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Known Issue - Mayhem Scintillator Series

So basically, I checked entropedia:

If MindArk keeps the stats like they are now, the gun is completely in balance with other guns on same level.
For example: comparing dpp, dps & range with Mod Merc: Mod Merc wins in all 3.

If MindArk wants to lower the stats to the announced numbers, then this is the most useless gun on its level, as the stats are similar to guns 30 levels lower.

So apparently, the new way of thinking is: "give the most useless stuff in our biggest event, people play it anyway".


sorry but no. In the past 10 years, every single gun won in events had this 10% boost, I counted on that boost. I checked the stats before I played & saw that with the 10% boost the gun would be similar to other guns on that level, so I decided to compete & buy that many points due to that. They had a 10% increase in their system for 10 years, and people actually keep that in mind when they decide to compete.

Without the 10% I would have never competed in this event, because the gun is useless without that boost. They should have mentioned a change in their 10-year long running system before the event if they now suddenly choose to remove the 10% increase they've always given.
 
Rampsy said:
So basically, I checked entropedia:

If MindArk keeps the stats like they are now, the gun is completely in balance with other guns on same level.
For example: comparing dpp, dps & range with Mod Merc: Mod Merc wins in all 3.

If MindArk wants to lower the stats to the announced numbers, then this is the most useless gun on its level, as the stats are similar to guns 30 levels lower.

So apparently, the new way of thinking is: "give the most useless stuff in our biggest event, people play it anyway".


sorry but no. In the past 10 years, every single gun won in events had this 10% boost, I counted on that boost. I checked the stats before I played & saw that with the 10% boost the gun would be similar to other guns on that level, so I decided to compete & buy that many points due to that. They had a 10% increase in their system for 10 years, and people actually keep that in mind when they decide to compete.

Without the 10% I would have never competed in this event, because the gun is useless without that boost. They should have mentioned a change in their 10-year long running system before the event if they now suddenly choose to remove the 10% increase they've always given.
Click to expand...

Oh bull fucking shit.

You competed purely to win the top prize (as repeatedly stated in your rage thread) for the fame. Not because you expected it to be boosted 10%.

You didn't expect it to be boosted by 10%, no-one expected that, which is why we have 2 threads of 5 pages on the issue.

The gun is not at all useless, yes it has lower dps/dpp than some (SOME) alternatives, but it has focus blow which can be exploited and no other unL weapon has this.

Stop being so fucking prissy and childish throwing your toys out of the pram.
 
Could someone summarize in layman's terms, what's happened, please?


Rgds

Ace
 
Aio, there is a difference with what I say in public & what I think.
I'm not going to give out all my own research to others. Ofcourse in public I'll say things differently, to not help the opponents. After all, it was still a competition...

Feel free to ask Rocky, we had discussed the guns at the start of the event, and I always gave completely different numbers than the numbers that could be calculated with the stats announced, therefor I had higher dps & dpp on the guns in our talks, he asked me why, and I answered him that I don't calculate with pure stats, but with the comparison of the previous event guns.

Feel free to ask him if this is correct.
MindArk can also check my chat logs with him if they want to double check this.

That clearly shows that from day 1, I already took the event gun boost in mind.
 
Ace Flyster said:
Could someone summarize in layman's terms, what's happened, please?


Rgds

Ace
Click to expand...

Prize (gun) stats were announced prior to event commencement.

Upon receiving guns, winners noticed that stats were higher than originally stated.

MA now decided this was an error, and are reverting stats back to their proper numbers.

People are pissed for several reasons

1) XTLC weapons from previous mayhem had the same issue but stats were not reverted

2) Potentially completed sales are now tainted by the stat shift

3) And apparently Rampsy was banking on a stat increase ;)

As for your comments Rampsy, no one else in this thread indicated they shared your prediction on the stat increase... You say you were banking on it, sure, but you had to know on some level that this was a gamble and not guaranteed.

The same way people who bought/sold these guns should have known than the stats were potentially incorrect. We can't read MA's mind, but we know that they are consistently inconsistent ;)
 
Nobody should be angry that MA is fixing a mistake, winners will get what they were supposed to get in the first place. Now why it happened (twice) is what I really can't understand, better fix this before the guns change hands because I'm affraid it's too late for XTLC even though they should have been fixed too.

So yeah, fix mistake and investigate so it doesn't happen again.
 
