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Xen Hunting Log

LavaSparks said:
25k tickets x 50 ped = 1.25m ped. Anyway, it's how it works. Take what is offered or not. Wishful thinking isn't going to change the odds. One can have monthly entertainmeint in EU for free, $5, $50 or $500, MA doesn't decide what you spend, you do.

In other news: I see many folks refer to MA's stated average return. Well, for once those are old numbers. Secondly, a handful of players have higher turnover than the rest combined. If they have 98 % tt return, the rest need to be in the 92-94 % range for the numbers to go up. Median values would be more interesting, but MA has no interest of telling us what we don't want to hear ;)
Click to expand...

But he's running 80%+ efficency. To put that into prospective. He went out and bought a brand new Lamborghini, then spent extra on upgrades and additional bolts on's (say as rings). Yet under the hood MA changed other stats to compensate. So now he's running his expensive car on a race track littered with nails and deliberate cracks cut into the road to lower the performance of his car.

Although sure; he doesn't have buy the expensive car, or race on the damaged track. But it sure makes good entertainment watching these expensive race cars (threads) spin off the track, and slam into the walls every day.

Rick
 
RickEngland said:
But he's running 80%+ efficency. To put that into prospective. He went out and bought a brand new Lamborghini, then spent extra on upgrades and additional bolts on's (say as rings). Yet under the hood MA changed other stats to compensate. So now he's running his expensive car on a race track littered with nails and deliberate cracks cut into the road to lower the performance of his car.

Although sure; he doesn't have buy the expensive car, or race on the damaged track. But it sure makes good entertainment watching these expensive race cars (threads) spin off the track, and slam into the walls every day.

Rick
Click to expand...

It's always funny when Rick tries to explain the mechanics of the game with his words so he can better understand. Then you notice him failed to understand when he throws his "under the hood" as argument.
No Rick, Xen actually understands the system and he knows it's because of low turnover on big mobs.
Xen is tracking but he only shows a small part of the whole picture.
People shouldn't track and have expectations from a low turnover style. The variations are far too great to draw any conclusions.
 
Xen, ever tried mining instead?
 
I have not stated my expectations yet. I do expect when I get up around 2k kills the odds the tt return are under 90% should be pretty low.
 
Evey said:
It's always funny when Rick tries to explain the mechanics of the game with his words so he can better understand. Then you notice him failed to understand when he throws his "under the hood" as argument.
No Rick, Xen actually understands the system and he knows it's because of low turnover on big mobs.
Xen is tracking but he only shows a small part of the whole picture.
People shouldn't track and have expectations from a low turnover style. The variations are far too great to draw any conclusions.
Click to expand...

Funny stuff Evey.
I guess he could run the 1.25 million ped suggested a few posts previously. No small amount of cash that.

It doesn't matter how much you wrap it up in different ways; his efficency is not 'drastically' improving his returns, even if he has drastically reduced his cost. Because input cost is noe measured to calculate returns, not like the old days when costs were implied to be "static". Hence why weapons had insane values.

So his benefit ironically for that 80% efficiency is a lower bankroll requirement to get the same results with less efficency. Doesnt mean he gets more return for that efficiency.

So that brings it back to the huge 1.25 million ped suggested bankroll. He doesn't really need that many tickets then does he.

To prove that input cost is true and no longer static, let's look at yourself and Messi. No1 and No2 most globals. Almost outstripping the rest of the community by a large multiple. Why aren't you getting a 10k uber every week, based in your turnover?

Might well run less efficency. Doesn't matter if the system says... "your cost is less, to your return is less".

Rick.
 
Looter skills would be interesting to see, can you share those please?
 
RickEngland said:
Funny stuff Evey.
I guess he could run the 1.25 million ped suggested a few posts previously. No small amount of cash that.

It doesn't matter how much you wrap it up in different ways; his efficency is not 'drastically' improving his returns, even if he has drastically reduced his cost. Because input cost is noe measured to calculate returns, not like the old days when costs were implied to be "static". Hence why weapons had insane values.

So his benefit ironically for that 80% efficiency is a lower bankroll requirement to get the same results with less efficency. Doesnt mean he gets more return for that efficiency.

So that brings it back to the huge 1.25 million ped suggested bankroll. He doesn't really need that many tickets then does he.

