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Armor Deterioration Changes

what about a decrease in clothes tt?
if i have to repair my outfit, at least wouldnt cost too much as it costs now, no repairs = messed colors, fc&ed outfit.
Something must be done with clothes, or at least change the worn on them...
Some1 told me that i only needed to repair it to 50% of its condition to have the outfit good, not sure if its true or not, but at least another solution would be like for example, reduce that condition worn thing to lets say, 25%?
 
Marco|MindArk said:
And I am back from my vacation. I didn't think that it would be warmer here than in real life, but I am ready
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RoFL :laugh:
kudos for coming into the eye of a storm, and thanx for listening.
Didn't think there would be changes this quickly
 
Well, if the problem is with equipping too fast, i'm ready to take a major delay, to reduce this lag and to get rid of the fee. I'm sure everyone would agree to it as well. No one really needs to switch armor or clothes that fast anyways!

I think the 2 pecs fee is ruining the tailoring business. Very few people will buy clothes this VU, so i surely hope the plans for tailoring are very well thought out for the future...

Welcome back Marco.
 
Welcome Back Marco!
this place has been a litle peice of hell on earth while you were gone :)
 
hooters said:
Well, if the problem is with equipping too fast, i'm ready to take a major delay, to reduce this lag and to get rid of the fee. I'm sure everyone would agree to it as well. No one really needs to switch armor or clothes that fast anyways!
[...]
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A-b-s-o-l-u-t-e-l-y!

Just please make sure the delay does interests the clothing and armors, and NOT the weapons/faps/tools.
 
Hi Marco

Hope your holiday went well.

For me the "getting dressed tax" to reduce lag has worked 100%.

I have taken my clothing off, and put all of it in storage.

I have put a set of armour on, and do not plan to take it off.

Once clothing prices have recovered from the price crash I can see coming as people dump their now unwanted clothes, I will try and sell mine too.

It's funny really, the Colouring profession is improved, and at the same time a major change is made to put of potential customers.
 
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itree said:
Taxation is a means to discourage consumption of a product. Consider for example taxes on tobacco products which are intended to disincent people from smoking by making cigarettes more expensive. Adding a tax to equip clothes will drive many people into keeping the same outfit instead of buying new ones. So instead of encouraging the tailoring profession it will have the opposite effect, as can already be seen by many people posting on this forum static they don't mind the tax since they plan on never changing their outfit to avoid it. The knock-on effects of a reduced tailoring throughput will have far reaching effects on the economy of EU as a whole, so we are not talking just about the tax, but its implications. 2 PEC isn't a big deal, but when it ultimately translates in reduced turnover of crafting materials it becomes a big problem.
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that´s a solid true as a nail in a coffin
 
Simply put:

1) Increase the Armor equip time another .5 or even 1 second and remove the remaining tax.

2) Either give Footguards to everyone holding shins or make the shins and feet one unit.

3) Make the clothing decay realistically timebased, and not Equip-based.

4) Include any planned decay and other monetary changes in every future VU description BEFORE implementation.


Everybody happy?
 
Seriously though, Marco, don't you think the 2pecs fee on clothes has just discouraged people from buying clothes for a long time to come? I'm not even removing my clothes and the majority aren't either. So, that pretty much means barely anyone will buy clothes...
 
Yirrk said:
[...]
4) Include any planned decay and other monetary changes in every future VU description.
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... beforehand! (as in Previews, Community feedback, whatever...)
 
Marco|MindArk said:
Yes, a quick-fix will come in VU 9.0.2, where the middle mouse button functions as change aim-/cursor-mode. In a future TBD VU we will add customization to mouse buttons, as many mice today has a gazillion buttons.
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this clearly shows that even core MA staff is already alienated from their product - it is "tantillion", not "gazillion" :D

Back on topic, please remove the fee for equipping. I can understand the need for clothes looking like the state they are in, although feeling sorry for all those who spent lots of money on their wardrobe (be it to acquire it or to color it) -

BUT, the decay:

- make it either time dependant, maybe with mobs hitting also decaying the clothes worn,

- or introduce some mechanism that prevents from equipping clothes too fast... in fact, IRL it also takes time to change 3 pieces of clothes or 6 (7) pieces of armor, too... i think we all could live with that.

and yes, customer relations is surely something to be improved ;)

oh, i forgot, that was my hug ;)

hope you spent a nice vacation and looking forward to all those changes :yay:
 
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Foot guards, foot guards, foot guards. Is it tomorrow yet?

