Question: Considerations when choosing gear

ermik

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(no im not back, just casually visiting ;))

OK , we know this from MA communication and devnotes regarding loot 2.0

1. TT return from loot depends on TT spent killing the mob.
2. All markup used when killing the mob is a player to player thing and has no impact on the TT return itself.
3. Overkill in TT is compensated for in TT return unless created by overamping.
4. MISS shots are lost.

Given the idea that our pedcards are unlimited and could withstand a huge cycle to even loot events out, this means.

Always use a unlimited weapon that you max out.
Dmg/pec only gives you more loot events for the same amount of peds cycled, NOTHING more.

Why the heck are we using L gear?

The only thing im not clear on is if the table of multipliers is universal or personal, i guess someone can clear things out for me.

So, give me your thoughts.
 
I use (L) gear to experiment with new setups, DPS thresholds, and occasionally for PvP if I want more diversity in damage types.
(L) gear as a regular setup makes a lot of sense for a very casual player just looking to join in on team hunts and have fun with their friends, without having to make a significant investment.

Side note; over amping is compensated in TT return.
 
(no im not back, just casually visiting ;))

OK , we know this from MA communication and devnotes regarding loot 2.0

1. TT return from loot depends on TT spent killing the mob.
2. All markup used when killing the mob is a player to player thing and has no impact on the TT return itself.
3. Overkill in TT is compensated for in TT return unless created by overamping.
4. MISS shots are lost.

4. Is wrong. Missed shots are returned in loot. They just lower your DPP.

L stuff is flexible, and measured vs 60ish efficiency gear, they almost come out even economywise due to higher efficiency (>70 for some laser). Armatrix give Higher DPP and DPS as well, which can improve loot. For me, who likes to mix pistol and rifle, it's great. I happily pay a few hundred peds extra per 100k cycled to have this flexibility.
 
4. Is wrong. Missed shots are returned in loot. They just lower your DPP.
I'm sure he means the actual "MISS" shots that happens when using unmaxed weapons. These MISS are not compensated.

The only thing im not clear on is if the table of multipliers is universal or personal, i guess someone can clear things out for me.
While MA claim there's no personal lootpool, it's very easy to see on hof board that there is something deep in the lootpool system that controls and balances each player returns. Probably the ones who lost the most have more chance to get it back sooner than someone who lost less. I call them payback hofs.
 
I use (L) gear to experiment with new setups, DPS thresholds, and occasionally for PvP if I want more diversity in damage types.
(L) gear as a regular setup makes a lot of sense for a very casual player just looking to join in on team hunts and have fun with their friends, without having to make a significant investment.

Side note; over amping is compensated in TT return.
Not overamping with the red warning?
 
4. Is wrong. Missed shots are returned in loot. They just lower your DPP.

L stuff is flexible, and measured vs 60ish efficiency gear, they almost come out even economywise due to higher efficiency (>70 for some laser). Armatrix give Higher DPP and DPS as well, which can improve loot. For me, who likes to mix pistol and rifle, it's great. I happily pay a few hundred peds extra per 100k cycled to have this flexibility.
Real MISS due to not maxxing is lost. And for 100k ped cycle im sure decent dps L guns MU burn more than a few hundred, but then again, its your choice but it doesent change the mechanics of the game.
 
Side note; over amping is compensated in TT return.

I guess you have tested it and you are 100% sure.

This is very interesting, since MindArk hasn't released a comment on this theme after the creation of loot 2.0 (unlike they did for many other similar themes)

I would like an Official comment, like when they introduced the compensation for turreting or drowning mobs. since the question is very similar : so there is no need to keep any "secret" on this.


Paul
 
1. TT return from loot depends on TT spent killing the mob.
2. All markup used when killing the mob is a player to player thing and has no impact on the TT return itself.
3. Overkill in TT is compensated for in TT return unless created by over amping.
4. MISS shots are lost.

The only thing I'm not clear on is if the table of multipliers is universal or personal, I guess someone can clear things out for me.
You are back at it again, Ermik!? Wondered where you fluffed off too lol.

1. DPP is the biggest factor for stabilising returns and provides more markup. More loot with markup and more skills per ped spent.
2. All MU spent on gear or enhs is a pure loss, don't pay markup, get UL setup, sell L guns when looted.
3. Overkill is compensated in TT returns, I'd imagine Overamping is the same, but I am sure MA said it's a bad practice? Negatively affects DPP, see point 1 again.
4. Missed shots IE NOT MAXED is lost peds, the peds go into the bonus shrapnel loot pool as far as I can recall that's what MA said about it.
5. Efficiency rating on weapons may be overrated or not as hyped up as was first announced, skills later probably took over with Looter profs. If you want more TT returns, get a very high Looter prof and try using some high-efficiency weps, but sub 70% can still produce 98% TT returns, provided you got the skills.

Overkill may now be a side thought due to the compensation, but I still believe against it for low lvl mobs. Suppose you hunting regen mobs DPS all the way. Defence costs do get returned through armour/plate decay, and some healing, but this will never be 100% of the cost, might be 75%? So cheap def costs will be handy when grinding out for markup. I know I'd be closer to 100% returns without my defence costs.

I reckon loot multipliers are universal, they apply to anyone some fall on the bad multipliers ie none, some fall on the have some multiplier list, the list swaps after X amount of kills, or amount of peds taken reaches the threshold. I call this Mob Deficit ie sine wave mapping. Without good looter prof's, you will be lagging on TT returns, or you will have lower returns than normal before stabilising trying to hit your required multiplier.
 
