Frustrated with the game, the cost of playing the return for money ?

How has your gameplay changed playing PC


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AJack10600

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Over the last years many new changes have happened to our Virtual Universe. We have seen reorganization between FPC and MA, we have seen new content added, new graphics improved, new storyplay implemented.

However... the subjective feeling of many is that:

a) We don't have more players ingame... on the contrary
b) People have reduced or stopped depositing or playing alltogether

I would like to try and get some statistical proof for some of these allegations and hence I have started this Poll to caputre the mood of the playerbase as of Mid Jan 2011. Please cast your vote !
 

milena jingles

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I would prefer the option ......

I depo as much as before...but i cant play as much as before...because the ped are burning off much faster then before
 

Warpath

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business as usual here, although I have to admit I have noticed the low periods are lower than I have ever seen before, but the good periods seem to be better too. I used to get by on a 2k bankroll but I had to bump it up to 3k to cover the lows now.
 
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I would prefer the option ......

I depo as much as before...but i cant play as much as before...because the ped are burning off much faster then before

Also: I deposit more than before and I play less than before.
 

AJack10600

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I would prefer the option ......

I depo as much as before...but i cant play as much as before...because the ped are burning off much faster then before

I dont' want to jump the gun on conclusions... how long you play with your ped greatly depends on your playstyle. My poll is more about "behaviour" than gamestyle. I see where you are coming from but I want to keep it objective for now. Hope that's understandable.
 

Jin Franka

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I deposit less, play less and Im currently selling out my skills (not all), though that means Im actually ingame more.
Not saying that Im quitting, thats just what Im doing right now. we´ll see... :)
Maybe changes tomorrow or next year lol
 

XeroX2

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I dont' want to jump the gun on conclusions... how long you play with your ped greatly depends on your playstyle. My poll is more about "behaviour" than gamestyle. I see where you are coming from but I want to keep it objective for now. Hope that's understandable.

but still i feel that the... i deposit more... and play less option is missing... isn´t that objective?
Well that was my option for the end of last year now it is I don´t depo and play less.
 

langsuyar

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I deposit more and I play less.

As far as I understand this is quite an objective statement. And it is in no way related with my game style, I'm not stating here that my peds vanish faster than before!
 

Jennson

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It also depends a lot of what i do in game. When i go unamped mining, my log tells you pretty much about how much it costs me, but i also shoot a few hours feffs during MM, which was pretty expensive. Imho the major pint is the game should be more forgiving in some mindless playing, that would cause more fun and most certainly i'd play more in terms of having fun and needed less number crunching.
 

AJack10600

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I deposit more and I play less.

As far as I understand this is quite an objective statement. And it is in no way related with my game style, I'm not stating here that my peds vanish faster than before!

I appologies, I did not consider this scenario... simply because I assume that depositing is related to your gaming activity. In your case this seems not to be corrolated, so you are building up cash ingame...
 

milena jingles

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I dont' want to jump the gun on conclusions... how long you play with your ped greatly depends on your playstyle. My poll is more about "behaviour" than gamestyle. I see where you are coming from but I want to keep it objective for now. Hope that's understandable.


It is the same style as before :)
 

Mikass

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Cost to play didn`t increase

There`s bigger loot variation now than say 3 years ago. Few years back big hofs were not an option for many people and L items can`t be looted in very small globals. This made MA increase the loot variation to allow people to loot more L items and was good move. Not to mention high tt unL items that can be looted only in hofs.

On top of that cost of play decreased in my book. You can buy from tt rookie hunting/mining gear and can go hunt specific v low maturity mobs and/or mine. I believe you can get 100rookie bombs for 1ped and 100probes for 50pec or something. If this isn`t a reduced cost to play, don`t know what is. :laugh:

Also, having more options such as vehicles don`t "increase" cost to play. It just provides more options for people basically. People are free to travel on foot for free as they were before. MA just provided some extra options for those willing to pay more for the convenience of a faster commute.
 
