JohnCapital
Slayer
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2006
- Posts
- 9,828
- Location
- Colorado
- Society
- Freelancer
- Avatar Name
- John Teacher Capital
Warning: l-o-n-g ass post.
Note: Much of this isn't necessarily new or shocking information, but no one's put it together in one post before. However much of it is my own theories based on information I've picked up here and there. If you question any of it, please feel free to tell me where you believe I'm wrong.
Well, since McCormick found a pic that seems to confirm my theories, it's time for me to tell you all how I think Entropia works. I'm going to be discussing many aspects, but in general I'll try to focus on the important part: Loot.
First let's set some facts down as our foundation.
How the game works (minus loot)
The game itself is fairly easy to understand. Marco and the others have been telling us the secret the entire time.
As Marco tells us time and again:
Well, let's change that word "dynamic" to "random". EU is random. Or more specifically, it's based on random numbers created with formulas regarding skills, equipment, mob, etc.
To give you an example: I'm hunting an atrox dominant with ghost+5As, fap-80 and EP-41 w/ A104 amp. I have lvl 11 evade and lvl 30 laser pistol hit and lvl 30 laser dmg. I have 118 health.
Atrox dom has a specific amount of health and specific max dmg it can do spread in a set % between certain dmg types. (Most believe atrox does 33% each cut/stab/impact, for example.)
The hunt begins
I fire my gun and the system registers the trox is close enough for the weapon to hit. It determines a possibility to hit based on my skills vs. the weapons requirement, lasers/scope modifiers, etc. I have x% chance to hit. The system determines a random figure (say 1-100). If it's within a set range (say 1-72), I hit, otherwise I miss. If I hit, the system determines the chance for a critical hit (meaning increase dmg bonus) much as it did for the shot. Then it determines the range of dmg (say 20-60) capable with that weapon/amp combo vs. my skills and whether CH = yes this time or not. A random number from that range is chosen, which becomes the dmg I did to the atrox.
This is done every time I attack the trox,
Every shot/attack creates up to 3 random numbers and 2 set numbers (decay & health).
The same occurs when the trox attacks me. However, there are other factors to determine:
Obviously, the same is true for PVP situations. Armor calculations must be done, but they are always done on the victims side, not the attackers side.
If I need to fap, that heal amount is also picked at random from a range based on my fap vs. my skills (profession). 1 random number and 2 set numbers (decay & health)
After every successful attack and dmg. The system must determine if health minus dmg <= 0.0 If so, then status = dead. So either I killed the trox or the trox killed me. If I killed it, I get to loot it.
How Loot works
I've read many theories about how loot works in Entropia. Hunting, mining, crafting, etc. whatever the activity, there's tons of theories. However most of these theories all suffer one fatal flaw: They assume it's personal.
Many theories are based on % back during a given time frame, how much they deposited last month, etc. Essentially tracking your "session" and giving loot only as you deserve. This is all nonsense. No system could keep up with each individual session, track with they do the whole time, and assign loot as needed in any decent way. What if you quit early, change "jobs" or any of the 100s of changes occurring in EU every day. There's no way a system could assign proper loot drops in that method.
As I hinted at in a previous post, Entropia's loot distribution is based on casinos. However, many folks don't really understand what that truly entails.
A casino does not care about how much they win or lose in every hand. They do not set up blackjack so that every customer wins every third hand only. In short, they do not care about you personally.
The casino cares about how much money they started with at the beginning of the dealer's shift, and how much it has at the end. The games & odds are designed so that on average, customers lose a certain amount per hour. They don't care specifically who wins, how much they win, or who loses. They simply expect a certain number of folks to come in, play and lose X amount on avg. per hour.
Sound familiar?
Now what this means is that taking a large group of people's results, the average is $1 loss/person. This does not mean that every person loses only $1/hour or that everyone has to lose $1/hour.
Taking 4 sample folks
Avg. loss = 230 peds over 15 hours or 15.33 peds/hour. I other words $1.53USD. Nice avg. for only 4 people. Counted over 1,000's, it's much easier to come close to that figure.
This is similar to poker. You win the pot that everyone else bid on, and the house rakes a percentage off the "loot pool" to make their money. They don't care who wins at the table. They don't care who the champion is. They don't care how much Stryker gains or how much Mags loses. They don't care about KcJeeper, Skam, or anyone else specifically when it comes to loot.
And there we have the best clue for loot. For this part, I'll refer to hunting specifically, but I'll connect it to mining and crafting shortly.
So many folks have used the "loot pool" theory. In general, they are right. Here's how it works.
The loot pool is comprised (mostly) of the decay, ammo, bombs, materials, etc. spent by using equipment. Each mob type (and I think each separate spawn, LA, or location) has their own "loot pool".
This decay is what drives Entropia and makes it the game that it is. Decay is the "fee" for using equipment, or crafting something. This fee is what MA makes their money from. (Some disagree with that but I'll discuss that more later.)
The distribution of the decay money is what matters most to us. Here's the general idea.
Note: These numbers are not accurate, but based on certain guesses
Don't worry about MA's low cut. It might even be lower than that. You see, they know that the players winning 97% of their money back will simply use it, now winning back 94.09% of the original amount. We will continue to use that, (91.26% now) etc., etc. Just like casinos who promise 97% payback on their gaming machines, they expect us to replay our winnings, and we do. Which is fine. It lets us get the most entertainment value for our money.
That is, in essence, the loot distribution. As I said the numbers are fictional and change from mob to mob. For example, Aurli loot fairly poor in general, but hit very big, meaning the 1k+ and ATH percentages are increased by reducing the "normal" loot. In contrast, Exarosaur have essentially non-existent ATH percentage assigned to them and much more "normal" loot.
This means that each mob can only pay out what is used on them. (non-mob-specific decay such as tp chips, pvp shooting, etc., is split evenly between all the mob spawns in that area.)
This creates a self-fulfilling prophecy. Someone sees a few globals on argos, and goes to hunt them, thus increasing the amount of weapons decay used, thus increasing the globals, thus generating more interest, thus...
