Is It Time To Bring Back the Sweat Cap?

[Az Bloodz]

When I said I dislike sweat reseller and auction resellers, I’m not talking about resellers who buy and sell little amounts. But those who drive the prices up from weapons and tools. Go ahead browse auctions for a while and you see what I mean. Fact is that it happens, and already a long time, if you look good you find the names. There is a group of players that every week buys weapons on auctions. At the end of the week they sell them for higher markup on auctions. Sometimes ten in a row, then it gets fishy, haven’t even checked their names on tracker, but I bet a lot are not listed there. Now I do know there is nothing I can do about this and it is their right to resell. But it harms the economy for sure. Check the markup on all your items, I did and found out I lost about 15k there alone. I knew this was the risk and was prepared to take it.

You still got something wrong here. Sweat resellers do not manipulate the price in any way and even if they did drive the price up no sweater would complain at all I bet. The problem still is there is not enough demand for too much sweat may it be old stocks for speculation or even the amount gathered daily. When I look at Neas I see more sweat gathered than ME will sold that day. Mind Essence is no target of manipulation just a target of undercutting each other to get something sold.

Regarding the usual market manipulation this worked mainly in the past. You need an item limited in supply and high in demand but since people tend to buy weapons and tools less as an investment and do look more at its usability some weapons lost on value. Just look at the price of the Mod Merc or other items who were almost 150% as expensive as they are now.

 

[Mariko Ninja]

We don't need another 100.000 accounts /year for dummy sweater avatars like we used to have in the days...

(unless sweaters don't mind to extract a maximum of 2 sweats/pull)...

Can't agree more with the 100.000 more accounts.

As I understand it, it's already close to 2 sweat per pull.

 

[Executor]

Deleted post.

 

[Mariko Ninja]

You still got something wrong here. Sweat resellers do not manipulate the price in any way and even if they did drive the price up no sweater would complain at all I bet. The problem still is there is not enough demand for too much sweat may it be old stocks for speculation or even the amount gathered daily. When I look at Neas I see more sweat gathered than ME will sold that day. Mind Essence is no target of manipulation just a target of undercutting each other to get something sold.
Regarding the usual market manipulation this worked mainly in the past. You need an item limited in supply and high in demand but since people tend to buy weapons and tools less as an investment and do look more at its usability some weapons lost on value. Just look at the price of the Mod Merc or other items who were almost 150% as expensive as they are now.

It's not the price manipulations of sweat that is a problem for me. But the fact that some will go through any length to make a extra few peds on those new players. And the fact that the rest of the community in general helped creating them and maintaining them. Buying sweat at low prices and selling them for the purpose to gain an few extra peds it what I dislike at them. I also know not all do it for the same reason, now I see I should have stated that too.

I do understand that, but it’s not a thing of the past. Happens daily right now, limited weapons and unlimited weapons is the most targeted area. Seen the skill implants ? I calculated I lost about 30% on MU overall on my avatars skills. Rifle sells atm below 1k MU compared to 2.8k last year. My unlimited boar also lost over 50% on MU, but for that I blame Mindark and not the community.

 

[Az Bloodz]

But the fact that some will go through any length to make a extra few peds on those new players. And the fact that the rest of the community in general helped creating them and maintaining them.

Well there are very very very very very... very few that buy sweat at 3/k to sell at 3,1/k [fictional number]. Most of the Mind Essence traders or resellers do buy Nexus, Sweat and refine to Mind Essence. After calculating refiner decay, most use MT-104, and auction fee there isn't much left. Nexus is hard to acquire cheap since it has a rather more limited supply than sweat also you need to spent some PEDs to acquire it. When buying large amounts you can save a few PEDs but after all everyone is paying close to the same rate.

