Why do you think MA does not allow trading the daily tokens ?

Everything i own in this game should be tradeable, since is mine i can do whatever i want with it.

Except... what is the concept of ownership in a virtual world? You don't even own the money in your bank account. There are only contracts and laws which protect your rights to it to a certain extent but nothing external, physical or apriori of any kind.
 
Tbh the mudslinging starts at post 10. Before that no mudslinging at all. Just opinions. But then someone says that another player is full of crap.

You are absolutely right and that is my fault. But in my own defense I did say I was sorry and it was my be a butt head button.
 
Would be a very bad idea of making the daily tokens tradeable.

First, many people would start just making tons of alt avatars and farming gauntlet daily 1-2 with minimal input for the daily 2 x 1 token's.

Don't say no one will cheating, already lot of player cheating and scamming for some ped to be able to shoot, many would make tons of alts immediately.

Even solo completing the instance cost you like 5 ped, and as they are "puny - prototype" mobs inside, you will get back around 4.5p from the run. With just joining to a team, you can few a couple of shots, or even skip gauntlet 1 and just join somebody to kill the boss of Gauntlet2 together for like 0.2-0.5p

At a cost of 0.5p, you can get 1-2 token's.
40 token than 10-20p cost.

if token is sellable, you will sure sell it because poeples will use it as a cheaper version instead of armatrix weapons.
For a 40 token Kallous weapon, you get like 20k uses.
An Armatrix weapon for example the LR-20 will be used for 5k uses at 45p TT.
So, for 10-20p cost, you can sell enough token for a gun, that will last as long, as 4 x full 45p TT armatrix weapon.
Cost of the weapon will be of course a bit lower, so even at TT price it will be a cheaper option than an Armatrix.

10-20p cost, like daily 5-15 minutes, in 20-40 days, depending on gauntlet 1-2 or just gauntlet2 boss, you got 180p worth of token.
Peoples already sweating for much longer time for the fractional ammount of this.

20 x 15 minutes is 5 hours. You can get 5p of sweat during that, or 180p of tokens.

At the current form, it would be not a logical step to make it tradeable, first they would have to remove daily tokens from gauntlet, to make it impossible to farm easy token for almost zero cost and energy.
And / or, make the daily weapons much worse than now.


As i see the daily tokens, its something like a "free" option for a weapon for low budget, no or small depositor, to be able to use a good weapon without expensive purchase price, and be able to shoot some big mobs as he just have to buy ammo, and it last long enough to be able to collect enough for the next weapon before it runs out, but not something you could earn on.

The Sky is failing, the sky is falling hehe. Sorry couldn't resist:) But i do find it you know all of the after a couple of months of play.
 
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I think that a lot of this negative discussion is based on taking advantage of the system, i.e. cheating and I don't think there are that many cheaters and the ones that are are usually found out pretty quick.

The point I am still trying to make is it should be my choice if I spend the money to get the items, if they are given to for free then that is difference.
 
I think that a lot of this negative discussion is based on taking advantage of the system, i.e. cheating and I don't think there are that many cheaters and the ones that are are usually found out pretty quick.

The point I am still trying to make is it should be my choice if I spend the money to get the items, if they are given to for free then that is difference.

My guess is that if the daily tokens could be traded, we wouldn't see the items we see at trader today,
they would probably have more limitations.
It's a balance imo, we gain on some parts, but lose on others.
 
Ok let's see. I go to the doctor who has been in practice for 5 years but who has never had a patience, not sure that's the one I want to go to.

Anyway I still have my opinion and you and others have a different one who cares. Neither will change.

So you Chicken Little's can have it. I am done with this.

BTW It was a simple question, Why. All that had to be said was "It would hunt the economy" not a dissertation in economics :confused:

How does "hunting in a team" tell you if the doctor has 5 years or 10 years experience. Maybe the doctor that you have no idea about has done 2-3x more patients but doesnt need to brag about it (or have stats visible for everyone to see). Your comparison lacks logic, just like your idea of making daily items tradable. But not everyone has logical thinking, and thats perfectly fine. People are all different...
 
The point I am still trying to make is it should be my choice if I spend the money to get the items, if they are given to for free then that is difference.

Is it not your choice at the moment? You don't have to do the dailies if you don't want to. If you do the dailies then the items are free as the tokens are a bonus, they are not taken from your loot on the side.

You're original point is that you want those dailies to be tradeable....and that is where lies the issue due to what can be purchased with them.
 
My guess is that if the daily tokens could be traded, we wouldn't see the items we see at trader today,
they would probably have more limitations.
It's a balance imo, we gain on some parts, but lose on others.

Finally some one who answers the question. To me that makes sense. Thank you for a very relevant and sensible response.
 
