Thoughts on Reselling/Trading

morey

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Aurisk Morey Kenbi
Lets have a healthy discussion :D. I see that there is this weird love/hate relationship going on in the community around re-sellers and traders, so I'd like to ask you what you think to potentially clear it up. Personally though, I just want to understand it from your perspectives too.

My own thoughts:
I think everyone is a trader at heart, or at least want to buy low and sell high aka make a profit.

Trading/reselling basically makes our entire economy work. Yes, I know re-sellers who know the value of items may snipe your auctions, buyout that nice looking item that you had your eye on to turn a profit, etc. Yeah, it rocks and it sucks, happened tonnes of times to me on both sides.

I see trading very very simply to be:
- The closer you want to sell an item to it's true value, the longer time/effort it will take.
- The lower you want to buy an item from it's true value, the longer time/effort it will take.
Therefore, there is a group of people that would rather save the time/effort to not go through this hassle.
So, ultimately, Traders/resellers make their PED by offering convenience
- Whenever you want to buy something. Someone can provide to you right away.
- Whenever you want to sell something. Someone can buy it from you right away.

Lets say an item worth +5000 sometimes may get sold for +2000. You see it, want to buy it. And dang, that trader got it for +3000, and is selling it for +4000. The item still depreciates overall value, but less so. But they make PED from a player! Well, don't hate on it. There has got to be a decent incentive for someone to put in their effort and PED to risk some gains here.

That said, I also don't think all types of trading are good. There's a whole bunch of ways people trade. It's an art. Sometimes people may trade like the real-world sleazy salesman making things up/pressuring. I don't like that. I personally value open and honest communication. Say if a trader buys from an auction house/player/shop, and then is clearly reselling the same item immediately after. That is not a problem to me whatsoever. In fact, I would prefer them to do that rather then to pretend to use it for some time and selling because they are "finished with it" or create some fake believable story for an item whose sole purpose is to be resold. I don't believe in the 24h rule.


My thoughts. Happy discussions, and Happy Easter!

~Morey
 
I never understood the hate towards resellers. In this game everyone has to b good with managing their resources. Resellers help the economy by taxing the lack of patiencs of some of us (mine included, at times) - they offer a premium service, by allowing you to sell your resource when there's no immediate demand of your good so you dump on them...
Hate towards this profession is a frustration because lack of one's patience or just laziness, but, haters gonna hate so it's all cool! :D
 
Lets have a healthy discussion :D. I see that there is this weird love/hate relationship going on in the community around re-sellers and traders, so I'd like to ask you what you think to potentially clear it up. Personally though, I just want to understand it from your perspectives too.

My own thoughts:
I think everyone is a trader at heart, or at least want to buy low and sell high aka make a profit.

Trading/reselling basically makes our entire economy work. Yes, I know re-sellers who know the value of items may snipe your auctions, buyout that nice looking item that you had your eye on to turn a profit, etc. Yeah, it rocks and it sucks, happened tonnes of times to me on both sides.

I see trading very very simply to be:
- The closer you want to sell an item to it's true value, the longer time/effort it will take.
- The lower you want to buy an item from it's true value, the longer time/effort it will take.
Therefore, there is a group of people that would rather save the time/effort to not go through this hassle.
So, ultimately, Traders/resellers make their PED by offering convenience
- Whenever you want to buy something. Someone can provide to you right away.
- Whenever you want to sell something. Someone can buy it from you right away.

Lets say an item worth +5000 sometimes may get sold for +2000. You see it, want to buy it. And dang, that trader got it for +3000, and is selling it for +4000. The item still depreciates overall value, but less so. But they make PED from a player! Well, don't hate on it. There has got to be a decent incentive for someone to put in their effort and PED to risk some gains here.

That said, I also don't think all types of trading are good. There's a whole bunch of ways people trade. It's an art. Sometimes people may trade like the real-world sleazy salesman making things up/pressuring. I don't like that. I personally value open and honest communication. Say if a trader buys from an auction house/player/shop, and then is clearly reselling the same item immediately after. That is not a problem to me whatsoever. In fact, I would prefer them to do that rather then to pretend to use it for some time and selling because they are "finished with it" or create some fake believable story for an item whose sole purpose is to be resold. I don't believe in the 24h rule.


