The New 2.0 Loot system : Observations and Advices

bigPaul

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Paul Ray Spinn
Ok, let's start from the MindArk's announce of the new 2.0 Loot system :

Bertha Bot Developer Notes #11 - Loot 2.0 Developer Notes #11 - Loot 2.0

Later this month, MindArk will be releasing a special Loot 2.0 Version Update that will overhaul the way in which hunting loot is calculated and distributed.
Many of the features and systems added over the past few years have gradually led to this update, which will significantly improve overall loot returns for the vast majority (upwards of 98%) of participants.

The information in this Developer Notes article is intended to inform participants of the upcoming changes and to gather initial impressions and feedback to help ensure a smooth implementation of this exciting update.

Please bear in mind that the changes described below are still being finalized and tested, so some specific details may be changed upon release, while other changes may require additional refinement or testing and therefore may not appear in the initial Loot 2.0 release, but instead in subsequent patches or Version Updates.



Loot Changes
Loot calculations will be optimized and improved to better factor in the various costs associated with hunting activity, including: healing, ammo consumption, buffs, tool and armor deterioration, attachments, and more.

A special hunting bonus pool will be implemented that will distribute funds from various sources, including skill misses, PVP, marketing and special events, which will improve overall loot returns for all participants.


A new Economy rating parameter will be introduced, on a scale of 1-100, that indicates the efficiency of a tool and which influences loot calculations. This change from the once dominant damage/pec model will provide the design team with more freedom to release exciting and interesting items with a wider range of damage output and special effects. For example, our team will have the ability to create powerful new items that provide access to challenging and exciting content without dramatically increasing cost to play. Existing items will be assigned Economy values that reflect their relative efficiency to one another and to the entire array of items in the universe.


Avatar skills will play a role in loot calculations and this role will be expanded in future Version Updates.
Imagine new professions that offer hunting specialization opportunities and a way to incrementally increase net loot returns for dedicated and active hunters.


MindArk has been monitoring the community discussions concerning so-called 'loot waves' and will implement changes in the Loot 2.0 and subsequent Version Updates that will address this issue by improving the distribution of resources and items, with the goal of ensuring that loot opportunities are more interesting, dynamic and fair for all participants.

Ammunition will be removed from hunting loot. This change has been requested by many participants over the years and will assist participants in more accurately tracking their results.


Loot value calculations and the composition of the items in loot will be affected by properly matching avatar skills and gear to the creature being hunted, rewarding efficient kills with more interesting loot.
For optimal loot, it will be important to avoid inefficiencies such as low damage output compared to creature health, excessive time and cost to kill, overkill damage, unmaxed weapons and other factors.


This system is intended to reward game knowledge, which has traditionally been an important and unique aspect of success in Entropia Universe, and to provide opportunities for participants to improve their loot returns via experimentation, optimization and specialization.

Also in the Loot 2.0 Version Update will be a range of improvements to various other systems with an eye toward lowering costs and increasing enjoyment for all Entropians. An example of such are the following planned changes to armor:

Armor Changes
[...]


Our design and development teams have been working very hard on these important changes for many months now, and MindArk looks forward to incorporating valuable feedback from our wonderful and passionate community leading up to the release of Loot 2.0 !


It's remarkable that MindArk looks forward to incorporating valuable feedback from the "wonderful and passionate" player community :

in my opinion this 2.0 loot system is a big step forward from the old loot system based on cycles ("waves"), it's surely more open, more "democratic" :
now everyone knows what to look for hunting success.


Obviously, like all new things, some refinements must be defined and eventually implemented.


I would like to focus on the most "controversial" part of the system, colored in red :
" Avatar skills will play a role in loot calculations and this role will be expanded in future Version Updates.
Imagine new professions that offer hunting specialization opportunities and a way to incrementally increase net loot returns for dedicated and active hunters. "


In my opinion, instead of introducing new questionable hunting professions (i imagine they might have in mind something like "Atrox Grandhunter", "Feffoid Poor Hunter", "Aurli Average Hunter", and such, as new possible hunting professions), that would lead to making a player "ENSLAVED" by one mob (=extremely boring gameplay) ,

they should keep the things as simple as possible,
focusing on the mere creation of a new attribute, so not a real skill (the current avatar attributes are "Health, Agility, Intelligence, Psiche, Stamina, Strenght ") .

