Huge endless hunting trip

Leeloo Miner

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After 2 years ingame mostly mining and occasionally hunting I decided to go hunting mainly when mining is bad instead of standing at auction most of the time because it is so diverse.

Meanwhile I have invested in several (low) UNL armors and UNL weapons.
The aim is to build up skills slowly and also by doing ranks.

Although I am now lvl 20 laser I have decided to start with the lowest HP mobs, that is the Arkadian Hornet.
I also look at the level of the mob. This may be no more than 50% of my evade.
If I'm lvl 10 evade, the mob can be max lvl 5 to avoid lots of decay on armors when used and healing more than shooting.

I also have a number of goals for the time being and those are in the long term:
H.E.A.R.T fab (Cyrene), Viceroy (Ark) and healing chips.
Loot that I obtain and which I need to achieve these goals will not be sold for the time being.

You can also see what I'm selling and on which planet to make an offering (still need to be made)
When the end of the 25 ranks are reached, the loot is sold if there is interest for it.

So far I've hunted more than is listed here, but hunted wrong with too much overkill.
The next time I hunt I will use a lower weapon to make up for any loss (I hope)
 
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Arkadian Hornet (Ark)
Armor : none / Fab : none
Weapon : Ozpyn Chon S1X1
TT return - Cost : 89,74% / 120,34% / 131,60% / 66,64%
[Globals]: Leeloo Leeloo Mining killed a creature (Arkadian Hornet) with a value of 10 PED!
Weapon : Herman CAP-TT
TT return - Cost : 72,81% / 85,61% / 68,54% / 90,86% / 50,90%
Weapon : Piron PBP-0 looted from Hornet's
TT return - Cost : 61,64%
Weapon : Bukin's rifle adjusted
TT return - Cost :
Totall after all runs so far : -27,3 Ped - 84,47% Rank 20

Carabok (Ark)

Armor : none used / Fab : none used
Weapon : Herman CAP-TT
TT return - Cost : 73,50%
Totall after all runs so far : -0,93 - 73,50% Rank 4

Combido LVL 4 Cut 40%/Impact 60% (Caly)

Armor : CDF / Fab : S10
Weapon : Bukin's Spare Rifle Adj -TT-knife Eff 58,20%
TT return - Cost : 111,33%
Armor : CDF / Fab : S10
Weapon : TT-knife + extender P20 Eff 63,60%
[Globals]: Leeloo Leeloo Mining killed a creature (Combibo Old) with a value of 15 PED!
TT return - Cost :
Totall after all runs so far : 2,22 - 111,33% Rank 9

Cyber street vixen 100% cut (Rock)

Armor : Atlas 9 against cut / Musca 8 against cut
Weapons : Tagger Bukin's spare rifle adj / TT weapon
Healing : VivoS10

Daikiba LVL 3-4 Impact 90%/Stab 10% (Caly)
Armor : Grunt / Fab : S10
Weapon : TT gun
TT return - Cost : 84,71%
Totall after all runs so far : -58,13 - 84,71% Rank 15

Monura (Ark)

Armor : none / Fab : none
Weapons : TT weapon
Totall after all runs so far :

Tree Dragon LVL5 (Cy)
Info :
it takes about 40 shots with a TT gun to kill 1 so almost 50 peC
Totall bones so far : 93

Armor : Atlas / Fab : none 9,45% of the costs was dam on armor
Weapons : tagger Bukin's spare rifle adj - TT gun
TT return - cost : 67,52% Estimated after sales : 76,43%
Armor : Musca / Fab : none 5,95% of the costs was dam on armor
Weapons : tagger Bukin's spare rifle adj - TT gun
TT return - cost : 45,35% Estimated after sales : 49,18%
Armor : Gorgon 5,68% of the costs / Fab : S10 9,71% of the costs
Weapons : tagger Bukin's spare rifle adj - TT gun
TT return - cost : 121,84 % Estimated after sales : 141,20%
Armor : Gorgon 5,55% of the costs / Fab : S10 8,58% of the costs
Weapons : tagger Bukin's spare rifle adj - TT gun
TT return - cost : 70,71% Estimated after sales : 78,18%
[Globals]: Leeloo Leeloo Mining killed a creature (Finned Tree Dragon) with a value of 11 PED!
Totall after all runs so far : -62,61 79% Estimated after sales : 88,91% Rank 5
 
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An hour ago I described a similar problem in another topic. Your weapon is too big for the mob you are hunting, so your loss will be maximum. You will have much smaller losses if you use the smallest weapons for these 10 HP mob...


