what's bad with crafting??

ntelinatsos

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Stelios AKALYPTOS ntelinatsos
except the few times that we get uber loots, most of the times crafting sucks and that's even worst when you want to craft expensive items that require high mu matterials or rare L, expensive bps..

btw, i'll just post a screen of my recently crafting result trying to craft some d-class amps (i logged out after this run)


it's not the first time i get similiar results, many times i tried to craft an expensive bp (let's say armatrix bc-90 or warp drives for example) and got this shitty success rate (some times i had matterials for like 10 clicks and got none success). I'm wondering if MA even consider to increase the success rate on some bps or if they are happy with the system as it is..

more screens:
 
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Its 18 click run on bp youre not even max sucess rate with :scratch2:

I did 700 clicks on QR 86 BP 2 days ago, 78% return... and that's happening quite often even with max QR....

How are we crafters supposed to pay hunters/miners good MU, when we constantly have to face crap like that? :scratch2:
 
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This is why I usually refrain from crafting on weekends.
 
seems sunday to monday night is better, also for mining :)

ya i notice this too

but as for OP you got lots of mats back - thats how crafting works - maybe try condition maybe :)?
 
I did 1 click and failed...crafting is broken!!!! :mad:

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:
 
Well MA did said they will implement that low volatility in a coming patch. They didn't mentioned though if this century.
 
Well MA did said they will implement that low volatility in a coming patch. They didn't mentioned though if this century.

yeah, low volatility, yet they didn't say low volatility + high returns.
For all we know they may implement a stable 80% return :laugh:
 
more screens..

MA need to consider changing the success rate when crafting L items..
 
MA need to consider changing the success rate when crafting L items..

You need to stop doing small runs and expecting a good result on an UL Blueprint.
 
You need to stop doing small runs and expecting a good result on an UL Blueprint.

This! Stop it with that low qr BP
And maybe you should also post the pics with 50%+ COS after 10 clicks. (there are allways to sides on the long run)

But yeah, it sucks specially if you use expensive (L) BPs, where it is harder to collect a good ammount of clicks.
 
You need to stop doing small runs and expecting a good result on an UL Blueprint.

it's just that in loot 1.0 & loot 2.0 skill used to determine your success rate and that you could expect ~33% success rate when you're maxed out, like the OP is.
QR determined your failrate.
So by the old system it should have produced ~12 successes and due to low QR ~5 fails in the 37 clicks.
This was okay, it kept investing in QR increases quite attractive.

In the current state, 5-10% success even with maxed out skill, it's just no longer attractive to invest into new BPs, especially in those which are more expensive to click.
 
While I do agree that success rate is borked (I used to make armatrix and got damn fed up with it), you have to realize that when you use a ul bp and you post tiny runs like that, you're going to get flamed.

Store for a longer run, do a long run and post your results, that will be much more helpful.
 
While I do agree that success rate is borked (I used to make armatrix and got damn fed up with it), you have to realize that when you use a ul bp and you post tiny runs like that, you're going to get flamed.

Store for a longer run, do a long run and post your results, that will be much more helpful.

store for a longer run, as in 10k clicks (because you're even getting flamed at 2k click runs), takes ~110k PED in materials for clicking along with about 500k PED residue.... btw, 50 20 click runs are 1k clicks as well and should be no different to doing 1k clicks in a row...
 
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You need to stop doing small runs and expecting a good result on an UL Blueprint.

i don't except a good result, i except a normal result.
I have res for 3-4 amps and that's what i need for one mining run, so, having matterials for like 12 clicks is enough i guess to get at least 3 amps (considering, that with the matterials from near success, i'll do about 16-18 clicks). but when you does ~18 clicks and you get only one amp and then you don't have peds to buy more matterials, that's sucks. and as you see in the screens, that didn't happen just once, happened many times in many bps too. Imagine having this shitty success rate trying to craft warp drives (mu on matterials cost like 120ped for each click). or when you get 3 clicks boosted very rare bp and you get one near success and two failures..

MA need to do something about that

also, when you craft items, you need to craft few items of each kind to have a variety and sell them in auction faster (usually i sell one item of each kind and my auction is always full and then i replace the items i sold with other same kind item), not crafting the same item 100 times and then wait for a year to sell em all.

also about the low qr bp, tell me the magic to make it 100 qr and i'll make it.. someone have to increase the qr of these bps, they don't magically go to 100qr by theirselves..

MA need to change the crafting system. As i mentioned in the panel of my thread, they need to increase the success rate when crafting items to 45-50% and when i say success rate i don't inlcude the fail near success clicks
 
While I do agree that success rate is borked (I used to make armatrix and got damn fed up with it), you have to realize that when you use a ul bp and you post tiny runs like that, you're going to get flamed.