Bertha Bot said:
Mayhem Scintillator Viridian
Laser Pistol
Max Damage: 65
Attacks/Min: 79
Range: 36m
DPS: 85.75
DPP: 4.2428
Increased Critical Strike Chance: 1%
Recommended Level: 95



Originally Posted Here
Click to expand...

ok , lets add some clear mind here (I do not owon any of those guns) :


THIS statement shows that a guy with
Recommended Level: 95
Click to expand...
will have
Max Damage: 65
Attacks/Min: 79
Range: 36m
DPS: 85.75
DPP: 4.2428
Click to expand...

parameter ?

dont get me wrong but i just calculated 95 hit/dmg profstandings and i got 36amp and 27 meter range,
so word "incorrect" means it will be increased?

because
DPS: 85.75
DPP: 4.2428

people calc in "their way" and mindark calc in "their right way" , i just took cobalt gun (LINK) and gone to "neutral" (space area) and after opening gun it showed me 27 meters range.

As we all know Space belongs to Mindark and Planet calypso belongs to "Planet partner", so in plannet side parameter of gun is different, is there a place for discussion here?

I dont own any gun and i think i will not, just want clear minds here.

//mg
 
ZPF said:
Prize (gun) stats were announced prior to event commencement.

Upon receiving guns, winners noticed that stats were higher than originally stated.

MA now decided this was an error, and are reverting stats back to their proper numbers.

People are pissed for several reasons

1) XTLC weapons from previous mayhem had the same issue but stats were not reverted

2) Potentially completed sales are now tainted by the stat shift

3) And apparently Rampsy was banking on a stat increase ;)

As for your comments Rampsy, no one else in this thread indicated they shared your prediction on the stat increase... You say you were banking on it, sure, but you had to know on some level that this was a gamble and not guaranteed.

The same way people who bought/sold these guns should have known than the stats were potentially incorrect. We can't read MA's mind, but we know that they are consistently inconsistent ;)
Click to expand...


Correct, I knew it was a gamble, but if in the past 10 years it happened every event with a gun, then it's a system.
So either:

1. It's a system and current guns should have it too
2. It's a bug, and then all previous guns were a bug too, then all guns need to be lowered with 10%
3. It was a system, but they want to change it, then they should have made an announcement about it before the event, not change it afterwards.

I have a 100.000 ped loan @ Twin Peaks bank cause of the event, if they had announced that the system would be changed, I wouldn't have competed & wouldn't have that loan right now. So if they change the system afterwards, I won't agree to it if they don't change all other guns to what they were supposed to be as well. Either they fix all, or they fix nothing. If they don't want to keep the "system" but see it as a bug, they should announce the change for next events, but they can't revert 1 event series if they don't do it for the others as well.

I don't mind which side they pick, but either they change all, or none. Not something in between, as that would be extremely unfair as they had not made any announcement of a change in the system.

So like I said, I don't mind they revert the guns now, but then I expect them to revert all. Only reverting this series, I won't accept.
 
There is a big difference from the XTLC series and that is that those were handed out as prices, nobody payed anything for it.

In this case peoples sold points, they maybe would charge more if better value in the prices, allso some maybe decided about contending (IE other values for scores if more contenders) depending on the guns stats.

If they revert it we get exactly what we expected and I thought the same as we won XTLC gun but back then its smaller amount of peoples affected compared to here.

And rampsy I feel for you, youre a rockstar taking a loan to win this but its alot bigger then one person if you ask me.


:)
 
To MindArk:

Tell me what you think is the most balanced.
I compared the gun with current settings (the 10% increase) to other guns.

Viridian with increased stats:
compare-viridian.jpg

Full screen: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/gallery/files/5/2/6/5/1/compare-viridian.jpg

Other 95+ lasers
compare-high.jpg

Full screen: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/gallery/files/5/2/6/5/1/compare-high.jpg

Vengeance
compare-vengeance.jpg

Full screen: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/gallery/files/5/2/6/5/1/compare-vengeance.jpg

If you compare this, the current (increased) stats compared with the other 95+ guns (which should be similar):
- All guns except the Instant Karma have higher range
- all guns have higher DPS
- All guns except the XTLC 1000 have higher DPP (and this XTLC is by far the one with highest DPS)

So in the list above, it would mean that the veridian, even with the increased stats, is still the lowest gun for its level in the laser 95+ category.


If you compare the current (increased) stats of Viridian with lower guns, you will find out that the veridian has similar stats to guns around 20(!) levels below it:
Similar range, dps & dpp as the Vengeance, which is lvl 70-80, depending which of the 3 you pick. but those are 15-25 levels lower!
And even worse: the Vengeance, being a lower end weapon, can be combined with a higher amp than the viridian. So that means that the Vengeance, being 25 levels lower, is even a better gun than the current viridian if you don't take the 1% focussed blow into comparisson.