Is it not your choice at the moment? You don't have to do the dailies if you don't want to. If you do the dailies then the items are free as the tokens are a bonus, they are not taken from your loot on the side.

You're original point is that you want those dailies to be tradeable....and that is where lies the issue due to what can be purchased with them.

Not bad and something to ponder. But really I don't care either way I just asked why and I don't do the dailies every day any way. Some of the people acted like I killed a baby kitten and how that would probably be the end of the game and the world would go into deep depression.
 
Everything i own in this game should be tradeable, since is mine i can do whatever i want with it.

You can TT it all :)

Daily token items works good, guys, it's item you get for free for killing X mobs. Otherwise you would have to buy that weapon/tool/keys to open boxes -> pills.

I hope they add more stuff to daily token trader, and add more complex missions for more token rewards :) Like level 4 and 5 daily :)
 
Would be a very bad idea of making the daily tokens tradeable.

First, many people would start just making tons of alt avatars and farming gauntlet daily 1-2 with minimal input for the daily 2 x 1 token's.

Don't say no one will cheating, already lot of player cheating and scamming for some ped to be able to shoot, many would make tons of alts immediately.

Even solo completing the instance cost you like 5 ped, and as they are "puny - prototype" mobs inside, you will get back around 4.5p from the run. With just joining to a team, you can few a couple of shots, or even skip gauntlet 1 and just join somebody to kill the boss of Gauntlet2 together for like 0.2-0.5p

At a cost of 0.5p, you can get 1-2 token's.
40 token than 10-20p cost.

if token is sellable, you will sure sell it because poeples will use it as a cheaper version instead of armatrix weapons.
For a 40 token Kallous weapon, you get like 20k uses.
An Armatrix weapon for example the LR-20 will be used for 5k uses at 45p TT.
So, for 10-20p cost, you can sell enough token for a gun, that will last as long, as 4 x full 45p TT armatrix weapon.
Cost of the weapon will be of course a bit lower, so even at TT price it will be a cheaper option than an Armatrix.

10-20p cost, like daily 5-15 minutes, in 20-40 days, depending on gauntlet 1-2 or just gauntlet2 boss, you got 180p worth of token.
Peoples already sweating for much longer time for the fractional ammount of this.

20 x 15 minutes is 5 hours. You can get 5p of sweat during that, or 180p of tokens.

At the current form, it would be not a logical step to make it tradeable, first they would have to remove daily tokens from gauntlet, to make it impossible to farm easy token for almost zero cost and energy.
And / or, make the daily weapons much worse than now.


As i see the daily tokens, its something like a "free" option for a weapon for low budget, no or small depositor, to be able to use a good weapon without expensive purchase price, and be able to shoot some big mobs as he just have to buy ammo, and it last long enough to be able to collect enough for the next weapon before it runs out, but not something you could earn on.
Your thread is a bit lengthy and I stopped after the first sentence . You are acting like you get the tokens for free. You don't. In reality it is probably cheaper to buy a similar weapon unless you had a mission for the mob. 50 kerbies for 1 token is Ridiculous !
 
You can TT it all :)
Well....
There's actually some items you can't TT at all. (daily tokens come to mind)
Also there's a lot of items that, while you can technically TT them, you won't get back the TT value. You get 0.
When my wife's ava was stripped down because she had to stop playing, there was actually enough gear left over that we couldn't sell/TT that she can keep playing if she wants.

In reality it is probably cheaper to buy a similar weapon unless you had a mission for the mob. 50 kerbies for 1 token is Ridiculous !
Based on the lowest mob level you can hunt (that actually exist ingame), the average level 1 daily hunt means killing ~6,091 health per token. If you include the chirpy and merp bonuses, that drops to 5,823. Adding in feff/argo caves doesn't alter the number much from these numbers. Kerbies are ~8,667 health/token, plus you likely hunt the bigger maturities, so they are on the higher side.
For the record, lvl 2 is 16,750 health/token and lvl 3 is 33,129, so in that view, kerbies aren't a bad choice for grabbing "free" gear.

There was ~1 1/2 years where I did almost nothing but the dailies. (I don't have 10 hours/day to play like some people) Somehow, I did fine, even though short hunts on various mobs are often said to be one of the worst strategies you can do.

I currently have 2 CDF weapons, a few skill pills and enough tokens to keep me weaponized for the next year or two. And to get a weapon w/ the same DPS I get with those would cost me a LOT. Sure, I can't sell them, but it was my choice to go the "non-tradable tokens for items" route. No one forced me and even though I can't trade them, I'm good w/ it.

It always bothers me when people campaign hard against something that is voluntary. If it doesn't suit you, play the game a different way. I can't tell you how many times I've changed my play style of the past 15+ years. Never complained. Just kept enjoying the game in new ways.
 