Store for a longer run, do a long run and post your results, that will be much more helpful.

as i mentioned in my thread, the problem on crafting is not when crafting matterials but when crafting items. i said that they need to increase the success rate when crafting items, not when crafting matterials, i don't complain about the success rate when crafting simple i conds/ plastic springs, or gizmo comps for example, but when you want to craft items, you need to have higher success rate than when you craft matterials.

also, to all the players that told me to do more clicks.. did you really ever crafted any item?? and i don't mean items that we sell to tt, like some guns that we craft only to burn our mining resources and get some crafting skills and maybe rare L bps too, but i speak for items that you need maybe 50-100ped residue for each click.. how many clicks you think is ok to craft in these items? 100 click? considering doing 100 clicks with 33% success rate on an item with 100ped tt, that mean you need at about 3k ped metal res, also some more thousands peds for the matterials.

so, you think that success rate when crafting items (not matterials) is ok or they need to increase it?? that's the question..
 
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i don't except a good result, i except a normal result.
I have res for 3-4 amps and that's what i need for one mining run, so, having matterials for like 12 clicks is enough
......
also about the low qr bp, tell me the magic to make it 100 qr and i'll make it.. someone have to increase the qr of these bps, they don't magically go to 100qr by theirselves..

There is no magic formula, if you want that to be 100QR, then you need to click it around 24000 times on quantity.

If you have enough mats for only 12 clicks, then you should not be doing this BP....seriously.
You could click this BP 5 times and get all success....what would you say then? nothing , you would keep quiet.
Go save up enough mats to click this 500 times in one run, then see what the % is....guaranteed it will not be 5.3% on quantity. Otherwise you might as well just buy the amp from someone else at MU, your just throwing PED away at this rate.

Yes crafting does need to change, I'm fully for that, but you complaining about clicking a BP less than 20 times and think that it should be changed based on that is silly, plain and simple. This game has never been about the small runs...everything has always been about the long game.

Bankroll has always been important in this game, when hunting you do not go out with the ability to only kill 20 mobs and expect to last long. You do not go out mining expecting to be able to sell your loot on 20 drops. Why you seem to think crafting is any different is beyond me.
 
also, to all the players that told me to do more clicks.. did you really ever crafted any item??

Yeah, did quite a bit. Mostly lvl. 5 amps.

I have res for 3-4 amps and that's what i need for one mining run, so, having matterials for like 12 clicks is enough i guess to get at least 3 amps

Thats why I told:
And maybe you should also post the pics with 50%+ COS after 10 clicks. (there are allways to sides on the long run)

I am pretty sure that if you have only residue for 3-4 amps that you might also have 50%+ COS or even the first 3 clicks are all success.
I for example don´t craft lvl. 5 amps (100 qr BP) with less then 200 clicks, which of course need a bit of a bankroll. And I also do see the same things like in your screenshot with maybe one success in the whole window, but then again I also see a lot of success in a row. So in the long run it evens out for me.
The big frustrating problem could be the expensive (L) bps. Where are the Tokens that can increase our COS to 100%. :rolleyes:

But in the end like someone mentioned before it shouldn´t matter (no clue if it does) in the long run, if someone is doing 10 x 20 attempts vs. someone with 1 x 200. However I prefer to do the longer runs.
 
as i mentioned in my thread, the problem on crafting is not when crafting matterials but when crafting items. i said that they need to increase the success rate when crafting items, not when crafting matterials, i don't complain about the success rate when crafting simple i conds/ plastic springs, or gizmo comps for example, but when you want to craft items, you need to have higher success rate than when you craft matterials.

also, to all the players that told me to do more clicks.. did you really ever crafted any item?? and i don't mean items that we sell to tt, like some guns that we craft only to burn our mining resources and get some crafting skills and maybe rare L bps too, but i speak for items that you need maybe 50-100ped residue for each click.. how many clicks you think is ok to craft in these items? 100 click? considering doing 100 clicks with 33% success rate on an item with 100ped tt, that mean you need at about 3k ped metal res, also some more thousands peds for the matterials.

so, you think that success rate when crafting items (not matterials) is ok or they need to increase it?? that's the question..

I didn't say anything about materials. I simply said you need more clicks. 19 isn't enough. Yes. I do make items. I just said I used to make armatrix which, imho, is far more of a pain than those blueprints that only have 1 step ingredients.
 
There is no magic formula, if you want that to be 100QR, then you need to click it around 24000 times on quantity.

If you have enough mats for only 12 clicks, then you should not be doing this BP....seriously.
You could click this BP 5 times and get all success....what would you say then? nothing , you would keep quiet.
Go save up enough mats to click this 500 times in one run, then see what the % is....guaranteed it will not be 5.3% on quantity. Otherwise you might as well just buy the amp from someone else at MU, your just throwing PED away at this rate.

