Question: Are you flying in a greyzone?

[Sionkiewicz]

I think the point was someone flies out with no loot on them, deliberately gets killed by the pirate group they may do this 2-3 times to make the point they've got no loot.

At revive they repair their ship and take the stackables from another avatar that was holding it all for them or let a passenger on that is carrying the loot. Then they fly out again knowing that if the same group attacks them they'll get locked so probably won't risk it.

It's plausible.. but I doubt it would actually happen.. normally, Pirates will multi-kill noobs when they talk shit and piss them off.. I've seen that happen many times.

 

[DaisyColdFinger]

It's plausible.. but I doubt it would actually happen.. normally, Pirates will multi-kill noobs when they talk shit and piss them off.. I've seen that happen many times.

Not only plausible but fact - many of the loot screenies in my gallery were second or third hits on the same guys minutes after the first check. When the game was up and they knew we knew they got more creative still and began only half repairing their ships to show they are weak and so would be silly to carry loot - that trick did not work for long either.

Unfortunately there were guys who were legitimately thinking they were doing what should be done to show they have no loot - but trial and error meant we had to check each person several times over.

Ok so as EU one time most prolific Pirate - i will tell you how it went.

In the early days we were trying to figure out how to enjoy lootable space - so we just dueled and pestered folks really trying to provoke fights for fun. However it soon became obvious that space pvp was quite a bit more expensive for this sort of fun than planet side. So i and a few others became tactical hunters / pirates choosing loot over duels for fun and ego.

The professional for profit pirates such as myself at that time were a minority (less than 3) and these noobie pirates not only kept on harassing folks with no point double and triple kills but in so doing also scare the looters we professionals would wait to ambush in deep space - thats why i got so annoyed with the young nve soc - at that time most their guys played for ego not profit. So back then folks had not yet worked out how to get creative with hiding the fact that they carried loot. It was only much later when the noobies would go broke and leave space that we moved closer to station for ambushes. I personally profited quite a bit and would let folks go by after i shot them down once - often giving them a cya in chat to which they would normally really with severely abusive language - but that was my game and i was cool with that. We would shoot down so many targets that we would literally forget the names and have to scroll to see if the name had been checked as they fly by. So sometimes targets would get shot down more than once this way. However, it was because of this that we began to notice names that we had just shot down and were empty sometimes had loot the second time round and so that is when many of us began double checking targets who as it turned out would have a buddy or alt in the station that handed them the loot after a kill on them thinking they already got checked. We caught onto that game quickly and yes many targets did not try to pull the same trick but we because of their buddies could only tell one way - that was to check everyone at least 3 times.

Then folks started half repairing their ship so as to appear that they are not concerned about being easy targets and so would be highly unlikely to carry loot. Again many did in fact carry loot and so we had the whole cycle occurring again and again innocents who thought they were doing what indicated they had nothing were again checked over and over as well.

This is when the creatives began to realise they could spam MA with harassment complaints after one kill and in so doing circumvent not only taking decay but the need for combat ammo as well. We were getting banned left right and center.

Now i had no problem with folks getting creative, in fact it made the prospect of trying to figure out how to loot someone much more fun for me. Then unfortunately the creatives stopped trying to be creative and began changing the rules in a unrecoverable definitive way by involving MA. The creatives knew it was easy to spam MA with the most common type of complaint against other players in the way of harassment. MA ofcource have no clue about how space play evolved and chose to simply react without properly understanding the the evolution of space play with out right bans.

Abusing MA's harassment clause for pvp aggression in pace became the thing to do, and ruined the most important part of lootable space - it killed and severely disabled the core of space - they killed Player versus Player creativity and thats when i left.

So yes that and many other strategies did and maybe still do happen - BUT it is evolving and cutting creativity as MA are doing in this way will do nothing but hold back where space pvp could go. MA is killing heir baby by dishing out bans without understanding how space pvp is evolving !

 

[AlphaGeek]

The white zone is for immediate loading and unloading of passengers only. There is no stopping in the red zone.

