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Major concern regarding teaming and shared loot in Loot 2.0

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GrannyKillz said:
You dont think people stack pills to get faster kills to skill faster? :scratch2:
Click to expand...

In this case, that's not the purpose.

MA moved to a efficiency model, and put a efficiency parameter on guns to help players decide what guns would have better TT return.

Works as intended except with shared loot where dpp matters.

The reason why it is an issue, is that, should that player with lower dpp hunt in a non-shared loot manner, his tt return % will be the same as that with the higher dpp, assuming the same efficiency parameter.

In shared loot, higher dpp will claw loot from lower dpp. The lower dpp has a disadvantage when doing shared loot, that would not exist if that player was not doing shared loot.

All things equal, a 3 vs 4 dpp player doing the same dps, will get the same loot back from a mob, but the 3 dpp player will have paid 30% more than than the 4 dpp player.

Player A with 3 dpp will lose approximately 13% loot (relative to their cost) which goes to Player B with 4 dpp, who will gain approx 16% return (relative to their cost input).
 
Here's a spreadsheet I put together to show how return gets impacted by DPP during shared loot....

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1lEm6lVyxSMX1G5eMPKXyy0X0RSBMAAvuGLp2QTgVzaE/edit?usp=sharing

In addition, the probability that the player loots an item in loot depends on % damage done, so it affects items distribution as well. I know some players have talked about newer player looting ESIs and such, but the higher dpp players are still the main benefactors of these high dpp items/buffs.
 
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If damage dealt is measured by HP and loot is paid out by damage done, dpp has an unfair advantage.
 
Jhereg said:
Here's a spreadsheet I put together to show how return gets impacted by DPP during shared loot....

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1lEm6lVyxSMX1G5eMPKXyy0X0RSBMAAvuGLp2QTgVzaE/edit?usp=sharing

In addition, the probability that the player loots an item in loot depends on % damage done, so it affects items distribution as well. I know some players have talked about newer player looting ESIs and such, but the higher dpp players are still the main benefactors of these high dpp items/buffs.
Click to expand...

Thanks for this fantastic informative post! This information is very worrying indeed!

Hopefully MindArk will be able to find the time to fix Shared Loot and Team Hunting in Loot 2.0 soon.

Until then, be careful everyone :)
 
Jhereg said:
Here's a spreadsheet I put together to show how return gets impacted by DPP during shared loot....

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1lEm6lVyxSMX1G5eMPKXyy0X0RSBMAAvuGLp2QTgVzaE/edit?usp=sharing

In addition, the probability that the player loots an item in loot depends on % damage done, so it affects items distribution as well. I know some players have talked about newer player looting ESIs and such, but the higher dpp players are still the main benefactors of these high dpp items/buffs.
Click to expand...

I wish all these theories would explain why, whenever I team-hunt with n00bs just for shits & giggles, and I'm doing by far the most damage to mobs, when an item drops, it almost always ends up with the n00b teammate. This has been happening to me since team hunting was a thing.

The probability for a n00b to get the item may be far lower than MY probability, but it's still a probability. I just find it so strange that even though my probability ought to be much higher, I almost never get the item, when it drops.
 
Coelacanth said:
I wish all these theories would explain why, whenever I team-hunt with n00bs just for shits & giggles, and I'm doing by far the most damage to mobs, when an item drops, it almost always ends up with the n00b teammate. This has been happening to me since team hunting was a thing.

The probability for a n00b to get the item may be far lower than MY probability, but it's still a probability. I just find it so strange that even though my probability ought to be much higher, I almost never get the item, when it drops.
Click to expand...

This is like saying, why do you never get the parcel "when the music stops".
 
Coelacanth said:
I wish all these theories would explain why, whenever I team-hunt with n00bs just for shits & giggles, and I'm doing by far the most damage to mobs, when an item drops, it almost always ends up with the n00b teammate. This has been happening to me since team hunting was a thing.

The probability for a n00b to get the item may be far lower than MY probability, but it's still a probability. I just find it so strange that even though my probability ought to be much higher, I almost never get the item, when it drops.
Click to expand...

"Correlation does not imply causation"

It can be summed up to being bad luck and you attributing it to being a factor of your avatar being cursed?
 
Jhereg said:
In this case, that's not the purpose.

MA moved to a efficiency model, and put a efficiency parameter on guns to help players decide what guns would have better TT return.

Works as intended except with shared loot where dpp matters.

The reason why it is an issue, is that, should that player with lower dpp hunt in a non-shared loot manner, his tt return % will be the same as that with the higher dpp, assuming the same efficiency parameter.