This is noticed in "global trends". Certain mobs are "cool" to hunt for certain social reasons, and so more decay is spent on them, making for more globals. Smart hunters can read these and know how to "chase the money". (It's not as easy as just hunting the mobs that are globaling a lot lately.)
What I see with this is that each mob is a different "game" so to speak. For example:
Exarosaur – Easy to kill, drops beginning armor, and occasional bot armor, but generally loots very poorly. Very few globals. Similar mobs = combibo, snable, daikiba, etc.
Rippersnapper – low dmg, but large aggressive spawns often place many on you at once, thus increasing evade/healing, skilling. Low health means low loot each, however when a loot threshold is hit, a large weapon drops. Similar mob = Tantillions
Hiryuu – Generally low loot, but flying distance makes it great for skilling "tagging" weapons
Etc.etc. Each mob type also has specific items "assigned" to them so you must hunt them in order to loot that item. (I.E. molisk teeth/foul bone for tailoring)
How loot is created
I lied about those being the only figures involved in hunting. The system also checks after each dmg to determine if enough dmg has been given to assign a "looter". Once someone or a team does enough dmg to a mob, a "looter" is assigned. This person or team is the only one(s) who has access to the loot assigned to that mob.
That's right folks, you heard me correctly. Every mob in Entropia is assigned its own loot upon its spawning. (ACTUALLY, I'M WRONG. SEE BELOW) When a new mob is spawned, the loot pool (for that mob type in that spawn location) is assessed. A certain percentage of "no loots" is pre-determined. As for the rest:
A calculation is done to determine how much TT value that specific mob will have, either from 0 to the top available amount possible for that mob at that time. The loot amount is based on a sliding scale, making larger loots much less likely and even rarer as they get larger. (Keep this in mind. It shows up again later)
Once a TT amount is determined, the specific of the loots are figured. Generally (at this moment) loot is assigned into 4 rough groups:
Drops refer to anything w/ a value bar. Oddly enough, residue is determined last, as they are the default loot.
First, it randomly determines if a "drop" will be assigned. If so, which item(s) and how much TT value (out of the amount already determined). Then other stackables (molisk teeth, merp wool, etc.) are assigned, if any "loot amount" is left. Then oils and the balance is made of oil (or robot) residue.
Now that loot is assigned, the mob is generated in a random location within the "herd area".
EDIT: Further tests have proven that I am wrong on this. Hunting loot is determined at the moment of looting and is (at least partially) based on the amount you spent to kill the mob.
What happens during looting
When you loot, 3 checks are made.
Is it over 50ped?
If so, is it more than the lowest current HOF?
If so, is it more than the lowest current ATH?
Based on those answers, the correct animation and global chat text (and HOF/ATH update) is done, if needed. The items are then placed in your "inventory".
So in any "herd" you'll find a certain percentage of no loots, a certain percentage of small loots, and a very few global sized. The loot is dolled out in such numbers that if you do wipe out the herd, you'll gain "on average" 80% of the avg. amount of decay. This loot rationing may be why some folks feel it's personal, as they use avg. amounts of decay, thus hitting the statistical norm.
And that's the trick. Those that use less decay to get the job done have a higher chance of profiting.
Ironically however, since they spend less in decay, the lootpool is reduced, so in the long run they run the risk of only getting back the usual 80%. Their only saving grace is if other folks (I.E. noobies) use a larger amount of decay and don't hit the large loots.
So, doing more dmg/sec with less decay than others means you have a much better chance of collecting more loot than others hunting the same thing. In short better skills+equipment = better profit potential.
Globals, HOFs, ATHs
Please keep in mind: Globals are only loot that's 50 ped and over. These loot is announced in global chat as marketing. This is much like "Mary won "$5,000 playing keno. You can too." HOFs (hall of fame) are simply the 25 largest loots of that profession in the past 24 hours. (the PK and new item hof boards are obviously exempt from this statement.) ATHs are simply the All Time Highest TT value loots so far. That's all. They are rare, and nice, but not special.
Drop period
At any given time, there is a set amount of each item available. What happens is that at certain intervals, (days, weeks, once a month, I'm not sure) the balancing staff check the specific item amounts "in play", meaning accessible to players, and compare it to how are allowed vs. the amount of active accounts (meaning can log in, even if they do or not). If this number falls too low, they will assign another set amount of that item in the loot database. Now we simply wait for folks to get it.
For example: Vigi helmets are assessed a 1:130 player ratio. With 500,000 open accounts, that means 3,846 should be in play. If this number shows 3840, the balancing staff places 6 more in the loot database. Actually they go into the loot database and set the "vigi male helm available" count to 3 and same with the female amount. (Again these are fictional numbers but you get the idea.)
So the drop period is a time frame (unknown to us) when certain items are available to be looted. If the drop period has passed, meaning all available qty of that item have been looted, we simply can't loot another one until MA releases more.
Recently, there was a huge MA event involving much hunting of armax. MA gave hints of surprises in the loot, but nothing too unusual dropped. Shortly after the event, however, a few amazing weapons dropped from armax. I believe there was an programming error and the real good items got credited to normal armax spawns instead of the event spawns. So there they sat, waiting to be looted. (Keep in mind that other amazing items and loots are still out there, just waiting to be looted.)
Keep in mind that when the balancing staff add items in the "to be dropped" database, they have no way of knowing when an item will be chosen or exactly which mob it will be on. This is done for security reasons. If staff had the ability to know when and where items would drop, a few well placed bribes could make someone a fortune in this game. So for security and surprise sake, everything is kept random and unknown.
Turrets and drowning
Certain locations (or coordinates) have been decided as "death zones" and are marked by the turrets and water. (This is done mostly to protect "towns" and give folks feeling a mob some place to "hide") When a mob enters said location their status is immediately (or with a slight delay regarding water) set to "dead", and their loot amount is reassigned. The specific loot doesn't stay the same, but the item drops are released to be available to be picked again., This may happen immediately, or may not happen for months.