To prove that input cost is true and no longer static, let's look at yourself and Messi. No1 and No2 most globals. Almost outstripping the rest of the community by a large multiple. Why aren't you getting a 10k uber every week, based in your turnover?

Might well run less efficency. Doesn't matter if the system says... "your cost is less, to your return is less".

Rick.
Click to expand...
Please read these pages and try to remotely understand them before you spit out random nonsense next time:
en.wikipedia.org

Law of large numbers - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
en.wikipedia.org

Expected value - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
en.wikipedia.org

Variance - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

On topic:
I think your returns are absolutely within expectable ranges, I'd be curious to see what weapon you're actually using.
I'm usually not getting below 90% on 1k+ kills, your numbers seem a bit lower.
 
all said .
 
Taldur said:
On topic:
I think your returns are absolutely within expectable ranges, I'd be curious to see what weapon you're actually using.
I'm usually not getting below 90% on 1k+ kills, your numbers seem a bit lower.
Click to expand...

Electric Attack Nanochip 13, FEN Edition + NeoPsion Kinetic Amplifier 7, FEN Edition

2 tiers of damage enhancers used on eomon

xmas 17 + xmas 19
candy canes
 
weapon efficiency: 80.8%

Mob: atrox med/lg

Costs:
weapon: 4,106.36
armor: 57.02
healing: 1.02

tt return: 3,815.08

tt return %: 91.61

cumulative tt return %: 84.38

total tt cycled: 40,620.07

cumulative tt +/-: -6,479.14
 
RickEngland said:
Funny stuff Evey.
I guess he could run the 1.25 million ped suggested a few posts previously. No small amount of cash that.

It doesn't matter how much you wrap it up in different ways; his efficency is not 'drastically' improving his returns, even if he has drastically reduced his cost. Because input cost is noe measured to calculate returns, not like the old days when costs were implied to be "static". Hence why weapons had insane values.

So his benefit ironically for that 80% efficiency is a lower bankroll requirement to get the same results with less efficency. Doesnt mean he gets more return for that efficiency.

So that brings it back to the huge 1.25 million ped suggested bankroll. He doesn't really need that many tickets then does he.

To prove that input cost is true and no longer static, let's look at yourself and Messi. No1 and No2 most globals. Almost outstripping the rest of the community by a large multiple. Why aren't you getting a 10k uber every week, based in your turnover?

Might well run less efficency. Doesn't matter if the system says... "your cost is less, to your return is less".

Rick.
Click to expand...

you have been told at least twice to stay out of hunting discussion. not an insult but least 2 good players told you that. make your own log. yet again instead of damaging other
 
Apologies for going sideways on this thread's ownership/topic, just taking advantage of a little discussion with a hope of an explanation...
I keep reading of 90 or 95% return or any return and struggling to understand what that exactly implies...

A few years ago i run about a year of neconu hunting log and concluded that tjis game did cost me exactly about $7 usd per hour to play... (just threw this in here to show i am not completely new...)

anyway, if someone can clarify for me - I just got a few days run on longtooth mature. I might have popped 2000 of them... I started with 0 peds on the account and would depo 200 peds once out, i ve had a few globals including a 480 peds one - at some point i had 750 peds on my account. So i stopped after i made 5 200peds deposits ($100) and burnt through all. I am back at 0 now.

So the question is if there is any "return", lets say 90% - Does that mean that sionce i started with 0 and if i continue to deposit and pop the longtooth, then at some point I suppose to get a hof or a run of globals that would be around 90% of all money i have deposited since i started (on longtooth a few days back)? And i would get my $90 back?

(so far this longtooth mature run cost me $5 per hour - a little better then over 1 year of neconu in 2009 at $7 per hour - ended almost 2 year the run with 16k hof)
 
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fresco said:
Apologies for going sideways on this thread's ownership/topic, just taking advantage of a little discussion with a hope of an explanation...
I keep reading of 90 or 95% return or any return and struggling to understand what that exactly implies...

A few years ago i run about a year of neconu hunting log and concluded that tjis game did cost me exactly about $7 usd per hour to play... (just threw this in here to show i am not completely new...)

anyway, if someone can clarify for me - I just got a few days run on longtooth mature. I might have popped 2000 of them... I started with 0 peds on the account and would depo 200 peds once out, i ve had a few globals including a 480 peds one - at some point i had 750 peds on my account. So i stopped after i made 5 200peds deposits ($100) and burnt through all. I am back at 0 now.