Because the loss depends mostly on the bet of the weapon. With Chon you will cope faster with the goal you set, but your result will be in question even after MU. The idea of a successful hunt is not to chase the maximum but the best minimum, in this case every global of 10 ped would cover a two-day loss... but at the moment using Chon you would lose it in less than an hour.

With a bigger bet on a particular mob, you would increase your chances take the pool, which is the gambling part of the game, but this model is a loser in long runs like yours.

The problem in the beginning is that there are not enough small guns for these 10-20 HP mobs and a bad habit is instilled on our understanding. Multiplications may be more common when you hunt with a bigger bet, but that's because you have a bigger loss. At the moment, if there is no one else on the field, you are fighting with yourself against the game.

Taking or not, good luck with this.
 
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TT pistol works fine for a 10hp mob. Don't worry about the Hunt the thing weapons, frankly they suck, they don't use UA ammo, but special Hunt the thing ammo only. and they are non refundable. The Assault rifle is buggy as shit also and can't hit the broad side of a barn to save its life.
 
TT pistol works fine for a 10hp mob. Don't worry about the Hunt the thing weapons, frankly they suck, they don't use UA ammo, but special Hunt the thing ammo only. and they are non refundable. The Assault rifle is buggy as shit also and can't hit the broad side of a barn to save its life.

Which of the uber hunts with 3-4 shots?... show at least one in your next pointless comment.
 
Which of the uber hunts with 3-4 shots?... show at least one in your next pointless comment.
None cos they dont waste their time with 10hp mobs. but if they did they would just use TT pistol. Deemer have you actually used the Assault rifle from the thing? I'm trying to save this guy the wasted time and effort going across the universe to find out for himself how useless it actually is.
 
Yes of course, 500 TT start 106% TT end. MU loot +80.
I specifically tested it because they asked me for advice, and I wasn't sure about the result.
What experience do you have?

RRT..
The question was which of the uber hunts with 3-4 shots, not 10 HP mob.
 
Yes of course, 500 TT start 106% TT end. MU loot +80.
I specifically tested it because they asked me for advice, and I wasn't sure about the result.
What experience do you have?
My experience with that weapon is that the shooting animation can take up to 10 or more seconds to complete as it fires aimlessly into the general vicinity of the mob you target. Trying to deal any repeatable damage to a mob with it is practically impossible, After a few goes at it I threw it away as it is not fit for purpose.
Even without this bug, and even if there is a workaround. its fatal flaw still is the prepayment you must make on its specialised ammo in a certain corner of the universe, and the non refundability of the weapon.
 
My experience with that weapon is that the shooting animation can take up to 10 or more seconds to complete as it fires aimlessly into the general vicinity of the mob you target. Trying to deal any repeatable damage to a mob with it is practically impossible, After a few goes at it I threw it away as it is not fit for purpose.
Even without this bug, and even if there is a workaround. its fatal flaw still is the prepayment you must make on its specialised ammo in a certain corner of the universe, and the non refundability of the weapon.

It's no different than buying one Arkadia ore and another from RT to fulfill your Calypso recipe for a better pool.

@Leeloo Miner Pay attention to my 1st post here, I specifically considered what I write, because you hunt small mobs and you are low level, ie. without much experience.
 
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Thank you both for these wise words.

The intention is of course that I still end up close to break even and preferably a little more.
Killing with the chon is indeed 1-3 shots on the hornet.
That's why I'm definitely going to try to do a few rounds with a TT weapon Herman cap as well as, I think, and with the Bukin's spare rifle, adj.
Why I'm with the chon hunt because I hate it when you want to hunt and your (L) weapon is nowhere to be found.
Really curious now for the next hunts, is a nice test.
Updated the last run
Forgot to mention that I also prefer to use UNL weapons/armor to tier them up for bigger mobs later on.
 
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Thank you both for these wise words.