Yes crafting does need to change, I'm fully for that, but you complaining about clicking a BP less than 20 times and think that it should be changed based on that is silly, plain and simple. This game has never been about the small runs...everything has always been about the long game.

Bankroll has always been important in this game, when hunting you do not go out with the ability to only kill 20 mobs and expect to last long. You do not go out mining expecting to be able to sell your loot on 20 drops. Why you seem to think crafting is any different is beyond me.

well with 33% success chance, n=18,
the chance for only 1 success out of 18 is 0,65% (18*0,33^1*0,67^17)
the chance for 2 successes out of 18 is 2,74% (153*0,33^2*0,67^16)
the chance for 3 successes out of 18 is 7,22%
the chance for 4 successes out of 18 is 13,33%
the chance for 5 successes out of 18 is 18,38%
the chance for 6 successes out of 18 is 19,62%
the chance for 7 successes out of 18 is 16,56%
the chance for 8 successes out of 18 is 11,22%
the chance for 9 successes out of 18 is 6,14%
the chance for 10 successes out of 18 is 2,72%
the chance for 11 successes out of 18 is 0,97%

So the odds are pretty decent to get some okay results in 18 click runs. (79,11% chance to get 4 to 8 successes; 92,47% chance to get 3 to 9 successes)
However, when you pull the worst result, in this case 1 success with 0,65% chance, multiple times or over and over again, then something's fucked up or the mechanics to determine success rates has changed

When it happens once, no biggy, just unlucky, but when it happens over and over again, then it's time to raise eyebrow.

Edit: corrected the numbers
 
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well with 33% success chance, n=18,
the chance for only 1 success out of 18 is 0,65% (18*0,33^1*0,67^17)
the chance for 2 successes out of 18 is 2,74% (153*0,33^2*0,67^16)
the chance for 3 successes out of 18 is 7,22%
the chance for 4 successes out of 18 is 13,33%
the chance for 5 successes out of 18 is 18,38%
the chance for 6 successes out of 18 is 19,62%
the chance for 7 successes out of 18 is 16,56%
the chance for 8 successes out of 18 is 11,22%
the chance for 9 successes out of 18 is 6,14%
the chance for 10 successes out of 18 is 2,72%
the chance for 11 successes out of 18 is 0,97%

So the odds are pretty decent to get some okay results in 18 click runs. (79,11% chance to get 4 to 8 successes; 92,47% chance to get 3 to 9 successes)
However, when you pull the worst result, in this case 1 success with 0,65% chance, multiple times or over and over again, then something's fucked up or the mechanics to determine success rates has changed

When it happens once, no biggy, just unlucky, but when it happens over and over again, then it's time to raise eyebrow.

Edit: corrected the numbers

One of the problems (besides from you giving a neg rep due to disagreeing with my opinion) is that you seem to think MA have coded the game exactly on how chance applies. That is not how they have gone about it and you can tell from multiple outcomes in this game, not just crafting. Your expectation is that 33% chance should apply and you should get 1 success every 3 clicks. If that was the case, it would be exploitable. It is not how it is coded to work.
They have coded it so that over the long run you will reach the expected outcome...not the short run. When that comes together is also impossible to tell, some believe it is a sine curve, others multiple curves, whatever way it is coded you can see it come together the more you craft.

Like i said, I want crafting to change myself, I want a higher success rate to make it viable to profit or even click some of those blueprints. What I am sick of seeing from you and other people on this forum is whining about how you are getting a shit return or success rate on such low click amounts.

You want a higher success rate? then here is the magic formula.....click more in a run.

EDIT: Your numbers above apply in a Casino, not EU (despite it seeming similar to one in many ways)
 
One of the problems (besides from you giving a neg rep due to disagreeing with my opinion) is that you seem to think MA have coded the game exactly on how chance applies. That is not how they have gone about it and you can tell from multiple outcomes in this game, not just crafting. Your expectation is that 33% chance should apply and you should get 1 success every 3 clicks. If that was the case, it would be exploitable. It is not how it is coded to work.
They have coded it so that over the long run you will reach the expected outcome...not the short run. When that comes together is also impossible to tell, some believe it is a sine curve, others multiple curves, whatever way it is coded you can see it come together the more you craft.

Like i said, I want crafting to change myself, I want a higher success rate to make it viable to profit or even click some of those blueprints. What I am sick of seeing from you and other people on this forum is whining about how you are getting a shit return or success rate on such low click amounts.

You want a higher success rate? then here is the magic formula.....click more in a run.