The same is true for dead mobs that can not be looted in time before they disappear.
TTing items
Some speculate that when items are TTd, they immediately become available to be looted again. This is not true. See the "drop period" above. These items were taken out of the "to be looted" database, but are not set back in there once they are TTd.
The reason for the difference between this and the above turret/non-looting issue is quite clear. The items TTd are in play and exchanged for TT value in peds. This cash (in TT value) is still in the game, but has merely been changed to a different "token", whether you TT stinktree boards or a mod fap. But with turreted, drowned, non-looted mobs, their loot has never been released. They are still eligible for distribution.
Skills
Whenever you perform an act of using an object, (gun, tp chip, etc.) or an action is performed on you (I.E. being attacked) a yes/no decision is made as to whether that act gains you skills. This yes/no is currently on a sliding scale, meaning "yes" is very common when you are low in those skill areas, but becomes much less frequent when you have more skills.
Every action has a specific set of skills available (much like assigned loot) Getting hit by mobs give different skills than shooting a laser carbine, vs. using a longblade, etc. etc.
If skill increase = yes, a random skill from those available is chosen. Then a random amount (on a sliding scale but often less than 1.0 points) is chosen and added to your current amount.
The skills you get are NOT connected to any success or failure of that action. You can shoot a gun at nothing at all and still get skills. Skill gains are simply calculated when you perform an action. However, I will admit that performing the same action under two similar situations can increase the chances for successful skill gains.
For example if you shoot 100 rounds at nothing at all, you'll gain x skills. However, shooting the same amount into certain mobs will produce much more successful skill gains and thus you will gain more skills quicker.
This is important for miners. Many subscribe to the theory that reading skill gains tell you where claims are located.
Finding claims are not determined by skill gains. Finding claims are simply a matter of chance of success when a bomb/probe is dropped. (more about this below) Remember that as you increase your skills, you gain them at longer intervals. They are unconnected to successful mining
So what do skills do? They increase your chance of success, and influence the type of claim you find. The TT amount is not affected by your skills. However, higher skills means your claim will be 5 ped of adomasite and not 5 ped of lysterium, thus allowing you better markup.
At least this is true to a point. There still needs to be enough materials found to cover potential crafting needs. However, there is plenty found to cover all crafting attempts that MA will allow us to do.
Selling skills
Probably the best move MA did. Skills only have player to player value, as their TT value is quite low and no one would even consider TTing them. This keeps much ped in game and the 10% skill decay makes sure the amount of skills traded decreases over time, while maintaining high value. Time = money.
Mining
So now that most of the details are explained in terms oh hunting, let's discuss mining.
Funny enough, things are actually very simple here. Again, there is a loot pool, but it's broken down into the different ore and enmatter types.
Every location has specific ores/enmatter assigned to it. When a probe/bomb is sent, a chance of success is performed, based on your skills, equipment, and location. Yes location affects your COS. Again, like shooting a gun or swinging a sword, the random number is generated and checked to see if you hit the "success spread". Just as certain locations or herds must reform after being wiped out, it is possible for certain locations to be over mined, meaning you must wait for more loot to be assessed to that area.
Once a hit = yes, a TT amount is assigned, again in a random method based on the available loot pool. Your location is determined and the list of available finds in that area are checked. Your skills, equipment are checked to see which ones you are eligible for. One is picked at random and the appropriate actions (including global/hof animations if needed) are done.
(In truth, I'm not sure if the specific find is determined and then the TT amount or vise-versa. It could be item first then TT value, to make sure not too much of a resource is given out.)
Mining HOFs/ATHs
Just like mob loot, resources have to be assigned an amount available and given distribution rules. In the case of mining ATHs, simply enough decay was used in that location to allow the appropriate amount of that ore to be claimed by the next person with the appropriate skills/equipment to find that ore. Gratz to the finder.
Amps
Mining amps act as a "multiplier" with a nasty side effect. When amps are used, due to their high decay amount, more "loot" has now been made available. This means you'll find a larger amount "on average" compared to not using amps.
However, amps create the problem of lowering your chances of success while increasing the amount of finds you do hit. So instead of hitting 3 - 10 ped finds in 35 bombs without amps, you may find only 1 find in 35 bombs with an amp, but that find will be ~50 TT value. Bigger chance of success, but bigger chance of failure as well. (Much like the quantity/condition settings for crafting.)
So what if you run around with amps and don't score your 80% worth of loot? Simple: On average it will be assigned to others who come through that general location. Don't worry, someone will benefit from your decay and you will benefit from theirs.
Depth
So much voodoo is placed into the "depth" of the finders. Remember the magic word "random".
When a find is made, a random number from 1 to 1000 is generated for the depth. This number is based (as usual) on a sliding scale based on your skills, equip. And type of find located. For example, gold and ruga finds are only allowed a random depth number from 800-1000, (I may be wrong on the 800 number, but again you get the idea) while lyst is allowed the full spectrum.
It doesn't matter if you stand on a mountain, a valley or wherever, depth is meaningless to the loot. It's simply decoration and mood lighting.
Spaceships
MA knew mining might get boring, so they made something fun.
On a rare occasion, (determined randomly) a "strange signal" is looted allowing miners to attack bots and gather a 50 ped global possibly containing a valuable beacon (based on how many are available) These beacons offer robot killing excursions, loot paid for by the decay used of course. (The amount of decay used on a beacon run is NOT calculated to make the loot for that run. The decay from the previous runs of the same size are used.)
Crafting
Crafting is fairly straight forward to understand. Each item requires a "recipe" consisting of blueprint and required materials. A chance of success is determined by the blueprint, your skills, quantity/condition slider, etc. upon success, or partial success a TT value is assessed. Your crafted item (in the case of success) is assigned a value and the rest is assigned as residue. The type of residue is determined by what items are used, ores, enmatter, etc. they type(s) is chosen (again at random based on which ones you're eligible for) and off you go.