In shared loot, higher dpp will claw loot from lower dpp. The lower dpp has a disadvantage when doing shared loot, that would not exist if that player was not doing shared loot.

All things equal, a 3 vs 4 dpp player doing the same dps, will get the same loot back from a mob, but the 3 dpp player will have paid 30% more than than the 4 dpp player.

Player A with 3 dpp will lose approximately 13% loot (relative to their cost) which goes to Player B with 4 dpp, who will gain approx 16% return (relative to their cost input).
Click to expand...

Darkaruki said:
Thanks for this fantastic informative post! This information is very worrying indeed!

Hopefully MindArk will be able to find the time to fix Shared Loot and Team Hunting in Loot 2.0 soon.

Until then, be careful everyone :)
Click to expand...

13%+ loss for the noob/average player vs. 16%+ return for the ultra high DPP drugged out Uberz (and as you said greater chance to loot the high markup item). Makes me laugh when there are so many that either allow their own cognitive bias or their greed influence the truth :p This starts and ends with Mindark. Please make shared loot more equitable.
 
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WildD3mon said:
whitch weapons reach 4 dpp ?
Click to expand...

A&P Series Mayhem (Imp,Mod,Perfected) all of them with the good rings + some pills easy reach 4.0 DPP
 
ZippO said:
13%+ loss for the noob/average player vs. 16%+ return for the ultra high DPP drugged out Uberz (and as you said greater chance to loot the high markup item). Makes me laugh when there are so many that either allow their own cognitive bias or their greed influence the truth :p This starts and ends with Mindark. Please make shared loot more equitable.
Click to expand...

Except they use an extreme example with one player at 4 and the other at 3 and nothing else. So no, it's not really -13% and +16%. Usually the highest I see there is 3.5-3.7 and most others run at least some buffs.
 
Xen said:
Except they use an extreme example with one player at 4 and the other at 3 and nothing else. So no, it's not really -13% and +16%. Usually the highest I see there is 3.5-3.7 and most others run at least some buffs.
Click to expand...

I've been twice today and both times it was about 10-15 players, all of which were running sub-3.0 except for 2 or 3 players running slightly above and 1 player running about 3.9 and one player running about 3.95, so actually it's pretty accurate.
 
Jhereg said:
the higher dpp players are still the main benefactors of these high dpp items/buffs.
Click to expand...
This is true. DPP always was an important factor, ever since 2003. Even pre loot 2.0 you were able to do better than others, even make tt profit, even when you camped bristlehogs in cave or Nimets on Cyrene, but it was not from thin air nor MA's accounts, it was from other players.

Jhereg said:
In addition, the probability that the player loots an item in loot depends on % damage done,
Click to expand...

From my experience that's false. I am looting ESIs, but the majority go to someone else even when I'm the most DPs, no matter if I run accu or dmg enh. Actually the high TT ones are almost certain to go to a low dps. Proof of this is that my highest ESI looted was an 101 pedder from eviscerator 01 2 years+ ago.
Please test and or ask around people with actual experience.


Jhereg said:
Here's a spreadsheet I put together to show how return gets impacted by DPP during shared loot....

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1lEm6lVyxSMX1G5eMPKXyy0X0RSBMAAvuGLp2QTgVzaE/edit?usp=sharing
Click to expand...

I wish this was true :D My collected data of on shared clearly shows (me) that the impact you think dpp has is by far a lot lower than in reality. I should be rich according to this. Even with plenty of DPS I am sub 100% with considerably high DPP. So this has to be falseas well. So far my returns are worse than before loot 2.0 with better dpp.


Jhereg said:
Works as intended except with shared loot where dpp matters.
Click to expand...

I am pretty sure this works as intended. Especially since MA does shared events not almost on a daily basis and since MA told you in Twin Peaks to chill



Jhereg said:
The reason why it is an issue, is that, should that player with lower dpp hunt in a non-shared loot manner, his tt return % will be the same as that with the higher dpp, assuming the same efficiency parameter.

In shared loot, higher dpp will claw loot from lower dpp. The lower dpp has a disadvantage when doing shared loot, that would not exist if that player was not doing shared loot.

All things equal, a 3 vs 4 dpp player doing the same dps, will get the same loot back from a mob, but the 3 dpp player will have paid 30% more than than the 4 dpp player.
Click to expand...