Now they are trying to sell competing against other Mind Essence traders, sweaters refining their sweat and people who stockpiled Mind Essence/Sweat in the hope of an improved Mind Force System which will increase the value of Sweat. I guess there is 100 times more sweat available than actually needed. After seeing the limited chances they try to undercut each other which leads to minimizing their profit or even just an attempt to minimize the loss. The only advantage you could have on an almost dead ME market is cheap ingredents. As already stated it is rather hard to acquire Force Nexus cheaper but Vibrant Sweat is available in huge amounts and sold by newcomers who just want to get some PEDs fast in order to try out the game already. This is not ripping off newbies this is just adjusting to the market. The participants focusing on trading are able to do this pretty good but many of the brainless sweat gathering drones [I am not talking about sweaters/swunters who enjoy what they are doing] who just sweat sweat sweat and then burn all their PEDs within 10 minutes without even thinking of an alternative or a solution ain't able to do so. There reaction is crying out for help may it be MA or may it be other players. That's begging for charity in my book.

Don't get me wrong I started as a sweater and still sweat from time to time and I really love swunting but I just don't need it and still haven't deposited a single Cent up to today. Might be some people call me a leecher or whatever but I managed to survive without asking for charity though some people helped me along the way [big thx].

Anyways, sweating is dead at the moment so I can suggest find another way for example stones. 1 pile of Rutol [found one today in PvP4 without even looking for it] will get you more money than sweating for hours since 1 Stone = 1 PED. Also Trutun is quite the PED gainer and the standard finds of Brukite arn't shabby either. If they don't want to look for stones fine. I found it boring too and never did it. But just find a freaking way to make your PEDs last long enough and stop the crying.

I do understand that, but it’s not a thing of the past. Happens daily right now, limited weapons and unlimited weapons is the most targeted area. Seen the skill implants ? I calculated I lost about 30% on MU overall on my avatars skills. Rifle sells atm below 1k MU compared to 2.8k last year. My unlimited boar also lost over 50% on MU, but for that I blame Mindark and not the community.

Well it's not as profitable as it was. Don't know much about (L) Weapons, many come in waves followed by a dry period which leads to fluctuations in the price. Or have a look at the current Migration event, great opportunity for some short-time reselling. Nothing wrong with that imho.

 

[Norbert]

It's not the price manipulations of sweat that is a problem for me. But the fact that some will go through any length to make a extra few peds on those new players. And the fact that the rest of the community in general helped creating them and maintaining them. Buying sweat at low prices and selling them for the purpose to gain an few extra peds it what I dislike at them. I also know not all do it for the same reason, now I see I should have stated that too.

I do understand that, but it’s not a thing of the past. Happens daily right now, limited weapons and unlimited weapons is the most targeted area. Seen the skill implants ? I calculated I lost about 30% on MU overall on my avatars skills. Rifle sells atm below 1k MU compared to 2.8k last year. My unlimited boar also lost over 50% on MU, but for that I blame Mindark and not the community.

Hi Mariko

With all respect the problem at the moment is that the demand for sweat from pre vu-10 has been diminished. I sweat mainly for evade skills, but for new players the time sweating should be when you learn the game and develop social bonds via socs etc.
The only answers i think are other free activities and increased demand for sweat (new mf chips and powers? ).

Many say that sweat is free but that is incorrect as the time taken to do something people don't want to do has value.

As for falling mark up's i think we will see a reversing of this trend, the gateway area and missions i think will hold more people in game.

 

[py08jl]

1k sweat would take me about 1 hour 1 houre and a half AFK sweating while i am watching tv

sorry, that is not physically possible, the best we have ever got was 500 per hour, PC performance and internet connection dependent. The average is 450-480 per hour.

if i sweat myself i not really busy with my pc for the rest (maybe you dunno what AFK means , just in case it means Away From Keyboard)
and am prolly watching tv or doing some reading ,, whatever

so you are going to be away from keyboard for 1hour and not die and not dry a mob in 1 hour? what you sweating? Proteron?

 

[Derid]

Not until I hit 3K SG!! When I do that, put the cap in.

 

[NightwolfAA2k5]

Somebody has probably already said it, but whatever, the sweat cap isn't whats needed. What we need is for sweat to be more useful.

I concur, dear sir, largely because these sweaters are potential future advertisers as well...

I'd rather they tell their friends "I like Entropia Universe because..." than "Don't play Entropia Universe because it's a shit game, and here's why...".

MA really cannot afford to turn people away at the door. I'd like this game to still be here in five years.

 

[py08jl]

Not until I hit 3K SG!! When I do that, put the cap in.

not until I beat MegaVolt in SG skill, dont cap =)

 

[Derid]

not until I beat MegaVolt in SG skill, dont cap =)

What are you guys at? 10K?

