Question: Amps.. The Big Question.

[xXx Ultimate xX]

Alright, so I hope this is in the right thread, if not apologies let me know & I shall move it.

But as the title says, I'd like to pick some brains on the decision of amps..

Currently, I use a Ar-Matrix LR-45 (L), with an Ar-Matrix L-Amplifier 37B (L).

Now this current setup (amp wise), is mostly due to when I used to use the a104/a105 or even iA105, I seemed to be bleeding PED. (granted this was before loot 2.0).

Every hunt I went on, unless I hit big or lots of globals, the decay from the amp would drag me back into the negative, which eventually ended up with me taking a break.

So now with Loot 2.0 and everything it entails, is a Limited amp actually hurting my returns more?

Given that the amp is 126% MU, and I hunt roughly 4-8hours/day depending on work + general bankroll on that week.

So I guess the bottom line question is, do I stick with limited, or is it advised to seek out an UL in the very near future, to see higher returns overall.


Edit: I'm aware that using a (L) gun with such playtime is also not advised, I have my eyes set on a couple, but any suggestions would also be appreciated! I am currently 52 Laser Dmg, 51 Laser Pistol/Sniper, 45 BLP pistol/sniper and 41 BLP Dmg.


Thankyou for reading

Ulti

 

[ermik]

Alright, so I hope this is in the right thread, if not apologies let me know & I shall move it.

But as the title says, I'd like to pick some brains on the decision of amps..

Currently, I use a Ar-Matrix LR-45 (L), with an Ar-Matrix L-Amplifier 37B (L).

Now this current setup (amp wise), is mostly due to when I used to use the a104/a105 or even iA105, I seemed to be bleeding PED. (granted this was before loot 2.0).

Every hunt I went on, unless I hit big or lots of globals, the decay from the amp would drag me back into the negative, which eventually ended up with me taking a break.

So now with Loot 2.0 and everything it entails, is a Limited amp actually hurting my returns more?

Given that the amp is 126% MU, and I hunt roughly 4-8hours/day depending on work + general bankroll on that week.

So I guess the bottom line question is, do I stick with limited, or is it advised to seek out an UL in the very near future, to see higher returns overall.


Edit: I'm aware that using a (L) gun with such playtime is also not advised, I have my eyes set on a couple, but any suggestions would also be appreciated! I am currently 52 Laser Dmg, 51 Laser Pistol/Sniper, 45 BLP pistol/sniper and 41 BLP Dmg.


Thankyou for reading

Ulti

You need to ask yourself a few questions.

1. Is the current activity generating any markup? If so what kind of markup and at what quantities?

2. Is my current setup effecient enough to make sure i can manage break even with the markup i loot.

 

[xXx Ultimate xX]

You need to ask yourself a few questions.

1. Is the current activity generating any markup? If so what kind of markup and at what quantities?

Trying to ensure I hunt mobs with "good" MU, currently doing MsPuddings EntropiaGold Event (Neconus/Scipulors) , the MU comes pretty frequent in the oils + neconu's have been nice in paying out Angel (L) pieces every few 1K ped cycles.

2. Is my current setup effecient enough to make sure i can manage break even with the markup i loot.

I currently make back 92-93% with MU included, however I feel some of that is due to the MU i'm paying for guns & the amp, which is why I'm wondering if that, I was to say buy an iA105, will that investment eventually pay itself off, by even a singular % more returns, from not having to pay MU daily, sometimes multiple times a day.

 

[ermik]

Trying to ensure I hunt mobs with "good" MU, currently doing MsPuddings EntropiaGold Event (Neconus/Scipulors) , the MU comes pretty frequent in the oils + neconu's have been nice in paying out Angel (L) pieces every few 1K ped cycles.


I currently make back 92-93% with MU included, however I feel some of that is due to the MU i'm paying for guns & the amp, which is why I'm wondering if that, I was to say buy an iA105, will that investment eventually pay itself off, by even a singular % more returns, from not having to pay MU daily, sometimes multiple times a day.

Yes, it makes sense to get a UL amp atleast if you cannot go all in with a UL weapon.

 

[morey]

The Armatrix L amp is about roughly comparable to the I105 in terms of dpp and eff. i105 is lower dmg, so your overall efficiency and maybe dpp too (need calculation) will drop alittle since i105 amp has less of an impact than the 37b

So you probably wont notice significant composition change. As for TT, 92-93% is about on par for long term taxed area hunting. You can probably add the tax % to your returns if you do non la hunting (95-6 counting tt only should be reasonable).

