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Are lies the barrier to development of the human race? and indeed this game?

Fallen, every thing you said is absolutely true. This is a perfect example of what lying and deceit is all about in our society. The media and those in power do everything to downplay those things and distract the masses for their own personal gain. See, no deletion of posts. We are in perfect agreement.:)
 
Lies are the barrier to development of the human race.

This is a lie! :D
There's no barriers, none whatsoever.

After every major scientific/technological breakthrough there's a wave of enthusiasm and overly optimistic prognoses for the future. After a while ppl realize their mistake and the pendulum moves to the opposite extreme - we're stuck, there's no progress whatsoever!
Both are equally wrong ofc. The progress has never stopped, it's constantly slowly accelerating.

I believe human race has an ultimate goal. (I also believe i know what it is, but that's going too far away from the topic at hand). We've been following a meaningful roadmap for centuries now. At times we fall, we stand up and we keep striving towards those goals, feverishly. Everywhere all over the globe, beyond the political, racial and culture borders - without any leading or coordinating force. Amazing.

Free your mind and look around. No spoilers. :tongue2:
 
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A lie is just a tool, not an offense in itself, like a hammer, which can be used to build a house or to crush a skull. There are no big or small, white or dark lies, only positive or negative goals we pursue with them.

I agree with Farmer Smurf. Lie is a glue that holds the society together. People rarely share views of those around them and if not for lie in the form of outward agreement, there would be a lot of blood and bruises even among the closest associates. A rare marriage or team project would survive its first month.
 
agree with the others that lie's are needed in order for society to function.
deception is sometimes all we have to hold things together!


ofc my viewpoint swings dramatically if i am the one lieing or the one being lied to.......
and im still pissed i didnt see the easter bunny today! :p
 
GeorgeSkywalker said:
Been thinking about this for a while, "Are lies the barrier to development of the human race? and this game"
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Sub-Zero said:
I'd say greed is the barrier, lies comes with greed.
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Greed is a result of the lie of scarcity...

tamlin said:
I'd say lies are a barrier to humankinds development.
... the largest obstacle I believe is egoism. That egoism doesn't have to be a single person projecting it; it could be a company, a political party, or a whole nation. Egoism in the form of greed is often a source of preventing cooperation, which obviously slows down or even halts development and evolution.
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Egoism is a result of the lie of scarcity and the lie of separateness. It should be clear by now everything is interconnected, pleasure can only be experienced when one has sensitivity, which means one can and will get hurt, pain is the back of the coin. Same thing with a lot of less obviously but still very related opposites.

Kimmi said:
Greed is one of the main ingredience in Inovation, aka development.
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Greed is not necessary for innovation, it's slowing innovation down: just check out wikispeed, uber-app could improve (the lacking public) transport in many countries but is being made illegal just like before the p2p-sharing, all open source projects, mondragon, language, ...

To the OP, keep asking the right questions.
I think the Unconditional Basic Income is an essential part of the solution.
Perhaps 'the gift economy' is of interest to you too.
 
I enjoyed this book and maybe you will as well:

Lying: Moral Choice in Public and Private Life - Sissela Bok

;)
 
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Someone once told me a story from the olden days:

A wise man was approached by a hardened criminal and he said that he wished to reform his ways. That he cheated, and stole, and was not a good man by any standards. What should he do? How would it be possible for him to give up so many bad things?

The wise man said: Just give up one thing: Stop lying.
 
~CHOPPER~ said:
The biggest barrier is laziness.

Be productive in society.
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The most productive people are the most lazy. [EDIT -->] hence, the barrier doesn't lie on them, but on the non lazy ;)

Reasons:
1) They do the most to do less, hence, create things that create things for them;
2) If anything has to be done, they will do it for the best "cost" effective they can come out with. Almost 99% [EDIT] of the times better then those that are not lazy;
3) A consequence of point 2 is that Lazy people tend to think "out of the box" because they are simply too lazy to do the boring stuff;
4) I'm too lazy to continue.

As for the original OP post, believe that lie is simply a consequence of selfish objectives oneself has towards something or someone. Though, like everything, it has a positive and negative effect, just depends on the perspective of the viewer. Which in turn - the perspective - can also be selfish, creating a cicle that is called evolution - or devolution, again depending on perspective...
 
dcampelo said:
The most productive people are the most lazy. [EDIT -->] hence, the barrier doesn't lie on them, but on the non lazy ;)
..
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Some good points..

But I sure know more productive people that are creative and beneficial in society than the other flavor:wise:
 
After some thought, I would agree that lies are preventing free and thoughtful discussion about many topics. It has become politically incorrect to discuss anything that isn't politically correct and may offend those who are insecure about their beliefs and unable to debate in a rational free manner. Free speech is dead, a lie of political correctness that labels those who dare have a different opinion to be bigoted, where free debate should occur. There is no debate or freedom when we must obey the lie of political correctness.:wise:
 
Few Scars said:
After some thought, I would agree that lies are preventing free and thoughtful discussion about many topics. It has become politically incorrect to discuss anything that isn't politically correct and may offend those who are insecure about their beliefs and unable to debate in a rational free manner. Free speech is dead, a lie of political correctness that labels those who dare have a different opinion to be bigoted, where free debate should occur. There is no debate or freedom when we must obey the lie of political correctness.:wise:
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and in my view the statement "political correctness" is a lie often hid behind by people that refuse to acknowledge the scientific method for fact finding, or the racists, misogynists, xenophobes, homophobes and other hate filled people unwilling to question their own prejudices and unwilling to accept that the world is changing and their view are becoming less and less welcome in a civilised and globally connected society.
 
Interesting..

I don't think 'lies" helped in any way the evolution of societies progression. I am still trying to wrap my mind around the "when we were monkeys comment."( picturing in *grunts and sign language "lies" of early mankind language*) I do think however think this quote below alone to be true...

"Necessity is the mother of invention." ;)
 
Thorns Rose said:
I don't think 'lies" helped in any way the evolution of societies progression. I am still trying to wrap my mind around the "when we were monkeys comment."( picturing in *grunts and sign language "lies" of early mankind language*) I do think however think this quote below alone to be true...

"Necessity is the mother of invention." ;)
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Plato. Good to see the monkeys still visit though Rose
 
Er, who said monkeys? Actually, we still are those monkeys, in so many ways... :smoke:


I mean, if u say a "Lie", it implies u actually know the "Truth", how something really is, right?
So, do you know the truth? I mean, truth about the ordinary things like, Who's your neighbor? Who's your friend, husband, wife?

Here's the thing, we don't. Not so much because they lie to us but because we deceive ourselves.
An average normal human being can't perceive other people without subconsciously projecting his/her own properties onto them. It's not the real persons we're seeing, it's a blur, some kind of mixture made up by our minds. All our good traits we project onto ppl that are close to us, all the bad stuff goes to those further away from us, the "others".
(btw, the same mechanism works for groups of ppl too: good close "friendly" nations, suspicious evil "other" nations... sounds familiar? ;))

Even if it's not (always) intentional lies, strictly speaking We're All Living In A Lie. Literally.
We have adapted to this and we don't like to think about it too much.
Preferably, not at all.

But, here's the paradox. The less we reckon it, the more vulnerable we become.
That's a wrong way, gotta go the opposite direction. We have to deal with all those intentional and unintentional lies, try to "wake up", try to see the reality behind em. It's not that easy but worth every effort nevertheless. Lies can't be a barrier, to anything. More like a key than a barrier.
 
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