Question: Kiting, exploit or not?
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fred5283
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Did this stem from the Discord chat? lol, we had this talk yesterday there.
Alright. No, it's not an exploit. You can run the same speed sideways as you can forwards, if you're skilled enough and willing to damage your wrist by turning sideways - jumping - re-positioning your cross-hairs and firing while in the air, then repeating......you're obviously playing the game much harder and more skillfully than someone who isn't doing that. That's just plain obvious.
If you called this an exploit and removed it, you're removing one of the ONLY skill based aspects of hunting in the entire game.
All you have to do is imagine yourself doing this type of thing in real life. You could walk backwards and shoot at someone, knowing your gun shoots 20/min and that while you're backing up there is a delay between your shots. Do you still walk slowly backwards doing that, know that you could just turn to the side, gain a better footing and run for those seconds? Better yet, you're more physically fit and tactful to also jump when you do that side step to keep your momentum while turning to fire again... all possible in real life.
This also does represent skill as well, some people aren't cut out to be able to make those movements so well and clear. Some people choose to turn and run only, some kite well. Some sit there and take it for...whatever reason.
Alright. No, it's not an exploit. You can run the same speed sideways as you can forwards, if you're skilled enough and willing to damage your wrist by turning sideways - jumping - re-positioning your cross-hairs and firing while in the air, then repeating......you're obviously playing the game much harder and more skillfully than someone who isn't doing that. That's just plain obvious.
If you called this an exploit and removed it, you're removing one of the ONLY skill based aspects of hunting in the entire game.
All you have to do is imagine yourself doing this type of thing in real life. You could walk backwards and shoot at someone, knowing your gun shoots 20/min and that while you're backing up there is a delay between your shots. Do you still walk slowly backwards doing that, know that you could just turn to the side, gain a better footing and run for those seconds? Better yet, you're more physically fit and tactful to also jump when you do that side step to keep your momentum while turning to fire again... all possible in real life.
This also does represent skill as well, some people aren't cut out to be able to make those movements so well and clear. Some people choose to turn and run only, some kite well. Some sit there and take it for...whatever reason.
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StarGlider
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Now your just being childish for the sake of being childish
Xen
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As I've already posted, it has nothing to do with ability to press keys correctly that I have a problem with. The problem, it seems to me, is that it produces a glitch that allows your avatar to move faster than it should normally be able to, sort of like the map key in space thing.
Xen
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No, I don't use the Discord chat. I haven't liked it for a while, just now bringing it up as it seems to have become acceptable practice and I am not that enthusiastic about playing atm.
It allows your avatar to move at the same pace as forward walking, nothing more, you can test that out. It's also slightly less than that also since you're required to have at least a small amount of time that you're still backpedaling. It's merely people using physics as they are in game and would be in real life.
Immortal
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Is it still skill if I record a macro
Well, to make the macro you'd have to get it right at least once. So yea, some skill there. This thread is about exploiting though.
Willfully admitting to automated play? Exploiting.
Playing normally with skill? Well, that's the current conversation we should get back to.
Mathilda
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If youre talking about the bug that happens when youre holding the strafe key at the same time as youre turning your character similar to how you bunny hop in counter strike for example you get a short amount of increased speed which is a client bug and you get rubberbanded back to your server position immediately after landing
Atrax
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'kiting' is a normal game play or hunting technique.
what you're talking about seems to be some sort of glitching.
Nothing wrong with kiting and as long zs you call (whatever) that you will continue to get confusion.
If the game has a motion glitch in it (press 'm' anyone?) there is no doubt that people will take what advantage they can. and tbh it's pretty expected.
Thanks for publishing though this leads to curiosity and pretty soon the technique will become standard if it's real and not just a client/display glitch. At that point if it's costing them money, MA may fix it. If it's not costing them money, it's not costing me money, so it's no matter.
'm' is a little different lol it incurs a cost to players but not MA.
Immortal
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But macros are exploits according to MA rules (third party software to control interaction).
Of course they have no way or motivation to clamp down on abusers, just like pvp-auto-follow "not exploit" exploit.
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no wonder. when you see someone with 100+ agility and like 40% speed boost this is not surprising. not sure but i think item cap is 25% speed boost + 15% from pills or something around that
and not sure if the bunny counts as item or not
The Abomb
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As many have said it is normal and I hate to say this but this is literally the dumbest thread I ever read in the hunting section. I was laying down reading this and it literally made my head hurt. Are some of you people this bored now to come up with topics like this? Is water wet would of been a better poll then this.
Holy jumping S**t balls actually playing the game and moving is an exploit? Come on guys!!!!!!
I am mainly melee and this doesn't change my opinion of the matter. This is a live action game with mechanics, skills and buffs. What is the point in even getting more agility for run speed or having speed items and buffs if you can't use them? Kiting is a HUGE part of action games! You are supposed to do it!
This thread makes zero sense and further more the word exploit is so heavily overused its insane. Just play the game. Oh by the way even though I am mainly melee I used speed buffs, pills and Pyro to kite mobs of Atrox Hatchling around in a cirlce for hours while killing them. I used the items exactly what they are intended for. Guess what? It also was tons of fun. The people that stood there and died should of learned how to adjust and play the game.
forgo
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I personally don't see why you would want to do it, but to each their own.