So the new attribute might be named "Hunting Efficiency", or even "Hunting Profitability".
Why i suggest an attribute instead of a skill ?

Because an attribute is tied to its own avatar, it can't be transferred to another avatar
(e.g. "chipped" on empty skill implants)
:

and in my opinion this is necessary, otherwise some avatars might become simply "invincible" lootwise, by buying the new looting skill chips, or gathering them in more "obscure ways" from other players (e.g. some rich players might pay/exploit some noobs to increase their new "looting skill", then chipping it and transferring it to the rich avatars) .


So i strongly suggest to implement a new attribute, instead of a skill or -even worse- a bunch of new hunting professions .


Then it's up to MinkArk to study the best way for the player to increase this new hunting attribute :
i guess that the new hunting attribute might increase a bit more when you hunt hard mobs instead of low level mobs. This is logical .

Also the so called "hunting efficiency", in the terms introduced by MindArk, might play a role in increasing faster this new attribute.


(Finally, i reasonably think that when a player "specializes" in hunting one mob, then efficiency comes as natural result :
also for this reason it's better not to introduce a new hunting profession tied to a specific mob, that, as i said previously, would also "enslave" the player to a single mob, in attempt to achieve the dream of regular super loots; while the creation of dedicated hunters can be equally achieved by implementing simpler and less boring ideas).



This matter must be studied carefully to avoid unbalances that might advantage too much some/few players over the vast majority.



Ok: my initial proposal is offered.
What do you think about this subject ?


Let's share our ideas and help MindArk with our feedbacks,
also keeping the discussion as clean and constructive as possible.
 
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I would like to focus on the most "controversial" part of the system, colored in red :
" Avatar skills will play a role in loot calculations and this role will be expanded in future Version Updates.
Imagine new professions that offer hunting specialization opportunities and a way to incrementally increase net loot returns for dedicated and active hunters. "


In my opinion, instead of introducing new questionable hunting professions (i imagine they might have in mind something like "Atrox Grandhunter" , "Aurli Masterhunter", and such, as new possible professions),
that would lead to making a player "ENSLAVED" by one mob (=extremely boring gameplay)
,

i cant see it been that detailed, if anything you will see scanning skills working towards the new skills, like animal scanning > Game Hunter or Robot Scanning > Robot Hunter

you might find you get daily bonus or crafted pills that give for example 50% skill bonus when hunting Atrox or +5% loot bonus when killing Merp
 
Whatever MA intends to create with these changes only one thing really matters; Quote: "....which will significantly improve overall loot returns for the vast majority (upwards of 98%) of participants".

MA knows their player base and our skills, they would've done the maths. So it's unlikely they're going to give us something that most players have already achieved. Therefore the new system will almost certainly be another requirement for skilling to qualify for special loot status.

With the added flexibility for both MA and us to adapt our avatars to a unique style of profession. Hopefully this won't turn out to be the new blame culture within the forum...lol. You didn't add special buff X, that's why your returns are sh*t.

Although if it is a nerf "as-such" under the hood "to force more skilling", I don't really care, as long as the main suggestion from MA turns out to be true. That peds last much longer and we're able to turnover peds many more times during our gameplay.

I've viewed many of these changes over the years like Mexican food, it all turns out to be the same, just wrapped up differently. I really hope that's not the case this time, you become more cynical as you get older.

Real change a new approach is most welcome, and speculation has little value. So let see what they throw at us, try it and see what we think.

Rick
 
Unfortunately I suspect this may be step back to what loot did a few years back... higher loot due to more folks getting no looters... except now low looter will be hide etc instead of ammo
 
Ok, let's start from the MindArk's announce of the new 2.0 Loot system :

I would like to focus on the most "controversial" part of the system, colored in red :
" Avatar skills will play a role in loot calculations and this role will be expanded in future Version Updates.
Imagine new professions that offer hunting specialization opportunities and a way to incrementally increase net loot returns for dedicated and active hunters. "

I've not seen mention in other discussions about loot 1.0 that camping one mob may actually lower the higher multi chances on them.