My thoughts. Happy discussions, and Happy Easter!

~Morey
I totally get the whole idea of resellers being good for lazy/impatient people and their role for owners of items in a falling market, and they will always exist in an economy anyways. However, question is if the economy doesn't benefit more from the items actually being used by active players instead of being out of reach due to inflated prices. That was my main point in the now modded Slugstorm thread. Falling market due to excess supply and low demand, it was clear what the active hunters that would actually use the Slug were willing to pay, but some resellers figured it just has to be worth more and tries to maintain the high price. There are still loads of weapons and other gear (especially armors) that are hugely overpriced for their actual performance nowadays.

And no doubt there is a resale factor. Resellers indeed are frowned upon by many. Even if you as a reseller get an item sold eventually since some people just don't care, you do miss out on potential buyers. In many cases there are enough potential buyers around anyway, but doesn't look as bright in markets like the Slugs to lose several potential buyers. Also many sellers won't bother with you (more than as a form of pricecheck) as a reseller since they know whatever you would offer, they would likely be able to get more.
 
I never understood the hate towards resellers. In this game everyone has to b good with managing their resources. Resellers help the economy by taxing the lack of patiencs of some of us (mine included, at times) - they offer a premium service, by allowing you to sell your resource when there's no immediate demand of your good so you dump on them...
Hate towards this profession is a frustration because lack of one's patience or just laziness, but, haters gonna hate so it's all cool! :D

The hatred comes from the shady resellers that are more common (or used to be). Example: the guy who was trying to sell Terra amp bps for 150k to 600k (and succeeded) and was later caught manipulating auctions (I have the snaps), the well-named folks who try to buy people's rings, etc for only a couple K when they fetch 10x their ask price, the resellers who bottom feed on auction waiting for the order mistakes, and so on.

There are good resellers such a divinity, the one that starts with a C, or perhaps even the OP (don't know you but suspect you're well intentioned).. but it's the bad ones that get more press.
 
I do some trading on small scale too, mostly things I can use while I'm selling them. And to be honest never felt any hate towards me, although I don't pay attention to those things.

Reselling is the only thing slowing down the economy's natural tendency towards saturation. If I don't take an opportunity someone else will. Why should I feel bad about it?, it's not like it's easy and I've made my fair share of terrible investments too.

On the other side of the coin are the people that wait forever to buy something because it's never cheap enough... You want it for 20k now, and when prices come down to that you will want it for less. And while you blame traders for your demise you are the one undervaluing other peoples gear with your attitude.

What was the "E" in RCE again?
 
resellers are necessary now that there's virtually no reason to consume resources beyond crafting mining tools and tiering gear.

Something has to keep players shooting and dropping probes, lord knows MA doesn't give a fuck about that.
 
What's the difference from traders and resellers ? You think that if you go in twin and sell your ores to a "trader" you will recive the exactly MU price ? No ! He will give you a % less , because he will sell it forward because that's the way he profit . Ingame we are all traders , 90% are all resellers , the 10% left remain to the crafters , that really use the resources that you sold to him , but then the crafter will resale the items that he crafted doing profit , or at least trying. Same thing with the guns let's say , if you don't have patience you might sell it to a reseller and not to that 1 person that really use it.
So I don't see the difference from traders and resallers , cuz still everyone it's reselling the stuff that gets from hunting , mining , crafting . We are all traders and resellers.
Now someone it's more patient, some not , some are smarter some not , some are more greedy some not .
It's up to you to know how it's better for you to sell, use your stuff .
 
A trader simply buys from auction. A reseller pms you whenever you put something wanted on auction with a low sb. In this pm they try to lowball you under your sb.
That's the difference.
 
A trader simply buys from auction. A reseller pms you whenever you put something wanted on auction with a low sb. In this pm they try to lowball you under your sb.
That's the difference.

Basically this... had it happen a few times..


+rep
 
I totally get the whole idea of resellers being good for lazy/impatient people and their role for owners of items in a falling market, and they will always exist in an economy anyways. However, question is if the economy doesn't benefit more from the items actually being used by active players instead of being out of reach due to inflated prices. That was my main point in the now modded Slugstorm thread. Falling market due to excess supply and low demand, it was clear what the active hunters that would actually use the Slug were willing to pay, but some resellers figured it just has to be worth more and tries to maintain the high price. There are still loads of weapons and other gear (especially armors) that are hugely overpriced for their actual performance nowadays.