 

[Az Bloodz]

I'd rather they tell their friends "I like Entropia Universe because..." than "Don't play Entropia Universe because it's a shit game, and here's why...".

MA really cannot afford to turn people away at the door. I'd like this game to still be here in five years.

Well Entropia Universe and even more Project Entropia is and always has been a niche game. It is not meant for people who think they'll get rich in 1 month. It is also not meant for people who think they should have top end gear/maxed everything within one year. EU is made for investors and people who are attracted by a RCE but also don't want to miss a gaming aspect. This is a very small group since many folks are focusing on either of these so they play WoW or SL.
The main problem of MA/FPC is to advertise to the target group and this is quite hard to accomplish since the usual portals/forums are for gamers with little interest in RCE or games you in which you cannot reach uberness within 1 year.

So it basically isn't a bad thing to get rid of the people who just don't fit into EU.

 

[py08jl]

What are you guys at? 10K?

still @ lvl 18 =( with 2K SG pts...
Mega is @ lvl 40 (faint....)

 

[Derid]

Working towards 2k myself. But after 1500 it really slowed down!

 

[Mariko Ninja]

Well it's not as profitable as it was. Don't know much about (L) Weapons, many come in waves followed by a dry period which leads to fluctuations in the price. Or have a look at the current Migration event, great opportunity for some short-time reselling. Nothing wrong with that imho.

Well I did some calculations and estimate that resellers 'together' on auctions
make between 100k to 300k peds 'profit' in one year.
And that is an low estimate.

 

[py08jl]

Well I did some calculations and estimate that resellers 'together' on auctions
make between 100k to 300k peds 'profit' in one year.
And that is an low estimate.

assuming 100K PED per year
thats at least 8kPED per month...
~250PED per day
11PED per hour -_-
0.19PED per minute
0.003PED per second

oh wait 0.003PED? thats the current sweat rate!

if I can get 1 sweat every second i can get 100K PED a month =)

Edit: not possible.... max sweat gather per second is ~0.138 sweat/sec -_-

 

[Mariko Ninja]

assuming 100K PED per year
thats at least 8kPED per month...
~250PED per day
11PED per hour -_-
0.19PED per minute
0.003PED per second

oh wait 0.003PED? thats the current sweat rate!

if I can get 1 sweat every second i can get 100K PED a month =)

Edit: not possible.... max sweat gather per second is ~0.138 sweat/sec -_-

Not talking about sweat resellers and not about one.

 

[py08jl]

Not talking about sweat resellers and not about one.

I know u r not talking about sweat reseller rofl xD

sorry, i didnt notice the "s" at the end of "resellers".... now it clicks in my head xD

 

[skunkjunk]

Well I did some calculations and estimate that resellers 'together' on auctions
make between 100k to 300k peds 'profit' in one year.
And that is an low estimate.

makes me curius how did you calculate , what factors did you took in ?

 

[kosmos]

makes me curius how did you calculate , what factors did you took in ?

its not hard to calculate and her estimate is very low I am sure its way higher. There are a group of "shadow" resellers (and a few that use their main accounts) that really kick and deflate markup here day to day and week to week. this is nothing new just takes a few moments a day to see.

kosmos

 

[py08jl]

hum... are we a bit out off topic again? xD

 

[Laurent]

Well, the question reveals it.

Something got to be done

ME uses have been reduced.

Sweating has been nerfed.

I actually think this is bad for the game.

Less people will do the effort to try and know the game because this will be to hard to make it his own way.

I hope the new newbie area will help, rather pessimistic sadly.

 

[Az Bloodz]

Well I did some calculations and estimate that resellers 'together' on auctions
make between 100k to 300k peds 'profit' in one year.
And that is an low estimate.

Still a pretty low amount of money compared to the past.

 

[Robert Black]

reasonable be ... 0.0 pec , you get that shit for free..

As a depo player i can safely say that if MA ever would decide to accually give sweat a tt value high enouf that it is worth to tt. It would stop me from depositing and i assume that goes for most people.

