Menu
What's New
By:
Filters

Universal Ammo for Melee, Repair

Me Really Never said:
in the early days once in a while u got lucky and hit something big that boosted ur bankroll again.
Click to expand...

False utter bs. You aswell lost that "big" in matter of days. Because that "big" was not so big actually. 4-500 peds was a treasure. The difference is that people are rolling shitload more. Hence the variance/time is huge by comparison. 1k hp mobs were for ubers (and would pay an ATH a year, where 10k was ATH). When I started (25 july 2005 that is) biggest hunting ATH was a 25k Atrox Stalker. Biggest mining ATH was 4k something. Biggest crafting ATH I honestly don't remember, but there were not enough 5peds+ clicks to justify over say 10-15k.

Game was alot slower. People would hunt 100 ped a day and would call that fun. Would skill to unlock CGA and be considered among the highest skilled miners. Because only 3-4 of them had Mineral Sense. There were no mining amps. Ml-35, starkhov or maddox were about maximum any sane person would use. In Sunday hunts.

Ofc you had the ubers cycling alot with mm, imk2 etc But they were still using at least 10k bankroll even then.

But for the large masses? Justifier mk2/karma killer and that was it. Argo/fef/trax/armax/drone (with hp like half of what they have now, for some of them and regen way lower) were bread and butter, and trox was like the pinnacle.

Nobody stops you from doing the same gameplay now. Just stop your evolution at a gun which can use maximum A102 or A103 and look for mobs which you can hunt naked or in rascal tops, with the mighty tt fap and you're there. Nobody forces you to speed. Literally nobody.

Half of the game was chatting and trading your 80 ped loot in cities. You had often random meeting some player in middle of nowhere and just stop everything and talk and talk. Nowadays people don't even say "hi" because they have this mission to complete, they have another 1k to roll, they must swirl because omg. Ffs. I miss that game like f*.
 
Last edited:
Thanks for the further contributions. It seems the main reason is either not made clear enough or got watered down in the discussion. Those who can't use uni ammo are at a disadvantage at the point of sale, i.e. depositing. They have to pay more for getting the same value into the game. Partial solutions with attachments etc. do not remove this. They have already recognized and remedied the situation for miners, leaving the melee fraction only the more wanting.
 
Melee has no range - i do not believe that all the melee users wait until the mob is upon them before attacking it, I have been skilling melee for 3 years and i always use a rifle until the mob is close enough then finish with a sword - I use all my UA in my rifle and sell the blp and laser ammo to repair my swords - whats the problem ? - portable TT unit solves the durability issue
 
San said:
Those who can't use uni ammo are at a disadvantage at the point of sale, i.e. depositing. They have to pay more for getting the same value into the game.
Click to expand...

Bump and pointing out again why this thread exists for the reading impaired.
 
I would love for ua to repair melee

Currently I use a gun to shoot out my ua monthly deposit
Then I sell the shrapnel

When I am down to 100 per ua I start using melee

My system sucks :( but best way that works for me
 
San said:
Bump and pointing out again why this thread exists for the reading impaired.
Click to expand...

the disadvantage gets eaten up by eco melee weapons being a LOT cheaper than their gun counterparts though...
and there are melee weapons that use UA so you could use them as well.
also: crafters are at a disadvantage as well. should now the ep4 crafter be able to use UA too?
 
Me Really Never said:
the disadvantage gets eaten up by eco melee weapons being a LOT cheaper than their gun counterparts though...
Click to expand...
This is merely the market among players. The purchase price is compensated by the advantage when you use it in the long run and you wouldn't buy unlimited otherwise. Prices might adjust themselves if melee weapons were more attractive by implementing this.

Me Really Never said:
and there are melee weapons that use UA so you could use them as well.
Click to expand...
There are and it's practical for the time they last. They are not unlimited. And run them through the weapon compare tool at the markups they are traded. I reckon most people never do any homework.

Me Really Never said:
also: crafters are at a disadvantage as well. should now the ep4 crafter be able to use UA too?
Click to expand...
This is not the topic here but it was pointed out above that there could be side effects in some areas of crafting. This has to be examined, but I don't see it disabling the idea. Rather making it more attractive to craft other stuff than ep again.
 
Another issue is that this would make UA indirectly tradeable, unless you differentiate between UA repairs and PED repairs. One way to prevent this would be if item TT is split into "Locked, nonreimbursable value" and regular TT, and the item is avatar-bound while it has "locked" TT. This would also introduce a lock on items to prevent accidental TT or auctioning.
 
Blaffin McKrill said:
Another issue is that this would make UA indirectly tradeable, unless you differentiate between UA repairs and PED repairs.
Click to expand...

While you could trade an item repaired with UA, there is no way of claiming these funds other than by using the item, which channels everything through the loot system, or by tt-ing it directly and destroying the item which has to be obtained through the system first either by looting or crafting. The 1% gained on the repair portion can't compensate for the losses incurred either way. If it did, the entropy simulation would take care of it. Since we already got it for hunting and mining, its influence is priced in whether anybody noticed or not. For the system's balance it also doesn't matter whether an item changes ownership. The only influence on balance would be that the advantage of being able to utilize UA, which already was extended to miners, would now extend to crafters and melee-only users, too. Given the number of threads bemoaning the state of crafting, I'm actually astonished not more would find this a step in a positive direction.
 