And no doubt there is a resale factor. Resellers indeed are frowned upon by many. Even if you as a reseller get an item sold eventually since some people just don't care, you do miss out on potential buyers. In many cases there are enough potential buyers around anyway, but doesn't look as bright in markets like the Slugs to lose several potential buyers. Also many sellers won't bother with you (more than as a form of pricecheck) as a reseller since they know whatever you would offer, they would likely be able to get more.

Ahh so what you are saying is that when an item collects dust and is not used, and when prices are inflated because of them.

But then if someone hoards a tonne of the same item,
less is in market place to be used, so market price goes up. Makes sense. But from the traders perspective, if they sell all of the hoarded items, each sale would decrease the price. So it's very risky business for the trader, but if he sees a market hole and buys up all of these things, you could say it's the traders fault for increasing the price. Or you could say it's the sellers fault for decreasing the price so much that traders pick it up.

Either way, traders see these market holes and put their ped where their mouth is. If they make a mistake and overvalue something, traders do lose ped. All in all, this whole process is exactly what slows down the general devaluation of everything. Just like the Law of entropy, entropia universe. Get it? Its almost like they saw it coming from the beginning. ;)

I honestly see this as how everything is. Lets take the example of tje guy that owns 50% of the clds. Because there is 50% less, price rises, and people accept that it is traded higher. Whenever he decides to sell, prices will plummet. But people aren't emotional about that reality because it seems it doesn't affect them. People get emotional when they have a stake in something or someone related. So, for slug, hey maybe it was a friend, and feelings amongst friends are quite the same.
 
A trader simply buys from auction. A reseller pms you whenever you put something wanted on auction with a low sb. In this pm they try to lowball you under your sb.
That's the difference.

Ah, I always thought both of them did both.
 
Ahh so what you are saying is that when an item collects dust and is not used, and when prices are inflated because of them.
No, I was talking about items that really should be a lot cheaper, looking at their performance in relation to other available gear. Not inflated due to low supply. I was also talking about weapons and gear of a somewhat limited amount. Not stackables.

Rest of your reply is just explaining core mechanics of a marketplace and supply/demand. As I said before, I totally get that and why there is always a place for resellers in an economy. What I did is questioned if it wouldn't be better for the economy if the items are actually used by active players instead of being kept out of reach. That will never happen though due to the very nature of an economy (where there is money to be made people will ofc take advantage) so no need pondering that any further.


... People get emotional when they have a stake in something or someone related. So, for slug, hey maybe it was a friend, and feelings amongst friends are quite the same.
Once again as mentioned, what I reacted on was the fact that instead of going to an active hunter that would put it to use, it will keep being kept out of the economy by a reseller. I found that annoying. That together with that I found it a stupid and risky resale in a falling Slug market; limited amount of potential buyers already due to level requirements, a short range weapon in the time of EST, with not much benefit of tiers due to the accuracy enhancer situation, and more and better stuff that keeps getting implemented. You can argue about tier costs but as it looks today, a buyers market, tiering stuff up is generally not worth it for most items if looking at pure resale value.
 
There is a group of players who I consider to be a Item Devaluing Mafia (IDM). They resell devalued items later on for higher prices.

These players use their influence in the forums to devalue items based on their own personal opinions. As a result we see players losing $1000s USD over months of devaluation of items. The DOA Slugstorm is the current target.
Until recently the value sat around 20K for a Tier 0 and +30K for a Tier 10. Unhappy with this price being out of their reach, the IDM are systematically via auction and PCF attempting to bring down the value of this weapon.
With this fear in place, no one is buying as the thought has settled that the gun is worth less than what players want for it.

Other examples of IDM workings are like the Vampiric cloak with 12HP of health boost. Obviously this health boost can be matched by cheap pills and rings, not to forget the Perfected ring which barely fetches 1.4k, but they proffer the value to stay about 10K, clearly overvalued, yet what the IDM say, the forum listens to. With the fact real cash is involved in these transactions it is worrying these players have so much influence in the selling threads.
Another example was the VRex2000 SGA edition. It held a steady value of around 15k for ages, then the IDM came in and suddenly they were selling for 30-40k each!!! WTF? OOOOOhhh the community thinks it is of sudden amazing value...nothing actually changed. Now they are worth 15k again.