The intention is of course that I still end up close to break even and preferably a little more.
Killing with the chon is indeed 1-3 shots on the hornet.
That's why I'm definitely going to try to do a few rounds with a TT weapon Herman cap as well as, I think, and with the Bukin's spare rifle, adj.
Why I'm with the chon hunt because I hate it when you want to hunt and your (L) weapon is nowhere to be found.
Really curious now for the next hunts, is a nice test.
Updated the last run
Forgot to mention that I also prefer to use UNL weapons/armor to tier them up for bigger mobs later on.
Overkill cost is calculated into the loot, but since you are overkilling, your loot comp will be a bit worse, which is probably what deemer is trying to say, but those tiny mobs usually don't have a rare UL item and most of the items you can get even with overkill.
 
Yeap, I remembered the bug that Chalmers was talking about. The rifle works only in 3rd mode in the fixed view nearest camera, otherwise the effect is shot without causing damage. This is because the Rifle works similarly to the Explosives effect, ie. you don't have to survive the target, even if it's locked. I found the solution by playing with the Camera. In my case was no way to throw away 3 pitbulls full of rifles, because the TT of these weapons does not return the value for which you bought them. And yet the Rifle can work at a certain setting... The Pistol has the same statistics, but there is no bug problem, the rifles are specific, so I think I'd better remove them from my previous post..

The multiplications depend on the HP of the mobs, what we can control is our bet. Lack of patience and experience, compared to the expectation of big profits from a quick and big bet are at the root of the losses.

Take a look at this post here...

MA talks about specialization... optimization...
In the mob you have chosen, the value of the hides is 2 pek, and with low DPP and Efficiency, the price for a kill, even if it is over 4 pek, it will be harder for you to enter the hides cases... ie. low TT of MU loot, in high price for a kill.

This does not mean that I am trying to make you play this way. I use the moment that you are now starting your run, which will be seen by 2k other players... which can be done by anyone's choice. There is no bad experience in my opinion and this is the way to evaluate the different approaches, I just give a different point of view in this case. The bad experience comes when doing experiments on a mob that cost 20 ped per kill.

I will pretend to be a fortune teller and I will assume that if you do not have a 100 ped+ global up to Codex 25... you will probably need at least 3k+ ped for this purpose... TT lost over 250 ped... the core MU loot hides, about 100 ped... what is the markup from the hides now 120-140%? ... I don't want to curse you, I even wish you success, just a preliminary report of your hunting run with this fit.
 
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But how do you know which weapon to use?
When do you overkill?
Even if I hunt with a TT weapon like the Herman cap on Hornet I only need 1-3 shots. This one uses a little less ammo than the chon, but still...
 
OP seems to appreciate the discussion, so I will chime in:

It is, to my knowledge, not confirmed that overkill is fully compensated. It is however confirmed that some to all overkill is compensated in TT-return.

It is known that overkill has an impact on loot composition, as per the official statement.

High damage vs mob HP is a double edged sword. You have a higher variability in your cost to kill the fewer shots you take. If like in your case you kill 10hp mobs with chon, you can kill a mob in a single crit, at a cost to kill of 1.451 pec. you can also miss 3 times and then take 3 shots to kill the mob for a cost to kill of 8.706. That is a 6x variability in cost to kill. If you´d use a lower damage weapon that variability would be a lot lower. You will likely see this in your runs.

High damage vs mob HP also means you have a high variability on your "actual DPP" with the same scenario as above as limits you have a span of 1.148 - 6.892 actual DPP for any given mob. What impact this has, I have no idea. But given the official statement I would assume it means you get a higher variability on your loot composition.

So to conclude, if overkill is fully compensated the only thing you risk with a big weapon is higher variability. Meaning you need more loot instances to normalize your TT-return and loot composition

When choosing a weapon I would be careful not to use a weapon that can not fully utilize a critical hit. If you can overkill with a single critical hit, I would use another weapon. There is normalization between critical hits and misses.

The best way to know how much you are overkilling (for a no/low regen mob) damage inflicted / (creatures killed*creature hp.)
The value you get is how much excess damage you´ve done in percent.
If you are tracking accurately, also check your "Actual DPP" with (creatures killed*creature hp)/costs incurred
 
Of the various weapons, there are maximum loss margins. This bet in relation to HP per mob is about 2500 to 5000... variable.
Just as the maximum for globals multiplication currently has a maximum of loss.
Depending on the DPP and the efficiency of the weapon, this margin may be smaller, but it is basically decisive in the dynamics of the game.
You can understand this if you hunt for a long time every day and try to reach the maximum loss... follow your plan, but just don't be afraid to lose once you have these hints. Even losing 100 ped is not much for a week, my cigarettes today are $8...