Most people have probably seen that after some vus individual mob types hit harder for a while after some setting is reset or whatever until you have killed enough again for them to somehow gain more respect for you again.

What I've not seen mentioned is that globals become harder to get after you've killed thousands of them. My example could be carabok, of which I've killed maybe 300k or so. I used to get a 10 pedder every 10k kills or so, but this then started to extend to every 20k and more. At first I thought it might be general MA nerfs, but others on tracker were still able to get globals at apparently similar rates. However, others topping the all-time list were also no longer progressing as fast. Of course this may also be due to them no longer doing carabok, but I knew I was still active and not getting the globals. Yes, we can all have bad patches, but my 'curve' never recovered on them. I thus saw this as a way of penalising mob camping, but it could also have been related to my overall skills growing - I've not looked at other punies enough really, except for noting that I only got one global on monura m+f missions, which is some 32k mobs.

Maybe MA are going to change a few things on this part of loot formulas, which could be mob specific and overall skills/ profession levels of chosen weap.

Sometimes MA seem to completely invert a function - so possibly camping a mob may improve loots over time now. We will see ... :)
 
Unfortunately I suspect this may be step back to what loot did a few years back... higher loot due to more folks getting no looters... except now low looter will be hide etc instead of ammo

Or something else with the same tt value as ammo

For those worried about crafting being neglected; there are also plans in motion to reinvigorate the crafting profession, and lots of new blueprints will be in the release scheduled for later this month.

I'll be amazed if we don't get a handful of new stackables along with them.
 
I am pretty sure it will kill my Imk2 eco
 
What happened with last few years advertised MA orientation towards causal player?
 
I am pretty sure it will kill my Imk2 eco

Lol.
Yes you must act fast until you are still in time.
But I'm human and will help you. I can save you from disaster.
If it is clean i offer 14k peds.
If it is tiered then you provide gun and tiering skills gained for same price, if not i offer 6k peds lol.
 
I am pretty sure it will kill my Imk2 eco

You've keep saying this.... and yet no one knows any actual facts yet.... don't panic. Or do panic and fire sell it, its up to you. But honestly you won't get any real answers on it. All of us with MU items are in the same boat. We know nothing and we can just pray, and prepare for the worst...
 
You've keep saying this.... and yet no one knows any actual facts yet.... don't panic. Or do panic and fire sell it, its up to you. But honestly you won't get any real answers on it. All of us with MU items are in the same boat. We know nothing and we can just pray, and prepare for the worst...

True, but knowing mindark it can't be good also knowing they want to kill high Mu items to make it more playable for others. Preparing for worst is prolly selling. And some have more cash and care less about theyr high end items
 
Imo some parts in Loot2.0 are new, but some are also old, they already excist, but will be "polished".
 
You've keep saying this.... and yet no one knows any actual facts yet.... don't panic. Or do panic and fire sell it, its up to you. But honestly you won't get any real answers on it. All of us with MU items are in the same boat. We know nothing and we can just pray, and prepare for the worst...

Answer is in Loot 2.0 announcement. An imk2 owner have all requirements for very efficient hunt on certain mobs. Just will need to take into account more variables like right armor, right fap, killing time. mob hp, mob regen, finisher, buffs and so on. In the end players do it also now but it will become more important and evident after loot 2.0. Just ask yourself if you would hunt punies with imk2 right now.
 
Answer is in Loot 2.0 announcement. An imk2 owner have all requirements for very efficient hunt on certain mobs. Just will need to take into account more variables like right armor, right fap, killing time. mob hp, mob regen, finisher, buffs and so on. In the end players do it also now but it will become more important and evident after loot 2.0. Just ask yourself if you would hunt punies with imk2 right now.

Imo, a lot of those variables are already active in Loot 1. ;) But sure, it will more polished in Loot 2.
 
Or something else with the same tt value as ammo

even if its just shrapnels, its much better than ammo, as you can track your loots vs costs much more accurate when not shooting the looted ammo :)
 
Already do - I use melee. I think I've only fired a gun 2-3 times since vu9.
 
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