Blaffin McKrill said:
Another issue is that this would make UA indirectly tradeable, unless you differentiate between UA repairs and PED repairs. One way to prevent this would be if item TT is split into "Locked, nonreimbursable value" and regular TT, and the item is avatar-bound while it has "locked" TT. This would also introduce a lock on items to prevent accidental TT or auctioning.
Click to expand...

Uh, Ua is indirectly tradeable now... just use it and you get back some TT value in loot...

It's funny how people think about the economy now vs how they did before UA, vs how they did before L items were introduced.... The 'real' in Real cash economy just slowly gets more and more wiped away over time... As someone mentioned on another forum recently, "THERE IS NOTHING VIRTUAL ABOUT YOUR HARD EARNED MONEY!!"
 
Haruto Rat said:
I've been thinking about this, and it seems that a melee amp with exceptional durability and ammo use would be enough, given that:
  • a well-suited amp can cover up to 1/3 of the total cost,
  • barring big multipliers, shrapnel typically constitutes about 30% of total loot.
So, if we take for example a Melee Trauma Amplifier IV that has 4.444 PEC decay, and convert into an Adapted Melee Trauma Amplifier IV that has 0.044 PEC decay and consumes 440 ammo (=the same dpp), the amount of ammo consumed in long run would be pretty close to the amount of shrap looted.

On top of that, if you took UA equivalent to total uses of your weapon, you'd have a counter.

Could even have an upgrade mission for this.
Click to expand...

This sounds cool, too, but we also have melee weapons which can't be amplified. This would come at the expense of a specific region which already struggles to exist. Some may not mind if it was thrown out completely, while I'd much rather see it coming back.
 
We have an "ArMatrix Extender" now, as well as ArMatrix melee weapons which use universal ammo. Thanks for that! Slightly worried that buying/making those extenders to use with existing melee weapons is more expensive than tt-ing shrapnel... We'll see. Anyhow, great that the issue was being picked up. Cheers!
 
those extenders should be 50% nanocubes and 50% oils, so hunters could easily craft em for solo use instead of having 7 diffrent resources that push the mu to a useless number.
 
atomicstorm said:
All this is based on a false premise of once again.. 90%. Doesn't exist.

And while I wish this would happen also, you could just repair a crap melee weapon and tt it and that's not what mindark was after with UA.

It would be better if melee users would stop selling their shrapnel so cheap.
Click to expand...

Yeah i agree it would be better if mele users would sell ther shrap for like 100.9 or 100.8MU... but loot V2.0 changed that... shrapnel is 70% of my loot... also shrapnel is 70% of my buyers loot... so if i sell someone 1k ped shrapnel they have it for alot longer than before loot V2.0
On one side you have increased supply and diminished demand... all this becouse of loot V2.0... So yes this updated fucked up mele users and so we ask for help to find some better solutions.... since current situation is not good!
 
LokoMotive said:
Yeah i agree it would be better if mele users would sell ther shrap for like 100.9 or 100.8MU... but loot V2.0 changed that... shrapnel is 70% of my loot... also shrapnel is 70% of my buyers loot... so if i sell someone 1k ped shrapnel they have it for alot longer than before loot V2.0
On one side you have increased supply and diminished demand... all this becouse of loot V2.0... So yes this updated fucked up mele users and so we ask for help to find some better solutions.... since current situation is not good!
Click to expand...

regardsless of loot 2.0 and the new shrapnel bp i really CANNOT understand some posts in this thread..

Would it be all better for you if you get again AMMO instead of shrap? like it was in the past?

Regardless of the tt-return.....you can also tt the shrap or sell it for atleast 100.4% or such...isnt that BETTER than the ammo thing from the past???
 
ProActive Mango said:
those extenders should be 50% nanocubes and 50% oils, so hunters could easily craft em for solo use instead of having 7 diffrent resources that push the mu to a useless number.
Click to expand...
Seconded! :eyecrazy:
 
Edward-James said:
Regardless of the tt-return.....you can also tt the shrap or sell it for atleast 100.4% or such...isnt that BETTER than the ammo thing from the past???
Click to expand...
perhaps, IF you can find a buyer that's online when you are ready to hit the tt and they are on the same planet as you, willing to come to you to make that sell, etc...

Time is money... if it takes a lot of time to sell the shrapnel it'll cost more than 1% difference the tt will give you.
 
Had started another thread to learn more and evaluate whether the grounds for this thread's existence have been addressed:
https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/showthread.php?300694-ArMatrix-Extenders/

From what I understand so far, it is clearly not the case. The extenders don't consume ammo, hence do not take care of the main issue. Indirect ammo consumption in the course of producing the extenders exceeds the disadvantages of having to forgo the 101% conversion of shrapnel as well as the more favourable exchange rate for buying universal ammo from the webshop. Hence, while it is a good thing to try and improve marketability of mined/looted raw materials, this route will not motivate most melee users as potential regular buyers for the extender attachments.

Furthermore it is reported that they don't attach to certain items (Archon's Sword, if by analogy one may suspect all Greek swords), which would at least benefit from stretching their service life between repairs.

If the latter isn't a mere oversight and the Greek blades a victim of a general attachment ban since they weren't allowed to be amplified (for reasons) which could be corrected in a coming update, and the former isn't planned to be addressed in upcoming changes or further item releases, this petition/proposal remains standing.
 
Last edited:
Perpendicular to the topic at hand but... as minor differences in dpp don't mean much these days AG swords could as well be made ampable now.
 
I believe this is starting to come into play, with the new ArMatrix melee weapons and the unique dagger as examples that are using ammo.

It looks like the old school UL melee weapons may not get any changes though :(
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top