Residue
Residue was a fantastic idea. First, it allowed MA to give pec-level controllable loot besides the crafted item. But most importantly, they recognized the fact that items {(L) items for example} would want to be made with 100% chance of having full TT value. So put enough (and the right type of) residue and when you craft something, the difference between the original item and full TT value is taken out of the residue (assuming you put enough in.) So you in essence exchange x ped worth of residue for equal TT value extra on the item you make. Depending on what you craft, this is a great trade.
Blueprints
This is the part that matters most. Without a blueprint the ingredients do you no good. This makes blueprints valuable. Well, valuable depending on what it makes and how often they "drop". Just like other loot, certain BPs are only lootable by clicking on certain other BPs. You can not loot a gun BP by clicking on a component BP like basic filters.
Also keep in mind that for every blueprint dropped, the appropriate amount of crafted material must be in the loot database as well. Their protocol I believe, is to place the item first, then the BP.
For example, "Bessie", the bad assed ore finder. MA placed the item in the loot db, then placed the BP in, and waited for it to be looted, knowing someone with enough skills was likely to click it. It's quite possible that all attempts could have failed, but I believe MA produces these types of BPs with a built in high COS, in order to placed the item into the game.
Quantity/Condition
Much like mining amps, you can lower your chance of success but increase your chance of higher loot by adjusting the qty/condition slider. Keep in mind that in the long run ~80% is avg. loot back. Running condition does not create more loot in the loot pool until after repeated failures.
Mining/Crafting – hunting/tailoring connection
Some folks believe that the items used in crafting/tailoring are then re-released to be found again in mining/hunting. This is not true. Each profession pays for its own loot. If everyone stopped crafting/tailoring for a month straight, miners would be finding just as many ores/enmatter. (Of course since no one would be buying them, their finances would be in real trouble.)
Oil Rig
The oil rig spits out oil for free. Nothing is free, so where does the money come from for the oil? Simple. The decay needed to stay there long enough to gather it. Remember decay is spent either in PKing potential rivals, or used on the Atrox, and usually both. The amount of oil given out is truly a small amount compared to the amount of decay used in that area.
Land Areas
Land areas owned by players are amazing areas. They give the owner the ability to set the type of mob(s) in the area (assuming they have DNA samples) as well as the density and maturity. The owners set tax amounts for hunting and mining. This is how they make their money.
So, when you loot a mob in a land area, does MA increase the loot to cover the taxes? Nope. Remember the amount of loot can not exceed the amount of decay spent.
If you hit a 50 ped global on an LA with 5% tax, you'll find the TT value in your window is ~47.50. The other 2.50 was removed and placed into the LA owners account.
EDIT: I am wrong. The globals are calculated AFTER taxes are taken out. That's what I get for trying to write from memory and not double checking my facts.
So what's the point of hunting on Las if your loot is reduced? There are 2 reasons:
And to answer the question, if an LA has 2 or more mobs, each mob has their own loot pool amount.
What about DNA changes such as when the Equss LA became a Neconu dominate LA? The old herd is killed off, and can collect no more decay, so any left over loot will be reassessed by the balancing staff later.
Sweat
Sweat is dolled out in random amounts per success. Each attempt requires the same random COS check as anything else. When success = yes, a random amount of bottles (from 1-30 I think) are generated. The amount of sweat per mob is capped to an amount based on its health amount. Bigger mobs give more sweat. However, it's the number of successful pulls that are regulated, not the specif amount of bottles. Again, random.
This was MA's version of a "free trial offer" since folks could sweat, sell it to gather beginning equipment and move on from there. It is offered in such small amounts (low chance of success + few bottles per success) because for accounting purposes, they had to give it a TT value 0.00001 I believe it is, so 1,000 sweat = 1 pec (0.01PED). Obviously much too low to be able to be TTd for any substantial money.
However, this is eventually used in mindforce, so the decay there helps cover the cost of sweat.
Fruit
See Sweat. Fruit is a random find. At random moments a random avatar is picked and a random amount of fruit is placed close by them. If someone sees it and picks it up, great. If not it will eventually go away.
Sweat/fruit/dung were made so folks could "try it before you buy it". Mindforce and taming were created simply to give sweat/fruit a reason for existence.
This is also why MA will almost certainly never do anything substantial with these fields. Not until they can come up with some substantial method of building in enough decay to the processes to justify what they could be capable of.
Dung
Again, freebies. But in this case, they almost have a use, since they're needed to create fertilizer to maintain the land areas owned by other players.
Notice all the "freebies" are paid for by other players in markup, not MA.
Markup
This is the part of the game MA has the least control over. Markup is decided on us, the players, and how much we are willing to pay for each item. A lot of the markup of items is based on the "drop amount" and desirability of the item, but a lot of markup is based on "well others paid this price in the recent past so I'll try to get more for it."
Molisk tooth for example, drops very often but still maintains a high markup. While animal hide (which drops quite often) has recently dropped from a high markup to quite a low level.
However, markup is what makes the most money for MA. The more money turned into peds, for whatever reason, the more MA has to siphon from, because most of it will likely get spent in decay eventually.
Also high markups mean more deposits. The more deposits to MA, the more money for them to gain interest on.
The interest gained plus the "decay rake" is where MA makes 99% of there money.
In conclusion
Random, random, random. As I said, MA created a very dynamic game that really doesn't care what we do. The loot will distribute based on what we, as a community, do. What we hunt, where we mine, what we craft, how much we are willing to pay in markup etc. etc. etc.
Aside from what MA allows to be looted, this game is not really in their control. It's in ours. That's what makes it such a great game.
Note: Much of this isn't necessarily new or shocking information, but no one's put it together in one post before. However much of it is my own theories based on information I've picked up here and there. If you question any of it, please feel free to tell me where you believe I'm wrong.
Well, since McCormick found a pic that seems to confirm my theories, it's time for me to tell you all how I think Entropia works. I'm going to be discussing many aspects, but in general I'll try to focus on the important part: Loot.
First let's set some facts down as our foundation.
- MindArk is in business to make money
- MindArk is in business to make money
How the game works (minus loot)
The game itself is fairly easy to understand. Marco and the others have been telling us the secret the entire time.