Hope it rains foot guards as I have quite a collection of full armour that now has a missing piece.

But I can wait until tomorrow.

soundboy
 
It doesn't fill me with confidence that the devs are in control of the development of EU and that they don't consult or inform of any changes such as extra armour part. You should be top of the tree regarding information and should be able to veto any new addition before the devs can implement it.

I could understand putting the decay on new clothes that are introduced in the future but to make it retro active only seems a way to make people put more cash, I've already seen people quoting figures of $2700 (thats not ped) to repair their collections. I've stopped using clothes other than my hat as my armor covers everything so there isn't any point in wearing anything else, I guess a few may be doing that already.

This should have been openly discussed with the community way before any of the controversial updates and the devs had even started coding them. It would have stopped a lot of ill feeling and a loss of trust in MA.

Personally I won't be happy until the tax is removed totally.
 
Marco|MindArk said:
And I am back from my vacation. I didn't think that it would be warmer here than in real life, but I am ready.

In the future MA will convey more information about changes and upgrades before hand and have discussions about it. I will also make sure that the MA mission statement/vision will be made available in the next couple of weeks, to present how and why MA do things and what we intend to create, long-term.

Can I please have a hug before I get flamed? ,-)
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Marco|MindArk said:
It is not the armor per se, but the new ability to quickly change a lot of parts during a short time frame.

And, to make it clear - the changes comes in effect when VU 9.0.2 is released, which is expected to happen Tuesday, 16th of October.
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Marco|MindArk said:
No, it will not. It is a fundamental part of the whole clothes and beauty system upgrades planned for the near future. Clothes has had a condition bar since Entropia launched and it is unfortunate that it took this long before we activated it, therefore creating a "culture" where conditions of clothes didn't really matter.
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Marco|MindArk said:
Yes, a quick-fix will come in VU 9.0.2, where the middle mouse button functions as change aim-/cursor-mode. In a future TBD VU we will add customization to mouse buttons, as many mice today has a gazillion buttons.
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Marco|MindArk said:
I agree that it is a part of the social aspect. It is also a part of the business that exists in Entropia. And in order to facilitate and support the business in a balanced matter for future developments in the clothing system this is a necessity.

Also, the condition decay is when you put on clothes only, not when you take it off. Just to make that clear.
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Marco|MindArk said:
I am still gathering info about the foot guards and before I know more I will refrain from comments. I hope to comment tomorrow. I hope you understand.
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Marco|MindArk said:
This is being discussed. Right now it is less than perfect, especially that there is no warning as to it. I'll talk more with the devs and hopefully have a comment by tomorrow.
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Welcome back from your vacation Marco, I hope you had a nice one. I'm sure it was well deserved. :)

I have had my problems with the VU as well and I'm glad that you came by to answer a few questions. It might have been better to communicate some of the information you are sharing with us now, before the VU.

My main gripe has been the decay on clothes, not the fee, but the fact that I would have to spend hundeds of PED to repair them to the point where they look good. If all my clothes were full TT at the start of the VU, the fee would not have impacted as hard.

In any case please don't be a stranger, heres your hug :hug:

Cheers :beerchug:
 
1: Welcome back Marco, I hope you enjoyed a restful holiday.

Marco|MindArk said:
It is not the armor per se, but the new ability to quickly change a lot of parts during a short time frame.
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If people use the convenience of hotkeyed armour, then add a delay to this to avoid fast change exploits. The normal item by item armour change could be left at the previous VU speed. Therefore no need for ANY armour equipping fee. If people exploit things, ban them instead of making all other players pay for it!