The red zone is for immediate loading and unloading of passengers only. There is no stopping in the white zone.

No, the white zone is for loading of passengers and there is no stopping in a RED zone.

The red zone has always been for loading and unloading of passengers. There's never stopping in a white zone.

Don't you tell me which zone is for loading, and which zone is for stopping!

Listen Betty, don't start up with your white zone shit again.

 

[Me Really Never]

would you care to explain where exactly the creativity on the pirates site is considering they r only lurking at a space station, waiting for someone to fly out, then use speed exploits to catch up and bugs/exploits to hit every shot and just kill anyone? dont see much creatitivty there. it may be fun if pirates would try and play honest but i guess as long as MA doesnt cut off the exploits we will never see such thing.

and second question: where exactly is space pvp expensive considering planetside pvp? i mean you need 200 peds to start endgame in space pvp. in planetside pvp you need to get skills or buy them and buy equipment equivalent to maybe 10k usd to come close to endgame pvp planetside. they are not comparable. space pvp needs nearly zero investment and zero skills.

 

[DaisyColdFinger]

would you care to explain why i waffle so much. Clearly i have no clue what im talking about but like to stick my nose in here so can hopefully get lucky and socre some brownie points cause youre clearly a pirate an no one likes pirate, so just maybe i will get some cool reps to grow my rep empire with - forum cred here i come !

You truly do ride the horse up it's ass dont you. I regret plus repping you previously to make up for slapping you around on the assumption that you were an ignorant know it all done nothing troll. Turns out i was right. I would prefer to stop acknowledging your existence from this point on - and so that is exactly what i will do. If someone else wishes to ask the question, i might answer but you Me Prick Really Never Often Actually can leave now. poof !

 

[Me Really Never]

You truly do ride the horse up it's ass dont you. I regret plus repping you previously to make up for slapping you around on the assumption that you were an ignorant know it all done nothing rep seeking troll. Turns out i was right. I would prefer to stop acknowledging your existence from this point on - and so that is exactly what i will do. If someone else wishes to ask the question, i might answer but you Me Prick Really Never Often Actually can leave now. poof !

i dont care a single dipshit for + or - rep or whatever. i just cant stand when someone tries to talk bullshit into everyone. but i expected such an answer from you as you have nothing valid to say to my points. pretty much wins the argument for me. thanks.

 

[Sionkiewicz]

Not only plausible but fact - many of the loot screenies in my gallery were second or third hits on the same guys minutes after the first check. When the game was up and they knew we knew they got more creative still and began only half repairing their ships to show they are weak and so would be silly to carry loot - that trick did not work for long either.

Unfortunately there were guys who were legitimately thinking they were doing what should be done to show they have no loot - but trial and error meant we had to check each person several times over.

Ok so as EU one time most prolific Pirate - i will tell you how it went.

In the early days we were trying to figure out how to enjoy lootable space - so we just dueled and pestered folks really trying to provoke fights for fun. However it soon became obvious that space pvp was quite a bit more expensive for this sort of fun than planet side. So i and a few others became tactical hunters / pirates choosing loot over duels for fun and ego.

The professional for profit pirates such as myself at that time were a minority (less than 3) and these noobie pirates not only kept on harassing folks with no point double and triple kills but in so doing also scare the looters we professionals would wait to ambush in deep space - thats why i got so annoyed with the young nve soc - at that time most their guys played for ego not profit. So back then folks had not yet worked out how to get creative with hiding the fact that they carried loot. It was only much later when the noobies would go broke and leave space that we moved closer to station for ambushes. I personally profited quite a bit and would let folks go by after i shot them down once - often giving them a cya in chat to which they would normally really with severely abusive language - but that was my game and i was cool with that. We would shoot down so many targets that we would literally forget the names and have to scroll to see if the name had been checked as they fly by. So sometimes targets would get shot down more than once this way. However, it was because of this that we began to notice names that we had just shot down and were empty sometimes had loot the second time round and so that is when many of us began double checking targets who as it turned out would have a buddy or alt in the station that handed them the loot after a kill on them thinking they already got checked. We caught onto that game quickly and yes many targets did not try to pull the same trick but we because of their buddies could only tell one way - that was to check everyone at least 3 times.

