Cycles

Netaqel

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Dude, I think most people know about the waves, and it's no secret
Hah, there are loot cycles after all :) Bad-good-repeat ! Not only law of big numbers ?

Side note: to me cycles, waves, periods, sines looks quite isomorfic to me, at least in game context and especially
in light talking like on chats and forums. So far.

I know about waves in mining and you are so helples with this system that even facepalming effort is mission impossible...

But how it works with mobs ?

However, there are people who do not want to wait 5 or 10 hours to play for 2 hours after patiently waiting. That's why I personally look for the optimal option in which to play all the time, but not to be at a loss... even after I have paid for it.
In mining good wave is 5 minutes at max :>

In any case, everyone is below 100% TT sooner or later, I personally do not understand why even after the Markup the system does not allow me to make even a small profit
Same here. Looks I do not do bankroll management but I was broken so many times that law of big numbers should kick in at that point ;)

Anyway, if all what is needed is RoR and bankroll management you should be good with slowing down grind turnover. If it is just statistics and no
hidden mechanism that works only with enormous daily number of "loot instances". And looks like with RoR/b.m, 95% return and 30k in bank you
are guaranteed to have 18k after 10 cycles :> Without including mu. Or maybe I still do not understood Kerham math. That averages are hard ;)


Regards,

Net
 

M Rufen Power

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Dude, I think most people know about the waves. It's no secret, so some people reach level 100 after 20 years of surfing only on the crest of the wave flying from one place to another, looking at where the mobs are feed during this period, while the rate is low and many such of other shit.

However, some people do not want to wait 5 or 10 hours to play for 2 hours after waiting. That's why I personally look for the optimal option to play all the time, but not to be at a loss... even after I have paid for it.

In any case, everyone is below 100% TT sooner or later, I personally do not understand why even after the Markup, the system does not allow me to make even a small profit, but for jackals like you, it works well.

I'm not too fond of your style of play. I've tried it, and I can play like you at 100% TT, but I don't think to play 20 years to level 100, nor do I think 20 peds over 100% is worth it.
My first post was to OP. My second post was to Kerham. But seeing as you like to butt in, I'll gladly address your derogative post.

Most people know about waves, but they don't know how it relates to the loot system. I don't have to wait to hunt when I know the process. When you know the looting process, you always get ahead and not pay for it. If you can't figure it out, then figure it out; that's why it works for me, not because I am a jackal, as you say. I find your last statement contradictory to the 2nd and 3rd statements. If you know my method works, why is it you can't translate that knowledge the higher you progress? That would be an interesting explanation. Even earning 2 peds per run is a massive achievement, eventually reaching 2000 ped means I got to do that same run 1000 times over with 2 ped profit to reach my end goal. Patience is a virtue in this game; as long as I can play and survive without depositing, that's a win for me, whether lv10 or lv100; it is all relative.
 

M Rufen Power

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In other words: you cycle slow enough to sustain rought parts of loot cycle :)




Look, I stared with examples of what players say and post. One interpretation of that "common knowledge" is that there are magical return cycles -
on end of them you get what you lost - that was disprowed. Also asked about "mob cycling" and answer was same.

And in thread appeared other meanings of word "cycle":

- daily ped/mob cycling - that's related to bankroll
- waves / periods of loot - quite close to "magical cycle" becouse why there should be better and worse periods ? And if they are - how they work ?

Maybe others.

So to repeat: I asked about existence of any cycles in game and their workings.

And I am gratefull you guys try to answer __exactly__ what I'm asked for but I didn't have some specific meaning in mind that I was beliving to be truth.
I asked what is and is not in game and why people think that.

It's like I asked about some science domain and you keep asking which details I have in mind :)


Regards,

Net
This is a much better explanation.

My take on cycle is based on mob cycles which can be altered via input, tracked via hunting results, and reversed based on a number of kills and multipliers.

I hope that helps and like Messi says, don’t stop shooting or you will lose.
 
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Deemer

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In mining good wave is 5 minutes at max :>

The problem is that if someone tells you to kill 10,000 mobs for a good result, you will try to do it as soon as possible. The same goes for ped runs.

If you split 10, 100k or 1mil ped for 10 hours a day, but for a period of 1 month, the chance of getting into more waves is higher, which will affect your result. If you do it for 1 day, it can give a better result, but in most cases not, even worse.