If most of the people who do this a lot actually let the mobs hit them all these years, they wouldn't be getting hit anymore, and wouldn't have to move. At this point I have to go up to prots and occy ect and go naked melee just to skill decent healing for the few times they do land.
I do tend to think that the crit nerfs are partially to blame for this style of play though, as those players generally never showed decays, and skewed results even more while using EST armor ect. I dont think it was the crits as much as the lack of healing/armor decays and high hof ratios that made MA even look at it.
If most of the people who do this a lot actually let the mobs hit them all these years, they wouldn't be getting hit anymore, and wouldn't have to move. At this point I have to go up to prots and occy ect and go naked melee just to skill decent healing for the few times they do land.
I do tend to think that the crit nerfs are partially to blame for this style of play though, as those players generally never showed decays, and skewed results even more while using EST armor ect. I dont think it was the crits as much as the lack of healing/armor decays and high hof ratios that made MA even look at it.
atomicstorm
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I concur with this too.
Xen
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As many have said it is normal and I hate to say this but this is literally the dumbest thread I ever read in the hunting section. I was laying down reading this and it literally made my head hurt. Are some of you people this bored now to come up with topics like this? Is water wet would of been a better poll then this.
Holy jumping S**t balls actually playing the game and moving is an exploit? Come on guys!!!!!!
I am mainly melee and this doesn't change my opinion of the matter. This is a live action game with mechanics, skills and buffs. What is the point in even getting more agility for run speed or having speed items and buffs if you can't use them? Kiting is a HUGE part of action games! You are supposed to do it!
This thread makes zero sense and further more the word exploit is so heavily overused its insane. Just play the game. Oh by the way even though I am mainly melee I used speed buffs, pills and Pyro to kite mobs of Atrox Hatchling around in a cirlce for hours while killing them. I used the items exactly what they are intended for. Guess what? It also was tons of fun. The people that stood there and died should of learned how to adjust and play the game.
Apparently, you do not know how to fucking read.
Don't worry though, you aren't the only one.
das
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The Abomb
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Mel
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Even though it's probably an unintended mechanic from MA's perspective, I don't see what Slyk was doing as wrong, but as something MA should really look at. If you are running a macro, that would be player exploit, and those that might do that, know it full well. And I would be in favor of the potential consequences. I've seen some players, mmm, very good at this...but is also kinda situational...and have only seen a couple times that macro might be involved imho. But, without this express mechanic, many avatars would have a tough time with the mob they are shooting. And honestly, why should this mechanic in game, negate so many other systems in game like defense skills, armor, healing, etc..think we all know it shouldn't. Then it falls to MA.
StarGlider
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Well, soon all mobs will run at the speed of formicacida's, and everyone's screwed.
lethal
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I'm going to say that some mechanics of the game make no sense if kiting was not allowed. Mob speed and range would make no sense to add in from a developers standpoint. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the opposing view to kiting seems to think that you are avoiding intended hits. However, the line for what is considered taking intended hits should be explicit if you're taking up this viewpoint. In other words, it would have to be stated or agreed upon that anything past standing still at your guns max range is considered avoiding intended hits, or that anything other than direct backwards movement (i.e. diagonal movement, strafe, or forward movement away from the mob) is considered avoiding intended hits.
Now I'm going to give an example from my personal gameplay as to why I think movement speed was thought out and intended for killing mobs. There was a mob on Cyrene called the monsterously toxic jellyworm. Before the hermetic ring or pills existed, it had about the same movement speed as the max movement speed of a 20 agility avatar. The mob was just barely kiteable for a long time, then one VU they changed the movement speed to where it is no longer kiteable. In other words, it was acknowledged that the mob was killable without getting hit through kiting. The dev team decided they didn't want it killable through kiting, so they changed its movement speed. BUT they left other more popular mobs like tide claws with the same kiteable movement speed. If they acknowledged that mobs were killable through kiting and tweaked certain mobs so they couldn't be kiteable while leaving others kiteable, then that shows me they have the intention of having kiteable mobs.[/INDENT][/INDENT]
Now I'm going to give an example from my personal gameplay as to why I think movement speed was thought out and intended for killing mobs. There was a mob on Cyrene called the monsterously toxic jellyworm. Before the hermetic ring or pills existed, it had about the same movement speed as the max movement speed of a 20 agility avatar. The mob was just barely kiteable for a long time, then one VU they changed the movement speed to where it is no longer kiteable. In other words, it was acknowledged that the mob was killable without getting hit through kiting. The dev team decided they didn't want it killable through kiting, so they changed its movement speed. BUT they left other more popular mobs like tide claws with the same kiteable movement speed. If they acknowledged that mobs were killable through kiting and tweaked certain mobs so they couldn't be kiteable while leaving others kiteable, then that shows me they have the intention of having kiteable mobs.[/INDENT][/INDENT]
Konve
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Of course it is not an exploit. If it was I think MA might have said something about it in the last ~15 years people have been doing it.
With that said if there is some magic way to make your avatar faster than intended - then that could be an exploit. But kiting as such is surely not.
With that said if there is some magic way to make your avatar faster than intended - then that could be an exploit. But kiting as such is surely not.