Now, whether to upgrade or not. Check how many amps have cycled thru so far, and subtract the mu you paid on the L amps only, that's roughly how much you will save if you go UL amp. You do the calculation based on how much you play to determine if it's worth it.


p.s. Decay on 37b is much lower (roughly 25% of i105), so 37b does last a long time relative to its tt.

 

[Msturlese]

First of all i read this line that seems to recap all

Currently, I use a Ar-Matrix LR-45 (L), with an Ar-Matrix L-Amplifier 37B (L).

I currently make back 92-93% with MU included, however I feel some of that is due to the MU i'm paying for guns & the amp, which is why I'm wondering if that, I was to say buy an iA105, will that investment eventually pay itself off, by even a singular % more returns, from not having to pay MU daily, sometimes multiple times a day.

If you return 93% INCLUDED MARKUP i suppose you mean both MU in and MU out
let's just approxximate a MU of weapon+amp of 120%
93% of 120% means 111.5% based on a UL setup equivalent (armatrix 45 comapared to a EWE41+imp105 is just 1% less drop from eff)
if this is the case, it is even too good to be true , buy immediately a UL setup and start amortize now the item

if with 92% with MU you mean based on TT value of armatrix, a UL setup would bring it to 91 and a LP40 would bring it to 94 so does not help either.

sorry but i dont understand base for calculationg 93% percentage so add to use both cases

 

[xXx Ultimate xX]

The Armatrix L amp is about roughly comparable to the I105 in terms of dpp and eff. i105 is lower dmg, so your overall efficiency and maybe dpp too (need calculation) will drop alittle since i105 amp has less of an impact than the 37b

So you probably wont notice significant composition change. As for TT, 92-93% is about on par for long term taxed area hunting. You can probably add the tax % to your returns if you do non la hunting (95-6 counting tt only should be reasonable).

Putting my faith into wiki, the DPP numbers are as follows -

LR-45 + 37B = 2.951 DPP
LR-45 + imp A105 = 2.978 DPP

so it's ever so slightly higher, still below 3 where i'd like it to be ideally, but that's another struggle for another day

Now, whether to upgrade or not. Check how many amps have cycled thru so far, and subtract the mu you paid on the L amps only, that's roughly how much you will save if you go UL amp. You do the calculation based on how much you play to determine if it's worth it.


p.s. Decay on 37b is much lower (roughly 25% of i105), so 37b does last a long time relative to its tt.

I pay ~127% Per amp, the full TT is 74, I pay 94/amp, I recall seeing imp 105's around 2k+- last I saw, which napkin maths says roughly 100 amps to cycle before I really "saved". I roughly use 1 amp/day average, which means in just over 3 months I'd of gained it's value.. That seems to be a very good turn around imho.

I see, that's the part that worries me & which is why I moved away from UL amps way back when, the decay factor can really hurt if it's "not your time" & MA have a big swirl planned. May have to be a necessary evil with how loot 2.0 reads to be. Meaning the decay will be returned, unlike how it used to be where it felt like a Ped sink

 

[xXx Ultimate xX]

First of all i read this line that seems to recap all


If you return 93% INCLUDED MARKUP i suppose you mean both MU in and MU out
let's just approxximate a MU of weapon+amp of 120%
93% of 120% means 111.5% based on a UL setup equivalent (armatrix 45 comapared to a EWE41+imp105 is just 1% less drop from eff)
if this is the case, it is even too good to be true , buy immediately a UL setup and start amortize now the item

if with 92% with MU you mean based on TT value of armatrix, a UL setup would bring it to 91 and a LP40 would bring it to 94 so does not help either.

sorry but i dont understand base for calculationg 93% percentage so add to use both cases

My apologies,

It's TT value of armatrix + amp, since I know that returns don't count for the MU, so I never calculate them when I do returns.

Using this it seems going UL won't add much to my returns at all, I was originally under the impression on reading loot 2.0, that 95-97% returns was close to a guarantee over long-stretches (with the right setup). Then the MU you received pushed that number closer to 100, providing you hunt the right things etc etc.

 

[ulven]

It's TT value of armatrix + amp, since I know that returns don't count for the MU, so I never calculate them when I do returns

I pay ~127% Per amp, the full TT is 74, I pay 94/amp

Do you use 74 or 94 for the amp when calculating returns ?

if you use 94 (included MU ) your return is correct if not what is that 20 ped extra u pay to use that amp?

