My how refreshing, a space related thread which purports to be about 1 topic but has either by accident or by design turned into let’s bash the Kronan week. (Sarcasm intended)
That it is by Xane and fully supported by Yoshii with her baby talk references to others comes as no surprise at all. That she continues after all this time to hold a grudge against us because I privately messaged someone about something I had seen over 2 years ago is sad. Ironically she freely admits in any case now that some pirates, sometimes enjoy the hospitality of the Varyag for repair skilling etc that is her choice and her right.
In fact I would like to thank Xane and Penelope for shooting the mob ball left by Kronan last night, when lag caused us to blow up as we returned to the SS. Although we hurried back to clean up, they had found the ball and seemed to be happy hunting them, so there was no clean-up for me to do. Thx guys.
That Xane and Yoshii carefully avoid naming names, and use playground insults instead, is a such a thinly disguised attempt to avoid breaking forum rules and invoking the moderators wrath it is risible.
And yes I have little doubt the moderators will now ban me under that same rule, because contrary to comments made about me in the past in ‘the forum that shall not be named’, I do not have the PCF moderators in my pocket, any more than I have Mind Ark or any Dev team there, in fact my pockets are pretty much empty of all but cotton lint.
But since the ‘Kronan’ and my name are so firmly linked after 3 years of ownership, you’d have to have lived in a cave on a remote mountain top in another game for the past couple of years to not realise that these insults, lies, half-truths etc are directed at myself and my crew.
I see some of you have commented that it would be interesting to hear ‘the other side of the story’
Yet none have felt sufficiently curious to come and ask, so I very much doubt that anyone truly cares other than for the vicarious entertainment value of reading about other people’s troubles.
Will anything I have to say create change.. No, I very much doubt it, since you all seem to have an opinion on the subject whether or not you have both sides of the story.
But it’s a quiet afternoon so I guess I have time to make a few points…
As regards the attack on the Kronan by pirates near Calypso on the 2016-08-24.
First my compliments to the pirates on a well-coordinated attack and my congratulations on their good luck in the matter of timing. The reality is yes they caught us somewhat flat footed and vulnerable, since in accordance with Murphy’s law, several of our crew had been called away by real life issues only a matter of minutes before.
But sorry to burst your bubble guys, the Kronan was not ‘almost destroyed’ , though 1 station did take a fair amount of damage before we responded by kicking in some RK-20’s.
As explained above we had a smaller crew than usual, in particular I had a reduced gunnery team, and I had a pilot with no previous combat experience during warps. My compliments to them also, they stayed calm and handled it very well.
The decision was taken that as we had little chance of taking the fight to the pirates on this occasion, then we may as well enjoy the skills and let them enjoy wasting their ped on target practice.
There is always more than one way to handle an attack, and each crew/owner will always have to quickly consider the options open to them in a matter of seconds when under attack. Whether others approve or not of how we dealt with it on this occasion is irrelevant, you may think you would have handled it differently, but you were not there, it is easy to be smug and sure of your response when not under fire, and when the ship/service/reputation is not yours, and when the crewing, SI etc could be very different.
Eventually, as expected, the attack was broken off. It seemed both sides had their fun, gained experience etc and we were free to continue delivering our customers (not logged off btw, as they felt confident they were in no particular danger) and myself and my not inconsiderable amount of lootables, to our destination.
But no.. Xane seemed intent on breaking our warps and delaying us further. In the absence of clairvoyance we could not possibly know this was a game tactic to lure us into a warp mine and a further battle.
The first we heard of the warp mine, was in this thread, we were not mined once we did get to warp, there was no slaughter. So if any of my crew, passengers or interested others wrote to MA they did so without this knowledge of the pirates attempts at alternative tactics. It therefore appeared to us that Xane was simply up to his old tricks.
My previous support case about this very issue ‘Xane and harassment’ was not sent because it took place in pvp, but because it was accompanied on those occasions with threats about preventing us ever warping, seemingly he felt that the few minutes each day that Kronan and crew camped the area around Caly SS to prevent pirates attacking other ships while we were in the amounted to us trying to shut down his ‘legitimate business as a pirate’ and therefore felt it was an appropriate and proportionate response to regularly prevent us warping.
Xane :‘you fuck with our business we fuck with your business. You stop fucking with us we stop fucking with you...’
My support case at that time did not ask for him to be banned nor did it specifically even complain about him as a named individual. See below:
Support case
Question1 :
Is it normal pvp game-play for a pirate to deliberately target a sevice ship, with no hope of destroying it, but solely to prevent it warping and going about it's business as a transport provider?
Answer from support : No, this is not considered "Pvp-Gameplay", If a player simply shoots just to interrupt the warps.
IF this player would have shot at you with the intention of killing you then it would be considered Pvp-Gameplay.
Question 2 :
What is the minimum range of the quad gun? it appears that he is consistently shooting us from 0.108 while our guns are unable to engage. Given the lower speed of a mothership we are ofc unable to chase him, to bring him into range.
If we launch quads that risks us leaving them behind when we warp and then have reduced capability at the next stop
If we were a privateer we would not in any case have that option.
Can we please be assured that you will level the playing field in relation to gun range otherwise I suspect EU may shortly see pirates preventing all warp ships moving to do missions or transport. I am sure this would not be your intent.
I then included a link to the footage of the recent attack as demonstration of the ranges etc. But this ofc identified him as the attacker.
MA support replied:
Yes, This is one of the subjects we are discussing heavenly with our management, since there seems to be an clear unbalance.
In regarding to Xane;
We will investigate and further actions will be taken if necessary.
Thank you for your patience and understanding.
It was not my intent that Xane should be banned, I did not ask for that, I asked for clarification. When I read their reply I expected that they may perhaps advise him the answer they gave me above and ask him to desist. Instead they temp banned him (1 day if memory serves me correctly)
However his first day back, he did it again, this time claiming in space chat
015-06-02 01:30:55 [#space_travel] [Kane Xane Crossing] I attacked the Kronan and destroyed one of their qauds but they were able to warp away before my soc arrived....
Presumably having been told by MA that delaying us while reinforcements arrived was an acceptable tactic. Ironically none of the usual suspects were even on-line so this was an obvious ruse. MA obviously thought so as I believe it led to a further 1 day ban.
Since then he has tried on numerous times to play with the letter v the spirit of the rules, constantly pushing the edge of supports patience and then wonders why they have perhaps over-reacted on this occassion.
A pattern of behaviour reinforced since Xanes return to game by his having announced his return by playfully delaying our warp for a few minutes 1st or 2nd day back. And also more seriously confirmed by the threats which the pirates recently used against another ship for no better reason than they sometimes operate as part of KISS and know Granny.
Some of you seem to think that the rule in regard to interference in another players enjoyment of the game, has no place in pvp environments, of course it does, there is a world of difference between pvp game-play and spite. Threatening others because they know someone, or have dealings with someone clearly crosses that line.
As regards the support case sent I would point out that I did not report him, nor have I in fact written to support about him, the pirates or the Varyag crew in probably a year or more.
Reports in regard to rules about player harrassment would seem to be a waste of time in any case with reply’s such as ‘we don’t discuss other players’ and ‘just set them to ignore’. Since MA seems to believe that all problems between players can be resolved by one party setting the other to ignore. They have the mentality that if you close the curtains then it is no longer raining outside.
Opens curtains looks outside finds car in 6 feet of water.. how the hell did that happen I wonder ?
As an aside to Mastermesh, please note we do not deliberately seek others to pester Support by sending in mass complaints. On the one occasion it happened that 3 or 4 of us reported something separately but within a short period, we were politely asked to co-ordinate through 1 person in future. Though quite how they think we will ‘know’ when others may send in similar support cases remains a mystery to me. I am tired of your dragging the NBK name through the mud in regard to something that happened, as far as I know before I even joined the soc, and I have been here a long time.
I do however, contrary to unfounded comments repeatedly made about me, allow my crew to think for themselves. I do not bully, order them to do my dirty work or have a reign of terror. They are all grown adults with a mind of their own, their own tolerance levels and their own beliefs in what is acceptable and what is not. If one of them felt that this continued attack crossed what they found to be acceptable and reported it, then that is their right.
If Mind Ark chose to ‘investigate it’ in a particular manner that is their right (and yes..shock horror..I do agree with Xane, the system as it is could lead to abuse if people joined together to constantly report someone out of spite and does need amending) I am also aware that in some cases MA themselves ask for further supporting evidence if further issues arise. I can only assume that when directly asked to do so that players sometimes do a follow up. Though I have no idea if this has been the case as regards Xane.
Where there is financial risk such as theft of property, scamming during trades etc then ofc they should ban first and ask questions later, or else any financial trail, movement of items etc could quickly be rendered impossible to unravel.
However when it is a complaint about behaviours such as harassment, use of bots/ dupe avatars, stalking, or even use of inappropriate language, racial, religious or other slur, then it would seem far more appropriate that they pull the logs, check the facts, if necessary enquire of both parties if this is an isolated issue or has history which they will also need to consider. Then and only then, should they issue warnings, temp bans or whatever they deem an appropriate response to one or both parties.
I also think that any contentious issues such as things leading to bans, or that has financial implications should be reviewed by a manager to ensure that common standards apply, and that no-one is subject to the effects of that human condition ‘a bad day at the office’.
So what now..
I guess for me it is likely to be a farewell to PCF at least for a while for daring to reply and for turning this into yet another he said she said thread.
As for space and attacks there, I will continue to run the Kronan as I see fit, I will respond to pirate attacks according to the situation at the time.
I will not make promises to never report a pirate or anyone else for behaviours in breach of the TOU. Nor would I expect others to refrain.
But rest assured I do not use Support instead of guns or repairs to fight my pvp battles.
One question remains though..
If pirates enjoy pvp so much, if they believe all pvp battles to be fun, why then do they bitch so much about Kronan when we have fought them quad v quad, MS v quad, even MS v 2 pirate controlled MS over the years.
Could their singling out of Kronan, their vilifying of our crew be that they can’t take the heat, or could they be on some other services payroll ?
This reply took much consideration and some time to put together, and it is a shame I was unable to post before the recent requests for closure of the thread. I almost didn't post, but felt it would be wrong to not at least give a voice to Kronan's perspective.
I do appreciate that people are by now doubtless tired of the whole sorry mess, and I completely understand if they have no wish to reply.
! (and I'm sure lots of people know that).
