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Why Deeds of any kind does not have TT value?

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Geralt

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I often ask myself, how did MindArk convince players that 0 PED TT value item may be worth 100$? Have you ever been thinking why the TT value of deeds is zero?

MindArk lately is coming up with very dangerous ideas. Its effects are trurly impossible to foreseen. In worst case scenario, implementation of TP fee idea may make most players want to sell out and then leave the game. Soon, deed owners may live in virtual world, where there is nobody left who would be keen to pay any price for any deed.

Do you feel what I try to express? Deeds have zero value. And soon nobody may care that you paid 100$ for it, or bought it in-game for 170$ because there will be nobody left in game. What do you expect MA to do in such situation? Buy it back from you at market price? No, they will simply give you back the TT value of this item.

Isn't it the most brilliant idea to make money? Convince players to buy zero value items for real money, make 90% of players leave the game by implementing "stupid idea" and leave deeds owners alone, with their worthless virtual item.

I may be wrong, and I really want to be wrong, but I just think that MA is not very keen to give you back 6 millions $ you paid them. That is why self-destruction may be very profitable for MA. They simply may know that this project will soon be dead, that hardcore depositors will not keep this project alive, that too many players are already very disappointed. That is the reason why they want to make this game simply unplayable. But before self-destruction will happen, they for sure will try to sell you as many transport deeds as possible. And you can be sure that their TT value will be zero. They will take 5-10 or maybe even 100 millions $ form you and then kiill economy by simply driving away players who create market and deeds demand. If there will be no players because huge TP fee will make it unplayable (only deeds owners will stay), there will be no demand, no demad will make deeds (and other high markup items - including skills) worthless.

That is why deeds have 0 TT value. I understand that maybe, if some of you keep CLD from very begining, you could maybe break even, get back what you paid for this deed. But keep in mind my words when they will try to make you buy transport deeds.
 
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I think it was made pretty clear by MA all the way back to the beginning of estates and LAs that the only value in a deed was markup and any deed purchase is 100% market risk.

The CLDs, AUDs, Compets, and now transport deeds are all issues with the express purpose of generating immediate revenue for the company with any returns being 100% performance based.

Anyways they've been pretty clear on that, there's nothing sneaky or even unusual about it. In some other markets businesses may sell "fee shares" or other instruments that convey contractual rights to a percentage of revenues (gross or otherwise, as indicated in the particular agreement) while expressly not conveying any right to (or ownership/interest in) the company itself or any operational decisions.

It would be dirty to put out a new offering like the proposed transport deeds and then intentionally ruin the game. But that's another story.

I'm at "consider a cockup before a conspiracy" still.
 
Would it make sense to make deeds have value? No. If they put a 1000 ped value on the deed, it would not generate any revenue/ benefit MA in anyway...
 
Have you seen any stocks in real life ( stock market) with a TT value ( as in guaranteed to sell at a certain price no matter what market conditions)?? How can deeds be different?
 
Deeds are not stocks.

Are there MU on stocks? No
 
1st, they are NOT 0 ped TT, they are 0.00001 ped TT each, IIRC.

2nd, the deeds of Land Areas are worth MUCH more than any single CLD or other deed you were thinking of, and those too are only minimal TT value. And those have been ingame since many, many years before the CLD era.

Oh and who decided what they are worth? MA? Nope. Players.

Learn why and all your questions will be answered.
 
golddude said:
Deeds are not stocks.

Are there MU on stocks? No
Click to expand...

But there a lot of similarities.

A company does an IPO and sells stocks, the price depends on the market. Later if the company is doing poorly, the stock can go to 0. The same for deeds - the price depends on the market and for example if compet game fails after 2 years, those deeds will be worth 0.

Why own deeds/stocks - to make profit by 1) dividents; 2) selling for higher.


You might say stocks have 0 tt value and only markup as well. If the company goes bankrupt your stocks will be gone too. The only difference in my mind is that owning deeds does not give you say in the company.
 
Futurama said:
You might say stocks have 0 tt value and only markup as well. If the company goes bankrupt your stocks will be gone too. The only difference in my mind is that owning deeds does not give you say in the company.
Click to expand...

Yep, I agree with this.

My house deed doesn't have a "TT value", if nobody wants to buy my house then it has zero value. If makes sense for a deed not to have a fixed minimum value because they need to be a true measure of the value of something. From the current trading value of the CLDs we can infer the value of Calypso, this value needs to be able to drop below 1000 ped if necessary, or else the valuation cannot be trusted.

The trick is to sell quick if the price starts to drop :laugh:
 
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I highly doubt that MA will cut the head off the golden goose just to run away with the CLD money.

As much as people like to forget this fact, as soon as you buy a CLD your best interests and Mindark's are aligned. They're a business that wants to make money because that's what businesses do, and you are effectively a share holder that stands to make a share of that profit.
 
Just FYI. In game are Deeds with NOT zero value. This is Arkadia Land Deeds (Not AUD!), with a value of 150000 PED/each
 
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JohnCapital said:
1st, they are NOT 0 ped TT, they are 0.00001 ped TT each, IIRC.

2nd, the deeds of Land Areas are worth MUCH more than any single CLD or other deed you were thinking of, and those too are only minimal TT value. And those have been ingame since many, many years before the CLD era.

Oh and who decided what they are worth? MA? Nope. Players.

Learn why and all your questions will be answered.
Click to expand...

My guess here is that Deeds have had a 0ped value (.000001) to keep them safe from late night TTing as well?
 