 

[Evey]

I currently make back 92-93% with MU included, however I feel some of that is due to the MU i'm paying for guns & the amp, which is why I'm wondering if that,

The biggest factor you're missing from the calculations is the % tax you pay for hunting a LA. No point in looking so close to dpp if you're gonna play for fun only.

 

[Msturlese]

so basically
1. you return 93% INCLUDING MARKUP that means you return 88..89 TT
2. you r setup adds about 1.5% TT cost (the markup is on decay of items and not on bullet cost, ammo dont cost 120%)
2. you add another 2 to 5% in LA fees

as evey points
a. dont hunt in LA .. from 93 you rise to ? 97%?
b. use UL amp and weapon with eff posibly over 64% and rise to 98.5%

find higher markups to fill the gap (or top up ped card and have fun)

 

[Evey]

as evey points
a. dont hunt in LA .. from 93 you rise to ? 97%?

I didn't say not to hunt on LAs...
It's np to do it but understand the implications. That tax is cutting down on your returns, by the amount you see when you enter that LA (and not like some LA owners claim that MA does not take a 'cut' there - that is borderline scam);

LAs can be fun, there are some good codex missions, some good events sometimes, events can be profitable if you are lucky, LAs are definitely not my jam tho, I worked too hard on my gear and skills to throw 5% out of the window.
Good luck.

 

[Msturlese]

well said. it was the short form for "save some ped to icnrease return avoiding taxed area if not special reasons"

so far the only "mandatory" taxed land i met was scipulor islands, i dont think there are untaxed ones.
the other monster might be less dense but are for sure around
[Edited: Read below, there are!]

 

[Evey]

the only "mandatory" taxed land i met was scipulor islands, i dont think there are untaxed ones.

They are, good spawn too, just not too popular - [Calypso, 18515, 60675, 138, Waypoint]

 

[Katie Chalmers]

Unfortunately you are hitting the DPS level where UL weapons and amps to suit them are getting pretty expensive. It’s unfortunate that you have also chosen to specialise in the profession which holds the most markup, that being laser rifle.

Personally I think if you are paying 120% on both weapon and Amp and hunting as many hours as you do then you are going to be bleeding markup at an unreasonable rate.
I think many players reach this spot between a rock and hard place and will have to pick between spending a shitload upfront or bleed a lot more overtime.

First off, lets consider BLP. The switch isn’t as painful as you would think, and you will gain the levels quickly, as you already have all but one contributing skills already, that being BLP weapon tech. Most of your skill ticks will be allocated here.
Irregardless of comparative weapon markups, the amps are much cheaper. Mayhem amps being about half the price despite being basically the same thing. And UL amps being much cheaper and more powerful. Dante at 31dmg is about 1kped and you can normally always find one. What about it’s laser equivalent?

I would also normally suggest daily token guns but at 8hrs daily grind you’ll soon get sick of farming tokens.
Melee weapons are also great at providing low markup DPS but if you haven’t trained it already your hit professions are going to suck ass and you won’t like the drop in activity that you will have to endure. I think melee is something you have to switch to early.
But melee is very rewarding, and you can hit a 60+dps sword and amp combo with 3.0dpec combo for just a few k, and building some wicked HP.
Put on a M-Matrix Lifesteal amp too and you can take on harder mobs without expensive armor or having to hire a fapper. The markup on these is worth every penny if you use on the correct weapon.
The only downside to melee is not being able to take advantage of the shrapnel conversion, but having a hybrid offensive approach, such as burning your excess shrapnel with token guns can help here. This is exactly the strategy I use.

 

[Msturlese]

Dont forget MF.... mf chips are dirty cheap
a 1000 ped implant (top range) is like a P20 extender
and are also funny to use
one of the skills is shared "range damage assessment" with rifle.
(L) chip apart some L1 that is in the 110% are sold at 101 to 104% in trade channel on a regular basis
a Level 10 corrosion or electrical deals about 40 dps

 

[mastermesh]

Dont forget MF.... mf chips are dirty cheap
a 1000 ped implant (top range) is like a P20 extender
and are also funny to use
one of the skills is shared "range damage assessment" with rifle.
(L) chip apart some L1 that is in the 110% are sold at 101 to 104% in trade channel on a regular basis
a Level 10 corrosion or electrical deals about 40 dps

not to mention you can amp mf chips now.

 

[xXx Ultimate xX]

Thanks for all the comments & thoughts/advice guys, taking note of everything said & finding the best route to navigate with it, I couldn't think of replies to all so I just dropped a Like to show I've noticed & appreciate it

Unfortunately you are hitting the DPS level where UL weapons and amps to suit them are getting pretty expensive. It’s unfortunate that you have also chosen to specialise in the profession which holds the most markup, that being laser rifle.