But depending on the current stage of the game and our personal statistics, the results would be different every day if we did not have a lower loss threshold, which in my case is now is 93%. This does not mean that I personally play at a loss, but that it is max of my current loss. In order to make a profit, I am forced to do something other than what I like.

This threshold is raised with skills or items, but if we catch at the wrong time and mob, the MU loot is less, and also the return of TT.

Here you need a balance that you have to deal with yourself, depending on your expectations for profit, budget and time you spend in the game.

What you call a wave is just the end of the shortest cycle in the game... this is not the wave we are talking about.

During this period the system balances us with the dynamics rate. Players like you don't know it and often leave the field before this period, so there are a lot of people with lower scores. There are many bad moments in which this duration of this cycle can be even 2 hours, and the result is unsatisfactory. The idea is to figure out how to miss these moments, especially for those who shoot everything in one day can be disastrous. But how will you know all this if you do not play. How could you understand the difference between a good moment and a bad moment if you don't get into both... many times.

I'm giving you a hint, once you know it now you should catch it more easily... all you need now is to shoot.

Imagine this cycle as an elastic band. It can be short and more saturated or vice versa... or in its normal form. But it's still 100%... 100% + comes when someone else has left a piece of their elastic., but for me it is more important to combine my budget for a longer period of time.

 
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RickEngland

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OK explain this.

If I log in tomorrow just to for some 2 hour taming runs (full bolga whip+ amp), I'm pretty sure I will either profit or come out even for at least 2 days. As I've not logged in for a week or more (dunno been too busy to think about game). I know that because it happens "every" damn time.

Now if I play for 3 days+ I will get set of an average loss of between 50 - 70 ped a whip (on about 280 input peds per run over 2 hours) and that will "continue", until I'm bored shitless, and do something else with my life.

Take a week off, or month, rinse and repeat. I don't care how many dislikes I get that's what happens. It's so bloody predictable, it's dull in it's implementation. It's simply a test, of acceptance of loss... that's how I view it.

Sure I found a nice Royal pet had a lovely hof.. superb I'm very happy. I'm not moaning just saying the cycle that happens to me.

I don't do heavy hunting, I gave 15 years to the game. My ava is in pensioner chill mode.

Now... if I depot £100 it will be somewhat more generous. I know that too as it learnt my "acceptance" of cost ratio when I was paying I.e what I was "prepared" to pay.

I'm still fond of the game, i just don't give my life to it anymore. That's cool with me, don't know why it's not cool with some of you. Chill peeps.

Rick.
 
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RickEngland

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Messi there is nothing to dislike about my post and I'm sure that your "continued " harassment of "every" post I make breaks some rules. You're looking at a ban soon fella.

Actually it's quite sad really, your in game play or costs must be so awful, for you to focus on my posts all the time. How MA choose you to be their mascot with your arrogance surprises me ( you must have paid them a lot of cash). Still you had your 2 years mascot run, how's it going now? I think Ronny is the new mascot now haha.

Watch your peds fella. There's pain ahead, no matter how much skills you've got.

On a brighter point, Lloyds Bank (UK) reported a massive profit today andi made another £5k ($7k) gain in a "day". Woohoo.

Anyway give it, you're becoming a sad childish bore.

Rick.
 

Deemer

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OK explain this.

If I log in tomorrow just to for some 2 hour taming runs (full bolga whip+ amp), I'm pretty sure I will either profit or come out even for at least 2 days. As I've not logged in for a week or more (dunno been too busy to think about game). I know that because it happens "every" damn time.

Now if I play for 3 days+ I will get set of an average loss of between 50 - 70 ped a whip (on about 280 input peds per run over 2 hours) and that will "continue", until I'm bored shitless, and do something else with my life.

Take a week off, or month, rinse and repeat. I don't care how many dislikes I get that's what happens. It's so bloody predictable, it's dull in it's implementation. It's simply a test, of acceptance of loss... that's how I view it.

Sure I found a nice Royal pet had a lovely hof.. superb I'm very happy. I'm not moaning just saying the cycle that happens to me.

I don't do heavy hunting, I gave 15 years to the game. My ava is in pensioner chill mode.