Once you are done with your case and you already have your data, if you are interested, try hunting the same mob with PistolSA... try to lose as much as possible in one day with this gun... it is very difficult to even shoot 100 ped for one day. But if you do it several days in a row or at least a week, you will begin to understand all of the above. Or if you want can do it using bigger guns, the pattern is not different, TT pistol, PistolSA, Chon are just examples in this case.

In my opinion, the selection of the maximum loss is the most important factor, and subsequently this affects the single kills.

These topics are here, there is no escape. Pay attention to the links I gave you. Doubts will remain until you do it yourself... practice teaches, reading is a tool.

You can PM me in the game, although I prefer it to be here to be seen by other players. But still, if you want to do it, don't worry about it.
 
OP seems to appreciate the discussion, so I will chime in:

It is, to my knowledge, not confirmed that overkill is fully compensated. It is however confirmed that some to all overkill is compensated in TT-return.

It is known that overkill has an impact on loot composition, as per the official statement.

High damage vs mob HP is a double edged sword. You have a higher variability in your cost to kill the fewer shots you take. If like in your case you kill 10hp mobs with chon, you can kill a mob in a single crit, at a cost to kill of 1.451 pec. you can also miss 3 times and then take 3 shots to kill the mob for a cost to kill of 8.706. That is a 6x variability in cost to kill. If you´d use a lower damage weapon that variability would be a lot lower. You will likely see this in your runs.

High damage vs mob HP also means you have a high variability on your "actual DPP" with the same scenario as above as limits you have a span of 1.148 - 6.892 actual DPP for any given mob. What impact this has, I have no idea. But given the official statement I would assume it means you get a higher variability on your loot composition.

So to conclude, if overkill is fully compensated the only thing you risk with a big weapon is higher variability. Meaning you need more loot instances to normalize your TT-return and loot composition

When choosing a weapon I would be careful not to use a weapon that can not fully utilize a critical hit. If you can overkill with a single critical hit, I would use another weapon. There is normalization between critical hits and misses.

The best way to know how much you are overkilling (for a no/low regen mob) damage inflicted / (creatures killed*creature hp.)
The value you get is how much excess damage you´ve done in percent.
If you are tracking accurately, also check your "Actual DPP" with (creatures killed*creature hp)/costs incurred
This is very clear to me in anyway, thank you very much.

I've seen with many mobs that I get different loot depending on the weapon I use.

With always using the chon on the hornet I now also see large fluctuations in the outcome as you say.

The problem I now have with the hornet is that even the TT weapon, the herman-cap, can kill the hornet in 1 crit.
In the meantime I did get a weapon from the hornet: the piron PBP-0, but I will keep it until I get several to do a run(s) with it to see the difference again.

1 more question, any advice what tracker I should use? Been checking and seems there are several.
 
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This is a consequence of the changing pace of the game, it does not depend on your overall statistics or weapons. With the weapon you can reduce it, which is the basis of my comments.
The longest hole I came across was within three days .. bad MU loot and TT return. I expected something good for compensation in the end, so i push it to the end... but it never happened. So nothing is guaranteed.
Тomorrow or in a few days it might be better. One of the reasons I prefer to play safer is this. So, low gun less loses.

If you have found a tacker for this mob, you better use it as a main weapon :laugh:

I think that these 10-20 HP mobs are designed for free players, for swunt, ie. you will get those loss of 10% from the sweat. Maybe therefore there are no normal weapons for them or just i don't see logical reason why.
 
This is a consequence of the changing pace of the game, it does not depend on your overall statistics or weapons. With the weapon you can reduce it, which is the basis of my comments.
The longest hole I came across was within three days .. bad MU loot and TT return. I expected something good for compensation in the end, so i push it to the end... but it never happened. So nothing is guaranteed.
Тomorrow or in a few days it might be better. One of the reasons I prefer to play safer is this. So, low gun less loses.