As Marco tells us time and again:
Well, let's change that word "dynamic" to "random". EU is random. Or more specifically, it's based on random numbers created with formulas regarding skills, equipment, mob, etc.
To give you an example: I'm hunting an atrox dominant with ghost+5As, fap-80 and EP-41 w/ A104 amp. I have lvl 11 evade and lvl 30 laser pistol hit and lvl 30 laser dmg. I have 118 health.
Atrox dom has a specific amount of health and specific max dmg it can do spread in a set % between certain dmg types. (Most believe atrox does 33% each cut/stab/impact, for example.)
The hunt begins
I fire my gun and the system registers the trox is close enough for the weapon to hit. It determines a possibility to hit based on my skills vs. the weapons requirement, lasers/scope modifiers, etc. I have x% chance to hit. The system determines a random figure (say 1-100). If it's within a set range (say 1-72), I hit, otherwise I miss. If I hit, the system determines the chance for a critical hit (meaning increase dmg bonus) much as it did for the shot. Then it determines the range of dmg (say 20-60) capable with that weapon/amp combo vs. my skills and whether CH = yes this time or not. A random number from that range is chosen, which becomes the dmg I did to the atrox.
This is done every time I attack the trox,
- Determine if the attack hit based on skill and other modifiers (yes or no based on percentage)
- Determine if CH occurred (yes or no based on percentage)
- Determine random amount of dmg
- Subtract the dmg amount from health left
- Subtract set amount of decay from used equipment
Every shot/attack creates up to 3 random numbers and 2 set numbers (decay & health).
The same occurs when the trox attacks me. However, there are other factors to determine:
- Location I was hit (6 possible choices: head, arms, hand, torso, thighs, shins) picked at random
- Subtract any dmg points due to armor/plates in that location that protect against the correct dmg type/types.
Obviously, the same is true for PVP situations. Armor calculations must be done, but they are always done on the victims side, not the attackers side.
If I need to fap, that heal amount is also picked at random from a range based on my fap vs. my skills (profession). 1 random number and 2 set numbers (decay & health)
After every successful attack and dmg. The system must determine if health minus dmg <= 0.0 If so, then status = dead. So either I killed the trox or the trox killed me. If I killed it, I get to loot it.
How Loot works
I've read many theories about how loot works in Entropia. Hunting, mining, crafting, etc. whatever the activity, there's tons of theories. However most of these theories all suffer one fatal flaw: They assume it's personal.
Many theories are based on % back during a given time frame, how much they deposited last month, etc. Essentially tracking your "session" and giving loot only as you deserve. This is all nonsense. No system could keep up with each individual session, track with they do the whole time, and assign loot as needed in any decent way. What if you quit early, change "jobs" or any of the 100s of changes occurring in EU every day. There's no way a system could assign proper loot drops in that method.
As I hinted at in a previous post, Entropia's loot distribution is based on casinos. However, many folks don't really understand what that truly entails.
A casino does not care about how much they win or lose in every hand. They do not set up blackjack so that every customer wins every third hand only. In short, they do not care about you personally.
The casino cares about how much money they started with at the beginning of the dealer's shift, and how much it has at the end. The games & odds are designed so that on average, customers lose a certain amount per hour. They don't care specifically who wins, how much they win, or who loses. They simply expect a certain number of folks to come in, play and lose X amount on avg. per hour.
Sound familiar?
*Note: These are the Balancing Manager's responses to the Q&A, and not Marco's words.
Now what this means is that taking a large group of people's results, the average is $1 loss/person. This does not mean that every person loses only $1/hour or that everyone has to lose $1/hour.
Taking 4 sample folks
- Player A gains 400 ped over his 5 hour time
- Player B loses 30 ped over his 4 hour time
- Player C loses 700 peds over 5 hours
- Player D gains 100 peds in 1 hour
Avg. loss = 230 peds over 15 hours or 15.33 peds/hour. I other words $1.53USD. Nice avg. for only 4 people. Counted over 1,000's, it's much easier to come close to that figure.
This is similar to poker. You win the pot that everyone else bid on, and the house rakes a percentage off the "loot pool" to make their money. They don't care who wins at the table. They don't care who the champion is. They don't care how much Stryker gains or how much Mags loses. They don't care about KcJeeper, Skam, or anyone else specifically when it comes to loot.
And there we have the best clue for loot. For this part, I'll refer to hunting specifically, but I'll connect it to mining and crafting shortly.
So many folks have used the "loot pool" theory. In general, they are right. Here's how it works.
The loot pool is comprised (mostly) of the decay, ammo, bombs, materials, etc. spent by using equipment. Each mob type (and I think each separate spawn, LA, or location) has their own "loot pool".
This decay is what drives Entropia and makes it the game that it is. Decay is the "fee" for using equipment, or crafting something. This fee is what MA makes their money from. (Some disagree with that but I'll discuss that more later.)
The distribution of the decay money is what matters most to us. Here's the general idea.
Note: These numbers are not accurate, but based on certain guesses
- 3% of all decay goes to MA. That means 97% goes back into the loot pool for us.
- 82.75% goes into "normal" loot or loot under 50 ped (TT value)
- 10% goes into global sized loot under 1k ped
- 4% goes into loot 1k ped and above
- 0.25% goes into ATH sized loot
Don't worry about MA's low cut. It might even be lower than that. You see, they know that the players winning 97% of their money back will simply use it, now winning back 94.09% of the original amount. We will continue to use that, (91.26% now) etc., etc. Just like casinos who promise 97% payback on their gaming machines, they expect us to replay our winnings, and we do. Which is fine. It lets us get the most entertainment value for our money.
That is, in essence, the loot distribution. As I said the numbers are fictional and change from mob to mob. For example, Aurli loot fairly poor in general, but hit very big, meaning the 1k+ and ATH percentages are increased by reducing the "normal" loot. In contrast, Exarosaur have essentially non-existent ATH percentage assigned to them and much more "normal" loot.