Pretty much all of this is false.
Average players report shared feffs is a bit better for them, tt wise. Your data is from speculating but you should really try and ask them, how is their return there. You keep sepparating items and tt return but you don't seem to get that this is about the whole thing, if tt is lower by 1% but there's a few esi a week too - and I dare you to go loot esi in solo hunts on mobs under 1.5k HP...

MindArk can't come forward to explain this to a group of folks that won't understand even after that, it would mean they would have to discuss loot and they don't do that, except on a macro level.
All MA can do is ..

2018-05-24 12:55:22 [Local] [MindArkOfficial LiveSupport Zeus] Zho please stop.
2018-05-24 12:55:39 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] Am I not allowed to express myself here any longer?

And moments later,, EST pills and stuff:

dBivL8L.jpg


All I'm saying is you should stick your heads of of this numbers you think you got right and test or ask around.
The reasons for whoch you play the game could be different than the reasons someone else is playing the game.
Some play for the social part, some play for the graphics part (lol), some play for the hope of profit, some play to gamble, some find all this challanging their brains and try to beat the system. Regardless of the reasons, yours are your own fucking business, the next guy's reasons are his own fucking business.

Everyone should test and rely on your experience more than my or anyone else's numbers. It's that simple.
And when you see some special hunting theories, check the author's tracker, it may help you weight their experience.

have fun!


PS it's always great when people advise others to be mindful of their game style in this RCE envirnomnet, I'm sure there's a big bunch of players that got advice from me, but, pushing theories so far that you warn people to stay away from shared and hunt solo, based on your own speculations, is big bullshit and very misleading creating a very toxic atmosphere for others, think about it.
 
Don't like the shared loot rules stay out of and also don't team with your friends if he has a bit better gear

I like that we have now 2 different loot systems so we have 2 options
 
Evey said:
This is true. DPP always was an important factor, ever since 2003. Even pre loot 2.0 you were able to do better than others, even make tt profit, even when you camped bristlehogs in cave or Nimets on Cyrene, but it was not from thin air nor MA's accounts, it was from other players.



From my experience that's false. I am looting ESIs, but the majority go to someone else even when I'm the most DPs, no matter if I run accu or dmg enh. Actually the high TT ones are almost certain to go to a low dps. Proof of this is that my highest ESI looted was an 101 pedder from eviscerator 01 2 years+ ago.
Please test and or ask around people with actual experience.




I wish this was true :D My collected data of on shared clearly shows (me) that the impact you think dpp has is by far a lot lower than in reality. I should be rich according to this. Even with plenty of DPS I am sub 100% with considerably high DPP. So this has to be falseas well. So far my returns are worse than before loot 2.0 with better dpp.




I am pretty sure this works as intended. Especially since MA does shared events not almost on a daily basis and since MA told you in Twin Peaks to chill





Pretty much all of this is false.
Average players report shared feffs is a bit better for them, tt wise. Your data is from speculating but you should really try and ask them, how is their return there. You keep sepparating items and tt return but you don't seem to get that this is about the whole thing, if tt is lower by 1% but there's a few esi a week too - and I dare you to go loot esi in solo hunts on mobs under 1.5k HP...

MindArk can't come forward to explain this to a group of folks that won't understand even after that, it would mean they would have to discuss loot and they don't do that, except on a macro level.
All MA can do is ..

2018-05-24 12:55:22 [Local] [MindArkOfficial LiveSupport Zeus] Zho please stop.
2018-05-24 12:55:39 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] Am I not allowed to express myself here any longer?

And moments later,, EST pills and stuff:

dBivL8L.jpg


All I'm saying is you should stick your heads of of this numbers you think you got right and test or ask around.
The reasons for whoch you play the game could be different than the reasons someone else is playing the game.
Some play for the social part, some play for the graphics part (lol), some play for the hope of profit, some play to gamble, some find all this challanging their brains and try to beat the system. Regardless of the reasons, yours are your own fucking business, the next guy's reasons are his own fucking business.

Everyone should test and rely on your experience more than my or anyone else's numbers. It's that simple.
And when you see some special hunting theories, check the author's tracker, it may help you weight their experience.

have fun!


PS it's always great when people advise others to be mindful of their game style in this RCE envirnomnet, I'm sure there's a big bunch of players that got advice from me, but, pushing theories so far that you warn people to stay away from shared and hunt solo, based on your own speculations, is big bullshit and very misleading creating a very toxic atmosphere for others, think about it.
Click to expand...

Nice, you caught me taking advantage of low dpp noobs!

Too bad you don't post about how everyone attacked me after I try to tell them about the penalty for low dpp in shared loot during this shared loot event today. But no big deal.