Then folks started half repairing their ship so as to appear that they are not concerned about being easy targets and so would be highly unlikely to carry loot. Again many did in fact carry loot and so we had the whole cycle occurring again and again innocents who thought they were doing what indicated they had nothing were again checked over and over as well.

This is when the creatives began to realise they could spam MA with harassment complaints after one kill and in so doing circumvent not only taking decay but the need for combat ammo as well. We were getting banned left right and center.

Now i had no problem with folks getting creative, in fact it made the prospect of trying to figure out how to loot someone much more fun for me. Then unfortunately the creatives stopped trying to be creative and began changing the rules in a unrecoverable definitive way by involving MA. The creatives knew it was easy to spam MA with the most common type of complaint against other players in the way of harassment. MA ofcource have no clue about how space play evolved and chose to simply react without properly understanding the the evolution of space play with out right bans.

Abusing MA's harassment clause for pvp aggression in pace became the thing to do, and ruined the most important part of lootable space - it killed and severely disabled the core of space - they killed Player versus Player creativity and thats when i left.

So yes that and many other strategies did and maybe still do happen - BUT it is evolving and cutting creativity as MA are doing in this way will do nothing but hold back where space pvp could go. MA is killing heir baby by dishing out bans without understanding how space pvp is evolving !

So now I'm confused.. Xane stated that double/triple kills were so rare that they were not even worth talking about and you say they happened all the time and even claim to have done it yourself..

Which is it?

 

[DaisyColdFinger]

Were talking about a time line during which there was a period where it was a frequently used tactic by targets. It being timeline based implies it moves or evolves and so to strategies until they too either evolve, no longer exists or becomes rare which is where Xane's statement comes in and is correct. And even then we are referencing individuals whom are established pirates and not noobs or ego maniacs repeating the time line cycle.

 

[Sionkiewicz]

Were talking about a time line during which there was a period where it was a frequently used tactic by targets. It being timeline based implies it moves or evolves and so to strategies until they too either evolve, no longer exists or becomes rare which is where Xane's statement comes in and is correct. And even then we are referencing individuals whom are established pirates and not noobs or ego maniacs repeating the time line cycle.

Ok, so what you are saying is that at one point this was something that was done but since that time it no longer happens because Space PVP has "Evolved" away from it? Established pirates would not perform multi-kills anymore and only noobs and Egomaniacs would.

Ok, I can accept that.

 

[DaisyColdFinger]

Ok, so what you are saying is that at one point this was something that was done but since that time it no longer happens because Space PVP has "Evolved" away from it? Established pirates would not perform multi-kills anymore and only noobs and Egomaniacs would.

Ok, I can accept that.

Yes im an referencing learning in the pvp environment as the evolutionary aspect not the fixed environment itself which obviously evolves only at the beck and call of MA.

So yes established pirates would be less likely (rare) to continue double kills unless there is a suspicion that the target might revert to an old trick or they GENUINELY have a personal issue with a target as we get on planet side with folks kill stealing or blocking shots.

Ok so thats said - now as someone who likes strategy i might now because of this confession expect 1. Some might now go try that strategy again 2. There might very well be some of the more keniving types who will now go out with the sole intention of getting double tapped just to be able to come here and say how wrong i was.

Point is having said what i said, if i were in game now i WOULD be waiting and i WOULD be double tapping JUST because of this post. And this is what MA do not understand about how we evolve - If i were to shoot someone down 3 times now they will ban me without knowing that i might very well have used this writeup as a means to ENCOURAGE targets to take a chance again.

PVP is not just skin deep point and shoot ( Including planetside lootable which i did for a long time) and MA needs to get their head around that and stop banning folks because of other folks who have no clue about strategy spam them into doing so.