This means that each mob can only pay out what is used on them. (non-mob-specific decay such as tp chips, pvp shooting, etc., is split evenly between all the mob spawns in that area.)
This creates a self-fulfilling prophecy. Someone sees a few globals on argos, and goes to hunt them, thus increasing the amount of weapons decay used, thus increasing the globals, thus generating more interest, thus...
This is noticed in "global trends". Certain mobs are "cool" to hunt for certain social reasons, and so more decay is spent on them, making for more globals. Smart hunters can read these and know how to "chase the money". (It's not as easy as just hunting the mobs that are globaling a lot lately.)
Again, the balancing manager's words, not Marcos.
What I see with this is that each mob is a different "game" so to speak. For example:
Exarosaur – Easy to kill, drops beginning armor, and occasional bot armor, but generally loots very poorly. Very few globals. Similar mobs = combibo, snable, daikiba, etc.
Rippersnapper – low dmg, but large aggressive spawns often place many on you at once, thus increasing evade/healing, skilling. Low health means low loot each, however when a loot threshold is hit, a large weapon drops. Similar mob = Tantillions
Hiryuu – Generally low loot, but flying distance makes it great for skilling "tagging" weapons
Etc.etc. Each mob type also has specific items "assigned" to them so you must hunt them in order to loot that item. (I.E. molisk teeth/foul bone for tailoring)
How loot is created
I lied about those being the only figures involved in hunting. The system also checks after each dmg to determine if enough dmg has been given to assign a "looter". Once someone or a team does enough dmg to a mob, a "looter" is assigned. This person or team is the only one(s) who has access to the loot assigned to that mob.
That's right folks, you heard me correctly. Every mob in Entropia is assigned its own loot upon its spawning. (ACTUALLY, I'M WRONG. SEE BELOW) When a new mob is spawned, the loot pool (for that mob type in that spawn location) is assessed. A certain percentage of "no loots" is pre-determined. As for the rest:
A calculation is done to determine how much TT value that specific mob will have, either from 0 to the top available amount possible for that mob at that time. The loot amount is based on a sliding scale, making larger loots much less likely and even rarer as they get larger. (Keep this in mind. It shows up again later)
Once a TT amount is determined, the specific of the loots are figured. Generally (at this moment) loot is assigned into 4 rough groups:
- residue
- oils
- other stackables
- drops
Drops refer to anything w/ a value bar. Oddly enough, residue is determined last, as they are the default loot.
First, it randomly determines if a "drop" will be assigned. If so, which item(s) and how much TT value (out of the amount already determined). Then other stackables (molisk teeth, merp wool, etc.) are assigned, if any "loot amount" is left. Then oils and the balance is made of oil (or robot) residue.
Now that loot is assigned, the mob is generated in a random location within the "herd area".
EDIT: Further tests have proven that I am wrong on this. Hunting loot is determined at the moment of looting and is (at least partially) based on the amount you spent to kill the mob.
What happens during looting
When you loot, 3 checks are made.
Is it over 50ped?
If so, is it more than the lowest current HOF?
If so, is it more than the lowest current ATH?
Based on those answers, the correct animation and global chat text (and HOF/ATH update) is done, if needed. The items are then placed in your "inventory".
So in any "herd" you'll find a certain percentage of no loots, a certain percentage of small loots, and a very few global sized. The loot is dolled out in such numbers that if you do wipe out the herd, you'll gain "on average" 80% of the avg. amount of decay. This loot rationing may be why some folks feel it's personal, as they use avg. amounts of decay, thus hitting the statistical norm.
And that's the trick. Those that use less decay to get the job done have a higher chance of profiting.
Ironically however, since they spend less in decay, the lootpool is reduced, so in the long run they run the risk of only getting back the usual 80%. Their only saving grace is if other folks (I.E. noobies) use a larger amount of decay and don't hit the large loots.
So, doing more dmg/sec with less decay than others means you have a much better chance of collecting more loot than others hunting the same thing. In short better skills+equipment = better profit potential.
Globals, HOFs, ATHs
Please keep in mind: Globals are only loot that's 50 ped and over. These loot is announced in global chat as marketing. This is much like "Mary won "$5,000 playing keno. You can too." HOFs (hall of fame) are simply the 25 largest loots of that profession in the past 24 hours. (the PK and new item hof boards are obviously exempt from this statement.) ATHs are simply the All Time Highest TT value loots so far. That's all. They are rare, and nice, but not special.
Drop period
At any given time, there is a set amount of each item available. What happens is that at certain intervals, (days, weeks, once a month, I'm not sure) the balancing staff check the specific item amounts "in play", meaning accessible to players, and compare it to how are allowed vs. the amount of active accounts (meaning can log in, even if they do or not). If this number falls too low, they will assign another set amount of that item in the loot database. Now we simply wait for folks to get it.
For example: Vigi helmets are assessed a 1:130 player ratio. With 500,000 open accounts, that means 3,846 should be in play. If this number shows 3840, the balancing staff places 6 more in the loot database. Actually they go into the loot database and set the "vigi male helm available" count to 3 and same with the female amount. (Again these are fictional numbers but you get the idea.)
So the drop period is a time frame (unknown to us) when certain items are available to be looted. If the drop period has passed, meaning all available qty of that item have been looted, we simply can't loot another one until MA releases more.
Recently, there was a huge MA event involving much hunting of armax. MA gave hints of surprises in the loot, but nothing too unusual dropped. Shortly after the event, however, a few amazing weapons dropped from armax. I believe there was an programming error and the real good items got credited to normal armax spawns instead of the event spawns. So there they sat, waiting to be looted. (Keep in mind that other amazing items and loots are still out there, just waiting to be looted.)
Keep in mind that when the balancing staff add items in the "to be dropped" database, they have no way of knowing when an item will be chosen or exactly which mob it will be on. This is done for security reasons. If staff had the ability to know when and where items would drop, a few well placed bribes could make someone a fortune in this game. So for security and surprise sake, everything is kept random and unknown.