Marco|MindArk said:
Yes, a quick-fix will come in VU 9.0.2, where the middle mouse button functions as change aim-/cursor-mode.
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The middle mouse button is still operating normally, allowing the avatar view to rotate around. So now you are breaking another mouse function as a quick fix for the RMB???

Marco|MindArk said:
In the future MA will convey more information about changes and upgrades before hand and have discussions about it.
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I'm sorry but I no longer have any faith that these promises will be met. Just nice words that seem to be easily forgotten.
 
I'll will come back to this thread tomorrow and start reading after my last post (that one before this one) and comment again. Thanks for your patience and I will have more replies tomorrow.

Untill then.
 
Why can i attach plates to armor that i am wearing, but not detach? So when i wanna change plates i have to unequip, detach plates, attach new plates and equip... You wanna have us making lag, and paying for it in the progress, so it seems.
When that is fixed the tax isn't that bad, but you still are a snake taxing things we have since the game started. Last VU i could put on armor faster than now.
And where does the lag come from? The only serious lag there is, is on my computer to load the specifc textures? If you are sending all textures via the server you have some serious issues.
Putting on armor is no more data than switching gun, or hell even chat or move.

So please remove the tax on armor completely and maybe introduce a wearing tax on clothes (sunlight damage, sweet damage, which deteriorates clothes over time).
 
Marco|MindArk said:
I'll will come back to this thread tomorrow and start reading after my last post (that one before this one) and comment again. Thanks for your patience and I will have more replies tomorrow.

Untill then.
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:duh:
You've also hidden your "last activity" from your Profile page... nasty, nasty Marco! :wise:

See you tomorrow...
 
What Will Be Next

What will be next. I can still see it for there are lots of things with health bars not yet taxed. EVERYTHING in your apartment. Every tool, weapon, fap etc etc. They will all be next. Once this gets started it won't stop.
 
And as if all this wasnt enough, most of us had theyr clothes with the tt they got crafted and now due to that, its a mess, colors ruined, just because clothes are worn, and to repair them, ppl have to spend quite a few large peds, i have to pay 100 peds to get my outfit repaired, but i cant afford to spend 100 ped on that kind of thing atm,so im just taking clothes of, so its decreasing my interest on clothes, like in most of ppl, don't you think this demotivate ppl to buy more clothes and therefore will just lead to more ruin on tailorers business...
 
God forbid they ever introduce a whining tax... rawful <3
 
Bertha Bot said:
Armor Deterioration Changes
15 Oct 2007 Following an evaluation of the changes in VU 9.0, recent armor deteriorations have been revised for VU 9.0.2 due on October 16.

The 2 PEC deterioration of 'Limited' armor parts when equipping them has been removed. This will encourage the use of this armor type even more.

The deterioration of 'Unlimited' armor parts has been reduced to 1 PEC per equip. MindArk wish to differentiate between Limited and Unlimited armor series. Hunters now have the added dimension of weighting the advantages and disadvantages of using an all-round protective armor which doesn't need to be changed as often, or using special armors that protect against specific damage types. This compliments the economic balance MindArk strive to achieve in regards to armors.

The new abilities to 'Hot Key' armor parts will result in extra lag if abused i.e. participants repeatedly changing armors in crowded areas. This potential exploit is to be curbed. As the fee has now been reduced, an increased delay of 0.5 seconds is included when equipping armors.

Originally Posted Here
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Unfortunately, this solves only about a quarter of the problems. Here's the thing. Armor decays WHEN HIT. It should not decay when donned, no matter whether or not it is limited. Limited armor IS ALREADY DIFFERENTIATED from Unlimited armor in that IT CANNOT BE REPAIRED and must therefore be bought over and over again. To remove the use tax from one and not the other on the basis that the two need to be differentiated is just as much smoke and mirrors as putting the use tax on armor and clothing because of a lag problem. Rolling back a 2 pec use tax that shouldn't exist to a 1 pec use tax that shouldn't exist does not show compassion for your constituents, it simply shows that you believe that your constituents are easily led by the nose. How unfortunate for you at MindArk that you seem to want to underestimate the intelligence of your players so severely. Sadly for us, the players, there are people who will be thrilled to death that you've halved the tax, and that makes the rest of us who are holding out for a more reasonable compromise look really bad.

