Does DPP really matter?

[Hunter X Hunter]

loot is based on damage done, period

Hi, if I understood you correctly, do you mean that MA has a set cost for each mob?


Damage done = mob hp
1 damage dealt = 1 hp taken away from the mob
Eomon young has 502 Stamina = 5020 hp = 5020 damage dealt = you kill the mob

now the cost to deal 5020 damage can be different depending on the weapon you use

If you use Imk II, it would cost you 15.304 ped
If you use Herman Law-40 Smuggler, it would cost you 17.826 ped

Therefore, if the loot is related to cost to kill, the multiplier will be applied to cost to kill, hence Dpp would not matter.

If loot is related to damage dealt as you said, then they must have set a value(a cost) for 5020 damage dealt to which the multiplier can be applied to, or else I do not see how it can be related to damage dealt in any other way. what exactly do you mean by "loot is related to damage dealt" ? how do they program it to make that connection?

5020 damage = 16.73 ped to kill (3 dpp) by default? then let changing multipliers be applied to that 16.73 ped for every kill?

Does it look like this?

Mob count loot related to damage
mob 1 16.73 ped 0.9 multiplier = 15.05 ped loot
mob 2 16.73 ped 0.4 multiplier = 6.692 ped loot
mob 3 16.73 ped 0.72 multiplier = 12.045 ped loot
mob 4 16.73 ped 4.2 multiplier = 70.26 ped loot
mob 5 16.73 ped 0.2 multiplier = 3.345 ped loot


notice in the above example dpp is set to 3 so if you use weapons with dpp less than 3 it would cost more than 16.73 ped to kill but multiplier is still applied to 16.73 and not your real cost to kill because if that were the case then loot would be related to cost to kill.
This is the only example i can think of where the loot is related to damage dealt but then this would also mean that MA has a set value(cost to kill) for each mob for which the multiplier can be applied to and using dpp more than this set value will result in better return (more than the 90% avg TT return), because if default dpp is set at 3, 16.73 ped is the cost to kill and multiplier is applied to 16.73, but in reality if u use Imk II(3.28 dpp) it would only cost you 15.304 ped, the multipliers should be applied to 15.304 and not 16.73 but since loot is related to damage, multipliers are applied to 16.73 and that result in you getting 9.317% more than usual loot.
that is the only way I see how dpp can increase loot return, that is if loot is related to damage dealt and not cost to kill.

Conclusion:
For Dpp to matter, MA must set a default DPP or default cost to kill to which if a player uses weapons with dpp above that default dpp, his/her TT return increases, and vice versa.

 

[atomicstorm]

I am still yet to test this, but in short, it appears that there is some mechanism to determine the cost to kill with a given weapon and such multiplier is on that... and if using unmaxed, you are hit twice... once because the cost to kill is based on when you are maxed and two, you are getting no credit for the misses.

I am still testing it. more to come.

 

[Billy Jean Ruby]

Waiting to see some serious test results to be sure.
But from my experience when I go wild and forget about eco I global constantly.
But I did that only couple times.
My result was so obvious, the difference in loot so big for that small sample, so made me a believer even if I don't made an extend test.

Waiting results from atomicstorm

 

[aVaLON_52]

Hi, if I understood you correctly, do you mean that MA has a set cost for each mob?


Damage done = mob hp
1 damage dealt = 1 hp taken away from the mob
Eomon young has 502 Stamina = 5020 hp = 5020 damage dealt = you kill the mob

now the cost to deal 5020 damage can be different depending on the weapon you use

If you use Imk II, it would cost you 15.304 ped
If you use Herman Law-40 Smuggler, it would cost you 17.826 ped

Therefore, if the loot is related to cost to kill, the multiplier will be applied to cost to kill, hence Dpp would not matter.

If loot is related to damage dealt as you said, then they must have set a value(a cost) for 5020 damage dealt to which the multiplier can be applied to, or else I do not see how it can be related to damage dealt in any other way. what exactly do you mean by "loot is related to damage dealt" ? how do they program it to make that connection?

5020 damage = 16.73 ped to kill (3 dpp) by default? then let changing multipliers be applied to that 16.73 ped for every kill?

Does it look like this?

Mob count loot related to damage
mob 1 16.73 ped 0.9 multiplier = 15.05 ped loot
mob 2 16.73 ped 0.4 multiplier = 6.692 ped loot
mob 3 16.73 ped 0.72 multiplier = 12.045 ped loot
mob 4 16.73 ped 4.2 multiplier = 70.26 ped loot
mob 5 16.73 ped 0.2 multiplier = 3.345 ped loot


notice in the above example dpp is set to 3 so if you use weapons with dpp less than 3 it would cost more than 16.73 ped to kill but multiplier is still applied to 16.73 and not your real cost to kill because if that were the case then loot would be related to cost to kill.
This is the only example i can think of where the loot is related to damage dealt but then this would also mean that MA has a set value(cost to kill) for each mob for which the multiplier can be applied to and using dpp more than this set value will result in better return (more than the 90% avg TT return), because if default dpp is set at 3, 16.73 ped is the cost to kill and multiplier is applied to 16.73, but in reality if u use Imk II(3.28 dpp) it would only cost you 15.304 ped, the multipliers should be applied to 15.304 and not 16.73 but since loot is related to damage, multipliers are applied to 16.73 and that result in you getting 9.317% more than usual loot.
that is the only way I see how dpp can increase loot return, that is if loot is related to damage dealt and not cost to kill.

Conclusion:
For Dpp to matter, MA must set a default DPP or default cost to kill to which if a player uses weapons with dpp above that default dpp, his/her TT return increases, and vice versa.

Quite the Conundrum

I'm not opposed to this theory..... If we had all been foolishly following the DPP trend and applying ridiculous markup to weapons with higher DPP, it would be wise of MA to not say a word......................

(they would laugh behind closed doors as they rake in the profits of our DPP theories and excessive mu for ma)

until proven of course, it remains a theory.........
interresting indeed.

instead of finding guns that have high DPP this theory would favor guns with low DPP..... because you'd be wasting more ammo... and creating a bigger..... *multiplier* per se.........

hmmm

I think we'll need multiple tests.... multiple logs from multiple players.... in order to find a *norm*

multiple logs of

X mob with Y1 weapon for Z duration
X mob with Y2 weapon for Z duration
X mob with Y1 weapon for Z duration
X mob with Y2 weapon for Z duration

example
X = proteron young
Y1 = imk2 with a106 (no enhancers)
Y2 = some gun with shitty DPP + shit amp (no enhancers)
Z = hour length

then calculate average returns from say 10 instances of this test................

*edit*
Z has to be number of mobs killed not duration

 

[M Rufen Power]

and again you're wrong in my humble opinion, and i don't write it out of thin air - this has been tested and documented quite a few times! (mann mph on daspletor, for example)

Can I just ask you when exactly was this test carried out? Because I am very confident that if it was before 2015 then your statement might have been correct, but that was too long for it to stand now.

Conclusion: For Dpp to matter, MA must have set a default DPP or default cost to kill to which if a player uses weapons with dpp above that default dpp, his/her TT return increases, and vice versa.

100% correct in your statement. DPP matters now!

Let me write a simple scenario for you guys to see it from my point of view.

2.00 DPP WEP - Player gets 90% TT returns.
3.00 DPP WEP - Player gets 100% TT returns.
4.00 DPP WEP - Player gets 110% TT returns.

Remember that MA only make their rake/cut once you have repaired your equipment.
The rest of your peds not returned goes to feed the loot pool for other players to find.

2.00 DPP player is feeding 4.00 DPP player, 4 DPP player takes their 10%.
3.00 DPP player has sustainable loot returns between 95-105% long term.

This scenario was widely exaggerated to express my point across and a 4 DPP wep is possible for it to exist in today's game with certain new mechanics and gear involved.

 

[Deleted member 26456]

"Does Mindark has a set "cost to kill" for each mob in game"?

For short answer yes, not seperatly for each mob, there is just one basic rule for it, which is not to hard to find out if you think about it.
Most people here on forum are thinking way to much about all theories out here.
And ofc there are some other factors playing along.
Just read my SIG.
It's all in my head, it's just to complex to write it all down here, it would be close to getting a book.
And not sure if i would like to share it all.
This is also the reason why i don't post much here, because i don't want to argue to much around with most of the people here.

To keep it short let me share my 2014 TT return.
From January 1 2014 up to think it was around first week of december 2014, my TT return was around 104%
Then MA start pulling my leg, and i ended 2014 with a TT return of 96,33%
Even refiner and equiping fee's are counted here, so pure on Hunting it would be even little higher.
Did i have to depo in 2014? NOPE, think did around 75 Euro but that had other reasons.
Do i use old school weapons with maxed level 100?, yes i do since level 30

And how to achieve this, well that is up to you guys to figure out.

GL out there

 

[Therial Von Bai]

For short answer yes, not seperatly for each mob, there is just one basic rule for it, which is not to hard to find out if you think about it.
Most people here on forum are thinking way to much about all theories out here.
And ofc there are some other factors playing along.
Just read my SIG.
It's all in my head, it's just to complex to write it all down here, it would be close to getting a book.
And not sure if i would like to share it all.
This is also the reason why i don't post much here, because i don't want to argue to much around with most of the people here.

To keep it short let me share my 2014 TT return.
From January 1 2014 up to think it was around first week of december 2014, my TT return was around 104%
Then MA start pulling my leg, and i ended 2014 with a TT return of 96,33%
Even refiner and equiping fee's are counted here, so pure on Hunting it would be even little higher.
Did i have to depo in 2014? NOPE, think did around 75 Euro but that had other reasons.
Do i use old school weapons with maxed level 100?, yes i do since level 30

And how to achieve this, well that is up to you guys to figure out.

GL out there

Sorry to resurrect a dead post but i did some big time studys with different weapons.

I used a weapon that was a 2.98 dpp for around 2 hunting days and barely made positive. then, i switched to a weapon that was like a 2.30 DPP. and let me tell you. i made 60+ globals between 10-294 ped within 5 hours of hunting. The more i used for cost to kill, significantly increased the amount of loot i gained. Using a 2.98 dpp weapon, ill maybe land 2-3 globals a week but a 2.30 DPP landing me over 60! in 5.5hrs? I dont believe it has nothing to do with RNG because many friends of mine who hunt eco, land globals alot more often than they would with a super 3.00+ weapon.

 

[Svarog]

i switched to a weapon that was like a 2.30 DPP. and let me tell you. i made 60+ globals

This thread is pre-loot 2.0, which changed everything. Nowadays using a low eco gun increases volatility and amount of globals indeed, but in the long run it should ruin your anyway, unless the globals are the goal (like a Highest Single Loot kind of event).