Turrets and drowning
Certain locations (or coordinates) have been decided as "death zones" and are marked by the turrets and water. (This is done mostly to protect "towns" and give folks feeling a mob some place to "hide") When a mob enters said location their status is immediately (or with a slight delay regarding water) set to "dead", and their loot amount is reassigned. The specific loot doesn't stay the same, but the item drops are released to be available to be picked again., This may happen immediately, or may not happen for months.
The same is true for dead mobs that can not be looted in time before they disappear.
TTing items
Some speculate that when items are TTd, they immediately become available to be looted again. This is not true. See the "drop period" above. These items were taken out of the "to be looted" database, but are not set back in there once they are TTd.
The reason for the difference between this and the above turret/non-looting issue is quite clear. The items TTd are in play and exchanged for TT value in peds. This cash (in TT value) is still in the game, but has merely been changed to a different "token", whether you TT stinktree boards or a mod fap. But with turreted, drowned, non-looted mobs, their loot has never been released. They are still eligible for distribution.
Skills
Whenever you perform an act of using an object, (gun, tp chip, etc.) or an action is performed on you (I.E. being attacked) a yes/no decision is made as to whether that act gains you skills. This yes/no is currently on a sliding scale, meaning "yes" is very common when you are low in those skill areas, but becomes much less frequent when you have more skills.
Every action has a specific set of skills available (much like assigned loot) Getting hit by mobs give different skills than shooting a laser carbine, vs. using a longblade, etc. etc.
If skill increase = yes, a random skill from those available is chosen. Then a random amount (on a sliding scale but often less than 1.0 points) is chosen and added to your current amount.
The skills you get are NOT connected to any success or failure of that action. You can shoot a gun at nothing at all and still get skills. Skill gains are simply calculated when you perform an action. However, I will admit that performing the same action under two similar situations can increase the chances for successful skill gains.
For example if you shoot 100 rounds at nothing at all, you'll gain x skills. However, shooting the same amount into certain mobs will produce much more successful skill gains and thus you will gain more skills quicker.
This is important for miners. Many subscribe to the theory that reading skill gains tell you where claims are located.
Finding claims are not determined by skill gains. Finding claims are simply a matter of chance of success when a bomb/probe is dropped. (more about this below) Remember that as you increase your skills, you gain them at longer intervals. They are unconnected to successful mining
So what do skills do? They increase your chance of success, and influence the type of claim you find. The TT amount is not affected by your skills. However, higher skills means your claim will be 5 ped of adomasite and not 5 ped of lysterium, thus allowing you better markup.
At least this is true to a point. There still needs to be enough materials found to cover potential crafting needs. However, there is plenty found to cover all crafting attempts that MA will allow us to do.
Selling skills
Probably the best move MA did. Skills only have player to player value, as their TT value is quite low and no one would even consider TTing them. This keeps much ped in game and the 10% skill decay makes sure the amount of skills traded decreases over time, while maintaining high value. Time = money.
Mining
So now that most of the details are explained in terms oh hunting, let's discuss mining.
Funny enough, things are actually very simple here. Again, there is a loot pool, but it's broken down into the different ore and enmatter types.
Every location has specific ores/enmatter assigned to it. When a probe/bomb is sent, a chance of success is performed, based on your skills, equipment, and location. Yes location affects your COS. Again, like shooting a gun or swinging a sword, the random number is generated and checked to see if you hit the "success spread". Just as certain locations or herds must reform after being wiped out, it is possible for certain locations to be over mined, meaning you must wait for more loot to be assessed to that area.
Once a hit = yes, a TT amount is assigned, again in a random method based on the available loot pool. Your location is determined and the list of available finds in that area are checked. Your skills, equipment are checked to see which ones you are eligible for. One is picked at random and the appropriate actions (including global/hof animations if needed) are done.
(In truth, I'm not sure if the specific find is determined and then the TT amount or vise-versa. It could be item first then TT value, to make sure not too much of a resource is given out.)
Mining HOFs/ATHs
Just like mob loot, resources have to be assigned an amount available and given distribution rules. In the case of mining ATHs, simply enough decay was used in that location to allow the appropriate amount of that ore to be claimed by the next person with the appropriate skills/equipment to find that ore. Gratz to the finder.
Amps
Mining amps act as a "multiplier" with a nasty side effect. When amps are used, due to their high decay amount, more "loot" has now been made available. This means you'll find a larger amount "on average" compared to not using amps.
However, amps create the problem of lowering your chances of success while increasing the amount of finds you do hit. So instead of hitting 3 - 10 ped finds in 35 bombs without amps, you may find only 1 find in 35 bombs with an amp, but that find will be ~50 TT value. Bigger chance of success, but bigger chance of failure as well. (Much like the quantity/condition settings for crafting.)
So what if you run around with amps and don't score your 80% worth of loot? Simple: On average it will be assigned to others who come through that general location. Don't worry, someone will benefit from your decay and you will benefit from theirs.
Depth
So much voodoo is placed into the "depth" of the finders. Remember the magic word "random".
When a find is made, a random number from 1 to 1000 is generated for the depth. This number is based (as usual) on a sliding scale based on your skills, equip. And type of find located. For example, gold and ruga finds are only allowed a random depth number from 800-1000, (I may be wrong on the 800 number, but again you get the idea) while lyst is allowed the full spectrum.
It doesn't matter if you stand on a mountain, a valley or wherever, depth is meaningless to the loot. It's simply decoration and mood lighting.
Spaceships
MA knew mining might get boring, so they made something fun.
On a rare occasion, (determined randomly) a "strange signal" is looted allowing miners to attack bots and gather a 50 ped global possibly containing a valuable beacon (based on how many are available) These beacons offer robot killing excursions, loot paid for by the decay used of course. (The amount of decay used on a beacon run is NOT calculated to make the loot for that run. The decay from the previous runs of the same size are used.)
Crafting
Crafting is fairly straight forward to understand. Each item requires a "recipe" consisting of blueprint and required materials. A chance of success is determined by the blueprint, your skills, quantity/condition slider, etc. upon success, or partial success a TT value is assessed. Your crafted item (in the case of success) is assigned a value and the rest is assigned as residue. The type of residue is determined by what items are used, ores, enmatter, etc. they type(s) is chosen (again at random based on which ones you're eligible for) and off you go.