The fact is this, if you sell a Tier 10 DOA slugstorm for less than 30K, you are a retard and shafting your fellow Slugstorm owners. You are feeding the re-sellers to make great profits! A 30K weapon doesn't sell quickly.
 
Yea.. it's always funny when I've tried to sell an item, almost a half a dozen appear almost instantly for sale.

Want to buy an item? Well, one will sell it to you for 3x it's last sale because of [insert bogus formula and reason].
 
Once again as mentioned, what I reacted on was the fact that instead of going to an active hunter that would put it to use, it will keep being kept out of the economy by a reseller.

We believe differently. Guns sitting with a re seller's hands for a duration is not a problem.


No, I was talking about items that really should be a lot cheaper, looking at their performance in relation to other available gear. Not inflated due to low supply ... I found it a stupid and risky resale in a falling Slug market; limited amount of potential buyers already due to level requirements, a short range weapon in the time of EST, with not much benefit of tiers due to the accuracy enhancer situation, and more and better stuff that keeps getting implemented. You can argue about tier costs but as it looks today, a buyers market, tiering stuff up is generally not worth it for most items if looking at pure resale value.

Whether the market is good or not, whether I made a good decision or not, the market can judge that. I know it's worth more :). MU does not accurately reflect all item values.


There is a group of players who I consider to be a Item Devaluing Mafia (IDM). They resell devalued items later on for higher prices.

Lol yes, and auction manipulators.
 
An economy without traders/resellers, is not an economy!

Important part of the game, never will miss the resellers.

Beside that: Some planets don´t have enough of them, way to hard to sell loots there.

About items and its value discussion:

An items value is what buyer is willing to pay for it!

If you are not willing to pay the "inflated" price for an item, its just your personal view on it, not a general truth, as someone very likely has already paid much more for it than you are ever willing to pay for it.
Same personal view counts for sellers price! If he paid to much, he can´t resell it!

Example:
For me an Imp FAP has an value of 90k PED, as that is what I paid for it. I know there is several offers way lower than that, but that doesn´t scare me. For me my Imp FAP is still worth 90k PED, as I bought it to use it, not to resell it.
So if any reseller/trader buy an item at 30k PED he personally values at 35k PED, and then refuse to sell it for less, its absolutely ok for me.
He might sit forever on it, if to many similar items are on the market that get sold for less, but in this case it does not hurt the economy or MA in any way, as the item is still available, it just hurts the trader as he locked away his 30k PED he can´t get back at that moment.

Its like RL! I never get it why some people pay millions of dollars for an old stamp? Well collectors, I don´t need to understand that :D
On the other side not many people understand why I paid 5k Euro for my billardqueue! I don´t care if those people understand! They are simply no billard players but I am, and the queue is really worth what I paid for it, as I already made a lot more money from competition prizes I won than what I paid for the queue.
Same may count for EU! A big as item can win events, and beside the money paid for the item some count in how many money they make out of the use of it. Example: Terminator (inflated ?) - well no need to discuss this, as those owning it know its real value and those complaining about it, should know it too, but then why those complainers haven´t bought it when it was up for sale?

At the end its all dynamic
 
What's the difference from traders and resellers ? You think that if you go in twin and sell your ores to a "trader" you will recive the exactly MU price ? No ! He will give you a % less , because he will sell it forward because that's the way he profit

The difference as I see it: The street trader who pays a bit less than auction is doing a service; though he's paying less than auction, he'll offer more than the trade terminal, and as he buys Resources from hunters/miners those Resources can later be sold to crafters.

That kind of trading takes long time.

The resellers on the other hand, it's the kind of people who'll engage in endless +1 ped bidwars in auction, and immediately after having won an auction he'll sell it for 30% more. It's not about being "impatient"; it's about normal people with real lives can't spend hours for the resellers to get tired.

Normal players, who's buying a weapon from auction is most likely going to use that weapon, get loot, sell the loot (or, well TT the loot because there are almost no serious street traders anymore). Anyhow, their PEDs will be spent ingame, either to buy fun items (with intention to keep), or cycled in hunting or other decay related activities, so that MA get some Money to run the servers.

Then, we have the resellers. I got a feeling about half of them are "all ones"-attribute kind of people, just standing by auctioneer, waiting for a good offer 24/7. Doing nothing that would cause decay. And, any profit they make probably be given to the "master puppy" (I got a feeling alot of those 1 attribute avatars are alts), who in the end will withdraw it.

One example of how resellers have influenced the market: For AUDs, as long as the AUDs were availible at arkadia underground NPC, the market value was less(!) than the initial 50 peds. I there had the feeling that there was a lot of resellers who thought the supply would end as fast as it did with the CLDs (more about that later). When the AUDs were moved to the "shop" webpage, the value stabilized around 52 ped or so, which would be a fair price where 50 ped was the "base price" and 2 ped would correspond to the work it took to buy it with deposited money and then selling it ingame.
Now, after the supply of AUDs have stopped, the price of AUDs have started to go up.

As for CLDs, when they were initially sold, there were resellers who camped the auction. The only thing they did, was first (Before everyone knew about it) buying from the global auction and re-posting on Calypso auction. Then, as global auction got known, the resellers would start to hammer the refresh button 24/7, buying from auction, and reposting in public auction. That is, the resellers didn't do this to be nice; it was an opportunity for auction campers (possibly with macro software) to earn easy peds by liniting sales from MA to normal players and instead forcing players to buy from the resellers.

Another example where resellers have had an impact of supply to normal players are apartments. Long ago, there were tens of pages in auction with apartmetns at fixed prices, sold (and refreshed) directly by MA. There were apartments in pretty much all major cities on Calypso. Then, over a day the resellers woke up. A normal player just noted that the pages with apartments quickly were removed, and possibly contacted MA support. But it was apparent, that it was resellers who took this as an opportunity; for the price of one calypso hangar it was possible to buy up all apartmetns on Calypso. For a normal player, this quickly ment that instead of a choice of apartment (such as which floor and in which city) for say 300 ped, a player who would want an apartment would now have to buy it from a reseller at at least double-triple price. And didn't have a choice; a player had to take whatever apartment the resellers had posted in auction at the moment.

And, well, I Think it's a bit sad that the prices for AUDs and CLDs have became doubled. Here I just got a feeling, but the feeling is that at least the CLD market is resellers passing the CLD deeds back and forth between themselves and each time add say 50 ped - pushing the CLDs further and further away from normal players. And a normal player knowing that if they buy a reseller priced CLD, that those Money will leave the game.

(Well, for me the CLD market is kind of personal, I had some bad luck there. I put my CLDs in the bank at some Points, and eventually I thought I paid too much in bank interest to keep them, so I let them expire. A week later the announcement came that MA would release lots, and well, it did didn't felt fun. And now with resellers continuing to press CLD prices upward, and almost no normal player Selling any CLDs, it doesn't feel as fun anymore. Maybe, just maybe, I might factor in who gets a slice of my PEDs when I do my activities when I decide where to do them... if the PEDs from the expentures will go to resellers who just will withdraw it, if it goes to someone I Think does great work for development, or if even I have a symbolic share in it. I really would want to be able to buy at least one CLD back, but I don't want to give my PEDs, that comes from IRL deposited Money, to a 1-attribute auction drone..)

Oh, and apartments: I have the feeling that when a planet partner releases apartments, i got the feeling a big part of those released apartments will go to the resellers we all know. And, again, that kind of resellers I mean will only pay 1 ped more than the highest bid of a real player (unless there are two resellers bidwaring). Instead of going to a normal players, those apartments are likely to be "investment objects", or end up somewhere in a shopkeeper somewhere and forgottten about. At a reseller price (ie 30% surcharge). Not long ago, apartments were sold in Rocktropia. The idea was this: To be able to get into the "government", you must be committed but having some sort of estate deed (ie apartment, shop etc). Now, to kill the joy, there was of course some resellers who bidwared for the apartments, and one even said it was as investment object.
Now lets see if MA can help Rocktropia to release more apartments Before the government thing gets decided, and at the same time try to keep the pure resellers who are just are in it for the profit from reselling.
 
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The difference as I see it: The street trader who pays a bit less than auction is doing a service; though he's paying less than auction, he'll offer more than the trade terminal, and as he buys Resources from hunters/miners those Resources can later be sold to crafters.

That kind of trading takes long time.

The resellers on the other hand, it's the kind of people who'll engage in endless +1 ped bidwars in auction, and immediately after having won an auction he'll sell it for 30% more. It's not about being "impatient"; it's about normal people with real lives can't spend hours for the resellers to get tired.

Normal players, who's buying a weapon from auction is most likely going to use that weapon, get loot, sell the loot (or, well TT the loot because there are almost no serious street traders anymore). Anyhow, their PEDs will be spent ingame, either to buy fun items (with intention to keep), or cycled in hunting or other decay related activities, so that MA get some Money to run the servers.

Then, we have the resellers. I got a feeling about half of them are "all ones"-attribute kind of people, just standing by auctioneer, waiting for a good offer 24/7. Doing nothing that would cause decay. And, any profit they make probably be given to the "master puppy" (I got a feeling alot of those 1 attribute avatars are alts), who in the end will withdraw it.

One example of how resellers have influenced the market: For AUDs, as long as the AUDs were availible at arkadia underground NPC, the market value was less(!) than the initial 50 peds. I there had the feeling that there was a lot of resellers who thought the supply would end as fast as it did with the CLDs (more about that later). When the AUDs were moved to the "shop" webpage, the value stabilized around 52 ped or so, which would be a fair price where 50 ped was the "base price" and 2 ped would correspond to the work it took to buy it with deposited money and then selling it ingame.
Now, after the supply of AUDs have stopped, the price of AUDs have started to go up.

As for CLDs, when they were initially sold, there were resellers who camped the auction. The only thing they did, was first (Before everyone knew about it) buying from the global auction and re-posting on Calypso auction. Then, as global auction got known, the resellers would start to hammer the refresh button 24/7, buying from auction, and reposting in public auction. That is, the resellers didn't do this to be nice; it was an opportunity for auction campers (possibly with macro software) to earn easy peds by liniting sales from MA to normal players and instead forcing players to buy from the resellers.

Another example where resellers have had an impact of supply to normal players are apartments. Long ago, there were tens of pages in auction with apartmetns at fixed prices, sold (and refreshed) directly by MA. There were apartments in pretty much all major cities on Calypso. Then, over a day the resellers woke up. A normal player just noted that the pages with apartments quickly were removed, and possibly contacted MA support. But it was apparent, that it was resellers who took this as an opportunity; for the price of one calypso hangar it was possible to buy up all apartmetns on Calypso. For a normal player, this quickly ment that instead of a choice of apartment (such as which floor and in which city) for say 300 ped, a player who would want an apartment would now have to buy it from a reseller at at least double-triple price. And didn't have a choice; a player had to take whatever apartment the resellers had posted in auction at the moment.

And, well, I Think it's a bit sad that the prices for AUDs and CLDs have became doubled. Here I just got a feeling, but the feeling is that at least the CLD market is resellers passing the CLD deeds back and forth between themselves and each time add say 50 ped - pushing the CLDs further and further away from normal players. And a normal player knowing that if they buy a reseller priced CLD, that those Money will leave the game.

(Well, for me the CLD market is kind of personal, I had some bad luck there. I put my CLDs in the bank at some Points, and eventually I thought I paid too much in bank interest to keep them, so I let them expire. A week later the announcement came that MA would release lots, and well, it did didn't felt fun. And now with resellers continuing to press CLD prices upward, and almost no normal player Selling any CLDs, it doesn't feel as fun anymore. Maybe, just maybe, I might factor in who gets a slice of my PEDs when I do my activities when I decide where to do them... if the PEDs from the expentures will go to resellers who just will withdraw it, if it goes to someone I Think does great work for development, or if even I have a symbolic share in it. I really would want to be able to buy at least one CLD back, but I don't want to give my PEDs, that comes from IRL deposited Money, to a 1-attribute auction drone..)