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mastermesh

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On top of that cost of play decreased in my book. You can buy from tt rookie hunting/mining gear and can go hunt specific v low maturity mobs and or/mine. I believe you can get 100rookie bombs for 1ped and 100probes for 50pec or something. If this isn`t a reduced cost to play, don`t know what is. :laugh:
Exactly. Biggest change is that L came in to play, and that whole change to tiering of UL to make it always succeed brought myself and a lot of others back in to playing more. Up til then there was this huge invisible ceiling... The ceiling is still there since the cost to upgrade the gear is still high, but now at least you know that if you pay the price it will work always.

I honestly think the rookie gear and puny mobs, along with tier change was some of the smartest things FPC and MA has made in YEARS... Now, if there was only a rookie sword that cost less then the TT sword does, lol.

Its no secret I love using viper whip on those puny to up my whip skills... and lower cost to play enough that I can play every day for hours if I want. That is huge change! It allows me to get continual skill gain even if it's not much, every single day of the year if I choose... and without having to be bored to death sweating at Neas for the rest of forever.

The cost to play doing that is very, very low per hour since it does roughly same damage as the kiwio rookie rifle. It would be good if they would introduce more UL gear like the whip that does that low amount of damage. The tt fists are ok on the puny, but really they lead to too much overkill since average hit does 5 damage and puny has 10 health... so average takes 2 hits with the fists, but if one of those hits does not do 5 you are looking at overkill on the third hit. I use the whip to help with that and use it as a finisher, but not everyone has a finisher that does that little damage, unless they are using kiwio... Kiwio would be nice if it was UL, but it's not. Biggest disappointment with rookie gear is that it's all L... good for new folks, but not so great for folks that want to use it forever as a finisher. I guess this is good for the whip crafters who make the L versions of the viper, lol.

I do have a bigger whip now, along with other nice low level UL sib stuff, so hunt bigger stuff sometimes (love the Corn about one TP jump west of Zeus), but the lowering the cost through puny helps me skill daily whereas otherwise my deposit level would just make me a weekend warrior so to speak... That is enormous... it means the many micro depositors that are just casual gamers stand a chance. However, they have a lot further they can take this... The average cost to play and participate is still far higher then most casual gamers like I think. Rookie gear is a nice first step, and removing rent is a nice second step, but there's still an entire micropayment level of the rce that needs a lot of development to really be a global system that many will like and participate in daily.

If WOW is like 15 bucks a month, they need to get things at a low enough payment level where the average participant can chase down puny and stuff like that for 15 bucks a month to really be competitive for that audience... Right now they have it at around the one dollar an hour if you are uber eco and swunt puny like I'm doing some, BUT, 15 hours is not an entire month... That's one hardcore weekend a month... still a long ways to go til 15 bucks a month can get you through an entire month without having to go sweat at Neas or do other stuff that's not related to the main professions... Decrease cost of rookie gear and stuff even more. Create even punier puny mobs with 5 health, etc. Don't stop developing more mobs on the high end, etc. just make it cheaper to get to lower micropayment level to spread the chances that everyone can play every single day of the year if they choose to without having to deposit every single day of the year... make more interesting things to do for free (more starter quests, etc.)
 
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Mikass

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I voted for that

There should be an option in the poll: "I can`t afford to deposit as much as before due to RL financial issues(financial crisis) although I would if I could. "
 

Sonea

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Over the last years many new changes have happened to our Virtual Universe. We have seen reorganization between FPC and MA, we have seen new content added, new graphics improved, new storyplay implemented.

[...]


I deposit a lot some years ago, if i had to start today not a penny. All those changes made RCE near dead, turning Entropia in a soporific "entertainment" "universe"'s". Besides MA & consequently "planet partners" abused the trust & patience of PARTICIPANTS in many many areas. Not a surprise sooner or later they harvest what they sown.
 

sitram

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The high tt variance and lack of markup in loot makes EU a lot less attractive for me then it was before.