So the question is if there is any "return", lets say 90% - Does that mean that sionce i started with 0 and if i continue to deposit and pop the longtooth, then at some point I suppose to get a hof or a run of globals that would be around 90% of all money i have deposited since i started (on longtooth a few days back)? And i would get my $90 back?

(so far this longtooth mature run cost me $5 per hour - a little better then over 1 year of neconu in 2009 at $7 per hour - ended almost 2 year the run with 16k hof)
Click to expand...

People report even 97.5% tt return long term, but that implies constant activity and picking the right mobs. 97.5% by itself is not great, when you do an activity for extended periods of time. In my case, such a tt return would mean a 62k ped tt loss for this year, loss that you need to cover with markup in order to make sense (to me) to keep going.
To answer your question, yes, in theory, in long term, an active's hunter returns would be around 95-97 %, but... on large scale that is a big loss. Can you cover that loss with markup from Longtooth? LTs and Eomons are fun, I do them myself too but the markup potential isn't great.
If you want to do something, ask yourself first "why? What's the goal?". Is it for fun, then do it. Are you trying to get to a point where your avatar is self sustainable? Then be careful. Do more research before and find mobs suited for your goal and budget.
GL
 
Evey said:
People report even 97.5% tt return long term, but that implies constant activity and picking the right mobs. 97.5% by itself is not great, when you do an activity for extended periods of time. In my case, such a tt return would mean a 62k ped tt loss for this year, loss that you need to cover with markup in order to make sense (to me) to keep going.
To answer your question, yes, in theory, in long term, an active's hunter returns would be around 95-97 %, but... on large scale that is a big loss. Can you cover that loss with markup from Longtooth? LTs and Eomons are fun, I do them myself too but the markup potential isn't great.
If you want to do something, ask yourself first "why? What's the goal?". Is it for fun, then do it. Are you trying to get to a point where your avatar is self sustainable? Then be careful. Do more research before and find mobs suited for your goal and budget.
GL
Click to expand...
Thank you.
I believe there are 2 sorts of avatars: profiting ones and pay-to-play ones. There was a theory way back, that there is a "preset" that you trigger...
anyway my question was just a simple yes/no if i keep that LT run, will i eventually hit the hof/globalchain to get back 80-90% of what i put in on them (in this continuous run)?

(sustainability of my avatar is beyond my comprehension... 15 years in the game is a solid proof of that)

PS. 62k (2.5%) tt-loss this year at 97.5% return. Does that mean that 100% is ~2480000ped and that is what you have deposited this year and would have lost $6,200USD (2.5%) if you would not have had enough markup?
 
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fresco said:
PS. 62k (2.5%) tt-loss this year at 97.5% return. Does that mean that 100% is ~2480000ped and that is what you have deposited this year and would have lost $6,200USD (2.5%) if you would not have had enough markup?
Click to expand...
I told you everything in the previous post and your conclusion was that I deposited 2.48 mil PED to shoot? Sustainability means something else...
 
my conclusion was that you had to cycle through "fire the gun enough times" to have a total cost of ammo and decay spent to be about 2.48 million peds to "loose" 62k as 2.5%. I just wanted you to confirm/deny that. (if thats true, your cost to play is about $2.50 per hour, my gross estimate of your potential ingame time)

Which will imply you shooting through $100USD (1000peds) per hour every day for 12 hours straight since January 1, 2020. Did you do that!?

anyway i created a thread (not to highjack Xens anylonger - https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forum/index.php?threads/pay-to-play-theory.276316
 
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weapon efficiency: 80.8%

Mob: atrox large/neconu small

Costs:
weapon: 4,114.84
armor: 47.98
healing: 1.04

tt return: 3,944.81

tt return %: 94.74

cumulative tt return %: 85.33

total tt cycled: 44,734.91

cumulative tt +/-: -6,698.19
 
weapon efficiency: 80.8%

Mob: neconu small

Costs:
weapon: 1,390.09
armor: 15.05
healing: 0.11

tt return: 1128.33

tt return %: 80.29

cumulative tt return %: 85.18

total tt cycled: 46,125.00

cumulative tt +/-: -6,975.11

This is just finishing up neconu iron a couple weeks ago.
 
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