Xane stalling the MS for a ambush in the making should NOT be something he had to explain to anyone !

 

[Side Slay Show]

I have not had time to read all here (so busy irl). But I can understand both sides.

MA can´t ofcourse foresee all the strategics that ppl ingame will try.
But they really should tell everyone if they set up new guidlines for what is ok and not. We all think diffrent and
I dont want to see any fabricated rules by a player (cant just trust another players word for it ).

If we take one of the rules.
Droppig warps is not allowed if you dont intend to PVP.

I guess it could fall under these rules.
(http://legal.entropiauniverse.com/legal/terms-of-use.xml)

c. You cannot interfere with any other Participants ability to use and enjoy the Entropia Universe.

d. You may not take any action, post, communicate, upload or otherwise use any content, including text, images and sounds, that MindArk, at its sole and absolute discretion determines to be sexually explicit, racially, ethnically, religiously or sexually offensive, hateful, vulgar, defamatory, libelous, harassing or threatening to another person or organization or otherwise objectionable. This includes communications in the Entropia Universe and in any other website or forum with connection to the Entropia Universe.

But where to draw the line? Dropping a warp a few times should be ok, it could be for testing if someone will shoot back or maybe to ask a crew back if they are interested etc, to decide to attac or not. Holding a ship long time (what is long time?) I think is wrong no matter what the reson for holding it is. (This is my opinion, not trying to set the rule. It should be MA's job.).

I better also say, I am not a pirate. But I do drive a MS sometimes.

 

[OZtwo]

At the end of the day, sad to say, but Space in EU is meant to slow us down with the use of pirates. There really is no game like EVE here. Plan and simple, pirates have no rights and are just used as a tool to slow the loot from planet to planet. So yes MA will go out of their way to seem unfair and ban Pirates for anything and everything that will slow the average player down. You, the Pirate, are here to slow us down but not stop us from going to another planet. And wow, I didn't even talk about this being RCE here (oops - I guess I just did)

 

[Dan59]

Existence of motherships transport business depend a lot on presence of pirates.
Without pirates nobody would use motherships.
Without pvp and pitrates - investment in motherships could be seen like (to use very friendly worlds) donations to Ma.
Apart for MA - pirates work also for mothership owners in extortion model business (if you do not pay transport to mothership owner you will be killed and looted)

So pure nonsense is that mothership owner and mothership crew do support cases causing possible ban for their business partners (pirates).

Maybe happen that mothership owner didn't pay monthly salary in time or maybe less than is supposed and made business partners angry lol...

 

[Sionkiewicz]

Existence of motherships transport business depend a lot on presence of pirates.
Without pirates nobody would use motherships.
Without pvp and pitrates - investment in motherships could be seen like (to use very friendly worlds) donations to Ma.
Apart for MA - pirates work also for mothership owners in extortion model business (if you do not pay transport to mothership owner you will be killed and looted)

So pure nonsense is that mothership owner and mothership crew do support cases causing possible ban for their business partners (pirates).

Maybe happen that mothership owner didn't pay monthly salary in time or maybe less than is supposed and made business partners angry lol...

Or maybe not all MS owners play that game and are a Target of pirates because of that.

 

[Mega]

Cant wait to see what the next VU holds.

I know Mindark are sometimes years late delivering on their promises.... but they deliver (Mentoring, beacons, taming etc...)



If space is your business, be prepared to not like what is coming down the pipeline, even if you asked for it.

Some of you really asked for it.

 

[Xane]

Maybe happen that mothership owner didn't pay monthly salary in time or maybe less than is supposed and made business partners angry lol...

I would like to know who is paying this "fee" because I haven't been getting my cut!

 

[morgoth]

I would like to know who is paying this "fee" because I haven't been getting my cut!

Sorry been away, I'll give you your dues soon as I get back.



There is no grey area just what MA hasn't banned people for yet.