Either this or I simply got bored of the game :scratch2:

I hope things will improve because MA is slowly taking away all niches which could offer a chance to break even or profit.
 

LangeTobias

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There should be an option in the poll: "I can`t afford to deposit as much as before due to RL financial issues(financial crisis) although I would if I could. "

yeah.. however i got more than enough peds for my playstyle.. (dante + apis w/ boar armor +5b) but i just do not see the fun part of seeing the peds go away :)

rather save them and invest them in the future, as it looks now... or well, depends on the investment part tbh, if this game keeps develop like it is atm I am not sure I want to invest them in here :)
 

JoseMTacoral

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I honestly think the rookie gear and puny mobs, along with tier change was some of the smartest things FPC and MA has made in YEARS...

Totally agree, now with a few K of sweat the beginner can have a very similar experience to what will be in his virtual future life.

On the loot I had the feeling lately that even in with low mobs can be received a greater proportion of objects. That also is good because the rookies have a chance to make their armor pixie and goblin hunting instead of having to buy them.

However, I think the problem remains the low number of depositing players resulting in a poorer economy ingame.

I've said many times, Mindark / FPC and other partners should make an effort in advertising and promotion to increase the number of new depositing players.

It should bring back the mentoring system, renovated, so as to ensure that newcomers are accompanied in their evolution by the mentors and they receive an award for his commitment to the student over time.

The mission system would be an excellent tool with missions that must be completed by the student and his mentor. You could also add a new modality in the loot system in which, is only an idea, mentor and student will receive the same loot beyond the damage.

I would also be very interesting that novices could visit the various planets in the universe with a low-cost ticket that can be used only once per segment for a limited period of time. That way if you do not like or feel comfortable with the planet he chose to be born would not be lost to the others planets of the universe.

Finally, responding more specifically to the topic of the thread, being the leader of my Society and the obligation to keep the site running, have prevented me to take several "holidays" by the lack of good loot.
 

Smoerble

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I've said many times, Mindark / FPC and other partners should make an effort in advertising and promotion to increase the number of new depositing players.


This will always rsult in a big fail.
EU currently is not nice enough, to keep the current players spending their PEDs (see the current voting topic). This means, most of new players will not deposit much (or never anything).

First the game needs to become unique and amazing before it makes sense, to bring in new players.
 

AJack10600

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You can all assume as much as you want to... ultimately, the players decide if MA's return and loot distribution is appropriate and smart. IF the majority of people reduce deposits or stop depositing, then that's a clear message.

You can't say, oh this is such a fantatic product except that people are idiots, they don't realise how great it is...

No !

If people don't think it's worth the money then the product has a problem... it's as simple as that !
 

AJack10600

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There should be an option in the poll: "I can`t afford to deposit as much as before due to RL financial issues(financial crisis) although I would if I could. "

It's statistically proven that computer gaming also for MMORPGs has increased during the financial crisis due to more people being unemployed and having more time. Why would it be different for MA/EU ???

Because the cost of playing is too high maybe ?
 

Mikass

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You can all assume as much as you want to... ultimately, the players decide if MA's return and loot distribution is appropriate and smart. IF the majority of people reduce deposits or stop depositing, then that's a clear message.

You can't say, oh this is such a fantatic product except that people are idiots, they don't realise how great it is...

No !

If people don't think it's worth the money then the product has a problem... it's as simple as that !

We`ve had a booming Entropia economy with same loot distribution back in 2008 before the economic crisis. Would seem to me many were willing to deposit with same loot system we have now.

I know dozens of players that were severely effected by economic crisis, players from all over the world who were forced to withdraw, sell items, skills etc. Ofc many in the processes due to RL depression which is also not only monetary but also psychological, might tend to see all things in negative light cos of the increased bitterness of their situation. Yes, skill prices, item prices crashed a lot cos of this RL crisis. It`s a fact and blaming it all on MA or FPC won`t make things any better. Only thing where it would have an impact is turning off new players who coming to this forum see only a community of bitter `n sour ppl. Everyone`s free to play another MMO.