In addition, there was no word in this post about any aid for tailors. Most people would be willing to accept the changes in tailoring, except that (a) you sprang them on us without warning, and (b) you devalued the clothing market severely by making the clothing look poor and shabby when it is not fully repaired. I understand that this is something that someone suggested in these very forums, and probably something that MindArk has been planning for some time, but there was NO transition period at all. None. No warning for the tailors. Nothing. This is not customer courtesy nor convenience. A little more in the way of communication from you, MindArk, and Marco, would have made a world of difference in the attitude concerning the coming changes.

Please go back and read the support letters again. Be assured that the Wandering Noob will also be roaming the continents to get the people's views on this new change, and I surmise that the majority of them will not cast MindArk in a very good light.
 
Mathayus said:
And as if all this wasnt enough, most of us had theyr clothes with the tt they got crafted and now due to that, its a mess, colors ruined, just because clothes are worn, and to repair them, ppl have to spend quite a few large peds, i have to pay 100 peds to get my outfit repaired, but i cant afford to spend 100 ped on that kind of thing atm,so im just taking clothes of, so its decreasing my interest on clothes, like in most of ppl, don't you think this demotivate ppl to buy more clothes and therefore will just lead to more ruin on tailorers business...
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Exactly. So since the only value of a piece of clothing is what it looks like, MA has ruined the value of every piece of clothing in the game by all the sudden deciding to make the looks based on the condition. Yes, the condition bars have been there all along, but since it didn't have anything to do with the looks, it was ignored. The right and proper thing to do would be to would be to set the condition of every piece of clothing currently in the game to the proper level to maintain the VALUE it had before the VU. If a real-life company showed you a piece of new clothing, which you then bought, and when you got it it was old and shabby, they would end up in court.
 
Welcome back Marco! Now see what happenes when you go on a vacation? Don't you ever ... again :wise:

also .. hm it's not really me on my ava .. didnt mean anything with it tho.. I made it with luw, hugs and 16 glasses of redwine ... :hug:

Good to read all your responses here. We are thirsty for communication ;)
 
Marco|MindArk said:
Yes, a quick-fix will come in VU 9.0.2, where the middle mouse button functions as change aim-/cursor-mode. In a future TBD VU we will add customization to mouse buttons, as many mice today has a gazillion buttons.
Click to expand...

Frankly, I liked the way the mouse buttons worked in the previous VU. I liked hitting my scroll wheel to switch from rear to front view of my ava so I could see what she looked like easily. I liked the right-click functions that were available. I don't have a fancy mouse with lots of buttons. What's next? Requiring that we all have control pads as well as the keyboard functions? Ridiculous, that would be!
 
Marco|MindArk said:
I agree that it is a part of the social aspect. It is also a part of the business that exists in Entropia. And in order to facilitate and support the business in a balanced matter for future developments in the clothing system this is a necessity.

Also, the condition decay is when you put on clothes only, not when you take it off. Just to make that clear.
Click to expand...

I suspect this is because they will be introducing L clothes in the near future, and all new clothes bps will be L. Just like they did with the Necromancer, Lich, etc. armors.

The business aspect is it will create more business for the tailors.

They should make a "try on clothes" preview function, so we can try on clothes in a shop to see how they look before buying, or experiment with combinations of clothes we own before committing to one combination.
 
Marco|MindArk said:
And I am back from my vacation. I didn't think that it would be warmer here than in real life, but I am ready.

In the future MA will convey more information about changes and upgrades before hand and have discussions about it. I will also make sure that the MA mission statement/vision will be made available in the next couple of weeks, to present how and why MA do things and what we intend to create, long-term.

Can I please have a hug before I get flamed? ,-)
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Sorry , no hug from me!!
This better news simply because it appears like MA want to some customers.
At least they have listened & shows that we have some influence.

However, this situition should have never have araisen in the 1st place, why don't they ever check with the community before planning & coding something would potential slash the customer base & their revenue, along customer confidence :(
 
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