OZtwo said:
My guess here is that Deeds have had a 0ped value (.000001) to keep them safe from late night TTing as well?
Click to expand...

I didn't think the system would let you TT deeds... Might be wrong on that since I haven't tried, at least not on purpose in a sober state...
 
If they issued bonds then matured bonds should be possible to TT for peds.
But ofc MA didn't want loan but "free" money.
 
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Geralt said:
I often ask myself, how did MindArk convince players that 0 PED TT value item may be worth 100$? Have you ever been thinking why the TT value of deeds is zero?

MindArk lately is coming up with very dangerous ideas. Its effects are trurly impossible to foreseen. In worst case scenario, implementation of TP fee idea may make most players want to sell out and then leave the game. Soon, deed owners may live in virtual world, where there is nobody left who would be keen to pay any price for any deed.

Do you feel what I try to express? Deeds have zero value. And soon nobody may care that you paid 100$ for it, or bought it in-game for 170$ because there will be nobody left in game. What do you expect MA to do in such situation? Buy it back from you at market price? No, they will simply give you back the TT value of this item.

Isn't it the most brilliant idea to make money? Convince players to buy zero value items for real money, make 90% of players leave the game by implementing "stupid idea" and leave deeds owners alone, with their worthless virtual item.

I may be wrong, and I really want to be wrong, but I just think that MA is not very keen to give you back 6 millions $ you paid them. That is why self-destruction may be very profitable for MA. They simply may know that this project will soon be dead, that hardcore depositors will not keep this project alive, that too many players are already very disappointed. That is the reason why they want to make this game simply unplayable. But before self-destruction will happen, they for sure will try to sell you as many transport deeds as possible. And you can be sure that their TT value will be zero. They will take 5-10 or maybe even 100 millions $ form you and then kiill economy by simply driving away players who create market and deeds demand. If there will be no players because huge TP fee will make it unplayable (only deeds owners will stay), there will be no demand, no demad will make deeds (and other high markup items - including skills) worthless.

That is why deeds have 0 TT value. I understand that maybe, if some of you keep CLD from very begining, you could maybe break even, get back what you paid for this deed. But keep in mind my words when they will try to make you buy transport deeds.
Click to expand...


I think you would benefit from going on an economics course. (At at least business studies type.) Will help you a lot to understand markets.


Rgds

Ace
 
mastermesh said:
I didn't think the system would let you TT deeds... Might be wrong on that since I haven't tried, at least not on purpose in a sober state...
Click to expand...

K a bit of humor here. Well late last night without coffee I got the two mixed up..TT isn't like dropping an item on the ground... by mad. :)

Anyway my way of thinking was that since the deeds are linked to an item, this would be the best way to prevent someone from dropping the deed on the ground and loosing it....um :dunce:
 
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To stop TTing would be the obvious answer but also because back in the day MA covered all the TT value of items not just the last six months of deposits.

If they still did this then all the deeds of any type would be a massive liability on the balance sheet.
 
Yea MA save with this option his own Future, but this is not special. You want invest in Company you can do it, but take the risk. You can buying in real life shares from Companys and you must take the risk. Today it has a value of 100 Dollar, tomorrow maybee nobody want it and it has a value of zero.

You dont want invest in something becouse the risk is to high, dont do it. Business is not, that Companys do things fair or are there to help you, the want you MOney and you have maybee lucky and the chance make money. You dont want risk it, hold you Money and save it, dont invest..

Example : MA say every AUD is worth 70 PED, and every CLD is 1900 PED. Ok after this something happen with Entropia, Game dismiss what ever. You can run to the TT can sold you Land Deeds, but it means not that you get the Money. Becouse has MA no Money you get nothing, and after all MA says we are Bankrupt and nobody get something. It takes 3 to 5 Month that you withdraw works, in this time it can happen a lot of thinks. And believe me MA nows at first something is wrong or the Game dont bring it..

What i can say you is, this is a real cash game with a lot of risk. You have the Money invest and you can get good Money back or you cant also lose Money, you can handle this dont invest, but pls dont talk MA sell you nothing and take you Money.
 
Divinity said:
Have you seen any stocks in real life ( stock market) with a TT value ( as in guaranteed to sell at a certain price no matter what market conditions)?? How can deeds be different?
Click to expand...

If I get it right, stocks do have a kind of "TT value". When a Company issues shares, it becomes a special kind of dept to the shareholders ("own capital"). It Counts on the same side in the bookkeeping as for instance bank loans, but it doesn't cound on the kind of debt that is waiting repayment. It's possible that that value is paid back to shareholders if the Company shuts down in an orderly way (that it, not through bankruptcy).

Usually, for popular shares, this value/share is tiny compared to the market value.
 
Divinity said:
Have you seen any stocks in real life ( stock market) with a TT value ( as in guaranteed to sell at a certain price no matter what market conditions)?? How can deeds be different?
Click to expand...

Yes.
Stock market use many different financial instrument's and not only standard shares.
And investors choose depending on goal and possibilities offered with that financial instrument ( to have big roi, to have less problems with loosing value because of inflation, to have less problems with currencies exchange ratio and million of other reasons)
Many countries/states as well as companies issue a "paper" which work like loan and in stock you can find name like bonds which pay initial payment plus interest.
Matured Bonds have guaranteed payment and in same time they are in stock with MU for less (less than 100%), depend on time in which guaranteed value may be paid out by issuer. (issuer and not by other players but by company which pay on time promised for that I said that MA didn't want loan)
 
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