I`ve kept hearing over n over how something like WoW is better. You really think that? I`ve tried WoW in some trial and found the whole game truly retarded and extremely simplistic.

People have tried similar RCE games but they pale in comparison to Entropia in every way. Some even shoved RL money into those without any real hope of getting it back under, deposits cleverly labeled as "donations".
 

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I would prefer the option ......

I depo as much as before...but i cant play as much as before...because the ped are burning off much faster then before

Same for me.
 

mastermesh

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Another broken promise that they need to fix - the promise of getting rid of no-looters. I think that sometimes the silence from MA or FPC in these forums most days actually might be becuase they don't want to give off the hint of some other promise that they can't keep whether on accident or on purpose... which is bad. I really think Marco believed that the second item in the tiering process was needed or he would not have made the statements he made about it. Other statements that flip like a quarter without any warning is why I think EU may be really TOO DYNAMIC. There needs to be some ground rules that say that a, b, and c will always be this way in game no matter what vu we are in. So far the only thing like that we have is the ped to dollar ratio, and that's about it... Everything else is always changing so often that it's hard to know what the future holds in any area, so people are actually afraid to invest in any of it. Why buy high damage per second blp gun if blp might be the taming of the future and be nerfed or a system that gets broken completely for over a year and a half with no eta on the fix... Why buy an estate if they can be made to not work at all for over a month or a quarter of a year with no eta on the fixes? Why do anything since the future is so uncertain about any of it because EU IS DYNAMIC?!?... There needs to be more fixes and bringing back the old systems that people have already invested in - bringing back the real in this virtual reality and "real" cash economy. Right now it's not a "real" cash economy. It's a real crash economy...

Communication is a very important thing. Hanne does post here a lot, and some of the other folks at FPC do to, but is it really at the level that is needed? Why isn't there an eta on fixes? Why is it so important to build Medusa before bringing back taming? Where is mentoring? the list goes on and on...

Hanne says there's only 14 people in FPC. Take the profits from Medusa and similar sales and higher a 15th, at least for a temporary time til that money runs dry or the bugs get solved.. or you make enough to make them full time!

Not enough for a 16th? Sell off those shops and apartments that no participant has ever owned yet...

Not enough for a 17th? Sell off more of Amethera ASAP - MAKE SURE TO PUT THE START BID AT A HIGH ENOUGH LEVEL, and put the end date at a far enough out date that it will guarantee the money comes in...

Not enough for an 18th? Try something else...

Don't use all this new help for anything other then finding bugs and killing em dead.
 
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AJack10600

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We`ve had a booming Entropia economy with same loot distribution back in 2008 before the economic crisis. Would seem to me many were willing to deposit with same loot system we have now.

It's a bit dangerous to compare to 2008... because the 2008 results were boosted by the double and tripple skillgain events... the excitement of Cryengine... And, how can you prove what the loot distribution is and was ? You have no statistical proof it's the same...

I know dozens of players that were severely effected by economic crisis, players from all over the world who were forced to withdraw, sell items, skills etc. Ofc many in the processes due to RL depression which is also not only monetary but also psychological, might tend to see all things in negative light cos of the increased bitterness of their situation. Yes, skill prices, item prices crashed a lot cos of this RL crisis. It`s a fact and blaming it all on MA or FPC won`t make things any better. Only thing where it would have an impact is turning off new players who coming to this forum see only a community of bitter `n sour ppl. Everyone`s free to play another MMO.

Well if this forum is full of bitter and sour people... then maybe there is a reason for it ... ?

I`ve kept hearing over n over how something like WoW is better. You really think that? I`ve tried WoW in some trial and found the whole game truly retarded and extremely simplistic.

People have tried similar RCE games but they pale in comparison to Entropia in every way. Some even shoved RL money into those without any real hope of getting it back under, deposits cleverly labeled as "donations".