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Cozmo, I get the questioning of the dailies as not being tradable, but I gotta roll with the "That's just the way it is" reply. Lots here have tried to tease out the economic impact, both good and bad of it, but in the end, we're talking about real money from MA for free.

Think of the seasonal gifts and freebies we all get from this or that promotional. Only ~2-5 ped "TT" per player per season or promotional, but if we all could TT every freebie we all got and withdraw, that's a shiton of excess cash MA would lose with zero return. At least loot costs us. Free gifts? Worth actual cash? Small per person, but we're talking many $1,000s on the whole.
 
[QUOTE="JohnCapital, post: 3746053, member: 7905"


It always bothers me when people campaign hard against something that is voluntary. If it doesn't suit you, play the game a different way. I can't tell you how many times I've changed my play style of the past 15+ years. Never complained. Just kept enjoying the game in new ways.
[/QUOTE]

I really wasn't complaining just wondering what MA's thinking was. I like you, did them every day including the cave mission. Then it quit working and took almost a year to fix, I complained about once or twice a month :). When it finally did get fixed they cut the tokens by 60%. That was my last day. However, I think I was ahead of them on the cave because of a 500+ ped HOF. I think I have 5 CDF weapons that I use and they are great as far as I am concerned. I one time I have 500 tokens saved up. Even the tokens are not free (cost of ammo etc.) still its a fool that bitches when one gets something for little or nothing :) I hope no one took it for gripping.

Also I do agree with your second post too.
 
On a side note to this, I have UL weapons that mainly mean I do't buy the CDF guns with tokens, but I do save them up (over 1k atm) as my long time goal is the 5k coat with speed buff. This is a long term goal and will take me probably another couple of years. I can't remember if the coats are tradeable but if the tokens were tradeable then people could just buy the tokens to exchange for the coat. I like the long term goals in EU, it would be a shame if some rich players could just buy the coat using tokens they had purchased.
 
Your thread is a bit lengthy and I stopped after the first sentence . You are acting like you get the tokens for free. You don't. In reality it is probably cheaper to buy a similar weapon unless you had a mission for the mob. 50 kerbies for 1 token is Ridiculous !

Certainly not, there are many bonus missions in this daily missions and they are on mobs like Fuga, Gibni which cost like nothing to kill as you only have to get 10 or 20 of them for the 20 tokens. Also if you get a normal kill 50 of this little birds for one token it is like no cost at all also for one token.

You even can get more out of these weapons by using a P20 which is much better than to use it on a normal high TT Weapon.

Lastly to have a non CDF Weapon with similar power and similar level requirement I would have to either buy each week a L weapon with MU or have a big sum to buy a UL Weapon with comparable stats.

What would a UL Handgun with 91.6 HP Dmg/Sec. unamped cost?
What would a laser Rifle with 89.3 HP Dmg/sec unamped cost?
What would a BLP Rifle with 85.9 HP Dmg/sec unamped and a Range of 109 m cost?

PS: There is a CODEX Misssion for every Mob on caly so every mob who gives CDF Tokens is also a Mission Mob.
PPS: If you hunt you could win or lose peds so if you hunt CDF Mobs from Daily you can win or loos as if you hunt puny's and to kill 10 or 20 Fuga, Gibni or Chirpy is extremely cheap.
PPPS: There is even the chance that you get a Feffoid or Argo daily mission so it is double or even triple whammy as you get the token from the mission and the token from the 15 Feffoids in the cave as well as the advance in Codex from the Feffoids killed, same with the Argos.
PPPPS: There is even the possibility that because of CDF Daily you hunt a mob you wouldn’t hunt if not the daily mission would be here and you go and loot a nice item like a UL Combustive Attack Chip 8
 
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On a side note to this, I have UL weapons that mainly mean I do't buy the CDF guns with tokens, but I do save them up (over 1k atm) as my long time goal is the 5k coat with speed buff. This is a long term goal and will take me probably another couple of years. I can't remember if the coats are tradeable but if the tokens were tradeable then people could just buy the tokens to exchange for the coat. I like the long term goals in EU, it would be a shame if some rich players could just buy the coat using tokens they had purchased.
That is a very valid point .
 