Residue
Residue was a fantastic idea. First, it allowed MA to give pec-level controllable loot besides the crafted item. But most importantly, they recognized the fact that items {(L) items for example} would want to be made with 100% chance of having full TT value. So put enough (and the right type of) residue and when you craft something, the difference between the original item and full TT value is taken out of the residue (assuming you put enough in.) So you in essence exchange x ped worth of residue for equal TT value extra on the item you make. Depending on what you craft, this is a great trade.
Blueprints
This is the part that matters most. Without a blueprint the ingredients do you no good. This makes blueprints valuable. Well, valuable depending on what it makes and how often they "drop". Just like other loot, certain BPs are only lootable by clicking on certain other BPs. You can not loot a gun BP by clicking on a component BP like basic filters.
Also keep in mind that for every blueprint dropped, the appropriate amount of crafted material must be in the loot database as well. Their protocol I believe, is to place the item first, then the BP.
For example, "Bessie", the bad assed ore finder. MA placed the item in the loot db, then placed the BP in, and waited for it to be looted, knowing someone with enough skills was likely to click it. It's quite possible that all attempts could have failed, but I believe MA produces these types of BPs with a built in high COS, in order to placed the item into the game.
Quantity/Condition
Much like mining amps, you can lower your chance of success but increase your chance of higher loot by adjusting the qty/condition slider. Keep in mind that in the long run ~80% is avg. loot back. Running condition does not create more loot in the loot pool until after repeated failures.
Mining/Crafting – hunting/tailoring connection
Some folks believe that the items used in crafting/tailoring are then re-released to be found again in mining/hunting. This is not true. Each profession pays for its own loot. If everyone stopped crafting/tailoring for a month straight, miners would be finding just as many ores/enmatter. (Of course since no one would be buying them, their finances would be in real trouble.)
Oil Rig
The oil rig spits out oil for free. Nothing is free, so where does the money come from for the oil? Simple. The decay needed to stay there long enough to gather it. Remember decay is spent either in PKing potential rivals, or used on the Atrox, and usually both. The amount of oil given out is truly a small amount compared to the amount of decay used in that area.
Land Areas
Land areas owned by players are amazing areas. They give the owner the ability to set the type of mob(s) in the area (assuming they have DNA samples) as well as the density and maturity. The owners set tax amounts for hunting and mining. This is how they make their money.
So, when you loot a mob in a land area, does MA increase the loot to cover the taxes? Nope. Remember the amount of loot can not exceed the amount of decay spent.
If you hit a 50 ped global on an LA with 5% tax, you'll find the TT value in your window is ~47.50. The other 2.50 was removed and placed into the LA owners account.
EDIT: I am wrong. The globals are calculated AFTER taxes are taken out. That's what I get for trying to write from memory and not double checking my facts.
So what's the point of hunting on Las if your loot is reduced? There are 2 reasons:
- LAs allow you to hunt a specific mob, keeping you from spreading your decay over too many mob types.
- MA opens up the amount of loot available in LAs a small amount, so for example 98.5% return is available instead of a 97% return.
And to answer the question, if an LA has 2 or more mobs, each mob has their own loot pool amount.
What about DNA changes such as when the Equss LA became a Neconu dominate LA? The old herd is killed off, and can collect no more decay, so any left over loot will be reassessed by the balancing staff later.
Sweat
Sweat is dolled out in random amounts per success. Each attempt requires the same random COS check as anything else. When success = yes, a random amount of bottles (from 1-30 I think) are generated. The amount of sweat per mob is capped to an amount based on its health amount. Bigger mobs give more sweat. However, it's the number of successful pulls that are regulated, not the specif amount of bottles. Again, random.
This was MA's version of a "free trial offer" since folks could sweat, sell it to gather beginning equipment and move on from there. It is offered in such small amounts (low chance of success + few bottles per success) because for accounting purposes, they had to give it a TT value 0.00001 I believe it is, so 1,000 sweat = 1 pec (0.01PED). Obviously much too low to be able to be TTd for any substantial money.
However, this is eventually used in mindforce, so the decay there helps cover the cost of sweat.
Fruit
See Sweat. Fruit is a random find. At random moments a random avatar is picked and a random amount of fruit is placed close by them. If someone sees it and picks it up, great. If not it will eventually go away.
Sweat/fruit/dung were made so folks could "try it before you buy it". Mindforce and taming were created simply to give sweat/fruit a reason for existence.
This is also why MA will almost certainly never do anything substantial with these fields. Not until they can come up with some substantial method of building in enough decay to the processes to justify what they could be capable of.
Dung
Again, freebies. But in this case, they almost have a use, since they're needed to create fertilizer to maintain the land areas owned by other players.
Notice all the "freebies" are paid for by other players in markup, not MA.
Markup
This is the part of the game MA has the least control over. Markup is decided on us, the players, and how much we are willing to pay for each item. A lot of the markup of items is based on the "drop amount" and desirability of the item, but a lot of markup is based on "well others paid this price in the recent past so I'll try to get more for it."
Molisk tooth for example, drops very often but still maintains a high markup. While animal hide (which drops quite often) has recently dropped from a high markup to quite a low level.
However, markup is what makes the most money for MA. The more money turned into peds, for whatever reason, the more MA has to siphon from, because most of it will likely get spent in decay eventually.
Also high markups mean more deposits. The more deposits to MA, the more money for them to gain interest on.
The interest gained plus the "decay rake" is where MA makes 99% of there money.
In conclusion
Random, random, random. As I said, MA created a very dynamic game that really doesn't care what we do. The loot will distribute based on what we, as a community, do. What we hunt, where we mine, what we craft, how much we are willing to pay in markup etc. etc. etc.
Aside from what MA allows to be looted, this game is not really in their control. It's in ours. That's what makes it such a great game.
Last edited:
