You mean automation's going to take away my remedial job as a telephone switchboard operator? Besides, we already have a Universal Basic Income.
It's $0.
The UBI is $0.
in 5 - 10 years, your job will be killed by AI, and your current boss will get your incomming trough a robot. Why not tax your ex workplace, and give you a ubi, if you dont have longer work? Into the metal industrie (mechanic) there got a lot workplaces lost, if we got computers for making the pieces, instead of a human. if i was young, i saw all this destroying of workplaces. Now, the AI is some thing more as a computer/mashine. It realy will kill a lot of our current workplaces and there will be not enought new work for everyone.
no way, this is utter bullshit. In 5 to 10 years not much will be different.
At the moment the opposite is actually happening. We have far to few workers available!
Our unemployment rate has never been lower as it is today.
Maybe what you say will be true in 50 years or more. But in 10 years we still need more workers than we can supply.
And once automation will kick in we need folks to operate the machines.
And once we don't need those anymore, skynet will try to destroy all humans, sending in terminators after us, so no need for a ubi than anyways.
So, to bad you lazy fuckers! No UBI and just work for your money!! If you want something for free, just watch the sun go up and under.
To me UBI is a lazy way to implement a social safety net...giving money isn't always the best way to achieve exactly what you want.
But I believe people should be able to have the necessities of life, whatever their particular situation may be. I'm talking food, shelter, medical care, etc. In the end, this is cheaper than having them get sicker and sicker then they have to be taken care of anyways but at a higher cost to everybody. Not to mention it is just the compassionate thing to do.
I think providing basic needs for people actually means they can more easily actualize what they actually want to become. I think this really depends on your view, if people are self-motivated or if they are generally going to be as lazy as they can be.
Anyways, my two rambling cents.
let's talk about that in 10 years In my country, ppl above 55 age mostly don't find any job again. So im sure, those are not lazy, they just don't get a job!
Well, in both case we already have a solution to that.
As a social safety net, in case you can't work due to ilness, age or whatever reason, there is social welfare.
You only apply for that if you CANT work and not if you just dont WANT to work.
A UBI is not a safety net. A UBI is just a way to make people lazy.
I disagree with the word lazy, but money sure isn't everything, I agree. For me, UBI is a new starting place and a new attempt at finding a balance between individuals, the local and the global.To me UBI is a lazy way to implement a social safety net...giving money isn't always the best way to achieve exactly what you want.
Just a question, did you ever had the situation to use your so called welfare? I don't know how this is in other countries, but here in my country, if you get welfare, you get near noting, and you will loose all your hard worked things like car, house, etc... maybe also the wife. Then, if you get welfare in my country, you will be observed like you be a criminal.
Realy, welfare is not the solution in long term, and welfare cost a lot of money too, just only for observation, controling, office and all the other cost. But ok, how i told, we will talk about this all in 10 years. I don't think i can change your mind yet , also same at me, you can't change my mind about that theme.
Just looking at myself, if I would get a UBI, I would instantly stop working!! And for sure Im not the only one!
I simply got to many hobbies and to little time. ...
"maybe also the wife." lol!!
Dang I have to sell my wife first before I get welfare!!
She's worth at least 12 camels!!!
Jokes aside, yes, you surely have a point. It's not much different here.
But instead of throwing out money for an UBI, why not improve the welfare system to better standards?
Just looking at myself, if I would get a UBI, I would instantly stop working!! And for sure Im not the only one!
I simply got to many hobbies and to little time.
To me, time is worth more than money.
But as it is now, money buys time, but you need time to get money first.
Ok, and what you want do the whole day, if you get ubi, and this is the case why you give up your job? Watching TV and sleep 24/7 doing hobbies 24/7 ? I'm sure after 6 Months you start to feel bad and bored. But... if you get ubi, about you lost the job, and then you be not stressed about been too poor. Maybe you then start to study things, and learn other stuff, and maybe you be able to get a other job later, or you build a new buiz? On getting welfare, you only get some very small help for surviving and thats it!