Oh, and apartments: I have the feeling that when a planet partner releases apartments, i got the feeling a big part of those released apartments will go to the resellers we all know. And, again, that kind of resellers I mean will only pay 1 ped more than the highest bid of a real player (unless there are two resellers bidwaring). Instead of going to a normal players, those apartments are likely to be "investment objects", or end up somewhere in a shopkeeper somewhere and forgottten about. At a reseller price (ie 30% surcharge). Not long ago, apartments were sold in Rocktropia. The idea was this: To be able to get into the "government", you must be committed but having some sort of estate deed (ie apartment, shop etc). Now, to kill the joy, there was of course some resellers who bidwared for the apartments, and one even said it was as investment object.
Now lets see if MA can help Rocktropia to release more apartments Before the government thing gets decided, and at the same time try to keep the pure resellers who are just are in it for the profit from reselling.

Great post :) Pretty much its same happend in explosive IV and III . Go please check auction and see who are selling them and you will understand :D .
 
Mindark promises to not allow market manipulation but they are very, very, very far behind and lax on that promise on a daily basis.
 
Mindark promises to not allow market manipulation but they are very, very, very far behind and lax on that promise on a daily basis.

I do see that too. People sell a huge stack of AUDs or etc on a dead planet for either too high or too low back to themselves. We've called that toileting when someone does that to a massive stack of AUDs at +0.01 or something.

You can these in the massive volume and price spikes/dips that make no sense on AH just to manipulate MU.
 
I do see that too. People sell a huge stack of AUDs or etc on a dead planet for either too high or too low back to themselves. We've called that toileting when someone does that to a massive stack of AUDs at +0.01 or something.

You can these in the massive volume and price spikes/dips that make no sense on AH just to manipulate MU.

People did it with arkoins when I was going after my LA. They did it to adm too. Luckily they did it much later in my campaign and took a while for them to wise up.
 
People did it with arkoins when I was going after my LA. They did it to adm too. Luckily they did it much later in my campaign and took a while for them to wise up.

That is completely wrong for ppl to do.
 
A trader simply buys from auction. A reseller pms you whenever you put something wanted on auction with a low sb. In this pm they try to lowball you under your sb.
That's the difference.

Absolutely! I totally agree about your description about a reseller and a trader. That's how I perceive it too.
 
The gaming economy is very difficult, so you need to spend a lot of time studying the patterns of the auction. Because there are so many manipulations
 
Oh, and apartments: I have the feeling that when a planet partner releases apartments, i got the feeling a big part of those released apartments will go to the resellers we all know. And, again, that kind of resellers I mean will only pay 1 ped more than the highest bid of a real player (unless there are two resellers bidwaring). Instead of going to a normal players, those apartments are likely to be "investment objects", or end up somewhere in a shopkeeper somewhere and forgottten about. At a reseller price (ie 30% surcharge). Not long ago, apartments were sold in Rocktropia. The idea was this: To be able to get into the "government", you must be committed but having some sort of estate deed (ie apartment, shop etc). Now, to kill the joy, there was of course some resellers who bidwared for the apartments, and one even said it was as investment object.
Now lets see if MA can help Rocktropia to release more apartments Before the government thing gets decided, and at the same time try to keep the pure resellers who are just are in it for the profit from reselling.


I'm quite interested in the government thing. Do you have any links or references where others or even officials may have talked about that?



Anyway, I was thinking one solution to overcome resellers could be using the gift system within the game i.e. the system used to gift players at christmas etc. So it could work something like this - have the planet partner state specifically what needs to be done to get an item and the rules governing how the distribution/"gift" work. Here ofcourse it's not a gift but a buying process that makes use of the gift system. For example a planet partner could make an apartment token. Every player is allowed to buy one such token then the planet partner uses the criteria whoever has an apartment token gets an apartment deed.

This would raise some other challenges e.g. apartment tokens may not be selective enough agaisnt type of apartment hence some luck involved. A solution to that could be to have different categories of apartment tokens to differentiate between different apartments.

Another problem would be the use of multiple avatars. Players who have multiple accounts or don't have issues with making multiple accounts would have an obvious advantage as they would be able to buy multiple apartments depending on how many such multiple avatars they have. This would again bring us to square one as the player who plays honestly would be at an obvious disadvantage and would only be able to buy one apartment.
 
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