I'm done. People can make up their minds themselves. I'll still warn people about this balancing issue, but it seems people don't give a damn how lower level players are treated, if it means they can make a dime.

I'm done caring.
 
Here's the full chat, sanitized (hopefully I didn't miss any names)...

2018-05-24 12:39:22 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] MA please fix shared loot :)
2018-05-24 12:39:53 [Local] [Player1] more mulc!
2018-05-24 12:39:59 [Local] [Player1] or mulmun looter elites!
2018-05-24 12:40:06 [Local] [Player1] pretty please
2018-05-24 12:40:15 [Local] [Player2] gosu
2018-05-24 12:40:43 [Local] [Player3] It seemed to suffer from morale failure
2018-05-24 12:40:48 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] It's going for the EST!
2018-05-24 12:41:21 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] EST for sale 1500%
2018-05-24 12:41:41 [Local] [Player1] ty
2018-05-24 12:41:43 [Local] [Player3] What are you using eve?
2018-05-24 12:42:38 [Local] [Eve Evey Everglades] got a scanner?
2018-05-24 12:43:47 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] MA are you going to fix shared loot? :)
2018-05-24 12:44:11 [Local] [Player4] the question is when
2018-05-24 12:44:22 [Local] [Player3] Try sending your gun link Eve
2018-05-24 12:44:51 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] ahoy:p
2018-05-24 12:44:58 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] 625 gleamner :p
2018-05-24 12:45:07 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] with a gamma
2018-05-24 12:45:16 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] and ares perf
2018-05-24 12:45:20 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] sweetness
2018-05-24 12:45:26 [Local] [Player1] lol
2018-05-24 12:45:28 [Local] [Player1] zeus crashed
2018-05-24 12:45:30 [Local] [Player1] :D
2018-05-24 12:45:40 [Local] [Player5] can u shut up and stop crying zho? :)
2018-05-24 12:45:48 [Local] [Player6] lol Player1
2018-05-24 12:45:49 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] Sorry :D
2018-05-24 12:45:57 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] We can't stop.
2018-05-24 12:45:57 [Local] [Player1] pearl neckless zeus :D
2018-05-24 12:46:23 [Local] [Player5] if shared loot isnt "fair" for u go buy one Gleamer for urself
2018-05-24 12:46:29 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] lol
2018-05-24 12:46:53 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] i won't be doing shared loot until they fix the distribution
2018-05-24 12:47:17 [Local] [Player1] so gtfo and let us play
2018-05-24 12:47:21 [Local] [Player1] write a support case
2018-05-24 12:47:25 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] lol
2018-05-24 12:47:26 [Local] [Player1] stop crying here
2018-05-24 12:47:35 [Local] [Player1] go bump your forum thread
2018-05-24 12:47:41 [Local] [Player7] ;p
2018-05-24 12:47:46 [Local] [Player5] +1
2018-05-24 12:47:55 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] I guess you enjoy losing 10-15% of your return
2018-05-24 12:48:02 [Local] [Player7] i mean zho i understand sort of but if u dont like it dont join?
2018-05-24 12:48:26 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] Just think it is time MA did something about it
2018-05-24 12:48:30 [Local] [Player1] hes like one of those vegan lesbians who get offended if you are straight and eat meat
2018-05-24 12:48:32 [Local] [Player1] just stfu
2018-05-24 12:48:35 [Local] [Player6] whats there to fix?
2018-05-24 12:48:44 [Local] [MindArkOfficial LiveSupport Zeus] File a support case Zho.
2018-05-24 12:48:49 [Local] [Player7] ;p
2018-05-24 12:48:50 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] It has been done
2018-05-24 12:48:52 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] Months ago.
2018-05-24 12:48:53 [Local] [Player5] rofl
2018-05-24 12:48:56 [Local] [MindArkOfficial LiveSupport Zeus] Okay.
2018-05-24 12:48:57 [Local] [Player1] ty
2018-05-24 12:48:59 [Local] [Player6] lol
2018-05-24 12:49:06 [Local] [Player5] NOONECARE
2018-05-24 12:49:09 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] It gets the same cut and paste response as it always does and closed.
2018-05-24 12:49:45 [Local] [MindArkOfficial LiveSupport Zeus] The thing is I'm doing it for players who wish to join.