Now tell me that the current stats are not balanced... What part makes this gun "overpowered" that a decrease in stats is needed? To me this looks extremely well balanced, it's even still "too weak" compared to other guns, but you want to decrease it even further?

If you decide to lower the Viridian with 10%, then that means the viridian will drop even further and become completely useless, making it comparable to lvl 50-60 guns...

Is that what you call balance?





PS: for the comparing of lower end guns I used only 1 gun (Vengeance), so this post wouldn't become too big, but there are many more examples, feel free to compare them yourself. Just a few that I can think of right now, but there are even more:

MacMahon Vengeance
CDF XTLC 800
Omegaton Igni L2000
Omegaton Igni L2020
Rip M6600
EWE LC-350 Dissolver
EWE LC-400 Submission CDF Edition
EWE LC-400 Submission
EWE LC-500 Fury CDF Edition
EWE LC-625 Gleamer
EWE EP-57 Catalyzer
 
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i dont get this rampsy guy. those are awesome guns and the only ones with a crit chance buff. everyone knows the effect of crit chance can be increased with crit damage on other stuff so these guns can be superior to many many other guns. and to gamble on that change of weapons after announcing is just plain stupid. of course you can do it and you may end up lucky but dont cry like a baby when your gamble didnt work out.
 
Me Really Never said:
i dont get this rampsy guy. those are awesome guns and the only ones with a crit chance buff. everyone knows the effect of crit chance can be increased with crit damage on other stuff so these guns can be superior to many many other guns. and to gamble on that change of weapons after announcing is just plain stupid. of course you can do it and you may end up lucky but dont cry like a baby when your gamble didnt work out.
Click to expand...


"awesome guns"?

If they decrease the stats, then the gun is comparable to a lvl 50-60 gun, while this gun is lvl 95.
I don't call that an awesome gun, it would be nowhere close to any other gun around its lvl.

If they drop the stats, then the gun will have less than 60 dps. As a pistol, which are supposed to be the guns with high dps... But even lvl 55 rifles with higher range and similar dpp do more dps.

So what exactly is your description of "awesome"? A gun that is beaten by a 40 levels lower gun is not awesome in my dictionary.

Anyway, if they want to "change the stats to what was announced", then I expect the gun to have the dps & dpp that was announced too. So that means, please increase the stats by around 40%.
 
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ZPF said:
....
Click to expand...

'You have to spread more rep blah blah'

Thank you for the summary! :)


(typical MA getting the basics wrong, again.)

MA seriously need someone with a really good eye for detail, and oversea ANY changes, ANYONE makes. It feels like there is NO manager taking control with the simplest of changes.

MA you need someone for quality control, because ya programmers cannot!


Rgds

Ace
 
just looked at weapon compare.. i looked at xltc1000, vengence, and viridian (all had HC204)

Viridian- 3.065 dpp, 100 dps (added 1% base crit chance)
Vengence- 2.996 dpp, 88.47 dps
XLTC1000- 2.926 dpp, 97.34 dps

**disclaimer** these numbers are wrong b/c the weapon compare has the wrong stats (viridian)...

**fact** rampsy is not helping the 'selling features' of his 200k BO auction
 
i would love to believe that MindArk is allways right, and people allways wrong.

WE calc DPP different
WE calc APM different
WE calc ECO different

Ma call it "Recomended Level" and we "Think we know" that with Recomended level gun not possible to shoot(sib start).

ma state range 104.5meter and i shoot mobs form 110meter range.

it only shows that MindArk calc s different but that not means wrong imo , so maybe MindArk not fault that we think different (and do not accept mindarks calculations as best possible)


mindark never said that community written formulas is better or more accurate, they was allways calculating everything in "their" way , jsut we (community invented "new eco rules") and started to call (Mindarks calculations "old formulla")

and i bet this announcement that bertha reposted is same as few others announcements of a support team that was made in weekend without talking with a programmers that did this guns.

(for example same announcements was about damphyre pet ban form plannets and other similar announcements.)

//mg
 
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Rampsy said:
"awesome guns"?

If they decrease the stats, then the gun is comparable to a lvl 50-60 gun, while this gun is lvl 95.
I don't call that an awesome gun, it would be nowhere close to any other gun around its lvl.

If they drop the stats, then the gun will have less than 60 dps. As a pistol, which are supposed to be the guns with high dps... But even lvl 55 rifles with higher range and similar dpp do more dps.

So what exactly is your description of "awesome"? A gun that is beaten by a 40 levels lower gun is not awesome in my dictionary.