If you have found a tacker for this mob, you better use it as a main weapon :laugh:

I think that these 10-20 HP mobs are designed for free players, for swunt, ie. you will get those loss of 10% from the sweat. Maybe therefore there are no normal weapons for them or just i don't see logical reason why.
Ah yes, that's what can happen the same with mining, good and bad times, so in soc we warn eachother mostly because HitRating is lower than normal ore we get a lot more smaller claims.
 
After 2 years ingame mostly mining and occasionally hunting I decided to go hunting mainly because it is so diverse.

Meanwhile I have invested in several (low) UNL armors and UNL weapons.
The aim is to build up skills slowly and also by doing ranks.

Although I am now lvl 20 laser I have decided to start with the lowest HP mobs, that is the Arkadian Hornet.

I also have a number of goals for the time being and those are in the long term:
H.E.A.R.T fab (Cyrene), Viceroy (Ark) and healing chips.
Loot that I obtain and which I need to achieve these goals will not be sold for the time being.

You can also see what I'm selling and on which planet to make an offering (still need to be made)
When the end of the 25 ranks are reached, the loot is sold if there is interest for it.
If you want to hunt small, you could also try the Pleaks on cyrene.
Also 10HP, and only does 1 or 2 dmg max.

There's also a daily mission for them . Kill 30 for 0,01 ped anatomy.
And a mission that grants you 100 stamina tokens.

Pleak wings also used to have some nice MU so definitely worth to try.

And, you gotta love all those swirlie colors they have :D
 
If you want to hunt small, you could also try the Pleaks on cyrene.
Also 10HP, and only does 1 or 2 dmg max.

There's also a daily mission for them . Kill 30 for 0,01 ped anatomy.
And a mission that grants you 100 stamina tokens.

Pleak wings also used to have some nice MU so definitely worth to try.

And, you gotta love all those swirlie colors they have :D
Thank you for all that info.

I already went hunting for them and indeed they are really nice, also the feathers they drop have a decent MU but didn't know there was a daily or a mission for stamina tokens.
When I'm done with the hornet, I might go to cyrene again.
Intended to follow entropiawiki, but next on the list are caboria, but these are not all 10 hp but only the young, so that's confusing.
I'm probably going to skip Rocktopia as I can't seem to find any decent info on where each creature is.
 
Thank you for all that info.

I already went hunting for them and indeed they are really nice, also the feathers they drop have a decent MU but didn't know there was a daily or a mission for stamina tokens.
When I'm done with the hornet, I might go to cyrene again.
Intended to follow entropiawiki, but next on the list are caboria, but these are not all 10 hp but only the young, so that's confusing.
I'm probably going to skip Rocktopia as I can't seem to find any decent info on where each creature is.
If you are going down the puny 10hp creature route, Rocktropia has probably the best profit opportunity at your level. Vixens have great mark up and you will generate consistent profit from the gears, although it is a bit of work picking out the 10hp ones from the larger, and turreting the ones that you don't want, certainly too fiddly for me to bother with for such a low turnover, but many people survive and thrive this way. They are right near to club never die where you land. Once again, hold on to that TT pistol.
 
This is a consequence of the changing pace of the game, it does not depend on your overall statistics or weapons. With the weapon you can reduce it, which is the basis of my comments.
The longest hole I came across was within three days .. bad MU loot and TT return. I expected something good for compensation in the end, so i push it to the end... but it never happened. So nothing is guaranteed.
Тomorrow or in a few days it might be better. One of the reasons I prefer to play safer is this. So, low gun less loses.

If you have found a tacker for this mob, you better use it as a main weapon :laugh:

I think that these 10-20 HP mobs are designed for free players, for swunt, ie. you will get those loss of 10% from the sweat. Maybe therefore there are no normal weapons for them or just i don't see logical reason why.
When mining and getting a lower HR or smaller claims, I just stopped for the day after like 20-30 drops.
Next day I'd tried again and stopped when still bad and meanwhile selling my resources/loot.
Like now loot is down on hunting so I only do 1 run / day of 50 ped, with the TT gun I loose like 2-3 ped so I do not worry about that but I can imagine how much I could loose when using a overkilling weapon. Think I'm beginning to understand how hunting works :) also finding the right balance of weapon/armor/tools for each mob.
 