2018-05-24 12:49:51 [Local] [MindArkOfficial LiveSupport Zeus] And have fun that's all.
2018-05-24 12:49:58 [Local] [Player5] true, u can leave zho
2018-05-24 12:49:59 [Local] [Player6] <3
2018-05-24 12:50:02 [Local] [Player7] Zeus most of us are grateful :D
2018-05-24 12:50:03 [Local] [Player1] and we appreciate that <3
2018-05-24 12:50:03 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] Sure, but do they all know the penalty the incur by using less DPP?
2018-05-24 12:50:03 [Local] [Player8] im heving hun tnx:)
2018-05-24 12:50:09 [Local] [Player9] :)
2018-05-24 12:50:31 [Local] [Player6] maybe it's an encouragement to become bigger and stronger
2018-05-24 12:50:38 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] lol
2018-05-24 12:50:56 [Local] [Player4] i think its kind of sucky most people
2018-05-24 12:50:59 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] the problem is most players don't even understand the balancing issue currently affecting shraed loot.
2018-05-24 12:51:04 [Local] [Player4] who attend shared loot dont even know how it works
2018-05-24 12:51:31 [Local] [Player1] oh jesus
2018-05-24 12:51:36 [Local] [Player6] ffs
2018-05-24 12:51:40 [Local] [Player1] find the right time and place
2018-05-24 12:51:41 [Local] [Player1] please
2018-05-24 12:51:50 [Local] [Player6] you mean the distribute of items in shared loot?
2018-05-24 12:51:54 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] No
2018-05-24 12:52:01 [Local] [Player6] then what do you mean?
2018-05-24 12:52:23 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] I mean that loot is cost based now, but shared loot is still damage split. Have you seen the post on PCF?
2018-05-24 12:52:38 [Local] [Player6] ofc its dmg split
2018-05-24 12:52:43 [Local] [Player12] are only theory's no1 knows for sure how loot goes :)
2018-05-24 12:52:49 [Local] [Player6] why wouldn't it be?
2018-05-24 12:52:53 [Local] [Player7] gl hof all
2018-05-24 12:52:58 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] Basically, when you do shared loot at lower dpp than some of buffed players who operate at 4dpp, you can incure 10-20% penalty to your return when
2018-05-24 12:53:02 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] compared to if you don't hunt in shared loot
2018-05-24 12:53:32 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] You can look at the PCF post, and I made a spreadsheet to demonstrate the effects.
2018-05-24 12:53:33 [Local] [Player6] bah, take your theory somewhere else
2018-05-24 12:53:39 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] It isn't a theory
2018-05-24 12:53:46 [Local] [Player6] Stop spreading your negative shit here
2018-05-24 12:53:48 [Local] [Player1] right click his name
2018-05-24 12:53:49 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] if you feel like sticking your head in the sand then please continue.
2018-05-24 12:53:53 [Local] [Player1] add to ignore
2018-05-24 12:53:57 [Local] [Player1] and it is all good agai
2018-05-24 12:54:03 [Local] [Player12] lol
2018-05-24 12:54:07 [Local] [Player6] I chose too because I play FOR FUN
2018-05-24 12:54:34 [Local] [Player6] and the only one messing with my fun atm is you Zho
2018-05-24 12:54:40 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] Could play for fun and not get your loot milked lol
2018-05-24 12:54:42 [Local] [Player10] [Player6] Demolish the whiners who do not understand FUN! <3
2018-05-24 12:54:45 [Local] [Player12] same for fun :) ppl are more calculated then rl here lol
2018-05-24 12:54:53 [Local] [Player11] taking part is having fun g/luck everyone:)
2018-05-24 12:55:09 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] The people who are calculated here take the peds
2018-05-24 12:55:18 [Local] [Player13] sure :)))
2018-05-24 12:55:18 [Local] [Player6] Stop whinng Zho
2018-05-24 12:55:28 [Local] [MindArkOfficial LiveSupport Zeus] Zho please stop.
2018-05-24 12:55:45 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] Am I not allowed to express myself here any longer?
2018-05-24 12:55:52 [Local] [Player8] no
2018-05-24 12:55:58 [Local] [Player6] This is not the right forum
2018-05-24 12:55:59 [Local] [Player7] your being very negative
2018-05-24 12:56:03 [Local] [Player7] toxic almost