No, I would not be bored at all!!
Creativity knows no boredom!
You're so far off thinking I would be bored after 6 months.
Just give me a piece of wood and I would make something out of it if there's nothing else to do.
Maybe I would write a book, or whatever. Everything but a boring job!!!
I would just sit back, relax, do stuff and never worry about my job.
Indeed, on welfare you just get the basic minimum to make sure you wont die. That will motivate you to get a job and do stuff to make some money.
A ubi won't. It simply doesnt motivate if you get enough money to live decently without a job.
Let it be clear, I would be totally in for getting a ubi. I would not be against it at all.
I would be the first to enjoy my retirement at the age of 43!
...that some dude just hang around, but those do the same also if they have a job, in the difference, that they hang out into the job also on the cost of the boss. ..
Thoughts during space flight...
While I tend to sympathize with the libertarian side, opinions whether it's a good thing or not are actually irrelvant because the legal basis exists already in form of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Its 30 or so sections apply all together and each single one, failures to implement them in their entirety are unconstitutional in all states that signed the declaration. The UDHR also has the one on slavery which forbids taking the means for social security by force in form of taxes. The problem is that we have fiat money now, but the tax system is still from the times of the gold (or other commodity) standard. The simple solution would be direct access to money creation for covering the most basic means to maintain human existence. In other words, the "human gold standard". It could be implemented in every country, no matter if rich or poor by whatever standard, with very little change to existing structures except those of power. Barter rings e.g. already implement the idea, the Swiss "Wir-Franken" is the only country-wide implementation I'm aware of so far but its acceptance is limited. Would its universal implementation really violate the principles of liberty, even if people get access to funds they don't "deserve" in the classical sense? Would really like to find out where the flaw is here, if there is one.
It could only work in a fully centralized system. A totalitarian communistic society of some sort.
"All people are equal. Some are just a bit more equal than others."
Hm, the funy thing is, that the main idea about UBI is created by some capitalism dude, also if it sounds like communism. And the idea is much older, as most ppl know.
Bottom line is this. There ain't no such thing as a "free" anything. If it doesn't cost you in taxes, it'll cost you in your soul.
At the moment the opposite is actually happening. We have far to few workers available!
Our unemployment rate has never been lower as it is today.
Unless your unemployment rate is zero, you do not have too few workers available.
It's inevitable. Either that or violent revolution. Take your pick.
Did you read that post for Canada? They scrapped UBI trial in Ontario for political reasons. It was started by one party in the government and then when a new party came in, they got rid of it so they could reduce taxes, government spending, etc. It was basically a way to make campaign promises claiming that it was too expensive, yet they did not back that up with any data.
Heres something interesting:
After Ontario launched its pilot, recipients began detailing how their lives had changed; the funds had afforded them healthier food, warm clothes for winter and even a long-postponed visit to the dentist. Others used the funds to go back to school or invest in their own businesses.
The Hamilton resident Dave Cherkewski, 46, said the monthly payments had eased the stress of daily life, enabling him to better cope with a mental illness that had kept him out of the workforce since 2002.
Now he was gearing up to return to work, hoping to find a role where he could support others with mental health challenges. “With basic income I will be able to clarify my dream and actually make it a reality,” he told the Associated Press.
“Because I can focus all my effort on that and not worry about, ‘Well, I need to pay my $520 rent, I need to pay my $50 cellphone, I need to eat and do other things.’”
Sounds like that guy was totally lazy.....
Not everyone will just be lazy and do nothing if they got UBI. In fact, many will use it to follow their dreams and do professions that they enjoy...fancy that, a job that you look forward to going to every day.
Yes there will be those that just sit around playing video games all day *cough* , but there are also many who will actually have the ability to focus on what makes their life enjoyable....which may very well be their own business, or going back to school, maybe even developing a new video game, the list goes on.
I'm not saying that UBI is an answer or should go ahead, but a modification of it could be something useful if its looked into and trialed properly. Something needs to be worked out for when Automation & AI remove a lot of jobs.