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Thank you for all that info.

I already went hunting for them and indeed they are really nice, also the feathers they drop have a decent MU but didn't know there was a daily or a mission for stamina tokens.
When I'm done with the hornet, I might go to cyrene again.
Intended to follow entropiawiki, but next on the list are caboria, but these are not all 10 hp but only the young, so that's confusing.
I'm probably going to skip Rocktopia as I can't seem to find any decent info on where each creature is.
Btw, Cyrene is an excellent place for small HP mob hunting.
First of all, there are many low HP mobs there. And also each one has a daily on them for the extra free skills.
Also the low HP mobs on cyrene usually have very nice MU.
For example the small scout bots (30HP) drop basic target chips which is an instant silent global if you loot one.
They sell (or used to sell) for around 10 ped each. So, not bad from a 30 hp mob.

So for low HP mobs cyrene would be my first choice.
 
The volatility of Cyrene's mob is greater than any other planet, which is not good for a new player who is captivated and chases the Globals in the game. There is a reason for the higher markups. And especially for low bankroll it would be catastrophic.


https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/...f-using-a-finisher-weapon.286305/post-3804946

You can make this test, even if you find Herman0 at 2000/3000+ tier rate you can do it the same. Not sure where you can find 100 HP mobs on Arkadia, those on my mind now are Zadul and Prospectors. But Zadul regen is high... maybe some ~100 HP Prospectors can be better choice, because they regen is very low.

I give an example with 100 HP because it is equivalent of 100% and easier to understand. 10 HP.. 100 HP... 1000 HP there is no difference between them. Maybe this is the way to find out what nonsense they are writing about the TT pistol and 10 HP mobs.

The game is full of cycles, and the lowest is 7/10 min. From this time frame the loot in the game is determined... I mean the normal loot and low multis. The Rare prey is mainly on windows, while the good multis as you know are on mini waves.

The simple 100... even 1000 kills if you want. Is nothing different from what you do every day, but for a specific purpose. There is no difference between 10, 100 or 1000 HP mob, the pattern is the same.... it's up to you.
 
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OP seems to appreciate the discussion, so I will chime in:

It is, to my knowledge, not confirmed that overkill is fully compensated. It is however confirmed that some to all overkill is compensated in TT-return.

It is known that overkill has an impact on loot composition, as per the official statement.

High damage vs mob HP is a double edged sword. You have a higher variability in your cost to kill the fewer shots you take. If like in your case you kill 10hp mobs with chon, you can kill a mob in a single crit, at a cost to kill of 1.451 pec. you can also miss 3 times and then take 3 shots to kill the mob for a cost to kill of 8.706. That is a 6x variability in cost to kill. If you´d use a lower damage weapon that variability would be a lot lower. You will likely see this in your runs.

High damage vs mob HP also means you have a high variability on your "actual DPP" with the same scenario as above as limits you have a span of 1.148 - 6.892 actual DPP for any given mob. What impact this has, I have no idea. But given the official statement I would assume it means you get a higher variability on your loot composition.

So to conclude, if overkill is fully compensated the only thing you risk with a big weapon is higher variability. Meaning you need more loot instances to normalize your TT-return and loot composition

When choosing a weapon I would be careful not to use a weapon that can not fully utilize a critical hit. If you can overkill with a single critical hit, I would use another weapon. There is normalization between critical hits and misses.

The best way to know how much you are overkilling (for a no/low regen mob) damage inflicted / (creatures killed*creature hp.)
The value you get is how much excess damage you´ve done in percent.
If you are tracking accurately, also check your "Actual DPP" with (creatures killed*creature hp)/costs incurred
I can confirm that not all overkill is compensated, and I've seen people get horrible returns simply because of an element of overkill.
 
I can confirm that not all overkill is compensated, and I've seen people get horrible returns simply because of an element of overkill.
Could this be a false equivalency caused by the fact that more overkill lowers the number of looting events and thus raises the volatility of a given cycle? What was your sample size?
 
Could this be a false equivalency caused by the fact that more overkill lowers the number of looting events and thus raises the volatility of a given cycle? What was your sample size?
Negative, the sample size was adequate to overthrow loot cycles of 4-5k kills on X mob.
 
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