2018-05-24 12:56:04 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] If you tell me I am no longer allwed to @Zeus, I will.
2018-05-24 12:56:23 [Local] [MindArkOfficial LiveSupport Zeus] You can express yourself but not on a negative way.
2018-05-24 12:56:44 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] I'm not sure how I am being negative? I'm stating the current status of the game and mechanics of shared loot.
2018-05-24 12:57:11 [Local] [Player6] You're stating negative BS
2018-05-24 12:57:17 [Local] [Player6] now stop
2018-05-24 12:57:26 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] I'm trying to keep newer players from getting their loot leeched without them knowing about it.
2018-05-24 12:57:30 [Local] [Player6] if you're not here to enjoy the current event then please leave
2018-05-24 12:57:38 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] I think Player6 is more toxic than I am.
2018-05-24 12:57:50 [Local] [Player7] ohh i got a kidney oil
2018-05-24 12:57:51 [Local] [Player12] honest to be loot no1 knows how it goes ...... in any way self or share :) so you type nonsense now honest to be
2018-05-24 12:57:53 [Local] [Player7] fromt he last 1
2018-05-24 12:58:02 [Local] [Player9] wow GZ! :)
2018-05-24 12:58:08 [Local] [Player7] profit :D
2018-05-24 12:58:35 [Local] [Player6] I'm only trying to get you to stop, it's not just me who's being annoyed by your comments
2018-05-24 12:58:42 [Local] [Player10] [Zho] - listen this: Delain - Scandal.
2018-05-24 12:59:03 [Local] [Player4] It would be nice if there was a dev note explaining that DPP is still relevant in shared loot since all the other ones say DPPis irrelevant to return
2018-05-24 12:59:27 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] Surprising to me how few players actually care about their return lol.
2018-05-24 12:59:38 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] @Player4 still got your EST?
2018-05-24 12:59:41 [Local] [Player15] Fun > Returns
2018-05-24 12:59:49 [Local] [Player6] You dont think I care?
2018-05-24 12:59:53 [Local] [Player7] ;p
2018-05-24 13:00:11 [Local] [Player1] is he still going on?!
2018-05-24 13:00:32 [Local] [Player10] [Zho] i dont give a shit. burn and lose 35k usd trough the uears. maybe someday hit big? till it just for fun. sure i get many do numbers on exel and
2018-05-24 13:00:37 [Local] [Player10] all. but thats not for me.
2018-05-24 13:00:37 [Local] [Player6] I care but I also have in mind that every time I join a shared loot event, I will most likely loose a couple of peds.
2018-05-24 13:01:18 [Local] [Player7] i know im losing peds but this is fun :D
2018-05-24 13:01:26 [Local] [Player4] OFC i dont want people to stop coming to shared loot, but i think its important people know the mechanics compared to solo hunting
2018-05-24 13:01:55 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] Screw it I'm joining EST team
2018-05-24 13:02:30 [Local] [Player7] est whats that?
2018-05-24 13:02:51 [Local] [Player6] Earth shock trooper Armor
2018-05-24 13:02:54 [System] [] Received Effect Over Time: Divine Intervention.
2018-05-24 13:03:09 [System] [] Item Set Effect: Increased Critical Damage (Earth Shock Set (3))
2018-05-24 13:03:11 [Local] [Player4] [Earth Shock Trooper Shin Guards (F,L)]
2018-05-24 13:03:19 [System] [] Item Set Effects removed (Earth Shock Set (3))
2018-05-24 13:03:19 [System] [] Item Set Effect: Increased Critical Damage (Earth Shock Set (5))
2018-05-24 13:03:31 [System] [] Item Set Effects removed (Earth Shock Set (5))
2018-05-24 13:03:31 [System] [] Item Set Effect: Increased Critical Damage (Earth Shock Set (7))
2018-05-24 13:04:10 [Local] [Player1] Tell me… Is being stupid a profession or are you just gifted?
2018-05-24 13:04:22 [System] [] Equip Effect: Life Steal
2018-05-24 13:04:30 [Local] [Player15] Studis is what stupid does.
2018-05-24 13:04:30 [Local] [Player6] Han la ner Player1, du behöver inte smeta mer :D
2018-05-24 13:04:34 [System] [] Received Effect Over Time: Faster Reload
2018-05-24 13:04:34 [System] [] Received Effect Over Time: Increased Critical Damage
2018-05-24 13:04:34 [System] [] Received Effect Over Time: Focused Blow
2018-05-24 13:04:34 [Local] [Player15] That's what mama used to tell me
2018-05-24 13:04:37 [System] [] You inflicted 142.9 points of damage.