Sweat is dead the sweater proffesion is dying out HOORAY

PS
to all the sweaters out there your skill worth peds 2 so stop whining ,everything you get is fucking free and yet it issent enouf..

Someone here at the forum (dont remember who it was) said it best when he/she said: sweaters complaining about the peds they get for sweat is like a homeless person complaining you gave him 1 dollar and not 10 dollars.

Accept the fact as a sweater in this game you the equivelant of the real life homeless person you at the bottom of the food chain and thats the way it is and should be..

I lolled + rep

 

[Robert Black]

The sweat market isnt dead, you just gotta find the right person.

Someone i know that started 3 days ago managed to sell his first k of sweat for 6 ped

I started 2 weeks ago. I sold my first 1k sweat for 6 peds.
I also made my first deposit within a week.
I enjoy sweating and listening to clubcalypto.com haha.
I sweat for the skills and the social interaction at swamp camp. Not for the peds

 

[py08jl]

I started 2 weeks ago. I sold my first 1k sweat for 6 peds.
I also made my first deposit within a week.
I enjoy sweating and listening to clubcalypto.com haha.
I sweat for the skills and the social interaction at swamp camp. Not for the peds

good for you, now go swunting =) you will really enjoy it =)

 

[skunkjunk]

its not hard to calculate and her estimate is very low I am sure its way higher. There are a group of "shadow" resellers (and a few that use their main accounts) that really kick and deflate markup here day to day and week to week. this is nothing new just takes a few moments a day to see.

kosmos

taking a look a few times a day dont explain the figure of 100 to 300k i do hope people go on more then well i looked a few time a day i guess....uh... a what the hel 200 k lts make it a bigger margin 100 to 300 k.. yeah thats a sweet calculation... totally convinced now :/

 

[Robert Black]

good for you, now go swunting =) you will really enjoy it =)

Tried it was fun and quite rewarding

 

[Mariko Ninja]

taking a look a few times a day dont explain the figure of 100 to 300k i do hope people go on more then well i looked a few time a day i guess....uh... a what the hel 200 k lts make it a bigger margin 100 to 300 k.. yeah thats a sweet calculation... totally convinced now :/

You are funny…
Seems to me you are not smart enough to figure this one out yourself.

If people not smart enouf to figure out how entropia works in the basic they prolly dont belong in this game and wont ever make it and thats a fact.

I am done with this debate, took this topic already too far off topic.
Again sorry about that.

Enjoy…

 

[Ingolenuru]

Just starting.

I haven't left the gate yet but as you can see I am doing my research first. Reading this thread it seems to me that the problem beyond the lack of demand for sweat due to nerfed devices and skills is that the current players don't think the game needs any new players. They don't care if there are any new players so they have no use for even being civil to the new players.

You don't need a cap for sweat. You need to fix the nerfed stuff or add more content to increase demand. That alone will not be enough. You also need to get people who think it is okay to be a complete ass to new players just because they don't want to deposit before they actually decide they like the game banned from new player areas. Telling people they have to pay for a game that is advertised as free to play is complete bullshit. If someone wants to wait and save they could start a career here and it will support itself. You have people saying they withdraw $35K USD a year. Do you think these people actually deposit???? If they do then the only money they deposit is coming from money they made in game.

This idea that you are better than someone else because you deposit is asinine shit. People are not better than each other period. Playing a game, having a job, being rich or poor; NONE of these things makes you better than anyone else. Get over your ego maniacal bitching and start realizing that no matter how anyone plays or behaves you are not better than they are. You can be more mature than the beggars and you can be more knowledgeable than new players but you are not a better person. Maturity is wonderful but having it doesn't make you better than someone else. Calling people names and treating them like shit by the way indicates the same level of immaturity as begging and whining.

Forget the cap. Reintroduce demand and enforce some kind of civility towards new players. If begging is a problem then there should be an ignore command, a method of reporting and banning the beggars or some other in game option to deal with them. If this is not the case then it is not the beggars fault you have to deal with them. It is the games fault. Every free game out there, let alone the p2p ones, has an ignore function. If you can't deal with the game not allowing you to ignore irritating people and there is no recourse from the developers either then stop complaining about the people and start complaining about the game. The game needs new players and new money. Be part of the solution and not part of the problem.

Ingolenuru