Now... if I depot £100 it will be somewhat more generous. I know that too as it learnt my "acceptance" of cost ratio when I was paying I.e what I was "prepared" to pay.

I'm still fond of the game, i just don't give my life to it anymore. That's cool with me, don't know why it's not cool with some of you. Chill peeps.

Rick.

If your question is to me, I have an explanation, but I'm still studying the game.

In my opinion, we take the loss of others and they take ours. After 3-4 hours of hunting, if I see that I have no change, I start looking for another mob from which I recoup my losses. This is personal sex from the system that I think needs to change. I enter in the game and I want to kill 5k Kerbs because they are fat and clumsy. When I have a 100 ped loss, the system just doesn't allow me to play for this pool and I'm forced to look for it in another mob.

Deep holes in the dynamic rate can also be removed. It is not necessary for everyone to pay because there are gamblers, I am not a gambler and I do not like that.
 

Deemer

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Hah, there are loot cycles after all :) Bad-good-repeat ! Not only law of big numbers ?
I'm curious if the hint I gave you was useful. Sometimes people say they don't understand me because of my English, so I ask.
 

RickEngland

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If your question is to me, I have an explanation, but I'm still studying the game.

In my opinion, we take the loss of others and they take ours. After 3-4 hours of hunting, if I see that I have no change, I start looking for another mob from which I recoup my losses. This is personal sex from the system that I think needs to change. I enter in the game and I want to kill 5k Kerbs because they are fat and clumsy. When I have a 100 ped loss, the system just doesn't allow me to play for this pool and I'm forced to look for it in another mob.

Deep holes in the dynamic rate can also be removed. It is not necessary for everyone to pay because there are gamblers, I am not a gambler and I do not like that.
Just a general reply for chit chat really.

The point I was trying to make, is there is an appearance of a 'personal' cycle for returns. Especially if say; you had a good loot day, the system would set you on a period of ped clawback. Although under loot 2 I think the coding is much more "lazy" than that. I don't even think MA know how to calculate personal returns anymore.

It feels more manually set. Until the balancing manager looks at your ava, and adjusts the dial for your returns. That could mean (in my opinion) you're stuck on a % return rate, until they decide otherwise. (It kind of works for tbier income prospective). It wouldn't surprise me actually, if they set a player on 88% tt or 93% etc. ... whatever they want per player until MA feel you're due some payback. It's similar to loot 1, but with added variables for looter skill, and everyone's pays etc, I find it much more easier to recognise "patterns" of returns, because it feels more dull.

I used to hunt much more than I do these days. I don't think I could do 12 hour sessions if I tried, my eyes wouldn't take it anymore. Nor do i live for the game 24/7 either (it was unhealthy actually). I much prefer it to pop-in now and then for a few hours (almost like visting an old retro game to smile at).

There is the crowd though that believe you "have to" or "must" continue to commit every waking hour to the game and hunt at full speed to the max. Like it's some life or death demand, chasing that loot cycle of madness. You can if "choose" to I guess. Whatever ticks people boxes haha.

Rick.
 

RickEngland

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Messi being his usual cuntish self I see. I've received had my "inactivity" email messi. So im due to log in soon and collect my deed income peds to play with. Im Still refusing to deposit while you behave like a toddler. (Think its over 2 years now, how time flies). Now imagine how many more 100's of old school players you make feel like that.

Rick
 

Deemer

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Just a general reply for chit chat really.

The point I was trying to make, is there is an appearance of a 'personal' cycle for returns. Especially if say; you had a good loot day, the system would set you on a period of ped clawback. Although under loot 2 I think the coding is much more "lazy" than that. I don't even think MA know how to calculate personal returns anymore.

It feels more manually set. Until the balancing manager looks at your ava, and adjusts the dial for your returns. That could mean (in my opinion) you're stuck on a % return rate, until they decide otherwise. (It kind of works for tbier income prospective). It wouldn't surprise me actually, if they set a player on 88% tt or 93% etc. ... whatever they want per player until MA feel you're due some payback. It's similar to loot 1, but with added variables for looter skill, and everyone's pays etc, I find it much more easier to recognise "patterns" of returns, because it feels more dull.