Oh and this lovely gem later :)



2018-05-24 13:22:15 [Local] [Player6] just a thought.. if you're so oppose the loot share and think it's unfair that people use EST... WHY ON EARTH HAVE YOU BOUGHT ONE THEN?!
2018-05-24 13:22:30 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] umm for events?
2018-05-24 13:22:34 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] like merry mayhem?
2018-05-24 13:22:41 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] where dps mattered? LOL
2018-05-24 13:22:52 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] don't be silly @Player6
2018-05-24 13:22:54 [Local] [Player6] yeah...
2018-05-24 13:23:04 [Local] [Player1] stfu Zho
2018-05-24 13:23:07 [Local] [Player1] go choke on something
2018-05-24 13:23:11 [Local] [Player1] you piece of shit
2018-05-24 13:23:14 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] I thought you ignored me

edited: More complete picture of last bit lol
 
Last edited:
SKULL777 said:
Don't like the shared loot rules stay out of and also don't team with your friends if he has a bit better gear

I like that we have now 2 different loot systems so we have 2 options
Click to expand...

It's actually the same loot system in both instances except one of them then divides the loot incorrectly since the rules are antiquated.
 
Jhereg said:
Nice, you caught me taking advantage of low dpp noobs!

Too bad you don't post about how everyone attacked me after I try to tell them about the penalty for low dpp in shared loot during this shared loot event today. But no big deal.

I'm done. People can make up their minds themselves. I'll still warn people about this balancing issue, but it seems people don't give a damn how lower level players are treated, if it means they can make a dime.
Click to expand...

- I didn't caught you doing anything wrong but doing something you feel very strong against;
- it's what usually happens when social justice warriors meet the people they are trying to defend, AGAINST their will and without a real need to be defended;
- it's the usual conclusion SJW's reach when they are being slapped in their heads by those who are being defended by force


Have fun and let others have their fun too
 
So if the loot split is only based on damage, tell me how I got loot when all I did is stand there and take armor decay.
 
Jhereg said:
Here's the full chat, sanitized (hopefully I didn't miss any names)...
Click to expand...

Here's a tip, MA doesn't like it when a player runs around telling other players they shouldn't be participating in something.
 
Xen said:
So if the loot split is only based on damage, tell me how I got loot when all I did is stand there and take armor decay.
Click to expand...

I've tanked stuff and never gotten a loot window doing so a single time ever, if this actually happens to you please make a recording I would genuinely be very interested to see it.

Xen said:
Here's a tip, MA doesn't like it when a player runs around telling other players they shouldn't be participating in something.
Click to expand...

Based on the chat logs it seems more like he's trying to pressure the MA official in regards to addressing the issue since they mentioned addressing it in a dev notes but are now long past their estimated deadline and have not been communicating with the community.
 
Jhereg said:
Here's the full chat, sanitized (hopefully I didn't miss any names)...


2018-05-24 12:48:26 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] Just think it is time MA did something about it
2018-05-24 12:48:30 [Local] [Player1] hes like one of those vegan lesbians who get offended if you are straight and eat meat
Click to expand...


lol, brilliant, you vegan lesbian! :laugh:

Who said that?
Kudos to him!

Jhereg said:
Oh and this lovely gem later :)



2018-05-24 13:22:15 [Local] [Player6] just a thought.. if you're so oppose the loot share and think it's unfair that people use EST... WHY ON EARTH HAVE YOU BOUGHT ONE THEN?!
2018-05-24 13:22:30 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] umm for events?
2018-05-24 13:22:34 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] like merry mayhem?
2018-05-24 13:22:41 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] where dps mattered? LOL
2018-05-24 13:22:52 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] don't be silly @Player6
2018-05-24 13:22:54 [Local] [Player6] yeah...
2018-05-24 13:23:04 [Local] [Player1] stfu Zho
2018-05-24 13:23:07 [Local] [Player1] go choke on something
2018-05-24 13:23:11 [Local] [Player1] you piece of shit
2018-05-24 13:23:14 [Local] [Feng Huan SecretAznMan Zho] I thought you ignored me

edited: More complete picture of last bit lol
Click to expand...


But Jhereg, arent you being a bit hypocritical vegan lesbian here?
Fully buffed with your EST taking money from unwary noobs???

This "lovely gem" how you call it doesnt work in your favour here.

You blame everyone about having unfair advantage over others while doing the exact same shit. :scratch2:


I mean, I think it's noble of you and the others to warn people (justified or not) but this makes you the same as all the people you warn others about.
 
wizz said:
lol, brilliant, you vegan lesbian! :laugh:

Who said that?
Kudos to him!




But Jhereg, arent you being a bit hypocritical vegan lesbian here?
Fully buffed with your EST taking money from unwary noobs???