Anyway, if they want to "change the stats to what was announced", then I expect the gun to have the dps & dpp that was announced too. So that means, please increase the stats by around 40%.
Click to expand...

combine that 1% crit chance with the 60% crit dmg from EST and put in another 12 or whatever % crit dmg from ares ring and then check again your eco. and then make it tier 10 and use full accu enhancers (when the price is down again) and recheck it. thats how awesome it is. you will probably get close to imk2 eco with a lot more dps.
 
Xcessive said:
just looked at weapon compare.. i looked at xltc1000, vengence, and viridian (all had HC204)

Viridian- 3.065 dpp, 100 dps (added 1% base crit chance)
Vengence- 2.996 dpp, 88.47 dps
XLTC1000- 2.926 dpp, 97.34 dps

**disclaimer** these numbers are wrong b/c the weapon compare has the wrong stats (viridian)...

**fact** rampsy is not helping the 'selling features' of his 200k BO auction
Click to expand...

This comparrison is not 100% correct.
You calculate with hypercharged, which is the max amp for viridian, but the others can have higher amps. so the other guns outdamage the veridian, even with the 1% base crit chance.
+ they also have more range, normally shorter range = higher dps, so I would actually expect viridian to be the strongest one.

If you reduce the apm of viridian back to 79, that would bring viridian (including the 1% crit chance) at same dps as vengeance, which is a 25levels lower gun. even if you calculate both with hypercharged.
 
Right up your a*s rampsy, hahaha.

Congratulations for paying the biggest price just to be number one....as if that evens helps someone in a competition where you can buy your place, also a bank loan....pathetic, I can only enjoy this, thanks MA!

You deserve this because you are not a man of your words
 
If u dont want it Rampsy i can take it :)

Can i pay with sweat?
 
bettlejus said:
You deserve this because you are not a man of your words
Click to expand...

oh now? Well, explain to me, what have I ever done wrong to you then?
I'm pretty sure a lot of people here will say completely otherwise.
As far as I know, I have never wronged anyone in this game.

If I have, then I'm sorry, but at least enlighten me then, and not just post bullshit about me on the forum.
 
I dont understand where is problem ? :D if MA change stats back then is good becouse they said at event start what stats is.
If they leave with better stats just say "thanks god" becouse u got more then expected


All know these weps unique just becouse 1% of crit chance


All who pay money for points knew what risk are

So i dont see here problem (Thats my opinion)
 
Tamosius said:
I dont understand where is problem ? :D if MA change stats back then is good becouse they said at event start what stats is.
If they leave with better stats just say "thanks god" becouse u got more then expected


All know these weps unique just becouse 1% of crit chance


All who pay money for points knew what risk are

So i dont see here problem (Thats my opinion)
Click to expand...

The problem is that ALL guns ever given in events had this same 10% increase, and were never reverted.
So if they revert this gun, they should revert all guns, to keep the balance.
I never said they can't revert my gun, I only said, if it's a bug, then they have to revert all the guns with this same bug.
It's either all or none. Depending on whether they call it a bug or part of the system.
But only changing the gun when it is not won by a friend of MindArk is not fair and sounds like pure corruption to me.


So either:

1. They revert all guns from history with same bug as well
2. They revert none & keep the 10% in the future as well
3. They revert none, and don't keep the 10% in the future, but then they have to make an official announcement about that prior to the next event, so that people actually know about it.
 
Well the points have used a lof of money to do that. Talking specially about the top1 as I know personly how much he used. MA had goldcard problems for 3 days and extended instead of 3, 7 days making more points to be farmed and crashing the current point holders.

This is a little compentation it should be and shouldn't change back the stats after giving them in their inventory!


http://www.planetcalypso.com/events/merry-mayhem-2016/
The link above says for example that xmas ring has Harvesting Node Detection: 20m while in the ring we have now is 0.2m... Is this the same?
 
Rampsy said:
oh now? Well, explain to me, what have I ever done wrong to you then?
.
Click to expand...

Remember that 55k FFA points transaction??You promised a price then changed your mind.
Reputation and dignity is all it matters.

Back in 2013 when I sold a mkII Laser, i said a BO and someone took it, i haven't change my mind just because i was offered 5k higher then that....also your reputation in the FFA trade was only worth 300 peds....you sold yourself for 300 peds, to bad WSS didn't listen when i told them you had over 1M points....but again, maybe they listened but no one is so eager to pay triple for an item just to be number one in a paid competition.

I really don't understand what you have earned with this,, hope you will enjoy the 20k price you'll get for the gun in few years.

Also, there is no guarantee in this game, why you act like you deserve something?
Why is MA faukt because you, in all your insanity, bet all in 1 hand?