I used to hunt much more than I do these days. I don't think I could do 12 hour sessions if I tried, my eyes wouldn't take it anymore. Nor do i live for the game 24/7 either (it was unhealthy actually). I much prefer it to pop-in now and then for a few hours (almost like visting an old retro game to smile at).

There is the crowd though that believe you "have to" or "must" continue to commit every waking hour to the game and hunt at full speed to the max. Like it's some life or death demand, chasing that loot cycle of madness. You can if "choose" to I guess. Whatever ticks people boxes haha.

Rick.

I hope you are wrong about the duty button from MA.

We certainly have personal statistics that participate in the determining function, but I think the highest priority is the dynamics. The dynamic rating simply imposes a cap that we cannot go over it. I do a lot of experiments to understand the basics of the game.

I think each type of mob has its own cycle. I think there are several time cycles. My theory is simple...

1. Entropy is a solar system, and the planets may be rotating in an axis.
2. Each planet has its own axis.
3. Each type of mob has its own life cycle.

For example a Cartesian coordinate system that has positive and negative values. A few simple cycles (values) create chaos, not just a simple cycle.

Even at a time when a mob has the highest statistics, if he does not have money in his pocket, because they come from us .. we will just hunt 100%. But if the mob was hunted a lot and has a lot of money, the one with the biggest loss will have the biggest chance for the bonus.

I'm not interested in algorithms under the hood, because hardly anyone will understand them. I'm just trying to distinguish every basic element that we have a "feel" for.

The shortest cycle resembles the SIB system .. after about an hour of hunting the system gives you a bonus for a few minutes.

My max loss is always when I hunt alone, i just feed them alone. Even at the lowest rate, when there are other hunters in the field, I don't have as much as if I were hunting alone. The problem is that there are not enough hunters at low and mid level and very rarely sees a hunter who stays more than 20 minutes.

Today I have a 100 ped loss. At least 50 of them go to MA, only from me, and I don't hunt big mobs. I just don't understand why the game is only made for level 100. You seem to have experience do you have an explanation for why MA is not trying to keep new players?
 

moondog

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Messi being his usual cuntish self I see. I've received had my "inactivity" email messi. So im due to log in soon and collect my deed income peds to play with. Im Still refusing to deposit while you behave like a toddler. (Think its over 2 years now, how time flies). Now imagine how many more 100's of old school players you make feel like that.

Rick
I do not see the need for that kind of language, especially to a player far more experienced than yourself. By your own admission, you are a "pensioner" avatar, so what value does your opinion hold against those who cycle thousands of ped a day. We are all aware of your disillusionment of the game and that you just whip your pets now and again. It maybe best not to comment in these kinds of posts having such limited experience as you do.
 

Kerham

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Rick, you're one of thousands. Per tracker, 4,5kish players globaling last 30 days. The idea that some loot manager sits patiently in his office (8hrs a day? 20?) waiting for you to login to then dial up or down your loot is preposterous. Your observation, in its core, is not wrong, but you don't have to use this conspirationist lense.

"Luck cycles" are vertical. Meaning, sine waves. The bigger the mob, the more acute the curve, up to looking like needles. The smaller the mob, the more lean, look like some slow hills. Most likely, ups and downs with a certain irregularity such as to not be in your face for anybody patient enough to check out over a few days. But not that irregular.

Turnover is horizontal. Over that graph of cycles put a band of transparent plastic so to say. The shorter it is, the bigger odds of being all over the place. The bigger it is, the bigger odds of going negative, because obviously MA is not a charity.

Then we're humans. So (1) we tend to consider break-even or profit as granted/deserved whereas loss as unfair and (2) we'll remember overwhelmingly the good stuff and develop reactions (still can't hunt argos after I grinded their iron mission years ago, it was a disaster).

So you found this rhytm where if you login once every few days (so no burnout from heavy grinding) you have a more enjoyable time and a swirl here and there is really the gratification mechanism they're meant to be. Shocking conclusion. Keep doing that and enjoy the game how you found it to work for you, is that easy and nothing wrong with that. Others will want to minmax and squeeze every pec. Nothing wrong with that either. Others will just press the left mouse button and not react at all to what's happening. That's bad. I tend to be there and is an work in itself to detach myself from grinding mode and try to look differently at things and see what I can improve/change. But overall is very okay to have different views and different expectations. And stop paying so much attention to messi if you don't like him, is that simple.
 
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