I find the value of the CDF token guns to be very intriguing concept. They are both ridiculously overpriced and free, depending on your mindset and play style.
IF cycling 60ped, to lose 3ped TT for a token, and thus deeming the tokens to be too expensive to get is your mentality, then why are you even hunting? What use could a gun give you if you aren't prepared to lose TT by cycling ammo?
Yes, some mobs are smarter to grind on than others, so I don't take every challenge religiously, but if I get a mob that I like then I see no extra cost for that token as I would likely be going out to hunt that mob anyway. I also believe the 0.01PED token you get is rewarded separate to your loot returns.
Right now I think the only people that share my mindset go for the guns, otherwise valuing the markups at 30000% (3ped per token) would deem all the weapons not worth acquiring, even with their exceptional durability. Being able to trade these weapons I think would cause these tokens to be farmed, traders to be out of stock, and the Armatrix supply chain to be affected.
Slightly off topic, I wish we had melee options in the trader. That would be a panty dropper.
 
Slightly off topic, I wish we had melee options in the trader. That would be a panty dropper.

I feel the same if there were MF weps in there , I might actually have a use for the tokens accumulating in my storage.

And i am always in favor of panties dropping , it could bring world peace.
 
Yes MF and Melee Weapons are missed heavily.

PS: Extenders are the non plus ultra for these 1 ped weapons as the extender last nearly forever and 20% less decay is a huge extention of the economics for these items. The other thing is you never ever have a shortage in them except if you do not have enough tokens ;)
 
Certainly not, there are many bonus missions in this daily missions and they are on mobs like Fuga, Gibni which cost like nothing to kill as you only have to get 10 or 20 of them for the 20 tokens. Also if you get a normal kill 50 of this little birds for one token it is like no cost at all also for one token.
Your statement above looks like one will get these bonus mission often. I have gone a month or more without a single one. As a matter of fact I have made several posts asking if the missions have been canceled. My last post, about the missions, I had went about 6 weeks without a single one and so did my buddy and then we both got one on the same day. But really both your post and my responses are off topic. This is not a debate about if they are good or bad, just why they are not tradable and there are several good reasons above but I truly don't think it would ruin the economy and that the rich would have all the good stuff because if they are rich they already have the good stuff :)
 
... This is not a debate about if they are good or bad, just why they are not tradable and there are several good reasons above but I truly don't think it would ruin the economy and that the rich would have all the good stuff because if they are rich they already have the good stuff :)

Yes but that is maybe the reason(how good they are) why they are not tradable because they are packing a real punch which you normally have to buy with Markup. So if they would be tradable it would may generate a wave on new avatars crated to have more chances at getting the bonus missions to sell weapons and take the peds out of the game. So somethig MA and PP's certainly not want.
 
Yes but that is maybe the reason(how good they are) why they are not tradable because they are packing a real punch which you normally have to buy with Markup. So if they would be tradable it would may generate a wave on new avatars crated to have more chances at getting the bonus missions to sell weapons and take the peds out of the game. So somethig MA and PP's certainly not want.
That is always the argument it will affect the economy and take money out of the game. You act as a player gets a bonus round every other day. That is not true, at least for me and my pal. Its more like a couple of times a month. What will these new Avas do the rest of the month ? Anyway I don't agree it will change the eco but I still respect your side.
 
That is always the argument it will affect the economy and take money out of the game. You act as a player gets a bonus round every other day. That is not true, at least for me and my pal. Its more like a couple of times a month. What will these new Avas do the rest of the month ? Anyway I don't agree it will change the eco but I still respect your side.

No you do not get a Bonus Mission every day but like in other games where Gold or other things where farmed by users with a lot of additional accounts if you have like 100 accounts every day you would get some Bonus missions from that volume, as you stated, you will get something like 300 times a 20 token bonus mission equals 6000 daily tokens and others where you get the token for minimal cost. If you now think about migration and for how much some of the looted 1 ped weapons where sold you can imagine that it will generate several hundreds of dollar each month ready to be withdrawn from each daily token farmer.
 
50 kerbies for 1 token is Ridiculous !

Then dont do the kerb daily?

Adapt and find the best solution for YOU.

For example, I choose to live on Monria for a while, why?

1. Monria only have 4 different mobs
2. All have daily token mission
3. All have codex (as of this VU)
4. All are involved in the mission to get The Horns of Z'agol http://www.entropiawiki.com/Info.aspx?chart=Clothes&id=626

So every single one of my dailies make sense in alot of other ways, so I choose to be on Monria.
 
Then dont do the kerb daily?

Adapt and find the best solution for YOU.

For example, I choose to live on Monria for a while, why?

1. Monria only have 4 different mobs
2. All have daily token mission
3. All have codex (as of this VU)
4. All are involved in the mission to get The Horns of Z'agol http://www.entropiawiki.com/Info.aspx?chart=Clothes&id=626

So every single one of my dailies make sense in alot of other ways, so I choose to be on Monria.
I thought it was clear I don't do the daily missions, except maybe the bonus one and I have went a month or more waiting for it to pop up.

I have no problem to find a solution. Not even sure why you responded to question.
 
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