depositors that make MA the money. Not the sweaters and freeloaders make MA money, its these crazy hunters I love so much who cycle several thousand PED every day, who pay for MAs bills. You want this players to pay even more to create options for non-depositors to make PED (jobs) on their back. Well if I would be a non-depositor I maybe would like that idea, but I am depositor aswell. My deposits don´t last long, I am broke very fast, when hunting or crafting at my level. I refuse to pay any additional fee, that just increase my cost to play.

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Yeah, that's exactly the kind of players I would expect to value time more than money and still use the TP left and right; at their cycled volume, the extra cost would still probably be 1% or less, so is not like it will make or break their game. New players would benefit from that (quite a few of them), while small depositors (like your or me - because yeah, despite everyone calling me a freeloader, I make my monthly deposits too) could adapt.

GoNi said:

I have customers I need to meet fast (use TP), have business partners I need to meet fast (use TP), I have disciples I need to meet fast (use TP), I have a shop that needs to be operated (use TP).

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DoA said:

- Have a certain number of teleporters forming a basic network (for example, on Arkadia, my home planet) that could be formed by: celeste quarry, celeste harbour, sanctuary cove, all firebases and main arkadia UG - these teleporters could stay free and would let any player travel to the important points on the planet hassle free;

Click to expand...

Just meet at the basic network TPs from my model, which would be free.

GoNi said:

To get a better retention rate, the game has to be attractive to new players. TP fee, that needs 2hrs sweating to use TP once, is not very attractive

Click to expand...

DoA said:

- Have a certain number of teleporters forming a basic network (for example, on Arkadia, my home planet) that could be formed by: celeste quarry, celeste harbour, sanctuary cove, all firebases and main arkadia UG - these teleporters could stay free and would let any player travel to the important points on the planet hassle free;

Click to expand...

The new players would probably do just fine with the basic network and there will be a while 'till they'll need to use the other, more exotic TPs. They will also have the conscript jobs income. So higher retention rate.

Zenzile said:

Has anyone considered the following?...

1000-2000 deeds at 1000 ped each. One deed per person, and deeds give you free teleport use and a small cut of teleporter profits.

This would give hardcore teleport users an opportunity to avoid fees.

Click to expand...

Now that's an idea, even a good one I would say - a life time "subscription" on the public transportation system.

See, we can do better than just childishly embracing a big "NO! I DON'T WANT TO!" without trying to at least offer an alternative for the needed money to be raised.

DoA said:

1) It could make a great marketing campaign "Don't pay $15 for subscription fee; make $15 instead!"
2) By giving people 150 PED per month (15 hours of conscript work * 10 PED / hour) they would be able to hunt, mine, travel and get hooked to the game.

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LOL
I don´t want to pay that 150$ that someone else can play for free!
It lowers the value of my deposits, its money that I deposit that I can play at my level, not that others can play for free

DoA said:

3) Once they'll be hooked to the game - start leveling up, getting some gear, etc, they'll realize that those free 150 PED per month won't get them far enough, and (hopefully) many will start depositing.

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And why should they start depositing if they can earn 150 PED every month ?
I know people (non-depositors) with a lot of free time, that sweat 5-10 hours a day for 500 sweat an hour (0.90 PED/hr), those people are hooked but never have deposited a dime!
And this sums up: 5 hr a day x 30 days x 0.90 PED == 135 PED / month (sweaters reality!).
Thats what they get free to play.
Give them a job, that makes them 150 PED for 1h/day it will look like that:
150 PED + 4hr sweating == 150 + (4x0.90x30) == 258 PED / month (and still not depositing)

Now guess why I don´t want to pay for them!

DoA said:

Now that's an idea, even a good one I would say - a life time "subscription" on the public transportation system.

See, we can do better than just childishly embracing a big "NO! I DON'T WANT TO!" without trying to at least offer an alternative for the needed money to be raised.

Click to expand...

Would be enough 1-2 PEC per TP, as I said above. And another thing - why MA removed armor equipping fee (0.02 PED)? To reduce cost of play? Then why MA need to increase it now (for 1 PED per TP)?

Whole idea about paid TP is not idiotic IMO. Idiotic is the price per TP and calculation, based on this price

Zenzile said:

Has anyone considered the following?...

1000-2000 deeds at 1000 ped each. One deed per person, and deeds give you free teleport use and a small cut of teleporter profits.

This would give hardcore teleport users an opportunity to avoid fees.

Click to expand...

Well hope I am online when this deeds set up for sale, to be able to buy one befor sold out (within 1hr)

Gewitter said:

Would be enough 1-2 PEC per TP, as I said above. Whole idea about paid TP is not idiotic IMO. Idiotic is the price per TP and calculation, based on this price

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1-2 PEC would probably be too low to raise any significant amount of money.

1 PED is probably indeed too much and many people would avoid it.

But yeah, indeed probably a middle ground can be found? I think something like 10 pec, or 25 pec coupled with a base network of free teleporters as I suggested would be a good compromise. Again... I think is important to think at offering MA alternatives, not force them with a choice of "all or nothing".

GoNi said:

Well hope I am online when this deeds set up for sale, to be able to buy one befor sold out (within 1hr)

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They shouldn't be limited in number; something like one month from now on everyone who will want could buy a life-time "subscription" to the public transportation network for $100 from web-shop.

Alternatively, it may even be a free perk, everyone purchasing 50 deeds from web-shop gets the life-time personal "subscription" for free.