Personally I think if you are paying 120% on both weapon and Amp and hunting as many hours as you do then you are going to be bleeding markup at an unreasonable rate.
I think many players reach this spot between a rock and hard place and will have to pick between spending a shitload upfront or bleed a lot more overtime.

First off, lets consider BLP. The switch isn’t as painful as you would think, and you will gain the levels quickly, as you already have all but one contributing skills already, that being BLP weapon tech. Most of your skill ticks will be allocated here.
Irregardless of comparative weapon markups, the amps are much cheaper. Mayhem amps being about half the price despite being basically the same thing. And UL amps being much cheaper and more powerful. Dante at 31dmg is about 1kped and you can normally always find one. What about it’s laser equivalent?

I would also normally suggest daily token guns but at 8hrs daily grind you’ll soon get sick of farming tokens.
Melee weapons are also great at providing low markup DPS but if you haven’t trained it already your hit professions are going to suck ass and you won’t like the drop in activity that you will have to endure. I think melee is something you have to switch to early.
But melee is very rewarding, and you can hit a 60+dps sword and amp combo with 3.0dpec combo for just a few k, and building some wicked HP.
Put on a M-Matrix Lifesteal amp too and you can take on harder mobs without expensive armor or having to hire a fapper. The markup on these is worth every penny if you use on the correct weapon.
The only downside to melee is not being able to take advantage of the shrapnel conversion, but having a hybrid offensive approach, such as burning your excess shrapnel with token guns can help here. This is exactly the strategy I use.

You're absolutely right about the crazy MU's with lazer, I was looking @ Mayhem amps earlier trying to boost some quick + easy DPP, the MU for laser is like 1500%+ for just the Alpha, it's insane! For comparison, the BLP Alpha is 800%, I also noticed some Beta/Gamma very close to that price range

As for the laser comparison, the only one I can recall of would be an A204 Hyper.. And that is way way beyond my paygrade.

I recall some of the Omegaton ASG range being extremely dirt cheap for BLP.. I was always a little sad that Laser didn't seem to have something like that, I believe their down-fall is that the efficiency is slightly lower, or maybe something else I've missed but it'll be something I research before switching.

For daily tokens, I do try do the ones I can pick up @ Twin, providing they're half-way decent mobs, I could however stick to that if it was a necessary evil that'll upgrade the future.

You're correct with melee, however that could be something I train whilst the PED card is on the dryer side, until it hits the more "fun" levels where I can take down mobs that I currently kill with it.. Food for thought for sure!

I'll do some research into the BLP side of things, seems as though it's definitely the route to take, will scower the forums + Wiki see where the natural progression for BLP leads, i'd imagine it's not far off laser in regards of guns.

Once again thankyou guys for the advice/thoughts etc. It's very much appreciated!

 

[ermik]

Melee weapons are also great at providing low markup DPS but if you haven’t trained it already your hit professions are going to suck ass and you won’t like the drop in activity that you will have to endure. I think melee is something you have to switch to early.
But melee is very rewarding, and you can hit a 60+dps sword and amp combo with 3.0dpec combo for just a few k, and building some wicked HP.
Put on a M-Matrix Lifesteal amp too and you can take on harder mobs without expensive armor or having to hire a fapper. The markup on these is worth every penny if you use on the correct weapon.
The only downside to melee is not being able to take advantage of the shrapnel conversion, but having a hybrid offensive approach, such as burning your excess shrapnel with token guns can help here. This is exactly the strategy I use.

I do the same, using L guns (preferably CDF) combined with shagadi + trauma 4.

 

[Deleted member 58836]

Get those crafting skills up. Repairing and Tech Gizmos help.

Go hunt and mine for the resources you need to craft your own set of armor, weapons, finders and amps, etc.

Sell what you find but don't require.

 

[Evey]

Get those crafting skills up. Repairing and Tech Gizmos help.

Go hunt and mine for the resources you need to craft your own set of armor, weapons, finders and amps, etc.

Sell what you find but don't require.

You will need 10 times the bankroll, but yeah, could be fun. OR, you could pay the services of miners and crafters and be a part of the economy and do what you like but try be profitable

 

[onlygodplays]

amp for laser is kind of a no brainer, they are good eff% dpp all that. when you get into blp weapons from what I've noticed its more complicated.
because blp UL amps are super low eff% so if your using a blp you should maybe think about (L) amps. just do the math the numbers are all there. pretty simple choice in my mind. (at lower level amps for blp at least)