EDIT: Your numbers above apply in a Casino, not EU (despite it seeming similar to one in many ways)

my main issue and demand is to increase the success rate, i see that we both agree in that, so, i don't understand why we still arguing about that. i know that if i do 1k clicks on d-class amp, i'll get about 333 amps, but the fact is that i demand higher success rate than just 33.3%, i demand about 45-50% when crafting items.
if the success rate was 45-50%. in the worst scenario i would get at least 3-4 amps out of the 18 clicks, and that would be in the worst scenario. now, with the current low success rate (33.3%), you see that many times i got only one amp out of ~18 clicks (5.5% success rate in the worst scenario). that's what i don't like and here is the problem. MA need to increase the success rate. you don't need to explain me how i get that low success rate cause i did only few clicks. i'm not an amateur crafter (i have already unlocked equipment methodology) and i know how the system works, the fact is that i don't like it and i want it to change..

the screens with the low success rate (~5.5%) i posted above and in the first post is to show MA how problematic is their current crafting system when crafting items
 
my main issue and demand is to increase the success rate, i see that we both agree in that, so, i don't understand why we still arguing about that. i know that if i do 1k clicks on d-class amp, i'll get about 333 amps, but the fact is that i demand higher success rate than just 33.3%, i demand about 45-50% when crafting items.
if the success rate was 45-50%. in the worst scenario i would get at least 3-4 amps out of the 18 clicks, and that would be in the worst scenario. now, with the current low success rate (33.3%), you see that many times i got only one amp out of ~18 clicks (5.5% success rate in the worst scenario). that's what i don't like and here is the problem. MA need to increase the success rate. you don't need to explain me how i get that low success rate cause i did only few clicks. i'm not an amateur crafter (i have already unlocked equipment methodology) and i know how the system works, the fact is that i don't like it and i want it to change..

the screens with the low success rate (~5.5%) i posted above and in the first post is to show MA how problematic is their current crafting system when crafting items

I dont see the point of crying a river over it as MA already stated they will bring bck what we had during crafting test with additional tweaks (question is when :D). Yes it can be freakin annoying: yday did 30 clicks on maxed L10 bp where i had higher failrate than success, i raged for a min then moved on, it all evens out in the end
 
short crafting runs like this similar to short mining runs even on surface,
when from 20 drops you can get 0 claims
 
One of the problems (besides from you giving a neg rep due to disagreeing with my opinion) is that you seem to think MA have coded the game exactly on how chance applies. That is not how they have gone about it and you can tell from multiple outcomes in this game, not just crafting. Your expectation is that 33% chance should apply and you should get 1 success every 3 clicks. If that was the case, it would be exploitable. It is not how it is coded to work.
They have coded it so that over the long run you will reach the expected outcome...not the short run. When that comes together is also impossible to tell, some believe it is a sine curve, others multiple curves, whatever way it is coded you can see it come together the more you craft.

Like i said, I want crafting to change myself, I want a higher success rate to make it viable to profit or even click some of those blueprints. What I am sick of seeing from you and other people on this forum is whining about how you are getting a shit return or success rate on such low click amounts.

You want a higher success rate? then here is the magic formula.....click more in a run.

I don't expect them to have 100% accuracy to match the math, but i expect them to be somewhat close rather than being very far off....

as it goes for more clicks in a run,
1.) are you willing to sponsor me 40k PED for materials to do a 1000 click run? no? well guess, then i have no other option then continueing the do small click runs, sell, do small click run, sell, repeat.
2.) even a 1000 click run ends up with 78-85% return regularly these days, even on QR 100 BP.
3.) doing 10-20 click run once a week for 16 weeks is about 160-320 clicks....

I've been clicking low amount runs for 1 year and success rate never has been an issue.
Sure some runs were 1/10, but then usually the next run was 2/2 or 2/3 and it moved towards the 33% rather quickly, but those 2/2 or 2/3 aren't happening anymore and it's something like 1/10 over and over again, since they've started tempering with loot a couple months ago.
So whatever change they did there, it was a change to the worse and should be undone.

I dont see the point of crying a river over it as MA already stated they will bring bck what we had during crafting test with additional tweaks (question is when :D).

about the when, i'm pretty certain, the tweaks made it into the game 1-2 weeks after the crafting test has been concluded, the game is certainly not in the state it was before the crafting test.
 
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2click EUconsumer rights

non+relevant topic
 
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Xp on armatrixes

non-relevant topic

Admins , plc

Delete this forum account (remove PCF user and all associated information posts etc ... )

Thanks
 
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I agree that crafting is out of normal bounds for the moment.

The only request that I have for MA that would help solve this problem immensely, is to allow us to select and copy/paste the crafting results window again.(they took this ability away for some unknown reason after nearly a year of nice crafting result data with over a million PED that I was able to track)


And I will say with that long term data, I was less prone to get upset at "the shitty crafting system", building confidence that the system will take care of me over time...confidence that has faded with the implementation of 2.0.

This way people can track long term gains and see the overall results better, and...point out possible errors in the system for you.....this is free bug testing. So please...if reading....allow copy paste of crafting results again so we can properly verify these kinds of issues!
 
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