1. DPP is the biggest factor for stabilising returns and provides more markup. More loot with markup and more skills per ped spent.

That's not entirely true. DPP has no impact over TT returns. See below:
DPP affects loot composition and critical hit/damage etc affect the DPP. Efficiency directly affects average TT return by 0-7%.
 
Few things:

1. Overprotection is fine, heal less, overprotect more
2. Eff = extra TT return, marginal, if you are hunting MU (for example doing Gorgon wave on AG and try to loot some)
3. DPP = loot composition, higher better to loot some nicer stuff, esp good on wave events with bosses that have extra loots

Now Eff/DPP goes out of window, when you are doing events to win - Mayhems, DPS is king, eff/dpp does not matter, just get best DPS for cat
Eff is king if you go long term grinding that has relatively low MU
DPP is king if you wish to loot anything else than Sharpnel

To find a good spot between DPP/EFF, depends on money you are willing to spend on gear. L is helpful, since UL is expensive. I use UL inexpensive to try and have a spot on Mayhems and L to grind for markup/wave events with good loots.

If you want great eff/dpp, you have to spend quite a lot. If you don't want to spend a lot, you have to pick your fights with diff weapons.

English not native, havent studied in school, sorry if hard to read :) I'm also bit drunkish :D
 
Not overamping with the red warning?
I guess you have tested it and you are 100% sure.

This is very interesting, since MindArk hasn't released a comment on this theme after the creation of loot 2.0 (unlike they did for many other similar themes)

I would like an Official comment, like when they introduced the compensation for turreting or drowning mobs. since the question is very similar : so there is no need to keep any "secret" on this.


Paul

Try it for yourself. Slap a fat Mayhem (L) amp on a TT pistol and give it a whirl. Easy test, spend maybe 50 PED on it before reaching compelling results. Or go compete in a "Highest Single Loot" event and go the whole event with it for shits and giggles.
The overamping results in extremely low DPP, which will result in almost pure shrapnel loots and basically nothing else, which eliminates your potential to profit from markup. So it's not a golden ticket to profit by any stretch, but it is a fun way to f*ck around with some friends shooting down prots with grossly overamped opalos hunting for swirls. It's "hunting on condition" and nothing more.
 
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I would like to know if this is true, when or where mindark said this. Someone can help me?
Look at Eves signature some posts up, follow the link "List of official statements pertaining to loot post 2.0" and
then look for Regarding unmaxed item usage
 
Always use a unlimited weapon that you max out.

The disadvantages of using an unmaxed weapon are a lot lower these days, since loot is dependant on cost so doing less damage than you pay for doesn't have an impact on your loot. If the weapon is good maybe it's worth using it sooner, probably above 6.5 - 7HA - that's what I did on a few occasions anyway.

Why the heck are we using L gear?

L armors are pretty good because of their high durability and some tests say that they are better to use vs their UL counterpart if they are below 100%.
Also, since the change of how decay works, they last a lot longer than they used to. Dev said somewhere that the def cost got reduced even as much as 5 times than what it used to be.
But L gear is not an option for a grinder, just for casual players. I personally always had an allergy to L :D

Good luck.

PS. I like that sig. It will never be too old.....
 
The disadvantages of using an unmaxed weapon are a lot lower these days, since loot is dependant on cost so doing less damage than you pay for doesn't have an impact on your loot. If the weapon is good maybe it's worth using it sooner, probably above 6.5 - 7HA - that's what I did on a few occasions anyway.

But cost accosiated with yellow line MISS due to not maxxing is not added to your lootcalc.


PS. I like that sig. It will never be too old.....

<3
 
But cost accosiated with yellow line MISS due to not maxxing is not added to your lootcalc.

Indeed. Just don't make it a rule, you always have to put the options in balance.
If I were lvl 62 in hit on let's say Electric chips, I would start using a FEN Electric chip even if my HA wuld be ~7.BEcause high efficiency vs. the alternatives, because good DPS, because MU in loot, because better skill gain compared to alternatives.
I did this on a couple of occasions last year and I also had good results, TT wise.

So if you are 7HA and u have an imk2 close by, you should consider using it. It's good DPP won't make you loose much on 'miss'.
 
Indeed. Just don't make it a rule, you always have to put the options in balance.
If I were lvl 62 in hit on let's say Electric chips, I would start using a FEN Electric chip even if my HA wuld be ~7.BEcause high efficiency vs. the alternatives, because good DPS, because MU in loot, because better skill gain compared to alternatives.
I did this on a couple of occasions last year and I also had good results, TT wise.

So if you are 7HA and u have an imk2 close by, you should consider using it. It's good DPP won't make you loose much on 'miss'.

Its more of a good rule for most players to only use maxxed, otherwise we send mixed signals to ppl since most dont have the imk2 :)
 
But cost accosiated with yellow line MISS due to not maxxing is not added to your lootcalc.
Indeed. Just don't make it a rule, you always have to put the options in balance.
If I were lvl 62 in hit on let's say Electric chips, I would start using a FEN Electric chip even if my HA wuld be ~7.BEcause high efficiency vs. the alternatives, because good DPS, because MU in loot, because better skill gain compared to alternatives.
I did this on a couple of occasions last year and I also had good results, TT wise.

So if you are 7HA and u have an imk2 close by, you should consider using it. It's good DPP won't make you loose much on 'miss'.

Thank you very much for your information, I thought to use weapons that are max at level 100 with level 70, what would go down would be my dpp, not my return tt, but apparently I was wrong. I really appreciate your help!
 
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