Dude, be a man and stop crying like a little puss, you clearly are fame driven, this is not the place for that.

Yiu must gamble what you are ready to lose, you gambled everything in pure guesses...be a man and be proud of what you earned, even though is was to much of a pay.

To much said:)
 
TheRock said:
Well the points have used a lof of money to do that. Talking specially about the top1 as I know personly how much he used. MA had goldcard problems for 3 days and extended instead of 3, 7 days making more points to be farmed and crashing the current point holders.

This is a little compentation it should be and shouldn't change back the stats after giving them in their inventory!


http://www.planetcalypso.com/events/merry-mayhem-2016/
The link above says for example that xmas ring has Harvesting Node Detection: 20m while in the ring we have now is 0.2m... Is this the same?
Click to expand...

Thanks Rocky,

That's true as well, the fact they made the event longer than announced prior to the event made the event cost more money as well, so imo it's indeed a fair compensation that items were made a little bit better than, to return the additional cost that the event has cost to win.

If they can "change" the event rules, then why not the event prizes to match the raised cost due to their rules change?
 
Rampsy said:
The problem is that ALL guns ever given in events had this same 10% increase, and were never reverted.
So if they revert this gun, they should revert all guns, to keep the balance.
I never said they can't revert my gun, I only said, if it's a bug, then they have to revert all the guns with this same bug.
It's either all or none.
Click to expand...

what stat is wrong for u ?

http://www.planetcalypso.com/events/merry-mayhem-2016/

all stats few mons ago was here u pay for points and put 1.4m pts to try win wep with stats what writen in this web all stats there : max dmg ,atks/min,range even DPP u can calculate allmost all about wep from these numbers

so whats wrong if MA change back to what they said at start :D

Like i said if they not change just say "Aleluia i love u MA"


Or u want to say u knew that weapons will be better 10% then MA said
 
Tamosius said:
what stat is wrong for u ?

http://www.planetcalypso.com/events/merry-mayhem-2016/

all stats few mons ago was here u pay for points and put 1.4m pts to try win wep with stats what writen in this web all stats there : max dmg ,atks/min,range even DPP u can calculate allmost all about wep from these numbers

so whats wrong if MA change back to what they said at start :D

Like i said if they not change just say "Aleluia i love u MA"
Click to expand...


Yes, that seems best post so far, at least we cant blame anyone here.
 
Tamosius said:
what stat is wrong for u ?

http://www.planetcalypso.com/events/merry-mayhem-2016/

all stats few mons ago was here u pay for points and put 1.4m pts to try win wep with stats what writen in this web all stats there : max dmg ,atks/min,range even DPP u can calculate allmost all about wep from these numbers

so whats wrong if MA change back to what they said at start :D

Like i said if they not change just say "Aleluia i love u MA"
Click to expand...

Please read what I said...

Every event with guns as prizes the guns have 10% higher apm & range than what was announced prior to the event.

If you want an example, I already posted this earlier in this topic:

http://www.planetcalypso.com/events/easter-mayhem-2016/

Here you can see the stats that were announced for XTLC series. Now compare it to the stats ingame. All these guns also received +10% rang & apm.

Same happened with all the events before that as well. In all of EU's history, the gun prizes in events always had this +10%. And some people know it, and actually take it into account when deciding to compete.
Some people that now react bad in this topic have done the exact same thing in the past. But then they all stayed quiet so it wouldn't be changed. Now that they didn't win, suddenly they want it changed? Well, that's what I'm talking about, if they change the current gun's stats, then they have to do the same with all the old guns with the same bug. Every single gun handed out in events on Calypso have had this same bug.
 
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Rampsy said:
Please read what I said...

Every event with guns as prizes the guns have 10% higher apm & range than what was announced prior to the event.

If you want an example, I already posted this earlier in this topic:

http://www.planetcalypso.com/events/easter-mayhem-2016/

Here you can see the stats that were announced for XTLC series. Now compare it to the stats ingame. All these guns also received +10% rang & apm.

Same happened with all the events before that as well. In all of EU's history, the gun prizes in events always had this +10%. And some people know it, and actually take it into account when deciding to compete.
Some people that now react bad in this topic have done the exact same thing in the past. But then they all stayed quiet so it wouldn't be changed. Now that they didn't win, suddenly they want it changed? Well, that's what I'm talking about, if they change the current gun's stats, then they have to do the same with all the old guns with the same bug. Every single gun handed out in events on Calypso have had this same bug.
Click to expand...

u mean "EVERY" means all or just first one where was xtlc ?



And im rly wont say that U or MA right here or NO :D just u cant change any. This was competition with prizes what u knew before participate
 
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