This "lovely gem" how you call it doesnt work in your favour here.

You blame everyone about having unfair advantage over others while doing the exact same shit. :scratch2:


I mean, I think it's noble of you and the others to warn people (justified or not) but this makes you the same as all the people you warn others about.
Click to expand...

Reading your posts on the forums is like listening to a really loud shitty screeching noise...
 
ZippO said:
Reading your posts on the forums is like listening to a really loud shitty screeching noise...
Click to expand...

Ah, at least good to hear it has such impact on you then.

Something like this?



*edit*

But Zippo, please tell me how this is not hypocrytical from Jhereg?
To blame someone for using EST and buffs, while wearing EST and using buffs?
 
Last edited:
wizz said:
lol, brilliant, you vegan lesbian! :laugh:

You blame everyone about having unfair advantage over others while doing the exact same shit. :scratch2:


I mean, I think it's noble of you and the others to warn people (justified or not) but this makes you the same as all the people you warn others about.
Click to expand...

Zho is just proving a point by wearing the EST and pills. His purpose was to show others how the loot calculation works at shared loot and how it can be gamed (right or wrong). People jump on him saying 'No DPP doesn't even matter, the lower your DPP the better items you get so it's worth it for everyone' (srsly btw??). It's education for the community to make their own decision about these events.

The same people who state 'DPP doesn't matter anyways' are the ones who jump on him for using high DPP gears too? But wait.....I thought a minute ago, when you were wearing it...it didn't matter. But all of a sudden, when he does, it matters? It's almost like you want to expressly have the benefit. Or something like that. It's hypocritical in the least to say anything about him wearing the gears. We all know how it works (some may pretend not to) and we will do what it takes to not be gamed as hard.

Not going to double-quote, but I am very much curious to Xen's statement about taking mobs and getting loot. I've had plenty of shared mobs where my slow M83 produces a Dodge on the first shot only to miss out on anything else...pumping the loot for others while obtaining none myself. So I don't really believe this happened or happens.

While on the topic of Dodge/Evade, yes, someone will jump on it saying that's exactly how it was in Loot 1.0 - a Evade/Dodge was your loss - but it wasn't someone else's gain. Loot was based on the mob and not the peds that went into it like before.

my 2pec, I'll see myself out :)
 
wizz said:
lol, brilliant, you vegan lesbian! :laugh:

Who said that?
Kudos to him!




But Jhereg, arent you being a bit hypocritical vegan lesbian here?
Fully buffed with your EST taking money from unwary noobs???

This "lovely gem" how you call it doesnt work in your favour here.

You blame everyone about having unfair advantage over others while doing the exact same shit. :scratch2:


I mean, I think it's noble of you and the others to warn people (justified or not) but this makes you the same as all the people you warn others about.
Click to expand...

He tries to address the problem with the MA official and is met with gross amounts of harassment by surrounding players and, after a while, decides to just say f it and put on the pills and EST, his reasoning for sharing these messages was to give context to what Eve posted to attack him and try to get us off the topic, which is as follows:

Shared Loot and Team Hunting scenarios currently are unbalanced on Loot 2.0
 
Slyk said:
Zho is just proving a point by wearing the EST and pills. His purpose was to show others how the loot calculation works at shared loot and how it can be gamed (right or wrong)..
Click to expand...

If this is the case then I take back my words,...

Darkaruki said:
He tries to address the problem with the MA official and is met with gross amounts of harassment by surrounding players and, after a while, decides to just say f it and put on the pills and EST, his reasoning for sharing these messages was to give context to what Eve posted to attack him and try to get us off the topic, which is as follows:

Shared Loot and Team Hunting scenarios currently are unbalanced on Loot 2.0
Click to expand...

but if you're a moral knight then this is not ok.
If you cant beat them, join them he?

In that case, just boycot the shared mobs.

Let's say that if all you guys say is true, and honestly, I think you're all right, then still, what's the problem?
You can all equip and buff up to do shared mobs. Same as the guy next to you.
And if you cant keep up, then simply stay away.
Nobody forces you to do shared mobs.

Same as for saying it's unfair that I can't hunt warlocks and ubers can.
It's unfair that they get all the nice MU loot and I dont.

Well, I know I cant hunt them since I didnt invest enough, so I simply accept it and dont hunt them.
Same as I dont do shared mobs when I'm heavily outgunned.

Remember, even though some wont admit, Entropia is a level playing field, but dont expect to compete if you dont want or cant invest like others did.

In other words, I dont like to level everything as it takes away ambition to grow.
 
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