I have never said WoW is better, in fact I have said many times that the RCE gaming concept of PC is exceptional !!! What I have said is that a game is a game and has to measure itself against the value for money you are getting. I see that a lot more people are willing to pay 15 bucks to play WoW than to pay 1500 to play EU...

And as I have said before, it's all about the value for money. People are willing to pay more, everyone here is willing to pay more for EU. But I have a feeling that whatever is going on in this universe, people are just not so willing anymore to pay as much as is needed to have a certain entertainment level. Of course I can kill chirpies on 15 USD per month. But I'd rather kill Spiders... and if I need 2000 USD to sustain my Spider hunting for one month because my loot return is poo ... then there is a problem in the setup.

Everybody here is free to talk down the problems in this universe and pretend it's all pink... I wish it was pink.. I really do! But what I see is a forum full of moaning sour people and that must have a reason. I started this poll because I want evidence that people deposit less and play less... You can pretend whatever you like is happening but numbers are numbers and I tell you they don't look good.

If MA ever have the courage to show some more financial reports you will see for yourself...

This is not whining, this is factual analysis of a status quo. And if deposits and player numbers are down, then that's not good and then you have a problem and you can not blame it on the financial crysis cos games like WoW have had impressive growth rates during the financial crisis, as did the computer industry in general..
 

JoseMTacoral

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This will always rsult in a big fail.
EU currently is not nice enough, to keep the current players spending their PEDs (see the current voting topic). This means, most of new players will not deposit much (or never anything).
First the game needs to become unique and amazing before it makes sense, to bring in new players.

Entropia Universe is in many senses "unique and amazing", without considering the aspect of economic return. There are many things to improve on the system, it is true. But no doubt the economy within the game will improve dramatically the day that there are many more players spending their peds here. It is not "one thing or the other ", Mindark and the owners of the other planets can improve the game and promote it at the same time.
 

Mikass

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It's a bit dangerous to compare to 2008... because the 2008 results were boosted by the double and tripple skillgain events... the excitement of Cryengine... And, how can you prove what the loot distribution is and was ? You have no statistical proof it's the same...
Those 2x-3x skillgains came only after VU10 and summer of 2008. The loot system we have in place today was in effect way before these skill events took place.
2-3x skillgains were introduced only to compensate for the lack of certain removed game components. Maybe some remember that when VU10(cryengine VU) came online not even basic system such as teams or tp chips were available. Not even now are all the older system back and running.
Economy was also booming in 2007 with same lootsystem, prior to VU10(cryengine) and prior to RL ongoing economic crisis that started in 2008.

Well if this forum is full of bitter and sour people... then maybe there is a reason for it ... ?
Yeah, I didn`t deny that. But I don`t think they`re anymore bitter than few years ago because of the lootsystem.

Markups or certain items crashed because of RL crisis mostly, as people withdrew to use money RL and less deposits coming in. This ofc impacted markup of loot and it became harder to profit from markup. Every player with enough game knowledge knows you can`t profit in tt value. Markups were always key to breaking even and if they got lower means it became increasingly difficult for some people to profit. This doesn`t mean however game became more expensive to play because MA or FPC did something on purpose to mess up the markups.

Also remember that MA was to go live with an IPO back in 2008-2009 and that was delayed. Lots of the cash gathered from that IPO could have gone into platform development. That didn`t happen because of the economic crisis. David/MA said himself they had to delay plans for IPO following the advice of Credit Suisse. This had big impact on development as they weren`t able to use that few mill $ from IPO to finish up certain platform features fast enough. But yet again we have the RL economic crisis to blame for that.
 
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sitram

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Mikass, 2x and 3x skill gain periods were introduced shortly after economic crisis was announced RL.

The reason behind this was to show to the shareholders that even on crisis time, EU still generates income.

I wouldn't count too much on seeing another increased skill gain period anymore in EU. If you do some skill gain studies you will see that the general trend now is to decrease the skill gain/ped. Based on my latest studies it's below 0.9% of the ped spent(in hunting)
 
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